Unstoppable Union

For the love of the Gods please oh please Anet Dev Gods rethink nerfing this trait. Right now Ranger is in it's own skin - It is kitten near perfect as to what Ranger should be in the Guild Wars world. This trait is a piece in the puzzle, maybe even the corner-piece that holds it all together. Very comparable to Fast Hands for Warrior. I do not see how a SB will be able to put pressure and force cooldowns at Mid-fights through aegis/block/reflect heavy teams. A clone with Aegis, a single a.i. will outlive damage from a burst that took 4 skills to set up. I think the shave to Sic 'em is enough. I don't want to see this build fall out of meta, this great role for ranger in SPvP. I don't want to see a Soulbeast and think "well dang, another profession could have done your job better." If the unblockable must go, I would suggest making Projectiles unblockable rather than all attacks. This would still allow SB's enough room to hold a solid purpose/niche and force out defensive cooldowns at range while also giving the enemy enough breathing room mechanically to ward off some of the burst (the melee portion.)

It's clear, they don't want it in PvP

People will still complain about ranger, as they always have

Should call it "Unstoppable Onion" with all the tears it makes.

...bad joke, couldn't help myself.

@"Zagerus.8675" said:For the love of the Gods please oh please Anet Dev Gods rethink nerfing this trait. Right now Ranger is in it's own skin - It is kitten near perfect as to what Ranger should be in the Guild Wars world. This trait is a piece in the puzzle, maybe even the corner-piece that holds it all together. Very comparable to Fast Hands for Warrior. I do not see how a SB will be able to put pressure and force cooldowns at Mid-fights through aegis/block/reflect heavy teams. A clone with Aegis, a single a.i. will outlive damage from a burst that took 4 skills to set up. I think the shave to Sic 'em is enough. I don't want to see this build fall out of meta, this great role for ranger in SPvP. I don't want to see a Soulbeast and think "well dang, another profession could have done your job better." If the unblockable must go, I would suggest making Projectiles unblockable rather than all attacks. This would still allow SB's enough room to hold a solid purpose/niche and force out defensive cooldowns at range while also giving the enemy enough breathing room mechanically to ward off some of the burst (the melee portion.)

It needed a nerf badly. 4 seconds of unblockable attacks from 1,800 range was broken. You should need to work and time your skills correctly. This nerf will ensure thats what SB players need to do.

@Doug.4930 said:

@"Zagerus.8675" said:For the love of the Gods please oh please Anet Dev Gods rethink nerfing this trait. Right now Ranger is in it's own skin - It is kitten near perfect as to what Ranger should be in the Guild Wars world. This trait is a piece in the puzzle, maybe even the corner-piece that holds it all together. Very comparable to Fast Hands for Warrior. I do not see how a SB will be able to put pressure and force cooldowns at Mid-fights through aegis/block/reflect heavy teams. A clone with Aegis, a single a.i. will outlive damage from a burst that took 4 skills to set up. I think the shave to Sic 'em is enough. I don't want to see this build fall out of meta, this great role for ranger in SPvP. I don't want to see a Soulbeast and think "well dang, another profession could have done your job better." If the unblockable must go, I would suggest making Projectiles unblockable rather than all attacks. This would still allow SB's enough room to hold a solid purpose/niche and force out defensive cooldowns at range while also giving the enemy enough breathing room mechanically to ward off some of the burst (the melee portion.)

It doesn't matter, this class will always be complained about. It was complained about with core in multiple ways even when it had no spot in the meta during the celestial meta. Druid was hated, nerfed multiple times , people still complained. Soulbeast comes out, people still complain. Now that it's major purpose for even being in PvP is nerfed (sadly, rightfully so which shows how many options ranger has), guess what?

People will still complain.

This class is automatically hated, seen negatively and looked at as imbalanced even when it's not. This will show exactly that, in the coming months will still see the same old thread of ranger being broken and needing nerfs.

At this point I really think they should just remove pets and longbow and give us something else in terms of thematic approach, it clearly doesn't have a place in this game and it's playerbase. They tried somewhat that with the pet aspect and add in active play with pet melding, but people still complain.

This playerbase and the people that hate ranger (pretty much 90% of the playerbase) kill any explorable option that ranger can possibly have because no matter what it is, it is complained about.

@ZhouX.8742 said:

@Doug.4930 said:

@"Zagerus.8675" said:For the love of the Gods please oh please Anet Dev Gods rethink nerfing this trait. Right now Ranger is in it's own skin - It is kitten near perfect as to what Ranger should be in the Guild Wars world. This trait is a piece in the puzzle, maybe even the corner-piece that holds it all together. Very comparable to Fast Hands for Warrior. I do not see how a SB will be able to put pressure and force cooldowns at Mid-fights through aegis/block/reflect heavy teams. A clone with Aegis, a single a.i. will outlive damage from a burst that took 4 skills to set up. I think the shave to Sic 'em is enough. I don't want to see this build fall out of meta, this great role for ranger in SPvP. I don't want to see a Soulbeast and think "well dang, another profession could have done your job better." If the unblockable must go, I would suggest making Projectiles unblockable rather than all attacks. This would still allow SB's enough room to hold a solid purpose/niche and force out defensive cooldowns at range while also giving the enemy enough breathing room mechanically to ward off some of the burst (the melee portion.)

Well let them complain, their complaints about soul beast were completely justified recently, but even a broken clock is right twice a day. On paper the nerfs look fine and fair. Hard to know though until we see them in action.

good job anet! bb pvp) The last viable build burnt to ground!^^ Lol, even DHs have unblockable longbow what damage even ll be increased in next patch))00 So, okay, ranger must suck at range.

Suggestion : Add 1.5s of unblockable to Eternal bond on merge on top of the current effectOr you can even do unblockable 2-3attacks for ranger on merge and unblockable 2-3 attacks for pet when you leave bestmode since it looks like it is the new way to balance. Less burst but slightly more annoying. Do not know which one is better.

There are 2 benefit to this :1) The trait has some use : Currently it has no use. In PvP and PvE. Even the hand kitter build on Deimos does not need it. The cd is too long, the heal too small and I understand that you cannot make it better to not be frustrating.2) You will still have way less damage compared to the previous sic em build. If you decide to pick this, you will loose the "oppresive superiority" high bonus or the high defense / dmg burst provided by "leader of the pack".It is a cheap way to solve the problem but I have been thinking about it for a while (since people started complaining about the build).

The nerf was excessive. I think toning it down instead of removing it entirely would have been enough (UU gives your next attack unblockable, Sic'Em down to 30%, though 25% isnt too bad with the new TaV, but I could do without that change too tbh), but eh, people will continue to cry even in the underwhelming state the build is in. It will still be "Oppressive" or "Overpowered" or "Toxic"...whatever buzzword people will use for Rangers in their games. It happened with Druid, and even now its getting kicked when its almost non-existent.

The nerfs were justifiedLaughs in Staff 3

@Euthymias.7984 said:25% isnt too bad with the new TaV, but I could do without that change too tbh

I would rather have the damaged spread to other areas than having a gimmick skill to begin with, and TaV was just about underwhelming enough to either boost duration or the modifier.

Bring back unblockable.

@"Cyric.7813" said:Bring back unblockable.

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/82331/bond-clarion-bond-or-crazy-people#latest

To me it thematically makes sense that something with "unstoppable" in the name would remove both hard and soft cc.But I used fresh reinforcement (as part of the boon stacking rotation) more often anyway.

'spose they could've changed it to make the next attack unblockable -- to prevent longbow spam.

~ Kovu

@stick.7258 said:

@"Cyric.7813" said:Bring back unblockable.

Marksmanship sucks

it sucks > @Cyric.7813 said:

@stick.7258 said:

@Cyric.7813 said:Bring back unblockable.

It does, except it does give u an option for unblockable cc or burst, so with some effort u get your unblockable

If it were me, I would make Unstoppable Union give Stability and Might.

Yur talking about a class which was designed to fight tooth and claw with their pet and have mainhand dagger as their Spec weapon.

It would make more sense to funnel traits to support melee combat SB instead of giving them so much unblockables to poke people down with 1500 range AAs which hit for 5k damage on average.

And maybe make power scaling on MH dagger better, I've been dying to fight with dagger like an animal but my fantasy of tearing and ripping my prey is ruined by the fact the dagger is condi focused.

@"Yasai.3549" said:If it were me, I would make Unstoppable Union give Stability and Might.

Yur talking about a class which was designed to fight tooth and claw with their pet and have mainhand dagger as their Spec weapon.

It would make more sense to funnel traits to support melee combat SB instead of giving them so much unblockables to poke people down with 1500 range AAs which hit for 5k damage on average.

And maybe make power scaling on MH dagger better, I've been dying to fight with dagger like an animal but my fantasy of tearing and ripping my prey is ruined by the fact the dagger is condi focused.

That's not a bad idea, and it would have been a source of Stab outside of Dolyak/SotP. Oh well...

As for Dagger, I think its current output is "fine" even as a condi weapon since its not far off from sword, but it just needs something like:

AA 2 and 3 merged into one attack so that it follows the conventional 3 hit auto chain vs 4That thing takes way too long to finish and each one just does one condition anyway. Having it go from 1-2-3 conditions per chain would give it some better pressure. Maybe add a couple seconds of Cripple (or even 1s Immob if you land a flanking strike) to Dagger 2 to make it better at helping pin down a target once you're in Melee range....and just make Dagger 3 have a slightly lower aftercast.

if we wanna talk broken, point the finger also at mesmur with their insane amount of condi/clones/one shot. soulbeast didnt have a one shot burst and even if it did should nerf the dmg on gs instead. What should of been done is kept unstoppable union as unblockable and nerfed the other two. Clarion bond does unblock when swapping pets and so the duration should be nerfed down instead of making it an almost useless trait. Unblock was one of the main ways that ranger could sustain itself vs heavy blocking which is what the role of soulbeast in the first place so now by nerfing it and revamping it, its pretty much crippled to the point of where its almost useless to run. you can not run with 1 solid unblockable vs like 2-3 block type classes, guardian, warrior, scrapper/holo specialy when trying to do a 2v1 in pvp and trying to bait the guard on resing and not able to prevent it from happening. This is total and utter garbage, so ill say this restore unstoppable union to its previous use.

@"vanflyheight.6832" said:soulbeast didnt have a one shot burst

What?

edit: What?

https://i.imgur.com/77ikhIj.jpghttps://i.ytimg.com/vi/zX8jIzUyy6Y/maxresdefault.jpghttps://www.twitch.tv/gladomer/clip/BlueCleverFishLitFamhttps://www.twitch.tv/gladomer/clip/ShyHelpfulDonkeyAllenHuhu

@knite.1542 said:

@"vanflyheight.6832" said:soulbeast didnt have a one shot burst

Well that's a thief with no doubt some pretty paper gear so I won't say it pushes yur point home.

Problem is, Soulbeasts were able to do this to EVERYONE, including people who run around 1500 armor and at least 17k HP.

And never mind Rapid fire, they were able to do this with Maul, Winter's Bite and Worldly Impact as well.

Oh missed or blocked any of these? Let me just poke yu down with either Axe or Bow for 3k~5k damage per hit.

AND DON'T THINK YUR GONNA GET AWAY FROM THIS BUSINESS, SWOOP SWOOP HERE I COME.

pretty much everyone knows how squishy thieves can be, plus if they were running exotic gear instead of ascended then yes they would be bursted down that fast. If you wanna talk bout one shotting that isnt one shotting at all. One shotting a player is based on a single skill that can do a ton of dmg instead of a combination of skills. Most soulbeasts use either one wolf pack or strength of the pack before rapid fire, that isnt one shotting that is a burst combo. and ofc along with quickening zephyr will more than likely snipe down the mount along with the player if their health isnt high enough to sustain it or they got bad to poor reflexes to out maneuver once their dismounted. Bet a mirage mesmur could do the same thing and most arent even raising havoc on that one with their 2-4sec burst. Now thats more of a one shot even though it takes like 4-5 skills on the mirage to make it possible and since its incredibly difficult to execute in the first place. If ya wanna talk one shot, try going over to perfect world with a barbarian with like 40k hp and get their tail whipped by a caster for 60k-1mil crit, without downstate.

Make all ranger attacks 1200 range capped them do whatever the f you want.

@vanflyheight.6832 said:if we wanna talk broken, point the finger also at mesmur with their insane amount of condi/clones/one shot. soulbeast didnt have a one shot burst and even if it did should nerf the dmg on gs instead. What should of been done is kept unstoppable union as unblockable and nerfed the other two. Clarion bond does unblock when swapping pets and so the duration should be nerfed down instead of making it an almost useless trait. Unblock was one of the main ways that ranger could sustain itself vs heavy blocking which is what the role of soulbeast in the first place so now by nerfing it and revamping it, its pretty much crippled to the point of where its almost useless to run. you can not run with 1 solid unblockable vs like 2-3 block type classes, guardian, warrior, scrapper/holo specialy when trying to do a 2v1 in pvp and trying to bait the guard on resing and not able to prevent it from happening. This is total and utter garbage, so ill say this restore unstoppable union to its previous use.

At least someone understand situation

Nah, unblockable + sicem + LB#2 = broken.
The change to unstopable union is fine, to balance the projectile hate what it should be done is the same treatement as for unblockables.The shield/barrier should have a number of blocks before it expires aside the duration.

But that change would probably need a lot of rework behind the scenes as all skills which block/reflect projectiles should get the same treatement (with some exception here and there).

if sic em was the main problem then just nerf that instead of the unblockables. The change to unstoppable union isnt fine, in fact it almost completely cripples the role of soulbeast which is to pressure the other side into know how to combat it. Doesnt take rocket science to understand you dont put up blocks till the unblockable is used. Plus takes a decent to good soulbeast player to know when to time their unblockables. Hating rangers for unblockables is just pure fantasy and a delusion not to mention being on a witch hunt for something that shouldnt of been changed to begin with. What should of been changed was the dmg on gs since i also get bursted by that weapon a lot. Plus i dont think you get the idea that a rangers role is to counter pressure or add pressure from range so it'll force the other team (aka spvp) or in wvw zergs to pressure the ranger instead. you always go for the target that is pressuring you instead of going after classes that dont.