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and the nerfs keep coming


EnderzShadow.2506

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@Blocki.4931 said:Is this something we other people are supposed to be sad about?

Soulbeast had it coming since its release. Just wait until you realize that most likely the Longbow change is also a nerf :)

You wouldn't know.

@Blocki.4931 said:I can't be bothered to learn the maps. I prefer the simple gameplay of WvW, where I just have to kill an enemy, not worry about what the rest of my team is doing or whether or not a point is capped or not, because that simply comes afterwards.

PvP is too hard.

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You know even with those strong but needed nerfs , the funniest thing is we'll keep seeing cry in the forums because Sicem rangers oneshoting paper zerker builds.

IMO unless the dynamic range thing for the autos actually nerf the damage, how is phrased PBS got a buff (ranger mains sure know why) and Barrage will just make ranger the perfect mobile AC WvW didn't know it needed. You'll need 5 of those in every squad.

The changes to Barrage and Sicem (if we get the mobility buff right) are a game changer for WvW and for the ranger a possibility to have some use in zerg fights.

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The only nerf that was out of place and unjustified was for poor old Druids staff 3.

The Soulbeast ones everyone knew were coming and won’t even come close to killing SB. Not to mention LB got super buffed for sure in any range threshold that isn’t the highest. And twice as vicious is now twice as long.

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@Durzlla.6295 said:The only nerf that was out of place and unjustified was for poor old Druids staff 3.

The Soulbeast ones everyone knew were coming and won’t even come close to killing SB. Not to mention LB got super buffed for sure in any range threshold that isn’t the highest. And twice as vicious is now twice as long.

I agree, i dont see where anet wants to go with the druid. Now that Medic Thief is going to be meta druid is going to be obsolete and forgotten.I hope Anet has more changes in mind however, the buff to LB should open squads for rangers but it will change very little how is played or the builds. We would need something to have a viable condi build at least.

If shortbow would get the 1200 range back and the glass arrows effect we may begin to see more grieving set soulbeast with double bow and SM\XX.

Also core pets would need some rework.

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@"Durzlla.6295" said:The only nerf that was out of place and unjustified was for poor old Druids staff 3.

The Soulbeast ones everyone knew were coming and won’t even come close to killing SB. Not to mention LB got super buffed for sure in any range threshold that isn’t the highest. And twice as vicious is now twice as long.

I have to disagree. LB got hit hard. Yes it is a damage buff that can be fun / annoying on the mid point but I am sure guardians are even more happy. This means they are a full counter to LB just like before we had unblockable. Not only do they provide lots of projectile mitigation but also they will have good reason to have builds with retaliation (like they used to). Also lots of classes already have projectile reflects (mesmer, engi) and I am sure those with "only" blocks are happy that we cannot deal with them anymore(warriors).

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@anduriell.6280 said:You know even with those strong but needed nerfs , the funniest thing is we'll keep seeing cry in the forums because Sicem rangers oneshoting paper zerker builds.

IMO unless the dynamic range thing for the autos actually nerf the damage, how is phrased PBS got a buff (ranger mains sure know why) and Barrage will just make ranger the perfect mobile AC WvW didn't know it needed. You'll need 5 of those in every squad.

The changes to Barrage and Sicem (if we get the mobility buff right) are a game changer for WvW and for the ranger a possibility to have some use in zerg fights.

It was a hard swing of the nerfbat.

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I'll say this, probably an overreaction on my part. I play a melee soulbeast in PvP that does just fine.I don't need the longbow and I gave up on Druid in the last month as scrapper does pvp support FAR better in every respect.

It should come as no surprise, that no matter the class that gets 'balanced'-- @Arenanet sorry but you guys and gals mess it up. You absolutely get it wrong 75% or more each and every single time you 'balance'. Your reasons for said balance don't make sense, confuse the player base and even when you try to base it on lore....it doesn't make sense. The pet nerfs for druid? lol, who are you kidding? Only yourselves.

It doesn't matter what class it is.If I go to the necro forums, there are some really good questions that you ANET haven't answered.Engi Forums-same.Ranger forumsetc etc.It doesn't matter what class it is, you change things that dont need to be touched.You nerf things and buff things that no one uses or cares about.

You @arenanet change things that have no business being changed.You don't split skills that could be split between wvw/pvp/pve--thus keeping everyone happy.You like to beat dead horses--the Druid for one. Who hates druid? Who hates Ranger.

Mainhand Dagger anyone? Why does no one use that? Hmm I wonder?Condi ranger builds are trash in ranked.The newest elite that was introduced, trash in pvp. No one uses it. It's HORRIBLE.

More of the same

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@"aymnad.9023" said:I have to disagree. LB got hit hard. Yes it is a damage buff that can be fun / annoying on the mid point but I am sure guardians are even more happy. This means they are a full counter to LB just like before we had unblockable. Not only do they provide lots of projectile mitigation but also they will have good reason to have builds with retaliation (like they used to). Also lots of classes already have projectile reflects (mesmer, engi) and I am sure those with "only" blocks are happy that we cannot deal with them anymore(warriors).

People were complaining about soul beast was not just because they hit hard, have unblockable. It's because it hits hard from over 1800 range away, come on! Like, if I can't use my gap closing skills to get next to soul beast, at least let me block the arrows, right? Boom! Unblockable.As an ele main, the only reflects we have are: staff earth 3 (magnetic aura), focus earth 4 (magnetic wave, also condition cleanse) and warhorn 4 (sand sqall)As scepter/focus ele, the only ways to not be killed from 1800 away hitted for 5k each hit areInvulnerable from earth focus 5, earth focus 4, double dodge, mist form, obstructed.That's a lot of options, right? 50s CD, 25s CD, 60s CD. That's not fair trade isn't it? You will run out of dodges and CDs, the soul beast just need to 111 from far, very far and still have their CDs.To summarise it, the problem wasn't the unblockable, was the "yo, check how I kill you before you can even touch me"

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@len.7809 said:

@"aymnad.9023" said:I have to disagree. LB got hit hard. Yes it is a damage buff that can be fun / annoying on the mid point but I am sure guardians are even more happy. This means they are a full counter to LB just like before we had unblockable. Not only do they provide lots of projectile mitigation but also they will have good reason to have builds with retaliation (like they used to). Also lots of classes already have projectile reflects (mesmer, engi) and I am sure those with "only" blocks are happy that we cannot deal with them anymore(warriors).

People were complaining about soul beast was not just because they hit hard, have unblockable. It's because it hits hard from over 1800 range away, come on! Like, if I can't use my gap closing skills to get next to soul beast, at least let me block the arrows, right? Boom! Unblockable.As an ele main, the only reflects we have are: staff earth 3 (magnetic aura), focus earth 4 (magnetic wave, also condition cleanse) and warhorn 4 (sand sqall)As scepter/focus ele, the only ways to not be killed from 1800 away hitted for 5k each hit areInvulnerable from earth focus 5, earth focus 4, double dodge, mist form, obstructed.That's a lot of options, right? 50s CD, 25s CD, 60s CD. That's not fair trade isn't it? You will run out of dodges and CDs, the soul beast just need to 111 from far, very far and still have their CDs.To summarise it, the problem wasn't the unblockable, was the "yo, check how I kill you before you can even touch me"

Where is this? In WvW?

So, let me get this straight, if I go to the Ele forums and find some Diamond Legend WvW'erNONE OF THEM can beat a zerk LB Ranger?

You can't build to beat a zerk lb ranger?

I know this, if there is some ELE build that rips me a new kitten--say something condi, I either change my build to combat that (if I see it enough), accept that it counters my class or I play a class that counters them.

Simple. Easy.

Go play a zerk Ranger and tell me how all mighty and powerful they are.If its fun, keep playing it.Or hey, learn the weaknesses and beat them!

Novel ideas, I know.Its core Winning Strategy for any MMO with pvp

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Yes, that's in wvw, and that's not just 1 ranger, they are EVERYWHRE wvw is not 5vs5 sometimes 5vs 7 or 1vs3 or vice versa. Pew pew from 1800 away, the range is the issue as I mentioned. Seems you didn't get it.There's no a class that counters all classes in wvw tho.And again, I'm bitching about the rangers longbow shooting range. Get my point.

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@len.7809 said:Yes, that's in wvw, and that's not just 1 ranger, they are EVERYWHRE wvw is not 5vs5 sometimes 5vs 7 or 1vs3 or vice versa. Pew pew from 1800 away, the range is the issue as I mentioned. Seems you didn't get it.There's no a class that counters all classes in wvw tho.And again, I'm kitten about the rangers longbow shooting range. Get my point.

You're point was pretty simple.

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@len.7809 said:

@aymnad.9023 said:I never said this build did'nt need a nerf. In fact I was 100%ok with reducing the unblockable to 2s and reducing the sic em bonus from 5% to 10%. The problem is that this also affects sPvP where you will never get this range and most of the classes can already deal with slb. (not to mention obstacles). As you said this probably was meant for WvW in priority. Warhorn / LB was not really used in sPvP where it is better to have close combat option with a range option. (I consider warhorn long range for dmg build and close for a support build).

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@DemonSeed.3528 said:

@anduriell.6280 said:I really wish core pets got reworked, we see the same pets all the time. We need pet diversity in PvP/WvW, they are all wasted opportunities.

Agreed. Seeing all these big changes for every patch (which I freaking love).I am. Save to assume that some are coming for druid and core ranger too.Atm soulbeast dominates hard and Anet wants to even stuff out. As they mentioned they like the place it is in right now, so I think druid and ranger will get some heavy improvements.I just wonder how long it will take.

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@EnderzShadow.2506 said:Don't come here and try to act like you want anything but nerfs for a class you haven't learned to beat.After all these nerfs, Rangers are still going to beat you. No amount of nerfs will make up for poor player skill.

I usually kill with no problem 99% of soulbeast I found. BUT the ammount of (unblockable) damage Soulbeast can make is no sense.The fact they are easy to face doesn't mean that in WvW they can make 25k with Maul, 3,5k x12 with Rapid Fire + 2k each arrow with One Wolf Pack..Of course it happened that I get oneshotte by a soulbeast, especially while I was fighting someone else, like in 1vs2/3.How many times I have downed an enemy, started safe stomp with Shadowstep and get destroyed by a noob soulbeast came from nowhere that only press 1 key?It's the game..This doesn't mean I don't know how to face them, but again is no sense IMHO make tons of damage at 1'500 range without any kind of problem.If this for you is fairy, then take back also oneshot perma stealth deadeye, that was the same shit.

Here we are talking to class balance: ranger have tons of Bonus Damage in their traits, like no other classes, so is normal to tone down their damage (like in fact they have done now).

If you want to check the fact that I know how to kill a soulbeast or not, you can find me roaming on Piken. :3

And you play a necro. I am not surprised.

I basically only play Thief and not Necro.. Or well, I use to play D/P Daredevil for the most of my time: so please don't come tell me that ranger gets more nerfs then Daredevil.Guess based on what you can say I play necro LOL. I usually only write in Thief forum.

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@SehferViega.8725 said:Here we are talking to class balance: ranger have tons of Bonus Damage in their traits, like no other classes, so is normal to tone down their damage (like in fact they have done now).

And like no other classes, ranger was designed with taxed power coefficients on all their weapons because of an AI (that is hopelessly bad). You can't make an argument for class balance without all the pieces on the table.

A 25k Maul means they're heavily invested and will drop like flies. You can't get those numbers with a more balanced gear setup, especially not when fighting someone else that isn't full zerk either. Longbow on the other hand is always gonna be oppressive in WvW, and I honestly think that's completely fair when the class itself has never had a build fit for the zerg meta.

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@"Lazze.9870" said:A 25k Maul means they're heavily invested and will drop like flies. You can't get those numbers with a more balanced gear setup, especially not when fighting someone else that isn't full zerk either. Longbow on the other hand is always gonna be oppressive in WvW, and I honestly think that's completely fair when the class itself has never had a build fit for the zerg meta.

I just take an example of the damage a Soulbeast can made.. insane.Of course with balanced gear and trait setup they can't reach that damage, but they can gain lots of survabilities making anyway great damages.

"They will drop like flies"..1) First you have to close the distance gap, easy with thief, not so easy with other classes.2) They will have Lesser Signet of Stone for sure that grants survability (cause is in Marksmanship) and maybe they can have Signet of Stone too. So you can run a full offensive build that hits from 1500 range with 2 Endure Pain.3) If you run a full offensive build with thief you can't reach the same damage as Soulbeast in competitive modes, no way.. Just to take another example.

I can understand Maul damage: is a skill easy to dodge or interrupt, with a 220 range.But Longbow damage is absolutely no sense considering range, projectile speed, Ranger mobility and survability.

Soulbeast/Ranger grants easy kills also to a completly noob player like no other classes do.. Guess why XD

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@SehferViega.8725 said:But Longbow damage is absolutely no sense considering range, projectile speed, Ranger mobility and survability.

Ugh. No sense to someone that refuse to admit WvW is inherently inbalanced and played on maps that favors a weapon like the longbow when roaming in open areas. People are gonna complain about longbow in that mode until it's completely deleted from the game. It doesn't surprise me that you play two of the classes most prone to die to longbow builds, even when you claim to beat 99 % of them. Which also makes me question why you even bother to complain about it at all. Sounds like free lootbags to me.

They drop like flies when I fight them, and as a fellow Piken roamer, it means I'm fighting the same rangers as you. And I'm not using longbow myself.

SoS trait means Marksmanship. Marksmanship means you dropped WS or BM, the former lowering your fury uptime and damage, the latter lowering your consistent damage, and both lowering your surviveability. If running SoS x2 was as good as Endure Pain x2, it would break stuns aswell. Aware that's not your point, but the skills aren't equal.

@SehferViega.8725 said:3) If you run a full offensive build with thief you can't reach the same damage as Soulbeast in competitive modes, no way.. Just to take another example.Your mobility and ability to disengange is better and some of that damage is already being adressed in the upcoming patch. Incremental nerfs are almost always better, whether you like it or not.

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