Imagine if Holo, Warrior, Thief, Mirage, and Firebrand got nerfed

Before I list each class, please make Sigil of Energy operate on an 18-second cooldown. Mirage, Bunker Weaver and Bunker Daredevil live around this sigil.

Holo: self-explanatory. Something needs to be done about their tankiness (Iron Blooded and Protection) and Shockwave hitbox (hitbox should be flatter and smaller). Increase heat build-up speed.

Warrior: all forms are kinda good in their own right, moreso Spellbreaker and then Core. Make Reckless Dodge blockable to start, and do something about the Might gen for Spellbreakers (looking at Magebane Tether). Burst skills are NOT able to be affected by Quickness.

Thief: Improvisation is a busted trait. Let steal recharge skill categories by 30 seconds, not fully recharge them (will refill some skills, but not others on heavy CDs such as Dagger Storm). Let Binding Shadow's animation be visible in stealth. Lower vault damage by ~15%.

Mirage: adjust Chaotic Interruption by removing/replacing immobilize. The synergy with Mantra of Distraction is just unreal. Increase Evasive Mirror CD to 15 seconds. Decrease duration of Lesser Chaos Storm by half.

Firebrand: Its synergy with Scourge is insane. The combination of resistance, healing, etc is too much. It outpaces other support specs. Needs more team support nerfs (reducing additional tomes would be a start, or even just removing the trait). If cancelling/interrupted while casting Signet of Mercy, 10 seconds will need to pass before being able to cast it again (similar to being affected by Power Block), because I've seen many Firebrands interrupted while casting the signet only to be casting it again a 2 seconds later--no reward in that.

Imagine if ..., ..., Thief, ..., and ... got nerfed

I Read that, I stop, troll

Nerf cc-influence of rampage and give cd to Evasive Mirror, also thief's improvisation shouldnt work on elite and holo have a little bit more sustain than deserve build with cc spam and good damage

Holo: yes.

Warrior: Reckless dodge can be blockable, I think that's a good idea. Although I really think increasing the cast time of burst skills is a very bad idea. Obviously this is only targeted at arcing slice, but to do it to every burst would hurt every other weapon type too, some like Rifle and Axe moreso than others. Arcing slice in general isn't very hard to predict and avoid. It's got a .5s cast time and only 150 range. At any health% above 50 it tickles too.

Thief: Can someone explain to me what they did to thief this patch? Why is everyone so against the class all of the sudden? The only thing I thought they should change prior was Instant Reflexes. Passive saves like that are supposed to be deleted from this game.

Mirage: CI doesn't need to be deleted, but given an internal cooldown, most def. Having a trait that combos into itself is just stupid. Mantra of distraction in general needs some type of nerf, maybe removing the recharge effect to F3 and increasing the CD. CI Mirage is up there i'd say, in the least fun builds to play against in GW2's competitive history.

Firebrand: I kind of feel like this shouldn't be nerfed, because there isn't many support options in the game at all. Like, the only other that comes to mind is Tempest, and i'd much rather see that class be buffed to become an equally viable support option rather than nerfing the only one we have. Signet of Mercy though could definitely be changed. I think it should keep the 150s CD from PvE. To compare, a warrior running Battle Standard, which did the same exact thing before; had and still has a 180s CD, double that of Signet of Mercy, and that's an elite skill.

@Raiden The Beast.3016 said:Imagine if ..., ..., Thief, ..., and ... got nerfed

I Read that, I stop, troll

Literally every patch isa thief nerf lmao...

Should we welcome everyone to our pity party lul

Oh yes, nerf thief. LoL.

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:Firebrand: Its synergy with Scourge is insane. The combination of resistance, healing, etc is too much. It outpaces other support specs. Needs a big team support nerf and more self-sustain to compensate. If cancelling/interrupted while casting Signet of Mercy, 10 seconds will need to pass before being able to cast it again (similar to being affected by Power Block).

This is literally the exact opposite of what we want to happen with Support Firebrand.

The reason Firebrand gets away with being literally THE support in the game while other specs like Scrapper, Tempest, and especially Druid get nerfed or are forced to languish behind it is because Firebrand is the first time Anet has designed a support spec for GW2 that was exclusively a team support and didn't just use it's healing to become an unkillable side node bunker. It's also significantly easier to kill compared to all those classes at their height.

What we want are for scrappers, tempests, revenant, and druids to be able to step into Firebrand's role as a team support on equal but unique footing without creating a bunch of unkillable bunker builds that just squat on side nodes all day like we saw when Scrapper was recently reworked.

Buff thief. Need Moar buff

EDIT: Realized I am not even surprised anymore

Vault damage rn is not good for the game given that it can be spammed. Idc where thief is in meta, if something is not good for game it should be adjusted. I agree with everything op said except firebrand. I think thats not the correct way to nerf fb. It just needs shaving in access to boons. Keep or even buff the potency, reduce the variety.

I agree that improv should not full reset skills like Daggerstorm, it's way too impactful. I would be okay with double basi venom though. Binding shadow needs an animation.

Reckless dodger should literally get a 75% damage reduction. It's a minor adept trait and it hits for twice as hard as bound while also being unblockable. I would also reduce damage by all rampage skills by removing the "physical" classification.

Greatly reduce the healing from heat therapy. Increase the cd of Holo leap to 6 seconds if an enemy was not hit. (Similar to what they did to ride the lightning all those years ago). Reduce radius of shockwave.

10 second icd on CI, or remove the immob from it.Lesser chaos field nerfs to go. Make it something else, lesser null field perhaps.

Reduce the amount of evades sword Weaver has access to. Riptide alone is almost 20% evade uptime. Move some of the burning from primordial stance to weapon skills. Increase range of dual attacks to 180.

Firebrand, increase the cooldown of signet of Mercy to 150.

Holo and warrior with quickness are insanely op. Sigil of agility needs to be removed from the game, and holo self quickness needs a substantial nerf with elixir and kinetic battery. Quickness in general needs duration nerfs on most class skills.

Mirage CI needs a nerf, and their mantra daze needs a huge nerf.Let me outline everything mantra of distraction can do:

• instant cast, 1200 range, 5 target daze
• takes 15s off the cd of diversion
• can be used TWICE every ~15 seconds???

Boon duration in general needs a nerf, its especially needed for FB.

So many easy changes to start balancing pvp. All we can do is hope a change comes sooner than the next balance patch 3 months from now.

war and mes nerfs are lol.reckless dodge needs a nerf tho.

LOL people still get hit by Vault? Really?

@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:I agree that improv should not full reset skills like Daggerstorm, it's way too impactful. I would be okay with double basi venom though. Binding shadow needs an animation.

Reckless dodger should literally get a 75% damage reduction. It's a minor adept trait and it hits for twice as hard as bound while also being unblockable. I would also reduce damage by all rampage skills by removing the "physical" classification.

Greatly reduce the healing from heat therapy. Increase the cd of Holo leap to 6 seconds if an enemy was not hit. (Similar to what they did to ride the lightning all those years ago). Reduce radius of shockwave.

10 second icd on CI, or remove the immob from it.Lesser chaos field nerfs to go. Make it something else, lesser null field perhaps.

Reduce the amount of evades sword Weaver has access to. Riptide alone is almost 20% evade uptime. Move some of the burning from primordial stance to weapon skills. Increase range of dual attacks to 180.

Firebrand, increase the cooldown of signet of Mercy to 150.

Why do I have to repeat this to people that suggest a riptide nerf. RIPTIDE GOT HIT THREE TIMES BECAUSE OF HEALING/EVADE.

You are literally punishing a class for comboing into one of the few healing fields they have because of an evade. You better give them their original healing modifier back if you plan to cut any evades frames because watching other classes barely have their own evades nerfed but having to suffer getting CC'd and bursted is BS while everyone else has a: 'I win' card. Seriously, suggest compensations or stop suggesting at all about classes people maybe pick up once in a blue moon.

@Raiden The Beast.3016 said:Imagine if ..., ..., Thief, ..., and ... got nerfed

I Read that, I stop, troll

Did you even read the nerf I proposed? I think even Thief mains would agree that Improvization is too much. Binding Shadow's nerf in stealth is more of a QoL fix since there is zero counterplay with a Deadeye that stealthed, and finally Vault is too spammy with the bunker build that has been popping up (and which I find unhealthy for the game).

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

slow down burst skill animations/cast times--the telegraphs are too fast especially with quickness.

Isn't that why quickness was created? and not only applies with the warrior xDD

I've adjusted my post after considering suggestions.

Thief: I think Improv on 30 seconds recharge would work very well with most people. It isn't too OP, would for the most part function very similarly to how it is right now except it doesn't 100% recharge Shadowstep and Dagger Storm.

Warrior: Burst skills remain the same cast time but they aren't able to be affected by Quickness. Dueling a Warrior should be very much based on telegraphing and avoiding burst skills, which I think Quickness makes it unfair coupled with the fact that you get punished very hard when hit by a Burst skill in some cases. Shouldn't affect too many Warrior mains. Keep this PVP/WVW only.

Firebrand: Tome count reduced = less healing and support and more strategy of what to use.

don't remove immob from chaotic interruption. its been there forever, if ppl are having problems with it then that's their problem. wouldn't mind a distraction mantra cd increase.

as always nerf will come... in 6 months-1 year

@Lala.8752 said:as always nerf will come... in 6 months-1 year

You're optimistic.

Out of those holo is the one that is truly broken. The amount of burst, sticking power, active defenses, tankiness and boon generation is absolutely ridiculous.

Photon forge needs REAL drawbacks. Free stability needs to GO. They are hulking juggernauts with protection and just about every single boon in the book rushing at you with 2s cd gap closers and 4-6k dmg hits + CC up the ass. They're pressured? Oh? let me activate shield stuff and the shield utility skill, stealth or invuln. Or what about a comboable healing skill that recovers 10k health on a 20s cd and is nigh impossible to interrupt?

People say corrupt ruins holo, except holo eats scourge.

@"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

@Raiden The Beast.3016 said:Imagine if ..., ..., Thief, ..., and ... got nerfed

I Read that, I stop, troll

I read again, i stop, troll me again ?

But to be more honest, impro I somehow agree, but for now we need it. Dont even start with DE and vault is learn t p i.

@Razor.6392 said:Out of those holo is the one that is truly broken. The amount of burst, sticking power, active defenses, tankiness and boon generation is absolutely ridiculous.

Photon forge needs REAL drawbacks. Free stability needs to GO. They are hulking juggernauts with protection and just about every single boon in the book rushing at you with 2s cd gap closers and 4-6k dmg hits + CC up the kitten. They're pressured? Oh? let me activate shield stuff and the shield utility skill, stealth or invuln. Or what about a comboable healing skill that recovers 10k health on a 20s cd and is nigh impossible to interrupt?

People say corrupt ruins holo, except holo eats scourge.

I have suggested a long time ago to make burning increase heat generation. Maybe one stack = +1%/s. To compensate, maybe make chilled reduce it.

people really complain about staff thief? wow this forum never fails to impress