Who are The Raiders? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Who are The Raiders?

In my time of playing, 9 out of the 10 raiders identities apart from our characters has never been identified, do we know who they are and their relationship with our character? are they also the pact commanders or the splinter group of the surviving pact members? if i'm not mistaken there were more than one commander of the pact in the dialogue on one of the episodes of ls2 where Trahearne said he wanted to speak with Commander X (didn't remember his/her name) so it is possible that 9 of them survived the pact fleet destruction. that's my theory it would be good if Raid Team/Lore Team gives insight to who they are.

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  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 21, 2019

    My understanding of the raiding storyline is that none of them are pact commanders, but rather that they're merely adventurers/mercenaries.

    Glenna doesn't ever call the PC a Commander, nor does any of the Pact Soldiers in Spriit Vale. In fact, the word "commander" never shows up in the raids, ever.

    I'd imagine that Glenna and Falgeir would both know who the Dragonslayer is, and Falgeir would no doubt refer to his superior (at the time) by rank. On top of that, when Zomorros sent his invitation to Glenna and the raiders, it was directed to Glenna and "those wonderful adventurers [she] always seem to be traveling around with". Zomorros would no doubt denote the Pact Commander in such a semiformal invitation letter.

    That said, the initial letter for Spirit Vale does imply that the raiders are Pact soldiers, though it would be left unclear if they're official soldiers (e.g., from the orders) or hired mercenaries. Either way, the group is only ever referred to as "adventurers". Same with Fractals.

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  • Kossage.9072Kossage.9072 Member ✭✭✭

    Although Glenna doesn't outright refer to any of the raiders as the Commander (and even seems to differentiate the raiders of Spirit Vale and the "adventurers" of Salvation Pass in her field journal), the canonicity of the Pact Commander's involvement in raids is a bit murky as we appear to have two alternate timelines depending on the player's involvement in raids. Squad Leader Bennett has voiced dialogue in Bloodstone Fen which changes depending on if the player Commander helped save him in Salvation Pass or not, which suggests that at least in one timeline the Commander potentially participated in the Salvation Pass raid similar to how in each timeline, regardless of the Commander's involvement with Apatia or lack thereof, the Pact recovered the blue orb in personal story:

    If rescued Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: After you rescued me, I notified the queen about Salvation Pass. Then I regrouped with my squad and chased some White Mantle here.
    If didn't rescue Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: After I was rescued, I notified the queen about Salvation Pass. Then I regrouped with my squad and chased some White Mantle here. [...]
    If rescued Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: I've been thanking Dwayna you busted me out of that infernal place. If not for you, I'd be rotting in a ditch.
    If didn't rescue Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: I've been thanking Dwayna that the rescue team found me in time. If not for them, I'd be rotting in a ditch.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Kossage.9072 said:
    Although Glenna doesn't outright refer to any of the raiders as the Commander (and even seems to differentiate the raiders of Spirit Vale and the "adventurers" of Salvation Pass in her field journal),

    Rather than differentiating the groups, it seems more like she did not know who the "a group of mercenaries" were and did not presume they were the same group as the "Groups of stalwart explorers". This makes sense, given that Glenna had minimal relevance to Spirit Vale, being nothing more than a merchant there, and having no direct interaction with the raiders beyond that optional merchant function. This changed with Salvation Pass, and she was the one who sent the mail for Stronghold (and all later raids since).

    the canonicity of the Pact Commander's involvement in raids is a bit murky as we appear to have two alternate timelines depending on the player's involvement in raids. Squad Leader Bennett has voiced dialogue in Bloodstone Fen which changes depending on if the player Commander helped save him in Salvation Pass or not, which suggests that at least in one timeline the Commander potentially participated in the Salvation Pass raid similar to how in each timeline, regardless of the Commander's involvement with Apatia or lack thereof, the Pact recovered the blue orb in personal story:

    I wouldn't really relate it to the PS' paths "always happening even if the PC doesn't take part". Nor would I really be so fast to say that whether or not the Commander is involved is a "alternate timeline" thing. Rather, I felt this was just a fun "easter egg" ArenaNet put in. This is, after all, the only example of the story acknowledging the player involvement in raids. The Commander doesn't recognize the Eye of Janthir if they did Bastion of the Penitent, for example. And if Bennett can recognize the Commander without introduction in Bloodstone Fen, why is there no recognition of rank in Salvation Pass?

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  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Kossage.9072 said:
    Although Glenna doesn't outright refer to any of the raiders as the Commander (and even seems to differentiate the raiders of Spirit Vale and the "adventurers" of Salvation Pass in her field journal), the canonicity of the Pact Commander's involvement in raids is a bit murky as we appear to have two alternate timelines depending on the player's involvement in raids. Squad Leader Bennett has voiced dialogue in Bloodstone Fen which changes depending on if the player Commander helped save him in Salvation Pass or not, which suggests that at least in one timeline the Commander potentially participated in the Salvation Pass raid similar to how in each timeline, regardless of the Commander's involvement with Apatia or lack thereof, the Pact recovered the blue orb in personal story:

    If rescued Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: After you rescued me, I notified the queen about Salvation Pass. Then I regrouped with my squad and chased some White Mantle here.
    If didn't rescue Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: After I was rescued, I notified the queen about Salvation Pass. Then I regrouped with my squad and chased some White Mantle here. [...]
    If rescued Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: I've been thanking Dwayna you busted me out of that infernal place. If not for you, I'd be rotting in a ditch.
    If didn't rescue Bennett at Salvation Pass:
    Squad Leader Bennett: I've been thanking Dwayna that the rescue team found me in time. If not for them, I'd be rotting in a ditch.

    I'd not take this too heavily, as there are bits where people refer to the PC depending on how far they got in personal story (mainly during season 1 of LS), even though explicitly in the timeline Scarlet's stuff happened after Zhaitan died.

    And then of course, like Dragon's Stand where Laranthir has three distinct sets of dialogue depending on where in the story you are, even though the battle only takes place once. Anet, during living story season 1, mentioned that big events, like the Marionette boss battle, happened one time. You didn't come back every so often and defeat (or get defeated) by the giant clockwork creation. The commander/people fought it once, won, then moved on. This is referenced with other boss battles as well. Such as "Claw of Jormag" is not a single dragon, but a host of champions. Tequatl is noted as having withdrawn and re-emerged multiple times until the "Tequatl rising" update, where he is defeated and declared dead. In Jahai, Almorra directly references the death-branded shatterer as being the same one from Blazeridge Steppes that the vigil fought.

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @Kossage.9072 said:
    Although Glenna doesn't outright refer to any of the raiders as the Commander (and even seems to differentiate the raiders of Spirit Vale and the "adventurers" of Salvation Pass in her field journal),

    Rather than differentiating the groups, it seems more like she did not know who the "a group of mercenaries" were and did not presume they were the same group as the "Groups of stalwart explorers". This makes sense, given that Glenna had minimal relevance to Spirit Vale, being nothing more than a merchant there, and having no direct interaction with the raiders beyond that optional merchant function. This changed with Salvation Pass, and she was the one who sent the mail for Stronghold (and all later raids since).

    the canonicity of the Pact Commander's involvement in raids is a bit murky as we appear to have two alternate timelines depending on the player's involvement in raids. Squad Leader Bennett has voiced dialogue in Bloodstone Fen which changes depending on if the player Commander helped save him in Salvation Pass or not, which suggests that at least in one timeline the Commander potentially participated in the Salvation Pass raid similar to how in each timeline, regardless of the Commander's involvement with Apatia or lack thereof, the Pact recovered the blue orb in personal story:

    I wouldn't really relate it to the PS' paths "always happening even if the PC doesn't take part". Nor would I really be so fast to say that whether or not the Commander is involved is a "alternate timeline" thing. Rather, I felt this was just a fun "easter egg" ArenaNet put in. This is, after all, the only example of the story acknowledging the player involvement in raids. The Commander doesn't recognize the Eye of Janthir if they did Bastion of the Penitent, for example. And if Bennett can recognize the Commander without introduction in Bloodstone Fen, why is there no recognition of rank in Salvation Pass?

    Doesn't the commander also have to be informed about the ritual to revive Lazarus? I recall the first few raid parts dealt heavily with white mantle and that ritual, but the bloodstone fen episode the commander didn't know about the White Mantle presence in the jungle.

  • Kai.9264Kai.9264 Member ✭✭
    edited August 7, 2019

    @Bobby Stein.3612 said:
    We purposely leave this vague to allow room for role-playing. Whether you want to be "the" Commander, "a" commander, or just a mercenary while playing raids is totally fine in my opinion. The stories inside raids, while thematically relevant to the Living World and Personal Story, don't really intersect except for the occasional comment by a character in the open world. If you did the raid, we think it's good for characters to acknowledge that. But if you didn't we still consider the events of the raid as canon--something that someone in the world did. We try to account for either scenario since each player's progress will be different.

    While inside a raid, you shouldn't ever be addressed as "the Commander" by the characters because it's not relevant to what's going on. These characters don't know you as anyone other than someone willing to help, so your past accomplishments don't really matter to the task at hand. We do show raiders develop a bit of a friendship with Glenna, but again we don't bother with the Commander distinction.

    Raids don't treat the instance owner as the raid "story owner" since raids are about the group, not the individual. Because of that, we provide moments where any player in the squad can chime in during scenes, thus alleviating the problem of "who gets to be the Commander and who is just a mercenary" in the squad. Does that make sense?

    In short, be who you want to be inside raids but don't expect to be addressed as the Commander. B)

    this is very nice and refreshing to me. I enjoy this kind of character role more then being the big hero commander who everyone knows and everyone needs you to save the day/world

  • @Bobby Stein.3612 said:
    We purposely leave this vague to allow room for role-playing.

    Freedom to role play in story and mechanics are exactly why I think raids are some of the best content in GW2. The Commander's story doesn't grip me much and I rarely need to tinker my build to complete it, leaving it low impact and forgettable both in narrative and gameplay.

    I greatly appreciate the effort put into raids and I hope they get more advertising and exposure as they are some of the only content that keep me, my SO, and my community in game. We eagerly await W8!

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