is scrapper discount holosmith — Guild Wars 2 Forums

is scrapper discount holosmith

foste.3098foste.3098 Member ✭✭✭
edited August 22, 2019 in Engineer

Instead of a tank/bunker scrapper became a discount holosmith. The most used scrapper build in pvp is a rifle build with explosives trait line using grenade kit to do huge bursts. The build doesn't even use any gyros, the entire elite spec is backwards. Imo there needs to be another total rework if this mess.

Comments

  • @foste.3098 said:
    Imo there needs to be another total rework if this mess.

    I agree! Penalized for being a Scrapper now :'( Sad sad days

  • foste.3098foste.3098 Member ✭✭✭
    edited July 25, 2019

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    Still relevant.

    And where exactly did i ask for nerfs? i said that the elite spec is a failure because it is designed to be a bunker but is used as a burst/dps spec instead because it works better that way, overlapping its role with holosmith. What's even the point of engineer having 2 elite specs when they both are the exact same thing?

  • EnderzShadow.2506EnderzShadow.2506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    Still relevant.

    Still funny

    mhm, ok, sure, whatever you say, no after you, I insist, no really, please, be my guest,

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @foste.3098 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    Still relevant.

    And where exactly did i ask for nerfs? i said that the elite spec is a failure because it is designed to be a bunker but is used as a burst/dps spec instead because it works better that way, overlapping its role with holosmith. What's even the point of engineer having 2 elite specs when they both are the exact same thing?

    I think you missed the point of my post.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • EnderzShadow.2506EnderzShadow.2506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @foste.3098 said:
    Instead of a tank/bunker scrapper became a discount holosmith. The most used scrapper build in pvp is a rifle build with explosives trait line using grenade kit to do huge bursts. The build doesn't even use any gyros, the entire elite spec is backwards. Imo there needs to be another total rework if this mess.

    Total rework needs to be a total reversal.

    @foste.3098 said:
    Instead of a tank/bunker scrapper became a discount holosmith. The most used scrapper build in pvp is a rifle build with explosives trait line using grenade kit to do huge bursts. The build doesn't even use any gyros, the entire elite spec is backwards. Imo there needs to be another total rework if this mess.

    What build are you talking about? I haven't seen this yet.
    Sounds like a drunk scrapper variant.

    Now I want to try that build. Anyone play it?

    mhm, ok, sure, whatever you say, no after you, I insist, no really, please, be my guest,

  • EnderzShadow.2506EnderzShadow.2506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @foste.3098 Haven't seen what you're talking about...which is basically a 'nade drunk scrapper'. That's pretty much what you've described.
    "rifle build with explosives trait line using grenade kit to do huge bursts. The build doesn't even use any gyros"

    mhm, ok, sure, whatever you say, no after you, I insist, no really, please, be my guest,

  • foste.3098foste.3098 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 18, 2019

    I put some thought in and came up with this idea: what if instead of having a function gyro skill that replaces f5 and is useless in pve, scrapper gets to choose out of 3 f5 function gyros through grandmaster traits in the same way a daredevil gets to pick a dodge.

    So we would have the 1st gm function gyro trait that is support based and basically be what the f5 is now, the 2nd gm trait that is bunker oriented and could drop a field that pulses protection, stability, and grants allies increased endurance recovery, and the 3rd gm that is offensive and pulses vulnerability and damage to enemies in the field.
    These 3 suggestion are just to get the idea across but the function gyros can be made vastly different through the 3 gm traits, we could have 3 different combo fields, or different aoe sizes, as long as the 3 traits covers different facets of scraper: support, bunker(or bruiser) and damage (not holosmith level of damage).

    This would also solve the issue of scrappers being completely excluded from pve, assuming that the damage function gyro (gm trait) is good enough to lift scrappers dps to a level where, when combined with its other perks, it becomes good enough to bring to at least high end fractals.

  • Matoro.9708Matoro.9708 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lonami.2987 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    Still relevant.

    Beautiful. Can't believe I never saw it before, thanks for sharing.

    I second this. Frankly I feel I'd have more dignity as a tree - none of this commander of the pact nonsense: the only engineers I've seen make a difference are the fellas who built the airship prototypes. Plus it'd be canon to use the twigs as the legs for my turrets...

    Society either needs a turret rework or to free bobby schmurda and I wonder which comes first?

  • I'd just try to move on at this stage. If you're not really into WvW and going support Scrapper, which is still pretty good due to the core engineer aspects, then there's not really much left and I doubt anything will be address until at least (if ever... Anet thinks this is a 'fix') September. Either continue playing the scrapper (warts and all), try and get into Holosmith (which is honestly a better 'bruiser/bully' at this stage and playing it this way isn't even the full extent of Holos power) or move on to a different class.

  • Ruufio.1496Ruufio.1496 Member ✭✭✭

    @Lonami.2987 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    Still relevant.

    Beautiful. Can't believe I never saw it before, thanks for sharing.

    So kitten acccurate even today holy kitten

  • Matoro.9708Matoro.9708 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ambrosius Custard.8137 said:
    I'd just try to move on at this stage. If you're not really into WvW and going support Scrapper, which is still pretty good due to the core engineer aspects, then there's not really much left and I doubt anything will be address until at least (if ever... Anet thinks this is a 'fix') September. Either continue playing the scrapper (warts and all), try and get into Holosmith (which is honestly a better 'bruiser/bully' at this stage and playing it this way isn't even the full extent of Holos power) or move on to a different class.

    I think I'll try running core turret engi in WvW and see if I can take cognitive dissonance so far they have to come up with a new term.

    Society either needs a turret rework or to free bobby schmurda and I wonder which comes first?

  • Condi scrapper is still viable in WvW roaming, however only due to the high tough/vita combined with barrier (more effective with higher toughness) and healing traits. In PvP it lacks either toghness or vitality thanks to the -3000HP :/

  • Greyjoy.5167Greyjoy.5167 Member ✭✭
    edited August 19, 2019

    required amount of characters.
    Sorry, removing my comment. It was a nonsense.

  • I was pretty unhappy with the changes to scrapper, pure melee specs have a tough time outside of sPvP due to how easy is to kite people around.
    I don't think the spec is dead, in fact I would say that the support build kind of improved, superspeed on blasts and how bulkwark gyro works now is enough to warrant taking scrapper over some core line. Said that, the spec itself doesn't feel support oriented, the infamous impact savant does nothing for either support or condi builds, and the traits are very underwhelming.
    I've played for the past couple of weeks with a ton of different approaches, from glassy to tanky bruiser, and being a melee oriented spec is tough.
    A thief should never die against you unless they're focusing on another enemy, a ranger can easily not just escape you in every way possible (from invisibility to the plenty movility skills they have access to) but is also capable of downing you without you even having the chance to produce barrier.
    Revenants, elementalists and mesmers have an easy time doing the same, and the only classes you can engage in similar combat are warrior, necromancer and guardian, as they are also melee oriented in most current builds.
    I don't believe that in this game every class should be good against every class, but even when you compare it with similarly oriented classes, the scrapper feels like a niche spec, not very well designed around the strenghts and weaknesses of the core class.
    See for instance how well flamethrower synergizes with the lower line of traits on scrapper (might on stab, extra damage with superspeed, swiftness and stab, access to quickness on might), all of this works pretty well with flamethrower, it has access to the right amount of stab and might to proc those traits, also swiftness and blasts to produce superspeed. It should be the goto skill to bring with a scrapper, but the autoattack is so diluded in multihits that unless you go full glass, you receive more damage from retaliation than what you do against the enemy. The damage is consistent, yes, but too low to synergize well with impact savant, making the synergies it does have, to feel underwhelming.
    So lets say that you want to make it work and be the promised juggernaut with scrapper, you bring firearms, it works well with close quarters and flamethrower, and you bring the mandatory alchemist line, to reach the 25 stacks of might, have some stunbreaks and extra stab.

    It should be a working build, if healing gyro is improved back up, flamethrower gets its hits number reduced and the damage increased, maybe even increase the radius on some skills (FT 2), imo make flamewall be a straight line from the caster and not perpendicular, and a bit wider.
    I can see it bringing something different from core and holo, with consistent damage output and barrier to compensate for the lack of health and regeneration.

  • Iozeph.5617Iozeph.5617 Member ✭✭✭

    Here, have a song- it's an old one and a good one. Isn't hard to guess which one. I just changed a few lines here and there.

    Happy guns are burning cold
    from projectile hate
    Runnin condi no one buys it
    Cleansed so easy

    Trade-offs landing everywhere
    Lost a belt skill it's not fair
    Vent your spleen the devs don't care
    'Cause it's alright

    I will get by
    I will get by
    I will get by
    I will survive

    I see you wrote your gripes out
    Some white knight told you,'Get out!'
    You got a forum ban for it
    But it's alright

    Lot's of time while you're in jail
    To peruse the gem store sales
    Where every legendary's got a
    Touch of fail

    I will get by
    I will get by
    I will get by
    I will survive

    Such a mystery to me
    The core nerfed just to balance the elite
    The things that worked
    have been replaced
    bite down and chew- ignore the taste

    It's a lesson to me
    To never beg for balance when aggrieved
    The kinds of change
    we all hoped for
    Wound up discarded on the floor

    With no expansion pack for years
    The healing turret's grinding gears
    And nothin' said to quell your fears
    But it's alright

    Core Engineer's a meme
    Parity's a long lost dream
    And no one wants you on their team
    But it's alright

    You will get by
    You will get by
    You will get by
    You will survive

    Nothing doin' fielding kits
    Impact Savant is full of @!%#
    So chug elixirs, throw a fit
    Cause it's alright

    Holo, Scrapper, it's all stale
    I told you once before to bail
    But you played on despite the fail
    And it's alright.

    You will get by
    You will get by
    You will get by
    You will survive

    We will get by
    We will get by
    We will get by
    We will survive...

  • @Baltzenger.2467 said:
    So lets say that you want to make it work and be the promised juggernaut with scrapper, you bring firearms, it works well with close quarters and flamethrower, and you bring the mandatory alchemist line, to reach the 25 stacks of might, have some stunbreaks and extra stab.

    What I don't like is pulsing might on stability competing with gyro superspeed for groups.
    You get group superspeed from FT-2, but only if there is no projectile-hate.

    I often run a power-scrapper-zerg build, using blast/shredder/mortar _and _explosives/firearms.
    So, by dismissing alchemy _for _explosives _for more damage, using _juggernaut, mass momentum, object in motion, applied force _and _flamethrower, heal-, blast- and shredder-gyro _+ _mortar, you get a pretty strong glass canon with high barrier generation.
    However, even not considering the retaliation issue, camping hammer/mortar _does more damage with _flamethrower _and you lose _modified ammunition. Gyros would also be enough superspeed generation with gyroscopic acceleration _ instead of _mass momenum. Regarding might, hammer-1 + blast-gyro is also plenti to get above 10 stacks. In WvW even in small zergs/groups you are at 25 most of the time.

    So, in direct comparison, even if you already use the traitlines, have the right stats and a dmg-oriented build, this trait synergy is actually a downgrade.

    It works well in a drunken-scrapper-variant at some pvp setups and on Halloween-labyrinth-farm, though. ^^

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