Old school PvP please?

I’m really not a fan of the gw2 PvP just base on capturing points...can we at least have one mode in rank that’s death match like GW1?I could play GW1 PvP all day because it was more engaging and fun unlike gw2 people just teleport away to capture points...like what is the POINT of PvP!!????? This is worse than MOBA game concept....many times I see my teams just scatter around trying to capture points,,. It is so lame and extremely boring...Literally everyday I just play 1 PvP game to get my daily I’m out because it suck so bad...Maybe there are some people really enjoy capture points but this is the most boring PvP game I have ever played...Probably the worst PvP mode in the market...please fix this!!

I mean isn’t it a wake up call nobody is going crazy for GW2 PvP... you don’t see massive fans tune in to watch the PvP game or tournament for a reason...Not sure if any dev will ever see this... or care about PvP in this game enough to make a change...But if you ever see this..thanks for reading.... I have been waiting since the game launch and still waiting... :'(

There are a ton of reasons why that would be a problem. Among the fact that you cant balance both gamemodes, Deathmatch has this tendency to incentivize staying alive moreso than killing an enemy. You will see a ton of bunker builds, permastealth thieves and other such builds that try to kill one guy, then just run out the timer, because unfortunately thats the most effective strategy.

@UNOwen.7132 said:There are a ton of reasons why that would be a problem. Among the fact that you cant balance both gamemodes, Deathmatch has this tendency to incentivize staying alive moreso than killing an enemy. You will see a ton of bunker builds, permastealth thieves and other such builds that try to kill one guy, then just run out the timer, because unfortunately thats the most effective strategy.

If other games can do it I don’t see why we can’t do it in GW2, in WOW rouge and Druid and go invis but that doesn’t stop blizzard from having arena PvP or changing it into capture points crap. So your argument is invalid.Plus with PvP specific stats it’s not like they can be full bunker anyways so not sure what you’re worry about. If that’s your major concern they can easily remove bunker stats and that will solve the issue lol.

But seriously if anyone here has ever played PvP in GW1 would know how bad GW2 PvP is in comparison.

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:

@"UNOwen.7132" said:There are a

ton

of reasons why that would be a problem. Among the fact that you cant balance both gamemodes, Deathmatch has this tendency to incentivize staying alive moreso than killing an enemy. You will see a ton of bunker builds, permastealth thieves and other such builds that try to kill one guy, then just run out the timer, because unfortunately thats the most effective strategy.

I played GW1 and loved it, loved the pvp. The issue is that it wouldn't work RIGHT NOW because of the way the game balance is, I mean we have soulbeasts who just poo poo on everything. Holosmsiths and Engineers in general rampaging through everything and just wrecking face; It would be a mess and you would end up with horrible match making, terrible team comps and they would have to do something about swapping durring the inital phase of the match. I WANT true pvp like gw1, like guild battless and alliance battles. I truly do.

Sadly This game is built for "PVE" and that is its focus and it couldn't be bothered to give two craps about any competitive game mode. This has been proven time and again with their lack of knowledge on how to balance, the lack of desire and the clear biases some have toward specific classes. ( I mean messmer is still a monster, as is soulbeast but messmer only recently has gotten some serious nerfs. Still not enough to stop it from over-preforming.) And then you have classes like Rev and necro. Rev only has ONE REAL viable build thats competitive and it can't be diddled with if you want to actually do well. Necromancer has scourage who is its ONLY saving grace at the moment, core is still strong but in a death-match environment I Feel like it would be hard-pressed not to get focus fired down.

The issue is the games classes would all need overhauls and frankly I Feel the Elite specs need to be merged into the base, The base needs to incorporate all of their goodies and just have a sort of "Specialize" feature where you could choose to have more of a lean into a specific arch-type. Rather than simply "Oh well this is scourage, it has no shroud because apparently people dislike it durr durr." Then give us secondary professions like the original game (Arguably would solve ALL the problems because you could choose to take a class and merge it with another, which would give you the sort of tools you may lack. Thus making balancing a bit easier because everyone would have access too X so X can't and shouldn't need to be nerfed into oblivion.)

Sure that would need new animations, new features and lord knows what it would do and how to do it. But I mean say taking a ranger and an engineer and getting a shaman and rather than turrets you get totems? Those totems function like turrets but offer benefits like spirits? Perhaps thats what happens to those utilities they merge and basically become one. Could be cool, doubt it would ever happen but it would be cool none the less~

We had courtyard in 2015, removed from rotations. You can still play it in your personal lobby or room or whatever they call it. I really don't remember how the map felt at the time. You can also play the strongholds, which I think is awful.

At this pnt I don't think deathmatch is a good idea, I can only see a mix of firebrand scourge in this game mode, like ppl deciding if the best comp is 3 fb 2 scrg or 2 fb 3 scrg

How often do people actually switch class to do 3 fb and 2 scourge lol!!I have done countless rank PvP I rarely see people switch class for team composition

I don’t think it’s impossible for death match to happen because there is always a counter for every class or any build. I mean even in GW1 Mesmer was annoy to deal with but that doesn’t mean a Mesmer can carry the whole team. I think ANet should at least just try to put one death match in the rank PvP and see how it goes or maybe switch the gladiator map to death match. Instead of adding stupid flower bushes on that map witch was so weird and make no sense at all.The best thing about that map before was like an open space PvP not sure why they always butcher the good stuff :s

Disable stealth in deathmatches, replace the effect with an aura that blinds melee attacks.

Honestly I think TDM is like the lamest pvp mode you can think of. It's just not exciting imo, so I'm really glad the mode is the way it is, I like it.

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:I mean isn’t it a wake up call nobody is going crazy for GW2 PvP... you don’t see massive fans tune in to watch the PvP game or tournament for a reason...

It's more the fact that Anet doesn't care about PvP and even let ESL die rather than investing a bit so the balance doesn't suck.I mean.. I am still always hoping there will be some changes and improvements but let's be honest.. A company that discards their eSport League because of lack of interest in the game mode and that abandon their brand (back then) new game mode (stronghold) rather than advertising and improving it speaks for itself imo.

If you want to enjoy TDM then I'd suggest playing custom games on courtyard or something.

@DoomNexus.5324 said:Honestly I think TDM is like the lamest pvp mode you can think of. It's just not exciting imo, so I'm really glad the mode is the way it is, I like it.

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:I mean isn’t it a wake up call nobody is going crazy for GW2 PvP... you don’t see massive fans tune in to watch the PvP game or tournament for a reason...

While yes it can be lame and easy etc. That's the point. For new people starting the game, it is much easier to understand how to participate in a game where the object is to beat the other team. Grab a build that can fit a role and kill the other team. Then as they learn more advanced builds/mechanics etc they can improve. Jumping into conquest in it's current state is just an epic fail....you have to know your class, the enemies class, your role, the other roles on the team, the right comp, when to rotate when not to rotate, to fight on point or kite around the point...and that's just to be half way decent....it's a lot of information for newer players and makes the barriers of entry unreasonably high IMO

Just give me capture the flag. Warsong Gulch was/is my favorite CTF mode. This conquest 3 node system has to go.

@Khalisto.5780 said:You can also play the strongholds, which I think is awful.Stronghold was great... Except not at all good for the low player counts of normal PvP. Should have been 10v10 or something. Anet really messed it up.

I just miss alliance battles, sod the balance if thats the issue really. Had enough of rob peter to play paul because some you don't like getting killed.

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:

@UNOwen.7132 said:There are a

ton

of reasons why that would be a problem. Among the fact that you cant balance both gamemodes, Deathmatch has this tendency to incentivize staying alive moreso than killing an enemy. You will see a ton of bunker builds, permastealth thieves and other such builds that try to kill one guy, then just run out the timer, because unfortunately thats the most effective strategy.

Because we tried it. Courtyard, a team deathmatch map you can still get in unranked I believe. Guess what happened? Bunker builds, permastealth thieves, and so on. As for WoW, it has precisely the bunker build nonsense I talk about. 3v3 in that game is a drag. And no, just removing bunker stats isnt wise. While that build is a problem in 3v3, it isnt in capture points. In fact, its quite neccessary in capture points.

Just shoot the damn horse in the head & git it over with....

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:I’m really not a fan of the gw2 PvP just base on capturing points...can we at least have one mode in rank that’s death match like GW1?I could play GW1 PvP all day because it was more engaging and fun unlike gw2 people just teleport away to capture points...like what is the POINT of PvP!!????? This is worse than MOBA game concept....many times I see my teams just scatter around trying to capture points,,. It is so lame and extremely boring...Literally everyday I just play 1 PvP game to get my daily I’m out because it suck so bad...Maybe there are some people really enjoy capture points but this is the most boring PvP game I have ever played...Probably the worst PvP mode in the market...please fix this!!

I mean isn’t it a wake up call nobody is going crazy for GW2 PvP... you don’t see massive fans tune in to watch the PvP game or tournament for a reason...Not sure if any dev will ever see this... or care about PvP in this game enough to make a change...But if you ever see this..thanks for reading.... I have been waiting since the game launch and still waiting... :'(

I've been wishing for this since day one. The devs have generally lightly experimented with PvP outside of conquest mode and give up on those experiments fast.

Capture the Flag mechanics - Spirit's Watch is the closest thing we've seen to the flag capture from GW1 GvG and it was always unpopular because it just randomly tossed the capture mechanic to a small map in the middle of a conquest game. This was incredibly unbalanced early on because the travel distance for capturing the orb is tiny on such a small map. This led to burst movement abilities becoming too powerful and instead of realizing that having a substantial travel distance for capture mechanics is the best way to allow players to react and strategize around escorting of orbs/flags, they just replaced all player skills with 3 generic skills in order to band-aid the map.

NPC/Lord Battles - Legacy of the Foefire was the closest thing we ever saw to the GvG fights in GW1 and while it has been a reasonable success off and on throughout balance patches, it's always been restricted in how much the lord mechanic really matters for most games since the team size is small and just focusing on the conquest objectives is still the major focus of the game.Stronghold was put forward as a sort of hybrid between GW1 GvG and MOBAs, but by adding in so much focus on NPCs, few players really enjoyed the game and devs were never able to balance the game mode in a way that didn't leave 100% pure rush strategies as superior. Now it's just a dusty relic that's been long forgotten, but never fully removed, despite a pretty hefty initial investment.

Deathmatch - This one is particularly sad since the fix is so obvious. When the devs added this to the game, they kept the point scoring and continuous respawn mechanics from Conquest, which was a huge shortcut that made the gameplay awful. Instead of mirroring the way that most of GW1 did deathmatch in Random Arenas or that WoW had done it with Arena, the continuous respawn just constantly led to games where a bit of actual good gameplay would start before one team inevitably gained the upper hand after securing some kills and then just snowballing and spawn camping until the timer ran out or score hit 500. If the devs would just turn off respawns or at least put in a killable NPC in charge of respawns, then games wouldn't drag out and be so miserable for everyone.

Devs have dabbled with aspects of what they think players liked from GW1, but they've always either shied away from fully commiting to replicating the experience or tried to shove the whole package into a small map when large area of effect abilities and flashy skills already make PvP a clusterfuck of a mess. However, I still hope that they learn from this and don't just give up on giving PvPers something different than Conquest.

Y'all consider the fact that you might just simply be bored of playing the same thing for so long?

Just multi game or take a break instead of asking the game to change maybe?

@Sampson.2403 said:Y'all consider the fact that you might just simply be bored of playing the same thing for so long?

Just multi game or take a break instead of asking the game to change maybe?

Nah, that's not really related. I enjoy Conquest, but the game would be better with more ways to PvP than just Conquest sPvP or World vs World. There's just a lot of potential in the game that devs haven't tapped into.

And the devs will always be making new content. The feedback here is just to allow devs to understand what type of new content is desired and how to prevent them from putting work into something that people don't enjoy.

Besides, what's wrong with asking for new stuff to be added to the game?

There's nothing wrong with asking for new content but that's not what this post is about.

People are saying that the sPvP game mode inherently sucks and that's why it needs to be replaced.

Give us back courtyard for unranked (without the silly orb that got added later on) - just add a queue preference option like we have for conquest and stronghold.

@Sampson.2403 said:Y'all consider the fact that you might just simply be bored of playing the same thing for so long?

Just multi game or take a break instead of asking the game to change maybe?

Ya I do play different games but that still doesn’t change the fact GW2 PvP sucks compare to GW1 and changes are needed!I wish GW1 PvP is still active but it’s literally dead right now.

@Dahkeus.8243 said:

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:I’m really not a fan of the gw2 PvP just base on capturing points...can we at least have one mode in rank that’s death match like GW1?I could play GW1 PvP all day because it was more engaging and fun unlike gw2 people just teleport away to capture points...like what is the POINT of PvP!!????? This is worse than MOBA game concept....many times I see my teams just scatter around trying to capture points,,. It is so lame and extremely boring...Literally everyday I just play 1 PvP game to get my daily I’m out because it suck so bad...Maybe there are some people really enjoy capture points but this is the most boring PvP game I have ever played...Probably the worst PvP mode in the market...please fix this!!

I mean isn’t it a wake up call nobody is going crazy for GW2 PvP... you don’t see massive fans tune in to watch the PvP game or tournament for a reason...Not sure if any dev will ever see this... or care about PvP in this game enough to make a change...But if you ever see this..thanks for reading.... I have been waiting since the game launch and still waiting... :'(

Thank you so much for pointing out more detailed flaws! There are just too much issues to really address but seriously dev should just implement what they had on GW1 to the PvP system here. Why abandon something that was great to something bad beat the crap out of me.