Advice from a long time WvW veteran. — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Advice from a long time WvW veteran.

Lightsbane.9012Lightsbane.9012 Member ✭✭
edited August 8, 2019 in WvW

you (had) one of the most unique game modes on the mmorpg market for five years running. One of the most dedicated communities that built their own story with their own accomplishments and heroism in battle. Yet you do not seem to love WvW like I do, ArenaNet. It disappoints me as a gamer. WvW is still dripping with potential and you leave it in the dust for nonsensical beyond easy pve content. I, like probably many others, like a challenge with my video games, otherwise there is no fun in it. Fighting AI is not a challenge. Fighting mobs that do not move are not a challenge, no matter how or where you fight them. Once you know their mechanics, you win. You cannot do this with players, especially a large group of organized players. Why do you neglect WvW? Do you not realize how big the WvW playerbase is? Do you not realize how many people play your game JUST for WvW?

Let's talk about the maps. Desert borderland is an experiment that should've been a jungle map instead. I mean, thieves hiding in bushes, rangers sniping from tree tops, not to mention edge of the mists which would've been much better off as the fourth map instead of a wait for queue to pop zone. You have so much space to work with in what we, the players of your game, can see alone. The mass of land/misted out areas surrounding eternal battlegrounds. The mass of water in the middle of nearly all of it, it just feels like you've run out of passion for what caused me to fall in love with your game. Why don't you put any focus into this game mode? Why? As a fellow artist I can't imagine why you don't put more work and love into this. Let me tell you, If i am not sketching, painting, lifting, or doing my other day to days, I am here, at home, gaming. What you had with Wvw was something i always wanted, the open world pvp, the objective based combat, the free flowing movement of an army at battle, and how skill and discipline will always beat a meta, every single day. Yet the game mode has stagnated beyond the point of no return, I believe. Unless something drastic happens, unless you have some massive map in the works for a new expansion, I don't know how much longer it has. and it pains me to say that, it really does. I love this game, I love the classes, and at this point my advice to you is to watch the Wvw forum like it's your duty. Take note of what the players are saying, and do things based off of that within reason. You give everything to the pve players as if they do not already have it, and give us nothing. When does wvw get the same respect as living story?

<1

Comments

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 8, 2019

    @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    This, but also, by it's very nature, pvp modes don't need as much new content injected to it as does PvE. You see this even in subscription based MMOs like WoW. Do you think their PvP game modes get anywhere near a fraction of the content added to their game mode that PvE does? But it doesn't have to, because the content of pvp is the players you are fighting, not as much the map you are on.

    While that's no excuse for the lack of content added to both pvp modes; WoW still managed to add many maps to arena and battlegrounds, as well as adding other open world pvp events over the year despite PvE being their primary content, but you will never see the same amount of content added to WvW/PvP as LW because it's not necessary.

  • @Turkeyspit.3965 said:

    @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    This, but also, by it's very nature, pvp modes don't need as much new content injected to it as does PvE. You see this even in subscription based MMOs like WoW. Do you think their PvP game modes get anywhere near a fraction of the content added to their game mode that PvE does? But it doesn't have to, because the content of pvp is the players you are fighting, not as much the map you are on.

    While that's no excuse for the lack of content added to both pvp modes; WoW still managed to add many maps to arena and battlegrounds, as well as adding other open world pvp events over the year despite PvE being their primary content, but you will never see the same amount of content added to WvW/PvP as LW because it's not necessary.

    i disagree that wvw/pvp need less content. They are constant chaos. Constant chaos needs new things that often. And you have no idea how many players it might draw in to the game mode if they added something even resembling a living story for pvp or wvw.

  • The only half decent wvw mmo of its kind, amazing combat system, huge potential for a strong competitive game with no competition from other game studios, and the entire game is focused around solo story based pve. Yes wvw has a small but relatively stable population now, but most gw2 players never play wvw or pvp. The game had its chance and they blew it.

    People claim that WvW cant make money, yet somehow other competitive games can make ridiculous amounts, anet just never added anything to wvw that could bring in revenue. For starters, the game is largely based around guild vs guild combat, whether its a guild leading a pug group around taking keeps, or a gvg focused fight guild. Add custom guild camp, tower, keep, siege skins to the gem store. Customizable guild cosmetic gear, unique guild finishers, pick nearly anything that lets guilds stand out from others and people will pay time and money for that. Give guilds/servers a reason to win the weekly matchup and people will become more competitive and feel a sense of pride for the group they represent. Its ridiculous to think that wvw couldnt be more than a niche gamemode when so many ideas for content have never been attempted.

  • zinkz.7045zinkz.7045 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 8, 2019

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    The only half decent wvw mmo of its kind, amazing combat system, huge potential for a strong competitive game with no competition from other game studios, and the entire game is focused around solo story based pve. Yes wvw has a small but relatively stable population now, but most gw2 players never play wvw or pvp. The game had its chance and they blew it.

    People claim that WvW cant make money, yet somehow other competitive games can make ridiculous amounts, anet just never added anything to wvw that could bring in revenue. For starters, the game is largely based around guild vs guild combat, whether its a guild leading a pug group around taking keeps, or a gvg focused fight guild. Add custom guild camp, tower, keep, siege skins to the gem store. Customizable guild cosmetic gear, unique guild finishers, pick nearly anything that lets guilds stand out from others and people will pay time and money for that. Give guilds/servers a reason to win the weekly matchup and people will become more competitive and feel a sense of pride for the group they represent. Its ridiculous to think that wvw couldnt be more than a niche gamemode when so many ideas for content have never been attempted.

    They could monetize it better, but that is all. As a competitive game mode it is a joke just like every other attempt at RvR, which ultimately is why all these types of games die off after a couple of years.

    Good, fun PvP requires competition, WvW lacks the mechanisms to provide that in every aspect.

    When it comes to "winning" the matchup (PPT) no one sane cares or has ever cared, because a 24/7 game mode, where the teams are different sizes, with different coverage and "gameplay" that is more boring than PvE (PvDoor, avoid fights, jump maps, etc) makes "winning" meaningless and the "gameplay" dull.

    Same thing for fights, a guy roaming who has played 10k hours jumping on a guy in a zerg build or a guy who has played 100 hours or a guy who is 70 years old, etc is dull trash tier PvP, same for large scale, no good tryharding with whatever meta cheese, all on TS/Discord and having nothing to fight, because every dumb tryhard is on two servers, so other comms just log off after a couple of fights.

    RvR is a flawed game mode, that basically only appeals to bads who are fine with trash tier "PvP" and trash tier gameplay, which is why it is dead in the handful of games that even bother to try it (and they only try because of rose tinted DAoC spectacles some devs are wearing).

    They would have been better off going with battlegrounds, that way casual players could face casual players, guilds could face guilds (and actually have some sort of competitive ladder / league) and the quality of PvP would be better and more fun plus it would have been way easier to add content to and keep things fresh.

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Dunno how you can state that when they had spvp to do exactly all that and still failed.

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    || Stealth is a Terribad Mechanic || Class Offense Defense Movement Balance is So Terribad ||

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    i think noone except for Ben cares

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • @zinkz.7045 said:

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    The only half decent wvw mmo of its kind, amazing combat system, huge potential for a strong competitive game with no competition from other game studios, and the entire game is focused around solo story based pve. Yes wvw has a small but relatively stable population now, but most gw2 players never play wvw or pvp. The game had its chance and they blew it.

    People claim that WvW cant make money, yet somehow other competitive games can make ridiculous amounts, anet just never added anything to wvw that could bring in revenue. For starters, the game is largely based around guild vs guild combat, whether its a guild leading a pug group around taking keeps, or a gvg focused fight guild. Add custom guild camp, tower, keep, siege skins to the gem store. Customizable guild cosmetic gear, unique guild finishers, pick nearly anything that lets guilds stand out from others and people will pay time and money for that. Give guilds/servers a reason to win the weekly matchup and people will become more competitive and feel a sense of pride for the group they represent. Its ridiculous to think that wvw couldnt be more than a niche gamemode when so many ideas for content have never been attempted.

    They could monetize it better, but that is all. As a competitive game mode it is a joke just like every other attempt at RvR, which ultimately is why all these types of games die off after a couple of years.

    Good, fun PvP requires competition, WvW lacks the mechanisms to provide that in every aspect.

    When it comes to "winning" the matchup (PPT) no one sane cares or has ever cared, because a 24/7 game mode, where the teams are different sizes, with different coverage and "gameplay" that is more boring than PvE (PvDoor, avoid fights, jump maps, etc) makes "winning" meaningless and the "gameplay" dull.

    Same thing for fights, a guy roaming who has played 10k hours jumping on a guy in a zerg build or a guy who has played 100 hours or a guy who is 70 years old, etc is dull trash tier PvP, same for large scale, no good tryharding with whatever meta cheese, all on TS/Discord and having nothing to fight, because every dumb tryhard is on two servers, so other comms just log off after a couple of fights.

    RvR is a flawed game mode, that basically only appeals to bads who are fine with trash tier "PvP" and trash tier gameplay, which is why it is dead in the handful of games that even bother to try it (and they only try because of rose tinted DAoC spectacles some devs are wearing).

    They would have been better off going with battlegrounds, that way casual players could face casual players, guilds could face guilds (and actually have some sort of competitive ladder / league) and the quality of PvP would be better and more fun plus it would have been way easier to add content to and keep things fresh.

    Yes i would agree the gamemode is fundamentally flawed, but to think that gw2 WvW couldnt have been improved is silly which was my whole point.

  • juno.1840juno.1840 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 8, 2019

    @Lightsbane.9012 said:
    I love this game, I love the classes, and at this point my advice to you is to watch the Wvw forum like it's your duty. Take note of what the players are saying, and do things based off of that within reason.

    At least half the ideas I see in the forums are garbage -- so that's the last thing I want ANet developers to do.

    I'm all for new content, but not designed by players that don't understand beans about software development, and who don't have a good vision of the complexity of the game architecture.

  • zinkz.7045zinkz.7045 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 8, 2019

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

    @zinkz.7045 said:

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    The only half decent wvw mmo of its kind, amazing combat system, huge potential for a strong competitive game with no competition from other game studios, and the entire game is focused around solo story based pve. Yes wvw has a small but relatively stable population now, but most gw2 players never play wvw or pvp. The game had its chance and they blew it.

    People claim that WvW cant make money, yet somehow other competitive games can make ridiculous amounts, anet just never added anything to wvw that could bring in revenue. For starters, the game is largely based around guild vs guild combat, whether its a guild leading a pug group around taking keeps, or a gvg focused fight guild. Add custom guild camp, tower, keep, siege skins to the gem store. Customizable guild cosmetic gear, unique guild finishers, pick nearly anything that lets guilds stand out from others and people will pay time and money for that. Give guilds/servers a reason to win the weekly matchup and people will become more competitive and feel a sense of pride for the group they represent. Its ridiculous to think that wvw couldnt be more than a niche gamemode when so many ideas for content have never been attempted.

    They could monetize it better, but that is all. As a competitive game mode it is a joke just like every other attempt at RvR, which ultimately is why all these types of games die off after a couple of years.

    Good, fun PvP requires competition, WvW lacks the mechanisms to provide that in every aspect.

    When it comes to "winning" the matchup (PPT) no one sane cares or has ever cared, because a 24/7 game mode, where the teams are different sizes, with different coverage and "gameplay" that is more boring than PvE (PvDoor, avoid fights, jump maps, etc) makes "winning" meaningless and the "gameplay" dull.

    Same thing for fights, a guy roaming who has played 10k hours jumping on a guy in a zerg build or a guy who has played 100 hours or a guy who is 70 years old, etc is dull trash tier PvP, same for large scale, no good tryharding with whatever meta cheese, all on TS/Discord and having nothing to fight, because every dumb tryhard is on two servers, so other comms just log off after a couple of fights.

    RvR is a flawed game mode, that basically only appeals to bads who are fine with trash tier "PvP" and trash tier gameplay, which is why it is dead in the handful of games that even bother to try it (and they only try because of rose tinted DAoC spectacles some devs are wearing).

    They would have been better off going with battlegrounds, that way casual players could face casual players, guilds could face guilds (and actually have some sort of competitive ladder / league) and the quality of PvP would be better and more fun plus it would have been way easier to add content to and keep things fresh.

    Yes i would agree the gamemode is fundamentally flawed, but to think that gw2 WvW couldnt have been improved is silly which was my whole point.

    The only things that are "silly" are the confused notion that a game mode that is fundamentally flawed on a competitive basis has "huge potential for a strong competitive game". Or that minor improvements will make any meaningful difference when they will be nothing more than band-aids when those fundamental flaws still exist.

  • you could always have a go at fortnite, and try win 3 million dollars /shrug

    Guild wars 3 when?

  • @zinkz.7045 said:

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

    @zinkz.7045 said:

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    The only half decent wvw mmo of its kind, amazing combat system, huge potential for a strong competitive game with no competition from other game studios, and the entire game is focused around solo story based pve. Yes wvw has a small but relatively stable population now, but most gw2 players never play wvw or pvp. The game had its chance and they blew it.

    People claim that WvW cant make money, yet somehow other competitive games can make ridiculous amounts, anet just never added anything to wvw that could bring in revenue. For starters, the game is largely based around guild vs guild combat, whether its a guild leading a pug group around taking keeps, or a gvg focused fight guild. Add custom guild camp, tower, keep, siege skins to the gem store. Customizable guild cosmetic gear, unique guild finishers, pick nearly anything that lets guilds stand out from others and people will pay time and money for that. Give guilds/servers a reason to win the weekly matchup and people will become more competitive and feel a sense of pride for the group they represent. Its ridiculous to think that wvw couldnt be more than a niche gamemode when so many ideas for content have never been attempted.

    They could monetize it better, but that is all. As a competitive game mode it is a joke just like every other attempt at RvR, which ultimately is why all these types of games die off after a couple of years.

    Good, fun PvP requires competition, WvW lacks the mechanisms to provide that in every aspect.

    When it comes to "winning" the matchup (PPT) no one sane cares or has ever cared, because a 24/7 game mode, where the teams are different sizes, with different coverage and "gameplay" that is more boring than PvE (PvDoor, avoid fights, jump maps, etc) makes "winning" meaningless and the "gameplay" dull.

    Same thing for fights, a guy roaming who has played 10k hours jumping on a guy in a zerg build or a guy who has played 100 hours or a guy who is 70 years old, etc is dull trash tier PvP, same for large scale, no good tryharding with whatever meta cheese, all on TS/Discord and having nothing to fight, because every dumb tryhard is on two servers, so other comms just log off after a couple of fights.

    RvR is a flawed game mode, that basically only appeals to bads who are fine with trash tier "PvP" and trash tier gameplay, which is why it is dead in the handful of games that even bother to try it (and they only try because of rose tinted DAoC spectacles some devs are wearing).

    They would have been better off going with battlegrounds, that way casual players could face casual players, guilds could face guilds (and actually have some sort of competitive ladder / league) and the quality of PvP would be better and more fun plus it would have been way easier to add content to and keep things fresh.

    Yes i would agree the gamemode is fundamentally flawed, but to think that gw2 WvW couldnt have been improved is silly which was my whole point.

    The only things that are "silly" are the confused notion that a game mode that is fundamentally flawed on a competitive basis has "huge potential for a strong competitive game". Or that minor improvements will make any meaningful difference when they will be nothing more than band-aids when those fundamental flaws still exist.

    Ok

  • hunkamania.7561hunkamania.7561 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Everyone should just quit till there's some actual proper content which will prob be never.

    Ferguson's Crossing Server Leader

    WVW LEADER

    VR

  • Acheron.4731Acheron.4731 Member ✭✭✭

    @hunkamania.7561 said:
    Everyone should just quit till there's some actual proper content which will prob be never.

    It certainly appears most have :/

    Top ten reasons I procrastinate:
    1.

  • sephiroth.4217sephiroth.4217 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 9, 2019

    @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    this is why I stopped spending money on the game.

    I was spending 50 a week to fuel my siege, food and fashion habits.

    its so dumb... half a second thought and its clear who whips out the credit card... is it the guy farming thousands of gold in pve or that broke WvW/PvP player that wants shiny stuff too.

    Not to brag, but I put together a puzzle in 4 days and the box said 2-4 years.
    Please allow team queue with rewards again at our own discretion.
    06210311 251521 121512

  • @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    I though ANet makes some nice chump change every X number of weeks for all the bandwagoning? Sure, no one but ANet knows the real numbers but it certainly isn't a trivial amount with all the server hopping on relinks.

  • Zephyra.4709Zephyra.4709 Member ✭✭✭

    You had me in the first half but it went a little wayward from there. Some things I agree with.

    You want a new map yeah - but do you trust them to give us a map that isn't DBL hell 2.0; especially DBL on release when they ignored literally every sane person's input on how to improve/fix the map asap? Furthermore how exactly does a map fix the plethora of problems that is, to say the least, the core issues voiced by the community with WvW's population/timezone + profession/class imbalance, stale meta, small class diversity, no in-depth scoring higher tiered objectives, no support for vets, no incentive to win, murdered server identity, bandwagoning, server lag, no GvG support, powercreep expansions, no action against hackers/spies, no communication other than catering to casuals etc?

    Be careful what you wish for:

    "Take note of what the players are saying, and do things based off of that within reason. "

    Because many of the vets have long gone - that one guy who kept trolling/baiting forums with "give WvW mounts" got exactly what he wished for and didn't we all enjoy the exploit-fiesta that was and still is, to a lesser degree - warclaw?

  • @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    i agree

    They could bring skins to wvw.

    • Skins for rams
    • skins for catas
    • skins for treb
    • Skins for arrow carts
    • skin for camps (the player who claims determines the skin )
    • skin for keeps (the player who claims determines the skin )
    • skin towers (the player who claims determines the skin )
    • garrisons (the player who claims determines the skin )
    • and finally skins for stonemist castle. (the player who claims determines the skin )

    They could add the skins in shop and by playing.
    Maybe some " legendary" skins require a lot of effort like the " inmovable object " title.

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @TheBravery.9615 said:
    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

    Want to bet that the total player time spent in Dragonfall doing open world content with 100+ other players exceed the total player time spent doing the actual story by at least 1000x?

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @TheBravery.9615 said:
    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

    Want to bet that the total player time spent in Dragonfall doing open world content with 100+ other players exceed the total player time spent doing the actual story by at least 1000x?

    I don't deny that. However, open world pve is braindead easy, the AI is awful, and content largely solo-able. Even if there's 100 other players fighting a champion it's another dpsfest with lousy loot. I can't think of a time in open world pve when true teamwork is necessary to the same extent as pvp/wvw (e.g. condi removal, boon removal, sustain, stealth etc)

    WvW/PvP on the other hand is a lot of untapped potential

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @TheBravery.9615 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @TheBravery.9615 said:
    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

    Want to bet that the total player time spent in Dragonfall doing open world content with 100+ other players exceed the total player time spent doing the actual story by at least 1000x?

    I don't deny that. However, open world pve is braindead easy, the AI is awful, and content largely solo-able. Even if there's 100 other players fighting a champion it's another dpsfest with lousy loot. I can't think of a time in open world pve when true teamwork is necessary to the same extent as pvp/wvw (e.g. condi removal, boon removal, sustain, stealth etc)

    Exactly. They make content for their audience.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • TheBravery.9615TheBravery.9615 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @TheBravery.9615 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @TheBravery.9615 said:
    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

    Want to bet that the total player time spent in Dragonfall doing open world content with 100+ other players exceed the total player time spent doing the actual story by at least 1000x?

    I don't deny that. However, open world pve is braindead easy, the AI is awful, and content largely solo-able. Even if there's 100 other players fighting a champion it's another dpsfest with lousy loot. I can't think of a time in open world pve when true teamwork is necessary to the same extent as pvp/wvw (e.g. condi removal, boon removal, sustain, stealth etc)

    Exactly. They make content for their audience.

    well kitten i might as well just quit then

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @TheBravery.9615 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @TheBravery.9615 said:

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @TheBravery.9615 said:
    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

    Want to bet that the total player time spent in Dragonfall doing open world content with 100+ other players exceed the total player time spent doing the actual story by at least 1000x?

    I don't deny that. However, open world pve is braindead easy, the AI is awful, and content largely solo-able. Even if there's 100 other players fighting a champion it's another dpsfest with lousy loot. I can't think of a time in open world pve when true teamwork is necessary to the same extent as pvp/wvw (e.g. condi removal, boon removal, sustain, stealth etc)

    Exactly. They make content for their audience.

    well kitten i might as well just quit then

    Which is what a lot have opted to do.

  • JTGuevara.9018JTGuevara.9018 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 9, 2019

    As a fellow veteran, I feel your pain. We, pvp-oriented people, have been left to rot.

    I don't think it's just gw2 either, MMOs have basically given up on pvp content or are simply too incompetent to make it work. Case in point, RTS games, MOBAs and FPS. _That's _ where people go for their multiplayer fix. In MMOs?....pvp is a side thing, it's not respected as pve is. The sad thing about all of this, it's the MMOs own fault. In a ham-fisted attempt to compete with WoW, they sacrificed pvp in favor of pve: in terms of the gem store, fractals, living world and raids. Like any other MMO, they have developed the "carrot on a stick" in order to get people hooked.

    I will say this, though. This is why I appreciate the wvw community. You guys seem to live in reality a bit more, much more so than spvp players. I basically stopped posting on the spvp forum because I was tired of the apologists for the power creep, stale conquest mode. I was tired of people shilling for their classes. I was tired of people shilling for the company whenever they buff your class and cursing it when they nerf yours. It's like how craven can you get! Now, what do we got recently? 2v2? Pft. We've been down this road before. If there's no queue for it, 2v2 is dead on arrival. Mark these words. This has already happened, I think twice. People get hyped up about 2v2 only to realize it's shipped over to the custom servers and...it dies. Nobody plays hotjoin anymore!

    But what the f--- do I know, I'm just some guy. I pretty much mostly wvw in gw2, I've basically already moved on games like Age of Empires: a TWENTY year old that is STILL growing! lmao! gw2 and all you goofy kitten MMOs...take notes. pve is not the be-all-end-all.

  • Sitting here and reading all the post, and reminiscing about a mmo that was just fixing to release,7 yrs ago. Watching the trailer to a game that caught my eye because it was all about guilds, and WvW…"World versus World", that was the seller for me. Now almost 7 yrs later, and the loss of many guilds, lots of good players gone, because no one listens to the people that play this mode. Whether it's Arena net or NcSoft's fault the game is dying. I've played wvw since release, we started with 24 servers and we now have 12, they could actually cut 2-4 more servers, because of the stacking on certain servers. Dev's don't even come into wvw, and when they do, they don't last...pug down...they claim a tower or a camp with Arena net tag, big whoop. The wvw community is dying, the very thing that this game was based on, and it's a shame, that something so good could go to chit in a handbasket, just because they don't understand and won't listen to people that has played this game mode from the beginning. It was great at one time, but I guess it's like everything else, there comes a time for "death"

  • hunkamania.7561hunkamania.7561 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    I mean, the gemstore makes them the cash with skins you can buy in any game mode. They have warclaw skins for wvw but its only a limited time thing so I guess they don't even wanna make money off of wvw it seems lol

    Ferguson's Crossing Server Leader

    WVW LEADER

    VR

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭

    Changing something in WvW seem to have 2 main problems:

    • at least 50% of the players don't want this change, whatever change it is.
    • important changes seem to take over 2 years development time, such that they are already outdated when they finally go live.
  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    Changing something in WvW seem to have 2 main problems:

    • at least 50% of the players don't want this change, whatever change it is.
    • important changes seem to take over 2 years development time, such that they are already outdated when they finally go live.

    I half agree with this.

  • DemonSeed.3528DemonSeed.3528 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Changes take too long to implement, if ever and look to remain as a future "possibility" without no indication of it coming into fruition. I think the masses are already tired of talking to walls, after which it incites some form of response from anet (eg vague roadmap, etc) presumably coinciding with gw2 content creators discussions regarding the game and this interaction ceases as suddenly as it came about. Change is welcome, change is wanted, but sometimes the issue with change is what is being implemented and how it affects things overall, and whether it is actually needed at all for the game mode. All in all, there is no doubt that WvW is neglected and only being drip fed once in a blue moon. I do sincerely hope that this changes starting with the announcement, but many have already lost their heart & hope for this mode. Kudos to those that can still soldier on despite this.

  • nthmetal.9652nthmetal.9652 Member ✭✭✭

    @TheBravery.9615 said:
    This is an mmorpg

    Living story is largely single player content

    Shows you how disconnected arenanet is with their audience.

    I'm not sure that is true. If so many players actually are casuals, they actually are very much in touch with their audience. And as to people quitting or demanding more hardcore content: I do disctinctively remember that we had at least one hardcore MMO (Wildstar?) in the last 5 years and that didn't pay off.
    That hardcore games can pay off, we know. Dark Souls was very succesful, but probably a lot less intense in maintenance than your typical MMO is.
    Centering an MMO purely around PvP and realm-vs-realm content probably would not be enough to carry a game either. IIRC Warhammer online tried that approach.

    So, in order to make a sustainable game, we need the PvE content, we need the casuals, and the hardcore community cannot carry the game. No amount of whining will do anything about it.
    I would suggest making most, if not all content scalable. They did a good job with fractals. From T1 to T4 + CM anyone should be able to find at least some challenge there (though of course true hardcore players will always whine). Why can't we do the same for raids? Invest 20% more time to make the content 100% (or more) more accessible, for PUGs like me.

    "and then we know that we have looked back through the ivory gates into that world of wonder which was ours before we were wise and unhappy"
    -- H. P. Lovecraft - Celephais

  • XenesisII.1540XenesisII.1540 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Warhammer online had the same format as gw2, pve/rvr/bgs, it wasn't purely about rvr, it closed because it was buggy, laggy, had a sub, owned by EA who hates mmos, and the warhammer license between ea mythic and games workshop expired, it wasn't because rvr failed.

    Wildstar was built to be more raid oriented, I don't know what the main problem for the game was, I played it a couple levels when it was free to play and it was boring and didn't stick with me, but I guess the raids weren't good enough to keep players.

    Now if a game gets released to certain audience of players, the game developers should probably continue developing those areas of the game for those players, if they want continued support. Shifting into new areas is ok post release, but you still need to/should look after your older customers. Abandoning dungeons, ignoring wvw/spvp, shoe horning raids into a game built on casuals comes to mind here.

    Another derailing post. ^^
    EBG North Keep: One of the village residents will now flee if their home is destroyed!
    || Stealth is a Terribad Mechanic || Class Offense Defense Movement Balance is So Terribad ||

  • KeyOrion.9506KeyOrion.9506 Member ✭✭✭

    Just make a Half Dozen more maps, and then randomize them week from week. Variety is the spice of life.

  • Give us a few Tournaments so that the player skill base, can improve ...

    Not the fix to issues, but it would give folks something to focus on.

  • nthmetal.9652nthmetal.9652 Member ✭✭✭

    @Elf Lord.8962 said:
    Give us a few Tournaments so that the player skill base, can improve ...

    Not the fix to issues, but it would give folks something to focus on.

    Generally: Do something with WvW. A new tournament, some kind of new content, new events, something that will keep things moving and player interested. If we're not fixing the problem anytime soon, at least do something with it. Show more people, what fun WvW is (and that is despite all the issues).

    "and then we know that we have looked back through the ivory gates into that world of wonder which was ours before we were wise and unhappy"
    -- H. P. Lovecraft - Celephais

  • @nthmetal.9652 said:
    Show more people, what fun WvW is (and that is despite all the issues).

    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

  • nthmetal.9652nthmetal.9652 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 20, 2019

    @Dhemize.8649 said:
    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

    There's a revolutionary idea: How about those people just ... shut up? If someone's already left and isn't coming back anyway, their whining has nothing to do with their current experience anymore, obviously.

    I'm having fun in WvW and judging by our server TS, I'm far from the only one. Judging from the team- and mapchat, too. I'm not saying it's perfect, but there's fun to be had. I can only recommend for ppl to join their server TS, look for a guild with a regular presence on TS, and especially join comms on TS.

    "and then we know that we have looked back through the ivory gates into that world of wonder which was ours before we were wise and unhappy"
    -- H. P. Lovecraft - Celephais

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 20, 2019

    My main problem with WvW is that the fight-system for 1vs1 nowadays mostly reduces to first-hit wins very fast. CC & Damage bursts are out of control (for longer fights healing and recovery are likely out of control as well).

    So it reduces to better reflexes and better internet connection. That's quite boring

  • Dhemize.8649Dhemize.8649 Member ✭✭
    edited August 20, 2019

    @nthmetal.9652 said:

    @Dhemize.8649 said:
    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

    There's a revolutionary idea: How about those people just ... shut up? If someone's already left and isn't coming back anyway, their whining has nothing to do with their current experience anymore, obviously.

    I'm having fun in WvW and judging by our server TS, I'm far from the only one. Judging from the team- and mapchat, too. I'm not saying it's perfect, but there's fun to be had. I can only recommend for ppl to join their server TS, look for a guild with a regular presence on TS, and especially join comms on TS.

    So your only hope is to somehow retain what few there are remaining? Those updated lists of server populations show it's failing miserably no matter what.

    But as for now I'm glad there's still somebody in WvW buying my blueprints on the trading posts!

  • nthmetal.9652nthmetal.9652 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dhemize.8649 said:
    So your only hope is to somehow retain what few there are remaining? Those updated lists of server populations show it's failing miserably no matter what.

    No, of course I hope we'll find a way to win more new players. But whining is not gonna do that.

    "and then we know that we have looked back through the ivory gates into that world of wonder which was ours before we were wise and unhappy"
    -- H. P. Lovecraft - Celephais

  • @nthmetal.9652 said:

    @Dhemize.8649 said:
    So your only hope is to somehow retain what few there are remaining? Those updated lists of server populations show it's failing miserably no matter what.

    No, of course I hope we'll find a way to win more new players. But whining is not gonna do that.

    Oh boi, you must be new here.

    No matter how much anyone whines, complains, has a deep, friendly and fully analyzing topics of problems and how to solve them. Anet simply does not listen to the community. They never have, they never will, in fact they go on a completely opposite route with everything that the players have always wanted.

    "From a dude whose been playing WvW since 2013".

  • kash.9213kash.9213 Member ✭✭✭

    Whatever new content, events, or gimmicks you throw into WvW right now it will still remain just a large team match with no sense of persistence or connection to any server or alliance and most of the maps being unused due to efficiency. With my hour or more after work I have to get in on whatever action is around during a ever smaller prime time and most of that action will be dictated by points and time constraints. This mode is disconnected from the rest of the game and any time elsewhere is time away from WvW, but this mode is not open world so there's none of the exploration or feeling of lived in maps, only a triangle corner vs corner. There's only so much stretching and fine tuning we can do with our builds in such a funneled game mode before prime time fizzles out again.

    Northern Shiverpeaks [EL]

  • @Dhemize.8649 said:

    @nthmetal.9652 said:
    Show more people, what fun WvW is (and that is despite all the issues).

    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

    I said, "To raise the base skill level of players"

    Not to convince people to return.

  • @Elf Lord.8962 said:

    @Dhemize.8649 said:

    @nthmetal.9652 said:
    Show more people, what fun WvW is (and that is despite all the issues).

    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

    I said, "To raise the base skill level of players"

    Not to convince people to return.

    Which is why I didn't quote you.

  • Straegen.2938Straegen.2938 Member ✭✭✭

    @Blockhead Magee.3092 said:
    Why? Money. Simply money. PVE makes it, WvW didn't and doesn't. Until they figure out how to monetize it better, we won't get bubkus.

    So much this. WvW is a side hustle for ANet and GW2 with a tiny fraction of the players in the game overall. One could argue they love the mode because they have certainly poured more into the mode than they have gotten back out of it financially.

  • Elf Lord.8962Elf Lord.8962 Member ✭✭
    edited August 20, 2019

    @nthmetal.9652 said:

    @Dhemize.8649 said:
    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

    There's a revolutionary idea: How about those people just ... shut up? If someone's already left and isn't coming back anyway, their whining has nothing to do with their current experience anymore, obviously.

    I'm having fun in WvW and judging by our server TS, I'm far from the only one. Judging from the team- and mapchat, too. I'm not saying it's perfect, but there's fun to be had. I can only recommend for ppl to join their server TS, look for a guild with a regular presence on TS, and especially join comms on TS.

    You are fortunate to have people on your server who can type and use Team and Map chat, I have been on for hours and get 3 lines in the whole period .

    Seems Discord, Team Speak, or similar, are the communication Gods, these days.

  • Svarty.8019Svarty.8019 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lightsbane.9012 said:
    You give everything to the pve players as if they do not already have it, and give us nothing. When does wvw get the same respect as living story?

    I don't even agree with a lot of what you've said, e.g. paying attention to the forums (they have and do, but that's ONE reason the game is a mess - they listened to the wrong people), and you can't state that they give us NOTHING because we just got a new mount!

    .... yet there's something about WvW that feels like it HAS been neglected, like there's something REALLY BIG that the devs could have been doing to make the mode better overall. Identify that thing. Tell us what it is that the devs should have put their resources into - instead of churning out their boring monthly new map, currency, play-it-once attention-grabbing content that could (cynically) be seen as simply maintaining sales by creating gem store items in coordination with the new PvE content and leaving little else for the studio to be producing. It's boring. I'm playing a competitor's product now instead. That merry-go-round nonsense is annoying.

    Necro. Never knowingly blasting combo fields since 2012.

  • Acheron.4731Acheron.4731 Member ✭✭✭

    Popping in the wvw forums and communicating more than once every 2 years may help :)

    Top ten reasons I procrastinate:
    1.

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Elf Lord.8962 said:

    @nthmetal.9652 said:

    @Dhemize.8649 said:
    But it's not; at least to those who already left because of [various reasons]. Having a tournament tryhard mode won't convince people to come back to this slop.

    There's a revolutionary idea: How about those people just ... shut up? If someone's already left and isn't coming back anyway, their whining has nothing to do with their current experience anymore, obviously.

    I'm having fun in WvW and judging by our server TS, I'm far from the only one. Judging from the team- and mapchat, too. I'm not saying it's perfect, but there's fun to be had. I can only recommend for ppl to join their server TS, look for a guild with a regular presence on TS, and especially join comms on TS.

    You are fortunate to have people on your server who can type and use Team and Map chat, I have been on for hours and get 3 lines in the whole period .

    Seems Discord, Team Speak, or similar, are the communication Gods, these days.

    its not new, it has always been the major reason for vets to socialize thru those external communication system.

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

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