How is it that when i play a bad meme build i either destroy, even 1v2, or get destroyed - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

How is it that when i play a bad meme build i either destroy, even 1v2, or get destroyed

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  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Justine.6351 said:
    I feel dirty for giving obtena a thumbs up. That's just how much I don't like anput's fake premise threads.

    SHAME!!!!

    Well.... yeah.. @Dawdler.8521 called me out in the last page so... I feel your pain..

    (Shameless attempt to pull someone into my level lol)

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • JTGuevara.9018JTGuevara.9018 Member ✭✭✭

    Are people seriously defending these meme builds? "An experienced player knows how to deal with it..." Yeah, but so what?

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭

    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    its not bad. ppl just have opinions on things.

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭

    @Sovereign.1093 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    its not bad. ppl just have opinions on things.

    Yeah and why is mine so unpopular here? Seems to be the common sense in about every other PvP game i play.

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Sovereign.1093 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    its not bad. ppl just have opinions on things.

    Yeah and why is mine so unpopular here? Seems to be the common sense in about every other PvP game i play.

    well some are popular and some are not. =)

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 18, 2019

    @Sovereign.1093 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Sovereign.1093 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    its not bad. ppl just have opinions on things.

    Yeah and why is mine so unpopular here? Seems to be the common sense in about every other PvP game i play.

    well some are popular and some are not. =)

    I have shown the current situation with mounts to world PvPers from other MMO's and some non-MMO PvP game players and they found it laughable and insane that this was allowed to be implemented in its current state lol.

    One of them even commented a big essay on game design and for PvP games on anet because he found this so wierd and know i care about this game.

    I just have no fun anymore, i used to go into WvW with any build, just run around and kill poeple, now i feel like theres barely anything to do and there is only toxic situations involving the mount, i just do a few duels at south sentry once a week at best maybe, because there is no world PvP to be had, i see more PvE in this PvP mode than actual PvP.

    How will poeple ever see this as a serious endgame mode when there is just dumbing down and more handholding? I really don't get the direction here. I barely play but i still comment here because i do care and i do want to play this game and have fun again.

    Oh and i play music ingame like thats the main reason i still log in since mounts lol.

  • Swagger.1459Swagger.1459 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 18, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Sovereign.1093 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Sovereign.1093 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    its not bad. ppl just have opinions on things.

    Yeah and why is mine so unpopular here? Seems to be the common sense in about every other PvP game i play.

    well some are popular and some are not. =)

    I have shown the current situation with mounts to world PvPers from other MMO's and some non-MMO PvP game players and they found it laughable and insane that this was allowed to be implemented in its current state lol.

    One of them even commented a big essay on game design and for PvP games on anet because he found this so wierd and know i care about this game.

    I just have no fun anymore, i used to go into WvW with any build, just run around and kill poeple, now i feel like theres barely anything to do and there is only toxic situations involving the mount, i just do a few duels at south sentry once a week at best maybe, because there is no world PvP to be had, i see more PvE in this PvP mode than actual PvP.

    How will poeple ever see this as a serious endgame mode when there is just dumbing down and more handholding? I really don't get the direction here. I barely play but i still comment here because i do care and i do want to play this game and have fun again.

    Oh and i play music ingame like thats the main reason i still log in since mounts lol.

    I have my concern with mounts too, but what you are not realizing is that a ton of other mmos, who also have owpvp, have mounts. Not like it’s a new concept only for gw2.

    Your op and that video are for what purpose? If you don’t like wvw then go to spvp period, right? You get pvp fights and no mounts there, so take advantage of it.

  • @Anput.4620 said:
    I have shown the current situation with mounts to world PvPers from other MMO's

    What other MMO's?

    and some non-MMO PvP game players

    How are non-MMO PVP games comparable at all? Completely different game modes and objectives. So who cares?

    I just have no fun anymore, ...

    Stop playing.

    How will poeple ever see this as a serious endgame mode

    When was WvW promoted as endgame mode? WvW was never even "world vs world" because of toxic players/guilds who don't get the concept at all.

    If you want duels, go to sPvP. There are enough bad players to complain about too. But ppl complaining about bad duels in a mode that's not only about duels, are hypocrites.

    Oh and i play music ingame like thats the main reason i still log in since mounts lol.

    Maybe the better choice? :p

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Anput,

    You are not exactly wrong its just that you are behind the curve on the wvw communities ability to gaf. Fake fronting your ideals isn't really helping and certainly not to people who can't read between the lines, aka these forums. It doesn't help that nobody knows who you are besides your string of threads and posts that fall along this line so the wvw forum community always perceives you in the same narrow minded light.

    If you want people to listen and understand you, you need to create a non-toxic image first and build a more experienced and favorable reputation. Right now you are just digging a hole.

    I know this because I did a similar thing, like my "chill bleed reapers & necromancers in general are going to overrun wvw" thread on the old forums and all I got was laughed at. Its stupid because I predicted the necromancer overrun years ago and people were dismissive of it and even recently I reminded one of them and he was still dismissive of not what I said back then, but dismissive of ME. People often cannot separate debating people rather than debating ideas and forums/reddits are obnoxious environments for that. Don't expect that to change, its only going to get worse.

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • schloumou.3982schloumou.3982 Member ✭✭✭

    This isn't even a meme build. This seems just random.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 19, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    It's not bad ... it's just not realistic. Unfortunately, the game is good for some people the way it is ... just not you. Anet went one way ... you are asking them to go COMPLETELY the opposite way.

    You've admitted it multiple times yourself ... these decisions are based on where the money is at. You always try to make that sound like a bad thing to seem like on the 'good' side to make what you want seem more like the right thing to do. These things are not about being right or wrong or you're good, he's bad.

    The honest answer here to you is always the same; if you don't like the game, don't play it. You are the customer of a service. We've gone through this before.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • KeyOrion.9506KeyOrion.9506 Member ✭✭✭

    Rock. Paper. Scissors. One build will destroy another...but this other build will destroy you...but that one guy you destroyed could easily destroy the one guy that destroyed you. Rock. Paper. Scissors.

  • It will ALWAYS be the case that you either destroy, be destroyed or you have an endless fight. The only variables are to which % each case happens. As Long as you don't win a marjory of ALL solo/smallscale WvW fights you should reconsider your build or keep on honing your skills. However, you will never win all fights or lose all fights

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭

    Usually the people who die to meme builds are casual players or newbies.

    Any veteran can detect something off meta the moment yu pop a few skill combos.

    And then it's all up to game knowledge to guess what yu are running and heavily punish the meme build after it's predicted combo.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 31, 2019

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    It's not bad ... it's just not realistic. Unfortunately, the game is good for some people the way it is ... just not you. Anet went one way ... you are asking them to go COMPLETELY the opposite way.

    You've admitted it multiple times yourself ... these decisions are based on where the money is at. You always try to make that sound like a bad thing to seem like on the 'good' side to make what you want seem more like the right thing to do. These things are not about being right or wrong or you're good, he's bad.

    The honest answer here to you is always the same; if you don't like the game, don't play it. You are the customer of a service. We've gone through this before.

    Except the way the poeple here are defending it, unlike you, is using arguments that these mechanics make a good competitive PvP game.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 1, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    It's not bad ... it's just not realistic. Unfortunately, the game is good for some people the way it is ... just not you. Anet went one way ... you are asking them to go COMPLETELY the opposite way.

    You've admitted it multiple times yourself ... these decisions are based on where the money is at. You always try to make that sound like a bad thing to seem like on the 'good' side to make what you want seem more like the right thing to do. These things are not about being right or wrong or you're good, he's bad.

    The honest answer here to you is always the same; if you don't like the game, don't play it. You are the customer of a service. We've gone through this before.

    Except the way the poeple here are defending it, unlike you, is using arguments that these mechanics make a good competitive PvP game.

    Well, considering the kinds of people that play this game, it is competitive for them. Good or not, it's the people this game has. Why would Anet not continue to build content around the kinds of people that play this game?

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Voltekka.2375Voltekka.2375 Member ✭✭✭✭

    In OP's defense, he has been notorious for playing meme builds. He has asked for the permastealth meme DE build (prenerf), he had switched to meme soulbeast (yes, the oneshot pewpew etc prenerf, while complaining that people wont fight him), you get the picture. My tip, OP, is that if you ACTUALLY want to post vids, of your skill and that of your enemies, post a vid of you playing against proper roamers, not the average "ima do ma dailies pve style" kind of people. And share the results.
    Till then, "meme builds", indeed.

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 1, 2019

    @Voltekka.2375 said:
    In OP's defense, he has been notorious for playing meme builds. He has asked for the permastealth meme DE build (prenerf), he had switched to meme soulbeast (yes, the oneshot pewpew etc prenerf, while complaining that people wont fight him), you get the picture. My tip, OP, is that if you ACTUALLY want to post vids, of your skill and that of your enemies, post a vid of you playing against proper roamers, not the average "ima do ma dailies pve style" kind of people. And share the results.
    Till then, "meme builds", indeed.

    I don't play those at all, well except this one, also, those first 2 are actual meta builds poeple used, not meme builds,, ive also never played glass longbow, always balanced longbow with survival skills because it is plain better, but only since mounts. My favourite build is boonbeast. Is any builds not used to hit doors in PvE a meme build to you?

    I don't play anymore though, ill wait for the dismount skill.

    This is not a build you see anywhere, it is flamethrower lol.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    It's not bad ... it's just not realistic. Unfortunately, the game is good for some people the way it is ... just not you. Anet went one way ... you are asking them to go COMPLETELY the opposite way.

    You've admitted it multiple times yourself ... these decisions are based on where the money is at. You always try to make that sound like a bad thing to seem like on the 'good' side to make what you want seem more like the right thing to do. These things are not about being right or wrong or you're good, he's bad.

    The honest answer here to you is always the same; if you don't like the game, don't play it. You are the customer of a service. We've gone through this before.

    Except the way the poeple here are defending it, unlike you, is using arguments that these mechanics make a good competitive PvP game.

    Well, considering the kinds of people that play this game, it is competitive for them. Good or not, it's the people this game has. Why would Anet not continue to build content around the kinds of people that play this game?

    "For them" "the kinds of poeple" lol, if i play any other game in my library the average skill level is way up, playing a new open world PvP mmo rn and most poeple are good at the game, some are average and there is very few bad poeple, how oh how. Theres also big fights at every siege, no ktraining and pvdooring.

    But yeah all the serious fight guilds are leaving for nothing rite.

  • Voltekka.2375Voltekka.2375 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Voltekka.2375 said:
    In OP's defense, he has been notorious for playing meme builds. He has asked for the permastealth meme DE build (prenerf), he had switched to meme soulbeast (yes, the oneshot pewpew etc prenerf, while complaining that people wont fight him), you get the picture. My tip, OP, is that if you ACTUALLY want to post vids, of your skill and that of your enemies, post a vid of you playing against proper roamers, not the average "ima do ma dailies pve style" kind of people. And share the results.
    Till then, "meme builds", indeed.

    I don't play those at all, well except this one, also, those first 2 are actual meta builds poeple used, not meme builds,, ive also never played glass longbow, always balanced longbow with survival skills because it is plain better, but only since mounts. My favourite build is boonbeast. Is any builds not used to hit doors in PvE a meme build to you?

    I don't play anymore though, ill wait for the dismount skill.

    This is not a build you see anywhere, it is flamethrower lol.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    It's not bad ... it's just not realistic. Unfortunately, the game is good for some people the way it is ... just not you. Anet went one way ... you are asking them to go COMPLETELY the opposite way.

    You've admitted it multiple times yourself ... these decisions are based on where the money is at. You always try to make that sound like a bad thing to seem like on the 'good' side to make what you want seem more like the right thing to do. These things are not about being right or wrong or you're good, he's bad.

    The honest answer here to you is always the same; if you don't like the game, don't play it. You are the customer of a service. We've gone through this before.

    Except the way the poeple here are defending it, unlike you, is using arguments that these mechanics make a good competitive PvP game.

    Well, considering the kinds of people that play this game, it is competitive for them. Good or not, it's the people this game has. Why would Anet not continue to build content around the kinds of people that play this game?

    "For them" "the kinds of poeple" lol, if i play any other game in my library the average skill level is way up, playing a new open world PvP mmo rn and most poeple are good at the game, some are average and there is very few bad poeple, how oh how. Theres also big fights at every siege, no ktraining and pvdooring.

    But yeah all the serious fight guilds are leaving for nothing rite.

    "meta" builds. Sure. Thats why its called memebeast, yep.
    I am still waiting for a vid against proper roamers btw.

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 1, 2019

    @Voltekka.2375 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Voltekka.2375 said:
    In OP's defense, he has been notorious for playing meme builds. He has asked for the permastealth meme DE build (prenerf), he had switched to meme soulbeast (yes, the oneshot pewpew etc prenerf, while complaining that people wont fight him), you get the picture. My tip, OP, is that if you ACTUALLY want to post vids, of your skill and that of your enemies, post a vid of you playing against proper roamers, not the average "ima do ma dailies pve style" kind of people. And share the results.
    Till then, "meme builds", indeed.

    I don't play those at all, well except this one, also, those first 2 are actual meta builds poeple used, not meme builds,, ive also never played glass longbow, always balanced longbow with survival skills because it is plain better, but only since mounts. My favourite build is boonbeast. Is any builds not used to hit doors in PvE a meme build to you?

    I don't play anymore though, ill wait for the dismount skill.

    This is not a build you see anywhere, it is flamethrower lol.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    I really don't get why poeple are so much against the idea of less handholding and carebearing, poeple seem so attached to these concepts in this game.

    Why is it bad that i want these things? I just want a good game. I keep hearing bad, but i am not saying anything particulary bad or unfair.

    It's not bad ... it's just not realistic. Unfortunately, the game is good for some people the way it is ... just not you. Anet went one way ... you are asking them to go COMPLETELY the opposite way.

    You've admitted it multiple times yourself ... these decisions are based on where the money is at. You always try to make that sound like a bad thing to seem like on the 'good' side to make what you want seem more like the right thing to do. These things are not about being right or wrong or you're good, he's bad.

    The honest answer here to you is always the same; if you don't like the game, don't play it. You are the customer of a service. We've gone through this before.

    Except the way the poeple here are defending it, unlike you, is using arguments that these mechanics make a good competitive PvP game.

    Well, considering the kinds of people that play this game, it is competitive for them. Good or not, it's the people this game has. Why would Anet not continue to build content around the kinds of people that play this game?

    "For them" "the kinds of poeple" lol, if i play any other game in my library the average skill level is way up, playing a new open world PvP mmo rn and most poeple are good at the game, some are average and there is very few bad poeple, how oh how. Theres also big fights at every siege, no ktraining and pvdooring.

    But yeah all the serious fight guilds are leaving for nothing rite.

    "meta" builds. Sure. Thats why its called memebeast, yep.
    I am still waiting for a vid against proper roamers btw.

    When has the build ever been called that? It has always been called sicc-em roamer in the roamer community and on metabattle, that build isn't even good compared to regular longbow and boonbeast, poeple are just salty it can kill their invincible mount.

    How does sicc em roamer beat holo or mesmer btw? Seeing as the nerfs make sense to you and many others.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:
    "For them" "the kinds of poeple" lol, if i play any other game in my library the average skill level is way up, playing a new open world PvP mmo rn and most poeple are good at the game, some are average and there is very few bad poeple, how oh how. Theres also big fights at every siege, no ktraining and pvdooring.

    But yeah all the serious fight guilds are leaving for nothing rite.

    You can make all the jokes you want and insult the skill level of the people ... but that's the reality of who this game is made to service ... and it's a successful formula for Anet for 7 years now. The part I don't get is that you can't figure out that the whole business model of the game is based on the idea that there was a segment of the market that wanted this kind of content aimed towards them and Anet recognized that. The skill level you loathe IS that market; they are literally the people that sustain this game.

    ... so the question still stands ... Why would Anet not continue to build content around the kinds of people that play this game? Of course they are going to REGARDLESS of what the skill level of those people are. If there is a massively underserved market of hardcore top level PVP players who want to have a WvW-like experience, then there is either a game out there that serves those players or their might be an opportunity for another visionary to come along and make that game, similar to what Anet did. But make no mistake, there isn't any reality where Anet does that with GW2. The whole platform and concept of the game is exactly the opposite to what is needed in a game to serve those hardcore top level PVP players.

    Pick your game wisely if you don't want to wake up 7 years from now and think "Oh this game's all wrong" because that's all about you, not the game.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:
    "For them" "the kinds of poeple" lol, if i play any other game in my library the average skill level is way up, playing a new open world PvP mmo rn and most poeple are good at the game, some are average and there is very few bad poeple, how oh how. Theres also big fights at every siege, no ktraining and pvdooring.

    But yeah all the serious fight guilds are leaving for nothing rite.

    You can make all the jokes you want and insult the skill level of the people ... but that's the reality of who this game is made to service ... and it's a successful formula for Anet for 7 years now. The part I don't get is that you can't figure out that the whole business model of the game is based on the idea that there was a segment of the market that wanted this kind of content aimed towards them and Anet recognized that. The skill level you loathe IS that market; they are literally the people that sustain this game.

    ... so the question still stands ... Why would Anet not continue to build content around the kinds of people that play this game? Of course they are going to REGARDLESS of what the skill level of those people are. If there is a massively underserved market of hardcore top level PVP players who want to have a WvW-like experience, then there is either a game out there that serves those players or their might be an opportunity for another visionary to come along and make that game, similar to what Anet did. But make no mistake, there isn't any reality where Anet does that with GW2. The whole platform and concept of the game is exactly the opposite to what is needed in a game to serve those hardcore top level PVP players.

    Pick your game wisely if you don't want to wake up 7 years from now and think "Oh this game's all wrong" because that's all about you, not the game.

    Trash for trash, like i said.

    Don't get me wrong, i love this game but.

    Also guilds are actually leaving lol.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design perspective, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    I judge from quality, if you do too you will see that many popular games, fe Hearthstone are just objectively worse than say MTG.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    These kinds of games make worse games from a gameplay and design perspective, just how mcdonalds makes worse food from a quality and health perspective, and serves the masses.

    A game like this will always offer less, top end games always offer way more to top end players than low end games do to low end, they are way more rich and deep.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    These kinds of games make worse games from a gameplay and design perspective, just how mcdonalds makes worse food from a quality and health perspective, and serves the masses.

    and? that doesn't change anything I've said. This is a business. There was an underserved market. Anet made a smart move to serve it.

    You should just recognize you've made a bad choice. No crusade you have will change how GW2 plays to accomodate you at the expense of the majority of people that like it. The market determines what games stick around and go away, not some self-righteous ideal you have about what gameplay is trash to be eradicated.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    These kinds of games make worse games from a gameplay and design perspective, just how mcdonalds makes worse food from a quality and health perspective, and serves the masses.

    and? that doesn't change anything I've said. This is a business. There was an underserved market. Anet made a smart move to serve it.

    You should just recognize you've made a bad choice. No crusade you have will change how GW2 plays to accomodate you at the expense of the majority of people that like it. The market determines what games stick around and go away, not some self-righteous ideal you have about what gameplay is trash to be eradicated.

    What youve said also doesn't change anything i have said, it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    These kinds of games make worse games from a gameplay and design perspective, just how mcdonalds makes worse food from a quality and health perspective, and serves the masses.

    and? that doesn't change anything I've said. This is a business. There was an underserved market. Anet made a smart move to serve it.

    You should just recognize you've made a bad choice. No crusade you have will change how GW2 plays to accomodate you at the expense of the majority of people that like it. The market determines what games stick around and go away, not some self-righteous ideal you have about what gameplay is trash to be eradicated.

    What youve said also doesn't change anything i have said, it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

    True, but that doesn't change the fact that GW2 has them. How you think it should be done is not relevant because you continue to fail to recognize who this game is made to service. The game appeals to the market it serves because it DOES have features like that, whether you think it's good for competitive PVP or not.

    Again, this isn't about what you think is good or not. As long as you keep flying that banner, you won't understand why businesses do these things. It's not even limited to MMO's.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    These kinds of games make worse games from a gameplay and design perspective, just how mcdonalds makes worse food from a quality and health perspective, and serves the masses.

    and? that doesn't change anything I've said. This is a business. There was an underserved market. Anet made a smart move to serve it.

    You should just recognize you've made a bad choice. No crusade you have will change how GW2 plays to accomodate you at the expense of the majority of people that like it. The market determines what games stick around and go away, not some self-righteous ideal you have about what gameplay is trash to be eradicated.

    What youve said also doesn't change anything i have said, it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

    True, but that doesn't change the fact that GW2 has them. How you think it should be done is not relevant because you continue to fail to recognize who this game is made to service. The game appeals to the market it serves because it DOES have features like that, whether you think it's good for competitive PVP or not.

    Again, this isn't about what you think is good or not. As long as you keep flying that banner, you won't understand why businesses do these things. It's not even limited to MMO's.

    Said market is lowest hanging fruit.

    Come on, "whether i think", you know it is not not good for competitive PvP, otherwise those games would have these kinds of features.

    There is a reason that the more complicated, less forgiving and competitive games are the better games that have esports, i just don't get why poeple want to be handheld and have these carebear mechanics except to make up for their lack of skill, which is just bad.

  • c space cowboy.2764c space cowboy.2764 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 3, 2019

    As someone who roams a lot, lately it's either a really good roamer running a meme build or 2-4 really new people running kitten builds.

    I've been testing a new build and it goes either way.

    I had a 4 man guild group of unranked people chasing and beating on me and I just ran away sustaining anything they did to me.

    Also the amount of unranked condi thief's that poison and run are becoming more numerous. Maybe hoping they catch noobs without condi clear?

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 3, 2019

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    If you follow the logic of his posts, he doesn’t even play WvW. Per him, there are only 5 of us that do..

    I mean you and obtena makes 2, but poeple totally aren't massively leaving.

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    Whatever you want to call it, there is a business case there, a good one apparently. Eight years ago if someone would have told me that an MMO was going to cater to this kind of player, I would have said it wouldn't last a year. Here we are.

    I hope those guilds find a game that suits them. Nothing worse than having people complain about the game because it doesn't suit them and skew Anet's efforts to provide content to the main market this game should continue to serve. In the end this will benefit the people that stay, as it should. Appealing to the outliers isn't a strong business case. I would say, Anet has spread themselves too thin. If they are going to make this game a big player again, they better look back to WHY this game was successful in the past and who made it that way.

    This is basically a glorified singleplayer game at this point with their current focus, they really are ruining the quality of the game, whether it is PvE or PvP groupcontent.

    MMO junkfood, worse than actual food yet it still sells more.

    Whatever you want to call it, the general MMO PvP community agrees.

    Ive already found a game that is based on WvW and does things way better though, still, i really want to play this game too.

    Maybe ... I mean, all the people that like it don't really care how you want to label it and continuing to make bad of it won't bring what you liked back to it. It's always been a glorified single player game. People were soloing dungeons as soon as the mechanics were learned. People can do raids with much lower than 10 people. I mean ... you pretend some switch was thrown and all the sudden Anet has done something to the game that's bad. That's just not true; the game has ALWAYS worked this way. it's ALWAYS appealed to the people you think are dragging it down with their scrub play. That was always the plan. If anything, the difficulty has increased over the history of the game, not been dumbed down.

    You just picked the wrong game, then you tried to impose your 'correct' version of it on everyone with your negativity-laden posts. Then you are surprised people were against you? Of course you weren't going to get anywhere with that.

    So why are you still here in the scrubgame? You don't sound like a scrub to me.

    Why I play this game has nothing to do with how you've poorly judged the game and it's direction.

    I have judged the game from a game design, to make a high quality and skill intensive, and mechanically rich game perspective, you judge it to how accessible it is to little timmy.

    And my judgement is more relevant than anything you have considered because the game intends to serve that market. That's why when you complain the game isn't targeting high caliber players, that complaint is a fail. This isn't new either like you want us to believe. It's always been that way. Even though you have judged to the favour of high performance, it's a poor judgement.

    I mean, the game is quality. It just doesn't target high performance. Those two things aren't even related. You have wrongly made that association ... or more accurately, for YOU quality is about high performance. That's not the case for everyone.

    These kinds of games make worse games from a gameplay and design perspective, just how mcdonalds makes worse food from a quality and health perspective, and serves the masses.

    and? that doesn't change anything I've said. This is a business. There was an underserved market. Anet made a smart move to serve it.

    You should just recognize you've made a bad choice. No crusade you have will change how GW2 plays to accomodate you at the expense of the majority of people that like it. The market determines what games stick around and go away, not some self-righteous ideal you have about what gameplay is trash to be eradicated.

    What youve said also doesn't change anything i have said, it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

    True, but that doesn't change the fact that GW2 has them. How you think it should be done is not relevant because you continue to fail to recognize who this game is made to service. The game appeals to the market it serves because it DOES have features like that, whether you think it's good for competitive PVP or not.

    Again, this isn't about what you think is good or not. As long as you keep flying that banner, you won't understand why businesses do these things. It's not even limited to MMO's.

    Said market is lowest hanging fruit.

    That's called a smart business move. Why WOULDN'T you target that group if you run a business. OFC you would. In this situation, it's the whole business case for the game existing.

    Come on, "whether i think", you know it is not not good for competitive PvP, otherwise those games would have these kinds of features.

    I don't know what you mean here ... I'm not arguing certain features are good for competitive PVP or not because it's not relevant to the discussion. If certain features are included in the game, it's probably because Anet feels they compliment what their targetted market wants from the game.

    There is a reason that the more complicated, less forgiving and competitive games are the better games that have esports, i just don't get why poeple want to be handheld and have these carebear mechanics except to make up for their lack of skill, which is just bad.

    No argument about that ... if you don't understand it, that's fine. You just need to understand that it's not necessary for Anet to build the game in a certain way for it to work and be successful.

    You have this constant theme that you want to ignore the fact that this is a business. That should be your starting point. I know you have told me many times you are completely ignoring that. You simply can't remove it from how you think about these things and sound like you have any idea what you are talking about.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • LetoII.3782LetoII.3782 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Anput.4620 said:

    it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

    Gotta say I'm resigned to give Anet the boot too, and I'm curious what game you're talking about.

    [HUNT] the predatory instinct

  • Anput.4620Anput.4620 Member ✭✭✭

    @LetoII.3782 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

    Gotta say I'm resigned to give Anet the boot too, and I'm curious what game you're talking about.

    Gloria Victis, very fun game.

  • LetoII.3782LetoII.3782 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Anput.4620 said:

    @LetoII.3782 said:

    @Anput.4620 said:

    it is not good for a competitive PvP game to have certain features, period. What makes kitten-saving features good? New RVR game im playing has 30 sec cast for tp so you can't combat tp among many other good mechanics that allow for a competitive quality PvP experience, thats how it should be done, and the player quality is way higher in this game.

    Gotta say I'm resigned to give Anet the boot too, and I'm curious what game you're talking about.

    Gloria Victis, very fun game.

    Completely missed it somehow, thanks

    [HUNT] the predatory instinct

  • Henrik.7560Henrik.7560 Member ✭✭✭

    I can relate, if your meme build has a lot of burst, you will delete anyone that doesn't expect it; regardless if you don't have any sustain or escape. However players who do have sustain or traits to save them will wreck you, or if they just simply dodge. Had a similar experience roaming on sc/f weaver

    [eA] Sakura | Kaineng

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