(Contained) Open World PvP Events, Cut Content?

Hidden within yesterday's AMA, something amazing was revealed, a new type of event that never made it into the release of PoF: contained open world PvP events.

The concept of these open world "PvP" events that were going to be implemented in Vabbi is so absolutely interesting I'm dreaming of knowing the details of what these types of events consisted of. Were they just events that threw a bunch of players into an arena, and had winners like the races? Or were they more PvMP centric like the fantastic branded beta finale event?

I sincerely hope we see these events reach the light of day sometime in the future, especially if they were well along into development! It would be such a pleasure and interesting encounter for sure; and I wouldn't be surprised if many players chose to rally the cause of Joko given the choice during an event!

How do you think these events were designed? Aside from obviously having to "check in" to participate like races, what type of "PvP" mechanics do you think they consisted of?

Edit: Before this is brought up again, these events were said to be "contained" which implies they were either in a segregated portion of the map, or required a sign up process like races. No one is forcing anyone into endlessly being ganked. You should also broaden your horizon of "PvP" if you think all it means is traditional SPvP- rather we already have a form of Open World PvP events that were introduced with this expansion: racing!

I agree. I am not a PvP fan in heart, but I always enjoyed seeing some (consensual) PvP happen on PvE servers in Everquest and SWG (rip).
In PoF they indeed may have had to do with chosing a faction(opt in) which would be a temp thing, maybe as part of a large Meta event? Then after the event had run its course (maybe conquering/holding checkpoints) you would lose your faction/pvp status.

@Tyncale.1629 said:I agree. I am not a PvP fan in heart, but I always enjoyed seeing some (consensual) PvP happen on PvE servers in Everquest and SWG (rip).

In PoF they indeed may have had to do with chosing a faction(opt in) which would be a temp thing, maybe as part of a large Meta event? Then after the event had run its course (maybe conquering/holding checkpoints) you would lose your faction/pvp status.

A meta event would be amazing! Especially if you chose a side before the pre, perhaps allowing a slight advantage or disadvantage based on the performance of each side during the pre? (Or maybe even the other way around if it was used as balancing act to handicap the side with fewer players).

I don't want anything to do with PvP, so forcing people into it for events in PvE would be pretty much the worst idea. People who want to PvP have two game modes for that, it really doesn't need to bleed into the third as well.

Please don't. It might be OK to add some sort of pit fight arena. Talk to NPC, be teleported into a cage with n other players, fight!

But I hope there will never ever be an open world PVP event beyond something like that. It would only consist of people signing up by accident to find out what it is and "professional" gankers who get a kick out of killing newbies.

I haven't read what the devs said in the AMA but I'm sure there would have been a RP element to it, so if you chose Joko as an ally at the beginning of the story you would have fought against people who chose neutral or sunspears ( if the numbers are even, which they probably aren't).

Maybe it would have been just conquering strategic points on the map and killing as many enemy players as possible, maybe there would have been an actual siege mechanic like wvw (which I prefer). I like the idea., they should do a test run one day, if possible. I just don't know if people with griffons wouldn't have a strong advantage, though maybe they could deactivate flying for that time.

No thanks, I really hope PvP stuff is kept out of PvE. Having PvP content in PvE will just cause map chat to be flooded with toxicity, elitist PvP players bragging, spamming chat for people to challenge them, or moaning at PvE players for not using meta builds etc if they lose etc. It will be far worse than the light moaning some people do if a meta fails.

I can't even see the need for any PvP arenas in PvE, as those players who want to fight can just go to the PvP mode to do it.

Squad based PvP events will just divide players up even more as experienced PvP players will just group up together and exclude/kick any non PvP or non meta build players. Leaving the non PvP/non meta players no chance as they will always be up against experienced PvP squads. That crap doesn't belong in open world PvE!

As someone mentioned above, there's already two competitive game modes involving PvP.

Open world PvE is a sanctuary where players can play how they want, with what gear they want, and using what builds they want. PvP events in PvE will destroy that sanctuary and freedom as players will only stand a chance at surviving in those events if they run meta builds.

No thanks. The community is toxic enough as is, without adding something like that.

Also given the amount of PvE players who didn't enjoy having to do WvW for the gift of battle. And the amount of players who complain about mob difficulty in story/HoT and PoF.

I can't see that throwing PvP into PvE, and replacing mobs at events with far more challenging elite PvP players, will be an idea that goes down well with a lot of the PvE community.

As a wvw player I can see how this would end badly if placed into a pve map. No need to force the brokenness of pvp or wvw onto pve players. There would be much anger, toxicity, trolling, and in the end, no fun.

Keep pvp and wvw out of pve. Those who wish to play either game mode can do so freely as it is.

It was an interesting concept, but I still hope one day they create a dueling toggle that is off by default. This is coming from someone who doesn't like to pvp. I just want something to watch in cities. So maybe have duels only allowed in places like cities so they don't interfere with metas. And just so this is very clear, because someone is going to jump on this immediately. OFF BY DEFAULT. Which means not even possible to get duel request spammed if you have no interest.

I've often speculated that at some point back before release they were planning to add small PvP arenas to PvE maps. There are several places where NPCs are fighting each other, like the arena in Guardian's Pass in Gendarran Fields, and of course Edge of Destinty mentions a large arena in Lion's Arch. I imagine it would have worked like the arenas in GW1, introducing people to PvP and letting you build up to fighting in the Mists.

So maybe they could do something like that. But it would have to be entirely separate to PvE events and map completion, not something you're required to do or can stumble into without knowing what it is. Otherwise as other people have said it would be made up entirely of people who don't know what they're doing and either 'signed up' without knowing it was PvP or are forced to do it for map completion or to progress an event chain and people who get a kick out of ganking those people and think it somehow makes them amazing.

Other games keep trying to combine PvE and PvP and in my experience it rarely works. There is a small niche crowd who love it, but then clamour for everything to be balanced and designed around it, a slightly largely group who enjoy ganking people who don't know how to play that mode and a much, much bigger group who avoid it entirely in favour of dedicated PvP or PvE.

PVP can keep it's filth in WVW (which is Open World) and in the actual PVP crap.Leave it out of the PVE. There's a reason there's VP modes outside of PVE.

Adding any form of PvP into PvE would be poison to the community. Everything would immediately turn hostile and toxic. Please keep it out of PVE.

While I personally would have loved to see a PvP event as a part of the map meta, I can see why many other wouldn't want something like this to be implemented. With a handful of WvW and PvP pros stacked versus players with no PvP experience, it would be total chaos.

However, a completely optional HotM-style free-for-all arena in the Bone Palace would have been amazing. Especially with some minor daily rewards for winning there, would definitely breathe life into the map and make it really interesting. Please devs, consider adding something like that.

If there are very few enemy players and they're more like champions/legendaries (low dmg, extreme health and bound to an area (so you dont have anyone spawncamping)) than actual pvp enemies, i hope the hypercasual people wont complain it away. Then it'd be an amazing and fun event.

@Chadramar.8156 said:I don't want anything to do with PvP, so forcing people into it for events in PvE would be pretty much the worst idea. People who want to PvP have two game modes for that, it really doesn't need to bleed into the third as well.

No one is forcing anyone to do anything, the dev said they were contained- as in an optional event. This means they would either require you to sign up like races if it was more traditional PvP style minigame, or head over to the specific area to partake if it was a PvMP (Player versus Monster Player) scenario.

@Latorn.4209 said:

@Chadramar.8156 said:I don't want anything to do with PvP, so forcing people into it for events in PvE would be pretty much the worst idea. People who want to PvP have two game modes for that, it really doesn't need to bleed into the third as well.

and probably hide a mastery behind it.

I do not see how anyone could accidentally get wrapped up in this if Anet makes this a clear, consensual, opt-in kind of thing, preferably localized to a certain area of the map (and part of a temp Meta for instance).

Having said that, it is possible that people simply dislike having to watch or be confronted with PvP antics in the PvE game, even if they are perfectly safe from it. I feel that the latter may also have to do with Anets decision to not implement it.

Races are not PvP per se. They are a competition, yes, but they're not a gankfest. You cannot negatively affect the other racers in any way.

Open-world PvP as part of a big map meta event would not feel optional, especially if parts of collections and achievements are locked being it. You shouldn't have to sit out part of a meta or interrupt your fun exploration just because you don't want to PvP.

And again: there are two game modes for people who do want to PvP. Why does it have to be forced in the one PvP-free game mode as well, the one uniquely and explicitly based on cooperation instead of on seeing other people as competition for resources at best and hated kill-on-sight enemies at worst? That focus on cooperation is part of the game's appeal, IMO, especially compared to the crappy attitudes fostered by faction-based games like WoW and ToR.

@Chadramar.8156 said:Races are not PvP per se. They are a competition, yes, but they're not a gankfest. You cannot negatively affect the other racers in any way.

Open-world PvP as part of a big map meta event would not feel optional, especially if parts of collections and achievements are locked being it. You shouldn't have to sit out part of a meta or interrupt your fun exploration just because you don't want to PvP.

And again: there are two game modes for people who do want to PvP. Why does it have to be forced in the one PvP-free game mode as well, the one uniquely and explicitly based on cooperation instead of on seeing other people as competition for resources at best and hated kill-on-sight enemies at worst? That focus on cooperation is part of the game's appeal, IMO, especially compared to the crappy attitudes fostered by faction-based games like WoW and ToR.

No one has said anything about collections and masteries being behind these "PvP" events. The most that I could see being attached to them would be achievements- which is perfectly acceptable because other achievements are already gated behind WvW and SPvP.

I think you're misunderstanding the entire premise: no one is being forced into an open world PvP map wide meta, rather the dev that revealed the concept stated they were CONTAINED, which implies participation was by player choice.

And yes, races are a type PvP. Any game mode where a player is facing another player is PvP. If a snowball fight event was added without players dying, but had an event winner beating out other players it is PvP. Character death is not a requirement for PvP.

Finally why am I sad that this was cut, and why should it be added in the future? Because it brings many new types of events to the game- which in turn keeps the game interesting. I have heard incredibly interesting suggestions like a base defense minigame utilizing Joko's minions like in the PoF story, etc. Events that incorporate other players into it like this could bring forth countless new event types rather than the typical escort/defeat waves.