A question of size — Guild Wars 2 Forums

A question of size

Kaladel.1670Kaladel.1670 Member ✭✭

So, maybe it's explained somewhere and I missed it, but it's been quite some time and I can't stop thinking about it.
Why are awakened / ghosts NPC so big in PoF ? Is there a lore reason for them having the size of norns ? Or is it just for a gameplay reason ?
Thanks.

Comments

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 22, 2019

    good catch, what I noticed is that the (rare)civilians awakened are bit smaller/normal human size.

    I don't think they had lore for it, just the tradition of old games where foes size was designed with base on their rank.

    "It's a testament to the folly of the humans and their gods. They say Arah was sacred, but all I see is one big dragon nest."(Rytlock Brimstone)

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 22, 2019

    Aside from the Turai Ossa model, not sure which ghosts you may be referring to. In this case, this is more a reference to GW1 - Turai Ossa, aka the Ghostly Hero, was oversized for mechanical reasons. The Ghostly Hero model was used in PvP as a critical NPC you would need to kill in certain PvP matches; Prophecies was largely designed with the idea of "PvP is the end-game" (this didn't pan out, notably) so when you reach Turai Ossa in the Crystal Desert, the three missions with him are focused on PvP mechanics to teach players how to PvP match, as right after those missions you got access to Hall of Heroes arena (highest PvP which has the Ghostly Hero). This just ended up continuing a thing where Turai Ossa was a giant among men, but fully human. He's basically your outlier 7-foot-something tall guy that looms over everyone else.

    So those models are large as reference to legacy game design choice reasons.

    As for the Awakened Archers, Soldiers, and casters. I'm betting this is a mechanical thing. Their models are based off of the norn animation rigging, so their size is likely defaulted to the norn size because of this. They wouldn't bother altering it because it meant that enemies were easier to see in a flood of players (same reasons why veterans, champions, and legendary foes are increasingly larger in scale - visibility for players).

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

  • draxynnic.3719draxynnic.3719 Member ✭✭✭✭

    We also know that Joko liked to alter the Awakened, so it's possible that those alterations did include making them bigger so they'd make better/more intimidating soldiers.

  • lakdav.3694lakdav.3694 Member ✭✭✭

    Taimi too has grown significantly ever since she doesn't ride on top of Scruffy. She is now bigger than my adult asuras.

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lakdav.3694 said:
    Taimi too has grown significantly ever since she doesn't ride on top of Scruffy. She is now bigger than my adult asuras.

    I'm pretty sure Taimi has grown up into adulthood as well by now. Atleast physically.

  • @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Aside from the Turai Ossa model, not sure which ghosts you may be referring to. In this case, this is more a reference to GW1 - Turai Ossa, aka the Ghostly Hero, was oversized for mechanical reasons. The Ghostly Hero model was used in PvP as a critical NPC you would need to kill in certain PvP matches; Prophecies was largely designed with the idea of "PvP is the end-game" (this didn't pan out, notably) so when you reach Turai Ossa in the Crystal Desert, the three missions with him are focused on PvP mechanics to teach players how to PvP match, as right after those missions you got access to Hall of Heroes arena (highest PvP which has the Ghostly Hero). This just ended up continuing a thing where Turai Ossa was a giant among men, but fully human. He's basically your outlier 7-foot-something tall guy that looms over everyone else.

    So those models are large as reference to legacy game design choice reasons.

    As for the Awakened Archers, Soldiers, and casters. I'm betting this is a mechanical thing. Their models are based off of the norn animation rigging, so their size is likely defaulted to the norn size because of this. They wouldn't bother altering it because it meant that enemies were easier to see in a flood of players (same reasons why veterans, champions, and legendary foes are increasingly larger in scale - visibility for players).

    Interesting.
    I was also thinking of Dahlah and Nahlah when I mentioned ghosts. (I believe other primeval kings and queens were bigger in the story too, but I'm not 100% sure)

  • @Kaladel.1670 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    Aside from the Turai Ossa model, not sure which ghosts you may be referring to. In this case, this is more a reference to GW1 - Turai Ossa, aka the Ghostly Hero, was oversized for mechanical reasons. The Ghostly Hero model was used in PvP as a critical NPC you would need to kill in certain PvP matches; Prophecies was largely designed with the idea of "PvP is the end-game" (this didn't pan out, notably) so when you reach Turai Ossa in the Crystal Desert, the three missions with him are focused on PvP mechanics to teach players how to PvP match, as right after those missions you got access to Hall of Heroes arena (highest PvP which has the Ghostly Hero). This just ended up continuing a thing where Turai Ossa was a giant among men, but fully human. He's basically your outlier 7-foot-something tall guy that looms over everyone else.

    So those models are large as reference to legacy game design choice reasons.

    As for the Awakened Archers, Soldiers, and casters. I'm betting this is a mechanical thing. Their models are based off of the norn animation rigging, so their size is likely defaulted to the norn size because of this. They wouldn't bother altering it because it meant that enemies were easier to see in a flood of players (same reasons why veterans, champions, and legendary foes are increasingly larger in scale - visibility for players).

    Interesting.
    I was also thinking of Dahlah and Nahlah when I mentioned ghosts. (I believe other primeval kings and queens were bigger in the story too, but I'm not 100% sure)

    They're all champion ranked. As I mentioned, veteran, champion, and legendary ranked foes get incremental size increases. Elites don't due to their origins as being "normal" foes in dungeons. So all veterans will be slightly larger than normal/elite versions, champions larger than veterans, and legendaries larger than champions. This is why, for example, the Legendary Bandit Executioner is larger than norn despite being human.

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

  • @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    They're all champion ranked. As I mentioned, veteran, champion, and legendary ranked foes get incremental size increases. Elites don't due to their origins as being "normal" foes in dungeons. So all veterans will be slightly larger than normal/elite versions, champions larger than veterans, and legendaries larger than champions. This is why, for example, the Legendary Bandit Executioner is larger than norn despite being human.

    I'd never really paid attention to that before, but yeah... that makes perfect sense.
    Thanks for your answers.

  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 23, 2019

    The GW series enlarges npc's a lot (especially enemies), often to comical levels. I think it's more for QoL than any lore based reason, since a bigger npc is easier to notice in a crowd.

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Westenev.5289 said:
    The GW series enlarges npc's a lot (especially enemies), often to comical levels. I think it's more for QoL than any lore based reason, since a bigger npc is easier to notice in a crowd.

    This. It's like how Scarlet at one point (IIRC) appeared huge, but that was during a public, large scale boss event so everybody could see her. She was just a normal Sylvari in lore. Applies to bosses, etc.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Taidha could use the treatment too. I’m not sure in 7 years I’ve been able to see her in game model...

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • ErikTheTyrant.4527ErikTheTyrant.4527 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 25, 2019

    I thought it had to do with how much magic they contained within them, or how powerful they are. kind of like the gods and Kormir, or like mathias in salvation pass. They are roughly normal sized but then they basically become supercharged.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 25, 2019

    @Randulf.7614 said:
    Taidha could use the treatment too. I’m not sure in 7 years I’ve been able to see her in game model...

    Taidha is weird in that she seems to be the only normal sized legendary foe I've ever seen. Given that the size increase is apparently hardcoded into the ranking designs, I'd guess that her normal model is the smallest human female size there is, making her on par to the tallest human female with the size increase.

    @ErikTheTyrant.4527 said:
    I thought it had to do with how much magic they contained within them, or how powerful they are. kind of like the gods and Kormir, or like mathias in salvation pass. They are roughly normal sized but then they basically become supercharged.

    Many of the champions/legendaries have nothing to do with magic.

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

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