When did GW2 turn into a grindfest? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

When did GW2 turn into a grindfest?

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  • Rasimir.6239Rasimir.6239 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Rasimir.6239 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:
    what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.
    but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

    Grab those xp potions and that food, and venture out into Verdant Brink. Gaining experience for Gliding rank 1 is no different than gaining experience for levels to unlock the next step of the personal story. You get xp through pretty much everything you do in game, including unfogging the map and exploring it's objectives (waypoints, points of interest, vistas ...)

    You can get around Verdant Brink without gliding or mushroom masteries (although those do open a lot of new ways to travel through the map), certainly enough to unlock the mastery for the next story step.

    If all else fails and you just can't bring yourself to explore the map and join in on events (no need to repeat them), then grab another character and start on the story with them. Unlike character levels, masteries are account wide, so several characters can contribute experience to the same mastery.

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:
    also, its not just playing the game, raptor long jump require 2 more mastery points, and those mastery points can only be done by doing quests within the raptor area, are there any NEW quests, no, it is a repeat of quests done over and over again to earn the achievement points.

    I think you are mixing up a few things here (which is not surprising, as the mastery system is different to most other games' progression systems and not quite intuitive to many). You need experience to fill mastery levels (the same as you needed experience to fill character levels pre 80), and you need mastery points to unlock a mastery once you've filled the experience bar. You do not need achievement points for any of this. The game does however use achievements to track a lot of objectives, including mastery points. Just view those achievements as your "available points" list.

    The early PoF masteries (up to raptor rank 3) are indeed a bit tight, though there are still more available than necessary. You do get several of them simply for playing the story, while others are attached to map objectives or specific "quests" (that are also tracked as achievements). None of the early ones require content repetition though, and since there are considerably more points available than necessary in any of the three mastery regions you can very well skip all of the repetitive ones if you don't like them. I know I didn't do them (unless on accident), and I've been maxed on masteries for a while.

    If you still feel uncomfortable with the system, try putting up a post in the players helping players section to get tips on what to do to advance your story and masteries, or even state your region and usual play times to find people to join you, show you how to get around, and even port you to mastery communes you wouldn't be able to reach yet to make things easier (there are several that require certain masteries to reach them, but you can easily get those masteries with the points available to you before).

    Thank you for explaining, however...in order to get 2 more mastery points, it says when I hover over the mastery points that I need to do quests etc in the area of the raptors. I done so, I dove every exploration point I could get my hands on, I even done some of the repeatable quests. The only thing that remains within the raptor area is to continue to do repeatable quests until I get the last 2 mastery points, because the storyline quest is over a sizable ravine that require the longer jump in raptors. So I am stuck doing that, which I detest, and honestly having being stuck there is causing me to play less because the moment I get into the game and I see I have to do same as I did yesterday, it gives me the "WoW chill" of having to do dailies ad infinitum and thats why I left WoW because they lock to much of the things behind "you got to get 3000 rep for your bodyguard in order to continue storyline". Thats not entertaining.

    Like I said, the early PoF story is one of the few points in mastery progression where points may seem a bit tight, but there are still enough in your reach to get those two and possibly a few extra. Check your achievement log for any category with a red mastery point. Those lead you to achievements that offer PoF mastery points you haven't claimed yet. Specifically the Crystal Desert and Desert Highlands categories in Path of Fire hold the ones available to you right now. Check the wiki for a full list of mastery point unlocks , including links to more specific explanations/maps.

    Reins of the raptor for example is an easy one, although that one does in fact require you to re-do some renown hearts if you haven't bought the collection items on your first trip through the area. You can however do this on any character, so if you have a second character you want to explore the Crystal Oasis with, just use them to do the hearts.

    The Crystal Oasis bounty tour is another quick and easy one. Check the lfg for a bounty train in Crystal Oasis or simply ask in map chat for players to join you for one bounty from each bounty board. An even easier way is to ask nicely in map-chat if there is a player willing to place a portal for you to reach a mastery point you don't have the required mastery for, like the quicksand one in northern Crystal Oasis or the one on top of the pillar at the start of the desert highlands.

  • @Dayra.7405 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    I don't remember any situation where I am forced to repeat stuff over several days. Which one are you talking about?

    Raptor area where you get to get to level 3 raptore to earn the long jump, just to get to the other side of the ravine. You say you got the 3 points without grinding. How?
    I done every quests, every hero challenge, every point of interest and yet, I am 30% into second achievment and I need to get to third.

    Hm, I remember that it was difficult to get enough Mastery Points to get Lvl 3 Raptor on the first map, but MPs cannot be grinded, they are once per account. I don't remember that I had an EXP problem, maybe because I started to do PoF with several chars to get Hero Points (to get their new elite) for all of them.

    Solution: You can pass to the other PoF (or LS4) maps and do stuff there. Or nowadays you can ask in map-chat for a friendly Mesmer with all mounts who can easily give you access to MP's you cannot reach with your current mounts.

    HAHAHAHAHAAAAA I almost came to same conclution, except I was thinking id create my own mesmer, seems they are fun ;)

  • @Naga.9623 said:
    Follow this video guide by dulfy to get mastery point needed to unlock them.

    Dulfy have guides for the other pof maps too. Like other have mentioned, do various event and hearts on map to fill up your mastery level. Then follow the video guide to get the necessary mastery points to unlock mastery you want.
    It's the same thing with hot mastery too.
    Another good YouTube guide to follow is aiyinmaiden.

    p/s: simply playing the story and doing some achievement will get you some mastery points too, good luck :)

    I will try this, thank you :)

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:
    I was thinking id create my own mesmer, seems they are fun ;)

    Hm, you cannot port yourself, and you have to reach the point you fail to reach yourself, and while Mesmer may be fun against few strong enemies, I found them annoying against many weak enemies (as the existence of clones and illusions is bound to the existence of the enemy you casted them on).

  • Fenella.2634Fenella.2634 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    I don't remember any situation where I am forced to repeat stuff over several days. Which one are you talking about?

    I remember being stuck at VB for about two weeks. Granted, at the time I was returning from a long break and had to practically learn the game from scratch. Also, I did not use guides at the time, did not have a guild yet and played mostly for the story. Those weeks were totally frustrating, as the story wanted me to save those people ASAP, but the game mechanics didn't let me proceed. It felt as if the Commander did not take the mission seriously. Sure, the events are nice and all, but I wanted to save DE first and do sightseeing later.
    I do love HoT. It's my favorite part of the game now. But back then, I never wanted to replay it ever. :lol:
    (It became way more fun once I got used to the game mechanics and once I had unlocked the masteries, so my alts could go at a better pace.)

  • Dayra.7405Dayra.7405 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    @Fenella.2634 said:

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    I don't remember any situation where I am forced to repeat stuff over several days. Which one are you talking about?

    I remember being stuck at VB for about two weeks. Granted, at the time I was returning from a long break and had to practically learn the game from scratch. Also, I did not use guides at the time, did not have a guild yet and played mostly for the story. Those weeks were totally frustrating, as the story wanted me to save those people ASAP, but the game mechanics didn't let me proceed. It felt as if the Commander did not take the mission seriously. Sure, the events are nice and all, but I wanted to save DE first and do sightseeing later.
    I do love HoT. It's my favorite part of the game now. But back then, I never wanted to replay it ever. :lol:
    (It became way more fun once I got used to the game mechanics and once I had unlocked the masteries, so my alts could go at a better pace.)

    As said, grinding starts where your mindset is: I want to reach that ASAP.

  • I think the dude is legit grinding the same events not realizing he can leave the zone to the other zones by exploration or if he got a bunch of birthday gifts tele to a friend. You can swap char and do story/exploration for exp. You can go to different maps to get MP. I do not know what more to say except you missed way too much on the long break and just do not know how to efficiently do anything and it has lead to this grind you created that none of us dealt with.

  • Fenella.2634Fenella.2634 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    As said, grinding starts where your mindset is: I want to reach that ASAP.

    True. :) I just wanted to point out that it's totally possible to waste a lot of time especially in HoT, if the player is not set on playing efficiently and using guides.
    Given the urgency of the story, that was especially unpleasant. And what a shame, really. I was so frustrated at the pace and the sidetrackings that I had really missed much of the beauty and interesting plots of HoT on that first playthrough. So, @ TE, don't be too negative, it might feel a bit grindy right now, but if you ever replay HoT and PoF and pay attention to the maps and the stories, it's really not that bad. :)

  • Ototo.3214Ototo.3214 Member ✭✭✭

    Only time I've ever experienced grinding in this game is when I intentionally and willingly farmed something like Silverwastes for gold. Which I didn't need to do, I just wanted to.
    Sure, when HoT first came out, the exp requirements were a bit steep, but I never really saw it as a big grind cause I enjoyed the new maps and metas and was having a great time just playing the game. I believe they've since made the exp requirements easier? Not that big of a deal.

    Better than doing the same dungeons over and over and over again to level a class you didn't take through the main story. Or grinding the same trial over and over and over again to get gear or that rare chance at a mount drop. Lookin at you FFXIV.
    And I've heard other MMOs like WoW are no better, though I've never played them. But to call GW2 a grind because you need to earn a wee bit of exp and do a few simple achievements is absurd.

  • Maybe they decided that hey, maybe we shouldn't just cater to the people who want things handed to them, lets give the players that are getting bored and burnt out on the easy handout content something to do for a while?

    Honestly though, not everything should be obtainable in 1 hour, an MMO is and has always been a grindy genre, and will always be. I enjoyed GW2 back in the day loads as well, but could I ever see myself playing a vanilla version of the game? Hell no. I'd get bored instantly like I did back in the day, taking a break from an MMO 2 months after launch cause there is literally no more content than PvP left cause everything was obtainable within hours is bad.

  • Dami.5046Dami.5046 Member ✭✭✭✭

    some of you have no idea what grind in a game is.
    sorry.

  • Rauderi.8706Rauderi.8706 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

    meaning: I have to do quests thats are non critical and non storyline just to earn points to get to use gliders

    I confess I forgot how much that rubbed me the wrong way when HoT launched, especially since I wasn't able to play for a week or so, and ended up far, far behind my cohorts.

    It really hurt in HoT because of how little you could explore without gliding or mushrooms. I remember during beta I couldn't even participate in event because I didn't have them. And the Metroidvania aspect of "this zone is locked off until you go to a much later zone to get a Move McGuffin and can be allowed to come back this way" was really off-putting compared to vanilla's exploration process.

    Many alts! Handle it!

    "A condescending answer might as well not be an answer at all."
    -Eloc Freidon.5692

  • @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    Fallout 76 is not a FPS

    No it definitely is. Just because there's more to the game doesn't exclude it from being a first person shooter.

  • Rauderi.8706Rauderi.8706 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It turned into a grindfest when they had to justify items on the market being farmed by the million and needed to pad out content players weren't interested in.

    Many alts! Handle it!

    "A condescending answer might as well not be an answer at all."
    -Eloc Freidon.5692

  • kratan.4619kratan.4619 Member ✭✭✭

    No need to feed the troll/ranter anymore. They have their mind made up already and nothing anyone can say will change it. They are not looking for help or assistance of any kind.

  • eldrin.6471eldrin.6471 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    Mastery system and collections and mounts have all been rolled into one system now that provides you endless grind if your up for it.

  • Luthan.5236Luthan.5236 Member ✭✭✭

    Good thing is you can dedice on how much you want to grind - and there is enoughs stuff to grind in the game. (Which some people like. Which keeps games alive if there is still stuff to complete that takes longer keeping people playing.) On the other hand: It isn't forced since most/all major content can be done without grinding.

    Mastery with it being account wide ... I haven't experience with that yet buying my first expansion in a few months or so) seems more like stuff you unlock while normally playing. Maybe a lil bit grind. But also fun.

    The more hardcore grind seem the - optional - collections.

  • Diak Atoli.2085Diak Atoli.2085 Member ✭✭✭

    @Elmo Benchwarmer.3025 said:

    @Bridget Morrigan.1752 said:
    The answer to the question in the title is 2012, with the introduction of fractals, ascended gear, and agony resistance.

    Pretty much what Bridget said. That's when it began.

    Actually, it began August 25, 2012 when GW2 Headstart began. ;)

  • Diak Atoli.2085Diak Atoli.2085 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dayra.7405 said:
    It turns into a grindfest in the moment your mind changes from "let run a around and see what's happen" to "if I repeat this and only this, I get XYZ fastest".

    The good point about gw2 is still: you are not much faster, it's just your choice, if you prefer speed over fun.

    I remember very well when HoT came out: a lot of player grinded exp in Flame Zitadelle to have their Pact mastery as fast as possible. I preferred to have it later: I did map-exporation in Tyria (let some time pass in HoT maps to get most bugs fixed) with my revenant. :) and that was not really much slower.

    I fully admit to grinding out Core Tyria masteries in the Citadel of Flame. That being said, I was on a Flamethrower Engineer... B)

  • Hashberry.4510Hashberry.4510 Member ✭✭✭

    Getting the raptor mastery is mind numbingly simple for most of us. I think you have a lot of 'grind' to look forward to.

  • I think "grindfest" is an exaggeration, but I remember being similarly frustrated when I first played HoT. It was much worse on release: enemies, events and adventures gave less experience, event chains didn't give experience until the end, waypoints were contested whenever there were events happening near them, and I think each mastery line required a greater amount of experience as well.

    I didn't have that problem with PoF though - I think I explored Crystal Oasis fully before I went to Desert Highlands, and in doing so got enough mastery points and experience that I comfortably had Canyon Jumping without any extra effort. If you're struggling with getting enough mastery points, I think the ones I used were Amnoon Bazaar, Old Amnoon, Pot of Soup, and Pahan, as well as the two from completing the story.

    @Vayne.8563 said:
    When this game launched, several stories were above my level and I had to level to get high enough to actually survive in them. Not really sure how this is different. Also grind means doing the same thing over and over again. You can easily get all the masteries you need without ever repeating a single thing.

    Obviously I can't speak for the OP, but for me the difference was that in the core game you have a huge number of options for maps to explore in order to level up. Typically there are several maps around your level, plus an ever increasing number of lower level maps - so you can level up mostly by exploring and doing map completion. When you first enter HoT you have one map where you can gain Heart of Maguuma experience, and you can barely explore any of it (and definitely can't complete it) because you don't have any masteries unlocked yet. Of course, you can go through to the later maps if you know where you're going - but that didn't occur to me because I thought they'd (a) be harder (at this point I hadn't cottoned on to the fact that ANet don't seem to make any attempt to implement increasing difficulty) and (b) require even more masteries to get around.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

    what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.
    but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

    What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

    Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.

    1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

    I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get Xp for masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance or maybe some misunderstanding you have about the game, not some indication that GW2 turned 'grindy' sometime while you were gone. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

    what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.
    but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

    What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

    Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.

    1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

    I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

    There are MMO that does not require to do same quest over and over again, then again they been around for a long time. LotRO is one of them but buying all the expansions would be supremely costly. heh

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

    what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.
    but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

    What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

    Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.

    1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

    I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

    There are MMO that does not require to do same quest over and over again, then again they been around for a long time. LotRO is one of them but buying all the expansions would be supremely costly. heh

    Sounds like those would suit you better. If GW2 is too grindy for you, you have options to choose from. Certainly, if you know what you are doing, you don't need to grind missions over and over like you claim you do, so this isn't a game problem, it's a you problem. As you have been told, if you just play the game, you get your XP. Can't understand how that's a barrier for you since you managed to level to 80 but ... Good Luck figuring it out for yourself if you don't want to listen.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • In the end I will have to somehow work this out, not that I got any clue to how to be happy about it, and the point of the game is to feel entertained, not feel like spending 3 hrs a day doing what feels like chores. So...

  • Cerioth.7062Cerioth.7062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I am a player that cannot stand repetitive content (for example Istan farming) and I still dont find this game grindy.

  • KelyNeli.4516KelyNeli.4516 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    TBH i enjoyed collecting all the mastery points across the map and trying to lvl up glider and etc stuff. The most enjoyable part was HoT, because it really required some research and thinking and trying and jumping and dying, it felt like a real video game...
    It makes you think about your next move, what to do and if you finish it, you feel rewarded a lot and you know you have put some job into it to have it.
    If anything, i think we need more of the content like that.
    Compare it to FFXIV where the end game content is literally 4 raids, 3 dungeons and nothing else once you finish the story, i dont like anything like that.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:
    In the end I will have to somehow work this out, not that I got any clue to how to be happy about it, and the point of the game is to feel entertained, not feel like spending 3 hrs a day doing what feels like chores. So...

    Well, that's just a matter of perception. If the game is a chore to you for getting XP for masteries, I don't see how that's a GW2 issue ... it has pretty much the exact same approach to giving you XP every other MMO that exists. That is to say ... you do something, you get XP as a reward. As you have been told, if you focus more on the XP than on playing the game, that's why you think it's grindy, not because it is.

    I mean, you've come across in this thread as unwilling to acknowledge this isn't a game issue. That's actually your first step to 'working this out' for yourself. You've encountered a scenario where you make a generally untrue statement about the game. That's not a very positive step for your recovery.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • KelyNeli.4516KelyNeli.4516 Member ✭✭✭

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:
    In the end I will have to somehow work this out, not that I got any clue to how to be happy about it, and the point of the game is to feel entertained, not feel like spending 3 hrs a day doing what feels like chores. So...

    In the end, if you were given everything on a silver plate, you would be complaining that there is nothing to do in the game.

  • Vayne.8563Vayne.8563 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tommo Chocolate.5870 said:
    I think "grindfest" is an exaggeration, but I remember being similarly frustrated when I first played HoT. It was much worse on release: enemies, events and adventures gave less experience, event chains didn't give experience until the end, waypoints were contested whenever there were events happening near them, and I think each mastery line required a greater amount of experience as well.

    I didn't have that problem with PoF though - I think I explored Crystal Oasis fully before I went to Desert Highlands, and in doing so got enough mastery points and experience that I comfortably had Canyon Jumping without any extra effort. If you're struggling with getting enough mastery points, I think the ones I used were Amnoon Bazaar, Old Amnoon, Pot of Soup, and Pahan, as well as the two from completing the story.

    @Vayne.8563 said:
    When this game launched, several stories were above my level and I had to level to get high enough to actually survive in them. Not really sure how this is different. Also grind means doing the same thing over and over again. You can easily get all the masteries you need without ever repeating a single thing.

    Obviously I can't speak for the OP, but for me the difference was that in the core game you have a huge number of options for maps to explore in order to level up. Typically there are several maps around your level, plus an ever increasing number of lower level maps - so you can level up mostly by exploring and doing map completion. When you first enter HoT you have one map where you can gain Heart of Maguuma experience, and you can barely explore any of it (and definitely can't complete it) because you don't have any masteries unlocked yet. Of course, you can go through to the later maps if you know where you're going - but that didn't occur to me because I thought they'd (a) be harder (at this point I hadn't cottoned on to the fact that ANet don't seem to make any attempt to implement increasing difficulty) and (b) require even more masteries to get around.

    The first zone of HOT is based around our first day in the jungle. There are five command posts each surrounding an areas where one of the airships with survivors went down. Each of those event chains has 9 events in it. If you do all of them, you have more than enough experience to train everything even if you do nothing else. By everything I mean gliding, advance gliding and jumping mushrooms. A lot of people don't understand how DS is laid out and your time int the jungle is learning the zone.

    At this point,. where people know the zone, there's very very little reason to complain but even back then, I found the outposts, I did the event chains, I explored and leveled.

    I had gliding and jumping mushrooms on the first day and I had updraft use on either the first or the second.

    When it came it out was indeed worse because you needed the poison mastery to complete the story but Anet took that out fairly early on. It was also worse because Anet wanted you to spent 400 hero points, every hero point in HoT to get your elite spec unlocked, and again, Anet changed that fairly early. Those two changes were to me, the major changes. Most of the people who were started HOT had access to buffs. Obviously we had food and utility (people using level 80 boosts get a stack of each free), most of the people I know where in guilds that had guild buffs, and everyone should have been getting celebration boosters with log in rewards if you didn't have birthday boosters. I had so many boosters I didn't know what to do with them, so I stacked them. But even without stacking them, especialliy now, I take new and returning players into VB all the time and in a few hours we have everything they need to move to the next zone. The amount of stuff you need is pretty paltry and it's required to teach you the much harder jungle.

    What the OP is asking is can't I just skip the game and just run from star to star. The answer is no,. because you learn nothing that way. Or very little anyway. That's not actually the game. That's other games. Running from star to star is pretty much every other MMO on the planet and that's not what Anet wanted for this game.

    That's why you didn't level enough from just stories to do the personal story in the first place. Anet knew some form of progression is important in MMOs and this is what they went with. I understood it before going in, not sure why so many people are shocked.

    In fact this goes all the way back to Guild Wars 1. To continue your luxon/kurzick story you had to be friends of the luxons/kurzicks and grind out 10,000 rep points for one or the other to continue the story. To get from the core game of Nightfall to the mainland, you had to reach a certain level or a certain sunspear rank, both of which required you to do events in Istan. I just did this with a new player recently which is why I remember it so clearly.

    And in Guild Wars 1 at launch, I often had to level to get to the next chapter of the story. Now you have about 3 levels of story and 7 levels of leveling with the changes to the story in the NPE. This is how the game has always been and it's how Guild Wars 1 was too.

  • Aenaos.8160Aenaos.8160 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 27, 2019

    GW2 ...grindfest....the Koreans called to complain in outrage.
    Try grinding for 1 hour in order to advance your level by 0.5% in a game with no level cap.
    Now that's a proper grindfest.

  • Getting really tired of posts like this. Grind has existed in MMOs since the beginning of time. GW2 actually has very little of it when you compare it to traditional and other MMOs. If you don't want grind, then you'd be bored in 0.2 seconds. Grind is put in to keep players busy for things that are COSMETIC and CONVENIENCE. It's your choice if you want it. STOP COMPLAINING.

  • @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @yusayu.3629 said:
    What part of that is grinding? You don't really have to level masteries, I think for the story you need gliding 1 or 3, which is achieved by just experiencing HoT, doing the metas and just looking through some of the event chains. It's nice they're trying to get people to try out the events.

    None of that I'd consider grinding, you don't have to farm the same group of mobs or the same quest for days or weeks.

    Alright so many asks where is the grind.
    Path of Fire part 4. Sacrifice, you have to get to the crystals. One crystal is beyond a ravine, you have to get raptor long jump in order to get there
    and that requires level 3 in raptors. I done all the map, done all points of interest, but still I am lacking 1 1/2 level to get to achievement 3, so unless
    there is something I missed, which is unlikely cause I run around the map about as many times as I can remember it by heart, or there needs to be
    done repeatable quests... thats the simple part of that.

    If you're having that much difficulty getting the experience for the mastery, go run the Casino Blitz meta a couple of times. Metas tend to give good experience, and in additio, you can consume any casino coins you earn for PoF mastery experience. Good luck!

  • Rasimir.6239Rasimir.6239 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

    what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.
    but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

    What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

    Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.

    1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

    I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

    There are MMO that does not require to do same quest over and over again, then again they been around for a long time. LotRO is one of them but buying all the expansions would be supremely costly. heh

    Are you sure about that? For some reason in my memory there are weeks and months of doing the same faction dailies day in and day out on my minstrel to get her raid ready, and then repeating the same process on my warden (after leveling her through all the same quests to even get there) when I decided to raid on her, too.

  • @Vayne.8563 said:

    @Tommo Chocolate.5870 said:
    I think "grindfest" is an exaggeration, but I remember being similarly frustrated when I first played HoT. It was much worse on release: enemies, events and adventures gave less experience, event chains didn't give experience until the end, waypoints were contested whenever there were events happening near them, and I think each mastery line required a greater amount of experience as well.

    I didn't have that problem with PoF though - I think I explored Crystal Oasis fully before I went to Desert Highlands, and in doing so got enough mastery points and experience that I comfortably had Canyon Jumping without any extra effort. If you're struggling with getting enough mastery points, I think the ones I used were Amnoon Bazaar, Old Amnoon, Pot of Soup, and Pahan, as well as the two from completing the story.

    @Vayne.8563 said:
    When this game launched, several stories were above my level and I had to level to get high enough to actually survive in them. Not really sure how this is different. Also grind means doing the same thing over and over again. You can easily get all the masteries you need without ever repeating a single thing.

    Obviously I can't speak for the OP, but for me the difference was that in the core game you have a huge number of options for maps to explore in order to level up. Typically there are several maps around your level, plus an ever increasing number of lower level maps - so you can level up mostly by exploring and doing map completion. When you first enter HoT you have one map where you can gain Heart of Maguuma experience, and you can barely explore any of it (and definitely can't complete it) because you don't have any masteries unlocked yet. Of course, you can go through to the later maps if you know where you're going - but that didn't occur to me because I thought they'd (a) be harder (at this point I hadn't cottoned on to the fact that ANet don't seem to make any attempt to implement increasing difficulty) and (b) require even more masteries to get around.

    The first zone of HOT is based around our first day in the jungle. There are five command posts each surrounding an areas where one of the airships with survivors went down. Each of those event chains has 9 events in it. If you do all of them, you have more than enough experience to train everything even if you do nothing else. By everything I mean gliding, advance gliding and jumping mushrooms. A lot of people don't understand how DS is laid out and your time int the jungle is learning the zone.

    Perhaps this is getting a bit off-topic now, but here's something that I didn't mention before: when HoT came out, I was bad at this game! I'd "completed" the core game (i.e. finished the personal story, map completion, and Season 2) and none of that had required me to be any good at it, so I'd just never learnt. Not only was there a lot I didn't know, I wasn't even aware that I didn't know those things. So when I got to Verdant Brink I just hit a brick wall. I was aware of the outpost events - they're pretty well signposted - but I couldn't complete them, so couldn't get the experience that way. I tried to explore the map and do smaller events, which had worked in Core Tyria, but didn't seem to yield much experience, even with boosters - in part because I kept getting killed, or stunlocked by enemies whose CC ignores stability.

    I don't know how much this relates to the OP's experience, because it sounds like they're managing to complete events (unlike me back in 2015) but not getting enough experience from them, and repeating the same ones over and over - but they're in a similar situation in that they feel like there's only one thing they can do to level up, and that one thing isn't progressing them as fast as they expected.

    At this point,. where people know the zone, there's very very little reason to complain but even back then, I found the outposts, I did the event chains, I explored and leveled.

    I had gliding and jumping mushrooms on the first day and I had updraft use on either the first or the second.

    When it came it out was indeed worse because you needed the poison mastery to complete the story but Anet took that out fairly early on. It was also worse because Anet wanted you to spent 400 hero points, every hero point in HoT to get your elite spec unlocked, and again, Anet changed that fairly early. Those two changes were to me, the major changes. Most of the people who were started HOT had access to buffs. Obviously we had food and utility (people using level 80 boosts get a stack of each free), most of the people I know where in guilds that had guild buffs, and everyone should have been getting celebration boosters with log in rewards if you didn't have birthday boosters. I had so many boosters I didn't know what to do with them, so I stacked them. But even without stacking them, especialliy now, I take new and returning players into VB all the time and in a few hours we have everything they need to move to the next zone. The amount of stuff you need is pretty paltry and it's required to teach you the much harder jungle.

    Yes, those changes really helped me - after that I came back to the game and made much more progress with HoT.

    By "the much harder jungle" do you mean the later Heart of Maguuma maps? The later story instances? If so, I don't agree with you - I think the story instances are much easier than the open world maps in HoT, and I found, and still find, Verdant Brink to be the hardest map in the game. I understand narratively why it's the first one in HoT, but from a gameplay point of view it doesn't seem like a good choice to me.

    What the OP is asking is can't I just skip the game and just run from star to star. The answer is no,. because you learn nothing that way. Or very little anyway. That's not actually the game. That's other games. Running from star to star is pretty much every other MMO on the planet and that's not what Anet wanted for this game.

    That's why you didn't level enough from just stories to do the personal story in the first place. Anet knew some form of progression is important in MMOs and this is what they went with. I understood it before going in, not sure why so many people are shocked.

    I'm not shocked, and I agree with you that not just running from star to star is a good thing - I don't think I've ever played an RPG in which the obvious story progression points weren't interspersed with other content of some kind. I was just trying to explain why - for me - mastery training in HoT felt different, and more restricted, than levelling up in the core game, because you and several other people in the thread don't see the difference.

    In fact this goes all the way back to Guild Wars 1. To continue your luxon/kurzick story you had to be friends of the luxons/kurzicks and grind out 10,000 rep points for one or the other to continue the story. To get from the core game of Nightfall to the mainland, you had to reach a certain level or a certain sunspear rank, both of which required you to do events in Istan. I just did this with a new player recently which is why I remember it so clearly.

    And in Guild Wars 1 at launch, I often had to level to get to the next chapter of the story. Now you have about 3 levels of story and 7 levels of leveling with the changes to the story in the NPE. This is how the game has always been and it's how Guild Wars 1 was too.

    How is what happened in GW1 relevant here?

  • Vayne.8563Vayne.8563 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tommo Chocolate.5870 said:

    @Vayne.8563 said:

    @Tommo Chocolate.5870 said:
    I think "grindfest" is an exaggeration, but I remember being similarly frustrated when I first played HoT. It was much worse on release: enemies, events and adventures gave less experience, event chains didn't give experience until the end, waypoints were contested whenever there were events happening near them, and I think each mastery line required a greater amount of experience as well.

    I didn't have that problem with PoF though - I think I explored Crystal Oasis fully before I went to Desert Highlands, and in doing so got enough mastery points and experience that I comfortably had Canyon Jumping without any extra effort. If you're struggling with getting enough mastery points, I think the ones I used were Amnoon Bazaar, Old Amnoon, Pot of Soup, and Pahan, as well as the two from completing the story.

    @Vayne.8563 said:
    When this game launched, several stories were above my level and I had to level to get high enough to actually survive in them. Not really sure how this is different. Also grind means doing the same thing over and over again. You can easily get all the masteries you need without ever repeating a single thing.

    Obviously I can't speak for the OP, but for me the difference was that in the core game you have a huge number of options for maps to explore in order to level up. Typically there are several maps around your level, plus an ever increasing number of lower level maps - so you can level up mostly by exploring and doing map completion. When you first enter HoT you have one map where you can gain Heart of Maguuma experience, and you can barely explore any of it (and definitely can't complete it) because you don't have any masteries unlocked yet. Of course, you can go through to the later maps if you know where you're going - but that didn't occur to me because I thought they'd (a) be harder (at this point I hadn't cottoned on to the fact that ANet don't seem to make any attempt to implement increasing difficulty) and (b) require even more masteries to get around.

    The first zone of HOT is based around our first day in the jungle. There are five command posts each surrounding an areas where one of the airships with survivors went down. Each of those event chains has 9 events in it. If you do all of them, you have more than enough experience to train everything even if you do nothing else. By everything I mean gliding, advance gliding and jumping mushrooms. A lot of people don't understand how DS is laid out and your time int the jungle is learning the zone.

    Perhaps this is getting a bit off-topic now, but here's something that I didn't mention before: when HoT came out, I was bad at this game! I'd "completed" the core game (i.e. finished the personal story, map completion, and Season 2) and none of that had required me to be any good at it, so I'd just never learnt. Not only was there a lot I didn't know, I wasn't even aware that I didn't know those things. So when I got to Verdant Brink I just hit a brick wall. I was aware of the outpost events - they're pretty well signposted - but I couldn't complete them, so couldn't get the experience that way. I tried to explore the map and do smaller events, which had worked in Core Tyria, but didn't seem to yield much experience, even with boosters - in part because I kept getting killed, or stunlocked by enemies whose CC ignores stability.

    I don't know how much this relates to the OP's experience, because it sounds like they're managing to complete events (unlike me back in 2015) but not getting enough experience from them, and repeating the same ones over and over - but they're in a similar situation in that they feel like there's only one thing they can do to level up, and that one thing isn't progressing them as fast as they expected.

    At this point,. where people know the zone, there's very very little reason to complain but even back then, I found the outposts, I did the event chains, I explored and leveled.

    I had gliding and jumping mushrooms on the first day and I had updraft use on either the first or the second.

    When it came it out was indeed worse because you needed the poison mastery to complete the story but Anet took that out fairly early on. It was also worse because Anet wanted you to spent 400 hero points, every hero point in HoT to get your elite spec unlocked, and again, Anet changed that fairly early. Those two changes were to me, the major changes. Most of the people who were started HOT had access to buffs. Obviously we had food and utility (people using level 80 boosts get a stack of each free), most of the people I know where in guilds that had guild buffs, and everyone should have been getting celebration boosters with log in rewards if you didn't have birthday boosters. I had so many boosters I didn't know what to do with them, so I stacked them. But even without stacking them, especialliy now, I take new and returning players into VB all the time and in a few hours we have everything they need to move to the next zone. The amount of stuff you need is pretty paltry and it's required to teach you the much harder jungle.

    Yes, those changes really helped me - after that I came back to the game and made much more progress with HoT.

    By "the much harder jungle" do you mean the later Heart of Maguuma maps? The later story instances? If so, I don't agree with you - I think the story instances are much easier than the open world maps in HoT, and I found, and still find, Verdant Brink to be the hardest map in the game. I understand narratively why it's the first one in HoT, but from a gameplay point of view it doesn't seem like a good choice to me.

    What the OP is asking is can't I just skip the game and just run from star to star. The answer is no,. because you learn nothing that way. Or very little anyway. That's not actually the game. That's other games. Running from star to star is pretty much every other MMO on the planet and that's not what Anet wanted for this game.

    That's why you didn't level enough from just stories to do the personal story in the first place. Anet knew some form of progression is important in MMOs and this is what they went with. I understood it before going in, not sure why so many people are shocked.

    I'm not shocked, and I agree with you that not just running from star to star is a good thing - I don't think I've ever played an RPG in which the obvious story progression points weren't interspersed with other content of some kind. I was just trying to explain why - for me - mastery training in HoT felt different, and more restricted, than levelling up in the core game, because you and several other people in the thread don't see the difference.

    In fact this goes all the way back to Guild Wars 1. To continue your luxon/kurzick story you had to be friends of the luxons/kurzicks and grind out 10,000 rep points for one or the other to continue the story. To get from the core game of Nightfall to the mainland, you had to reach a certain level or a certain sunspear rank, both of which required you to do events in Istan. I just did this with a new player recently which is why I remember it so clearly.

    And in Guild Wars 1 at launch, I often had to level to get to the next chapter of the story. Now you have about 3 levels of story and 7 levels of leveling with the changes to the story in the NPE. This is how the game has always been and it's how Guild Wars 1 was too.

    How is what happened in GW1 relevant here?

    Tangled Depths is generally considered the hardest HoT map.

    Why is GW1 relevant. We have a person talking about grind and how they have to wait to get to the next story. Showing that this existed early in this game is technically enough of an answer, but we also have a number of people who claim that this game took nothing from Guild Wars 1 so I threw that in as well, It's pretty much an aside, but it illustrates this has pretty much always been Anet's MMO all along. Some people may not have noticed that, so I thought I'd point it out.

  • Rauderi.8706Rauderi.8706 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hashberry.4510 said:
    Getting the raptor mastery is mind numbingly simple for most of us. I think you have a lot of 'grind' to look forward to.

    That spread of "Raptor 3 and Springer" wall was about the only one I really felt in PoF. Got kitten-blocked on skimmer for a short while. Everything else I progressed smoothly through. In HoT, the "you can't go anywhere" wall was much faster to run into.

    But then there's material/reward track grinds all over the place. Woo. And "wait two hours for this event and pray you get into a meta map" garbage.

    Many alts! Handle it!

    "A condescending answer might as well not be an answer at all."
    -Eloc Freidon.5692

  • Zuldari.3940Zuldari.3940 Member ✭✭✭

    I would advise you to look in lfg in the zones for an HP train. Most of those will get you the mastery points and wps too. Plus the experience you get for the mastery bar is pretty fast. Everytime i hit 80 the first thing i do is hit up a HP train to gain my elite specs, it takes about an hour and a half to two hours to get them all with a good train. There will be a bonus mastery experience event next week, you can earn double mastery at that time.

    Coo! Quaggan Love's You! ♥♥♥

  • @Rasimir.6239 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

    what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.
    but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

    What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

    Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.

    1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

    I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

    There are MMO that does not require to do same quest over and over again, then again they been around for a long time. LotRO is one of them but buying all the expansions would be supremely costly. heh

    Are you sure about that? For some reason in my memory there are weeks and months of doing the same faction dailies day in and day out on my minstrel to get her raid ready, and then repeating the same process on my warden (after leveling her through all the same quests to even get there) when I decided to raid on her, too.

    I played through weeks and weeks on my rune character before ever having to do same quest over again, but then again I bought expansion after expansion after each other and received xp stuff between so I guess that is what makes the difference.

  • @Zuldari.3940 said:
    I would advise you to look in lfg in the zones for an HP train. Most of those will get you the mastery points and wps too. Plus the experience you get for the mastery bar is pretty fast. Everytime i hit 80 the first thing i do is hit up a HP train to gain my elite specs, it takes about an hour and a half to two hours to get them all with a good train. There will be a bonus mastery experience event next week, you can earn double mastery at that time.

    That kind of defeats the purpose of why I chose GW2, if I wanted to go through LFG for groups, etc and go about that way of gaming, id stick to WoW cause it would be mechanically the same , group for mythics or group for hp trains...basically your at the whim of groups...you can not progress on your own without having to rely on others. I am more comfortable doing my own what I can rather than having to rely on others, and I definately do not like being forced to group with others, if anything I would want it to be my choise, which it seems it is not....

  • Neutra.6857Neutra.6857 Member ✭✭✭

    The Hot maps are somewhat more group oriented, and intentionally like that. You should have unlocked the first level of gliding basically right after the introductory story instance. There are so many mastery points around vb that it should not be an issue to have enough points which means it is simply an issue of getting experience. You get experience the same way you get experience throughout the rest of the game and you seem to have no issue there, so not sure why it is an issue now.

    As for POF, there was somewhat of a slow area around raptor 3/springer but even that was not that bad since part of the issue was learning where everything is in giant maps. There are enough mp to get the springer (I don't think I had raptor 3 when I got the springer). And I did not repeat any content except that stupid chef one since I kept failing it.

  • Cerioth.7062Cerioth.7062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Zuldari.3940 said:
    I would advise you to look in lfg in the zones for an HP train. Most of those will get you the mastery points and wps too. Plus the experience you get for the mastery bar is pretty fast. Everytime i hit 80 the first thing i do is hit up a HP train to gain my elite specs, it takes about an hour and a half to two hours to get them all with a good train. There will be a bonus mastery experience event next week, you can earn double mastery at that time.

    That kind of defeats the purpose of why I chose GW2, if I wanted to go through LFG for groups, etc and go about that way of gaming, id stick to WoW cause it would be mechanically the same , group for mythics or group for hp trains...basically your at the whim of groups...you can not progress on your own without having to rely on others. I am more comfortable doing my own what I can rather than having to rely on others, and I definately do not like being forced to group with others, if anything I would want it to be my choise, which it seems it is not....

    You... you do realise this is an MMO, right?

  • Hashberry.4510Hashberry.4510 Member ✭✭✭

    I have had a great time almost completely soloing this game. Never been forced to group, though in some areas it is helpful if others are adventuring there as well.

  • Vayne.8563Vayne.8563 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Jotunhammer.7029 said:

    @Zuldari.3940 said:
    I would advise you to look in lfg in the zones for an HP train. Most of those will get you the mastery points and wps too. Plus the experience you get for the mastery bar is pretty fast. Everytime i hit 80 the first thing i do is hit up a HP train to gain my elite specs, it takes about an hour and a half to two hours to get them all with a good train. There will be a bonus mastery experience event next week, you can earn double mastery at that time.

    That kind of defeats the purpose of why I chose GW2, if I wanted to go through LFG for groups, etc and go about that way of gaming, id stick to WoW cause it would be mechanically the same , group for mythics or group for hp trains...basically your at the whim of groups...you can not progress on your own without having to rely on others. I am more comfortable doing my own what I can rather than having to rely on others, and I definately do not like being forced to group with others, if anything I would want it to be my choise, which it seems it is not....

    Okay so this is actually not true. You don't have to look for groups to make progress. I don't. But I know the game, I know my class and I know my enemies. If you're just looking to make progress in HoT and you're on a US server, I'd be happy to help you out and show you how. There are a couple of HPs you can't get solo but there are other ways to get them, particularly if you level in WvW and have that currency. If you don't do that, you may have to call out some stuff in map chat. But you can definitely get enough HPs in HoT to unlock your hero spec without grouping, because I do it all the time. It does help to know/learn the zones to do that but I never run with an HP train and I've unlocked elite specs in HOT on an awful lot of characters.

    Also there's a huge differnce between raid groups in WoW and giant hero train groups in which you don't need to interact at all, just follow a herd of people. But as I said, you don't need this. I believe you're making HoT harder in your head than it actually is. There is a learning curve, but it's not undoable.3

  • Ghetx.1752Ghetx.1752 Member ✭✭
    edited August 29, 2019

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    never? I mean, what are you grinding that you need?

    You see, Anet never said there would be no grind because obviously that's dumb; there needs something you can grind to keep you interested in the game. Anet was specifically talking about needing to grind to get access to content, either with gear grinds or unlocking content. So far, they have delivered.

    So let's be honest. The game never became a grind ... you're just finding things you want that require it. If you're going to define 'gilder masteries' as grinding, I guess you should stick with FPS games or something, because that's a pretty tame 'grind' that you can achieve simply by playing the game. I guess if you're not willing to play the game, then I can see where you apply that label to it.

    By your logic,you actually don't need nothing in this game.Everyone can run around naked,without items and gear,and do nothing besides trolling in main zones.

    If you want to experience full game,you MUST grind,which is the whole point of playing games.You can't just sit in starter zone,and run around like moron.You want to do high fractals?You need to grind gold for crafting professions,then you need to farm gold for ascended items,then you need to farm gold for agony infusions...And that's just fractals.

    You want to do HoT meta events?You need masteries.
    You want to do PoF maps?You need mounts.
    You want mounts?You need masteries.
    You want masteries?You need to farm.

    In GW2 community people judge you based on how many legendary items you have,and how many 'cool' skins you have.That's why people are getting legendary items,to be noticed,because legendary items do nothing,well besides looking ugly AF...

    You can be piece of kitten player and have 10 legendary items,people still gonna follow you around and kiss your kitten.

    You can be the best person one can be,and don't have any skins or legendary items,people won't even pay attention to you.

    So,if you want to be accepted,you better be ready to spend countless hours doing events which are designed to give you lowest amount of loot possible,just to make you open your wallet and toss $ at TP gems.

  • ^So incredibly not true.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 29, 2019

    @Ghetx.1752 said:

    @Obtena.7952 said:
    never? I mean, what are you grinding that you need?

    You see, Anet never said there would be no grind because obviously that's dumb; there needs something you can grind to keep you interested in the game. Anet was specifically talking about needing to grind to get access to content, either with gear grinds or unlocking content. So far, they have delivered.

    So let's be honest. The game never became a grind ... you're just finding things you want that require it. If you're going to define 'gilder masteries' as grinding, I guess you should stick with FPS games or something, because that's a pretty tame 'grind' that you can achieve simply by playing the game. I guess if you're not willing to play the game, then I can see where you apply that label to it.

    By your logic,you actually don't need nothing in this game.Everyone can run around naked,without items and gear,and do nothing besides trolling in main zones.

    If you want to experience full game,you MUST grind,which is the whole point of playing games.You can't just sit in starter zone,and run around like moron.You want to do high fractals?You need to grind gold for crafting professions,then you need to farm gold for ascended items,then you need to farm gold for agony infusions...And that's just fractals.

    You want to do HoT meta events?You need masteries.
    You want to do PoF maps?You need mounts.
    You want mounts?You need masteries.
    You want masteries?You need to farm.

    In GW2 community people judge you based on how many legendary items you have,and how many 'cool' skins you have.That's why people are getting legendary items,to be noticed,because legendary items do nothing,well besides looking ugly AF...

    You can be piece of kitten player and have 10 legendary items,people still gonna follow you around and kiss your kitten.

    You can be the best person one can be,and don't have any skins or legendary items,people won't even pay attention to you.

    So,if you want to be accepted,you better be ready to spend countless hours doing events which are designed to give you lowest amount of loot possible,just to make you open your wallet and toss $ at TP gems.

    Needing stuff has NOTHING to do with grind, so no, it's not 'by my logic' that you don't need anything. it's by my logic you don't need to grind to get things you defined as needed. I have never GRINDED for any of the things you mentioned. This game is what I would call 'well paced'. In otherwords, if you play the game, you aren't 'short' for anything that requires unlocks ... like masteries or gold to buy whatever you NEED.

    I mean, I can do raid in exotic gear and if you don't have the gold to buy that by the time you are ready for raids ... that's just a matter of how you prioritized your spending. I NEVER bought infusions for fractals ... because if you do the fractals in the order they are presented to you, you naturally get the infusions. Even if you DON'T do that path to get infusions and buy them ... it's still from gold that you naturally get from just playing the game. Hell, I got guild mates with so many infusions, they literally GIVE them to people to get them to come along and play with us.

    Ascended gear for fractals? Anet makes it easy for you on trinkets a good start. I mean, aside from the highest level fractals, you don't need much of anything you can't get by just playing the game anyways. You're just being sensational because Anet hasn't just dumped a full set of Ascended into your inventory when you hit level 80.

    You are right ... you can completely suck and have an inventory full of legendaries ... but that has nothing to do with anything we are discussing here anyways.

    Sure, if you want full Ascended, you will have to do extra for it ... but we aren't talking about grinding to get things you want, we are talking about playing the game to get things you NEED to play it. I have certainly never been in a situation where I was blocked because I NEEDED a full Ascended setup except for the high level fractal situation.

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • crepuscular.9047crepuscular.9047 Member ✭✭✭✭

    maybe just my feel, but i feel it is less grindy compare to years ago...

    best way to get exp to fill up your masteries is just do the final big metas

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  • Daishi.6027Daishi.6027 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 29, 2019

    Progression is a lot faster in PoF than HoT.

    HoT demanded a little to much I agree, was a bit to slow to progress but it wasn't even all that bad, and A-net learned well form that. But you only reallllly need to suffer through glider, not much else is required.

    In most cases it's just asking you to fill the bar. 2012 if you were under leveled you had to level to do a story mission, I think of it as the equivalent. Wasn't so bad then, not so bad now.

    If you want to complain about anything in terms of "grinding" maybe ascended is a slightly more legitimate argument.

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