You engi players have lost your way — Guild Wars 2 Forums

You engi players have lost your way

Ya'll kill me with all this praise for holosmith as good as nades been to you. Back when you was core engi where was holosmith? You don't abandon ya folks that's been down from day one. You got a little xpac now so you too good for shrapnel nades? You gotta drop at least 12 hip shots chaith style for holosmith, but nades used to be 1500 range AND you get carpel tunnel from kit swapping. A lot of ya'll forgot where you came from and it's sad... Not me though. Nade kit until the day I die.

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Comments

  • Bigpapasmurf.5623Bigpapasmurf.5623 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I ran dual pistol pre HoT for a long time in WvW. Back when the "meta" was pistol/shield.

    Red = Dead...or someone runs away. Either way it's gone.
    twitch.tv/TRMC
    Lover of Jumping puzzles, Squirrels, WvW, and Taimi
    Co-Leader of SOmething inAPpropriate {SOAP}

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 31, 2019

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Core Engineer is still pretty solid, people don't like having to think though.

    "Thinking"

    (Yes, I know it's from WvW)

    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • MrForz.1953MrForz.1953 Member ✭✭✭

    @ellesee.8297 said:
    Ya'll kill me with all this praise for holosmith as good as nades been to you. Back when you was core engi where was holosmith? You don't abandon ya folks that's been down from day one. You got a little xpac now so you too good for shrapnel nades? You gotta drop at least 12 hip shots chaith style for holosmith, but nades used to be 1500 range AND you get carpel tunnel from kit swapping. A lot of ya'll forgot where you came from and it's sad... Not me though. Nade kit until the day I die.

    It's because those weren't Engineers before PoF.

    Disgruntled Charr Engineer and Pirate - Jade Quarry

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 31, 2019

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    "Thinking"

    (Yes, I know it's from WvW)

    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    Here's an old montage of Core engineer I made, that is after PoF. Power and Condition included.

  • MrForz.1953MrForz.1953 Member ✭✭✭
    edited August 31, 2019

    Nevermind, whole misunderstanding and all that.

    Disgruntled Charr Engineer and Pirate - Jade Quarry

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭

    @MrForz.1953 said:

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Here's an old montage of Core engineer I made, that is after PoF. Power and Condition included.

    I'm not sure where you got the idea that I said that non Holosmith engineers stopped existing after the expansion.

    Didn't quote the right person, nor have I made sure being so tired and using mobile. Just, ignore the last post. I edited it.

  • MrForz.1953MrForz.1953 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shao.7236 said:

    @MrForz.1953 said:

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Here's an old montage of Core engineer I made, that is after PoF. Power and Condition included.

    I'm not sure where you got the idea that I said that non Holosmith engineers stopped existing after the expansion.

    Didn't quote the right person, nor have I made sure being so tired and using mobile. Just, ignore the last post. I edited it.

    Oh, well. To erase all that as well.

    Disgruntled Charr Engineer and Pirate - Jade Quarry

  • Naxos.2503Naxos.2503 Member ✭✭✭

    I use Condi holo, because I consider it an addition to my existing core engi condi build. My build doesn't center around Holo, it centers around pistols and grenades. I however wont throw some solid burns and bleeds out if it's offered on a platter. Core engineer sorely lacks in damage all around due to skill obsolescence. Make turrets viable, properly differentiate Grenade Kit from Bomb Kit and we'll talk

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭

    @Naxos.2503 said:
    properly differentiate Grenade Kit from Bomb Kit and we'll talk

    One is placing bombs at your feet, the other one is a ground-targetting ranged grenade kit.
    One is a melee kit, the other one is ranged.
    I feel they are sufficiently differentiated.

  • Naxos.2503Naxos.2503 Member ✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @Naxos.2503 said:
    properly differentiate Grenade Kit from Bomb Kit and we'll talk

    One is placing bombs at your feet, the other one is a ground-targetting ranged grenade kit.
    One is a melee kit, the other one is ranged.
    I feel they are sufficiently differentiated.

    You misunderstand, but then again I wasn't explicit. I mean both Bombs and Grenade currently benefit condi more than they benefit Power. I want one to fit Condi, and one to benefit Power, to properly differentiate build and give everyone the same playing field.

  • Bigpapasmurf.5623Bigpapasmurf.5623 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Core Engineer is still pretty solid, people don't like having to think though.

    "Thinking"

    (Yes, I know it's from WvW)

    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    Ill have to locate my clips of my condi core endi smoking a condi scourge :p

    Red = Dead...or someone runs away. Either way it's gone.
    twitch.tv/TRMC
    Lover of Jumping puzzles, Squirrels, WvW, and Taimi
    Co-Leader of SOmething inAPpropriate {SOAP}

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭

    @Naxos.2503 said:
    You misunderstand, but then again I wasn't explicit. I mean both Bombs and Grenade currently benefit condi more than they benefit Power. I want one to fit Condi, and one to benefit Power, to properly differentiate build and give everyone the same playing field.

    I'd rather have them both focus on power damage and CC.
    For conditions we could have Flamethrower for melee and Elixir Gun for range.

  • Dirame.8521Dirame.8521 Member ✭✭
    edited August 31, 2019

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Core Engineer is still pretty solid, people don't like having to think though.

    "Thinking"

    (Yes, I know it's from WvW)

    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    Well a guy did Core Engie for a bit and had quite a bit of success. Here's a video:

    His build is not the usual though. And he gives the Prot engie a run for his money at the end.

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dirame.8521 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Core Engineer is still pretty solid, people don't like having to think though.

    "Thinking"

    (Yes, I know it's from WvW)

    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    Well a guy did Core Engie for a bit and had quite a bit of success. Here's a video:

    His build is not the usual though. And he gives the Prot engie a run for his money at the end.

    Watched it. Weird build tbh, guess he was relying on blinds to survive. Seemed decent as a side noder, but his opponents weren't too bright either.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Dirame.8521 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Core Engineer is still pretty solid, people don't like having to think though.

    "Thinking"

    (Yes, I know it's from WvW)

    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    Well a guy did Core Engie for a bit and had quite a bit of success. Here's a video:

    His build is not the usual though. And he gives the Prot engie a run for his money at the end.

    Watched it. Weird build tbh, guess he was relying on blinds to survive. Seemed decent as a side noder, but his opponents weren't too bright either.

    This is his build from the twitch page; https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Engineer_-_Comeback_King_Engie_Core_Spec

    He seemed to know how to fight his opponents. Most people get angry and run away from spamtastic staff thieves.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    I'd love to see some video of people actually trying core engi against the current meta. That'll be fun.

    Ha, since they announced the "balance" changes I've been trying a core engie build to replace my scrapper (tools/firearms/scrapper -> tools/firearms/alchemy, replacing 4 gyros with 4 elixirs). Works perfectly fine. Weaker in some areas (condi clear with purge for example), stronger in others (much more boons). Some things can be considered "equal exchange" - loosing the dome, but getting tons of protection, for example. Before the traitline changes I wouldnt have argued against the scrapper, but after... I would consider it about as good. Well, at least for condi lol.

    The "worst" thing is the mediocre elites on core. Supply drop has way too long cd for such a narrow use, mortar is situational and overall useless while roaming (the very bad F skill doesnt help) while elixir is so random, yet pretty much the only choice here. The F skill saves that (and sometimes you get a lucky tornado as opposed to the kitten zerker).

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • Elmo Benchwarmer.3025Elmo Benchwarmer.3025 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    Ellesee.8297. A legendary name of the mythical but sadly long forgotten past.

    The Engineer warrior wannabe specialisations are IMHO a disaster. I personally rate them among the most boring specialisations added to the game. A completely ludicrous addition considering the unique design of the core class, especially the kit gameplay.

  • rdigeri.7935rdigeri.7935 Member ✭✭✭

    I'm glad there are so many people feeling this way. I too feel like you give up your identity of engineer as soon as you pick holo.
    Although the problem is probably with core here, it's difficult to make elite specs for something so outdated while keeping its style.
    We need core reworkz bois

  • After having tried both Scrapper and Holosmith, I've gone back to Core Engineer.

    “I like nonsense, it wakes up the brain cells. Fantasy is a necessary ingredient in living.”
    **― Dr. Seuss **

  • Hoodie.1045Hoodie.1045 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @ellesee.8297 said:
    Ya'll kill me with all this praise for holosmith as good as nades been to you. Back when you was core engi where was holosmith? You don't abandon ya folks that's been down from day one. You got a little xpac now so you too good for shrapnel nades? You gotta drop at least 12 hip shots chaith style for holosmith, but nades used to be 1500 range AND you get carpel tunnel from kit swapping. A lot of ya'll forgot where you came from and it's sad... Not me though. Nade kit until the day I die.

    Luckily for you, there are still a few remaining good core engineer mains. I'm not talking about the players who claim that they are engineer mains but play nothing but holosmith in every game mode, but a real core engineer main who uses multiple kits. I've been playing the profession since 2013, the year I started playing GW2. There were very few engineer players back in the day, ranging from most of them being really bad to the very few good core engineers that use kits, the classic piano playstyle. It's the profession with the highest skill ceiling in the game (with elementalist having the second highest) and ever since the release of PoF, we went from very few people playing engineer to everyone playing holosmith and nothing but holosmith.

    I hated Holosmith from day one because I find it insulting that they would make an easier to play spec that not only doesn't require as much skill to play, but also achieves more. But no matter what, no matter if Holosmith is meta in all game modes and it's easier to play, I still play core engineer in both PvE and PvP to this day. Everytime I perfectly execute my skill rotations, I'm still motivated to keep going and to never abandon the skills I learned while playing core engineer years ago. In general, core engineer with kits never gets boring unlike holosmith.

    Karras

  • Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

  • Dediggefedde.4961Dediggefedde.4961 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    I still like to play an SD-Holo variant to get those LB-rangers and runaway-thieves... Also pretty fun. ^^
    always had a bit of trouble with condi-based roaming builds after the flamethrower toolbelt nerf, though.
    Also, as opponents core-engineers are a bit more fragile in my opinion. I've beaten turai ossa on an core condi build, though, so I guess it can also be used in roaming. ^^
    Currently, I still enjoy zerging and support-scrapper much more though. However, full-cleric and p/s with overshield and applied force.
    Also Power scrapper ("power shredder") for zerging with a supporter... which is actually easier than warrior...

    There are a few nice core builds, also usable in roaming (not so much in zerging), but in my opinion it lacks a defined role.
    For some time you would go core for condi-builds or tricky gadget fun, holo for power and scrapper for some half tank/support thing.
    Now you have condi, power and support builds on holo and scrapper.

    In my opinion there should be an additional condi-dmg-buff in the tools traitline which synergizes with explosives and firearms.
    Then core could be nice at condi damage again and one would have the choice between single-condi burn-holo or multi-condi core-engi.

  • mov.1246mov.1246 Member ✭✭

    I completely agree with you ellesee. I also play engi since launch and I dont like how "engineer" has evolved.
    Holosmith is a discount version of a strong short range fighter with literally no downsides, you have boon spam, high dps, high mobility and pretty good sustain.
    PvE, PvP and WvW is dominated by holosmiths, it prvides by far better results with less effort as core.

    Some weeks ago I tried a solo roaming build (WvW) as a power core grenadier, the result of some hours roaming was pretty clear: Holosmith is by far superior and core is like downgrading myself. I had some good moments and challenging fights but most time I was on disadvantage when fighting against other powercreeped elite specs.
    Grenades suffers from to much sources: retalation, anti projectile, blocks (except #5) and even bad terrain...

  • Matoro.9708Matoro.9708 Member ✭✭✭

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Here's an old montage of Core engineer I made, that is after PoF. Power and Condition included.

    The cast times on pistol are so abhorrent that it is useless at close range lol, this is the reason I have used rifle all these years.

    @Naxos.2503 said:
    You misunderstand, but then again I wasn't explicit. I mean both Bombs and Grenade currently benefit condi more than they benefit Power. I want one to fit Condi, and one to benefit Power, to properly differentiate build and give everyone the same playing field.

    This is why I love the thread we have about kit reworks so much. Man, if we got that, a turret rework, and an elite gadget, boi. Engi would be SOLID.

    Society either needs a turret rework or to free bobby schmurda and I wonder which comes first?

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Matoro.9708 said:
    The cast times on pistol are so abhorrent that it is useless at close range lol, this is the reason I have used rifle all these years.

    Lol I find the rifle slow as kitten to use.

    Did manage to get one decent 1v1 this evening out of the engie (vs mirage), most other fights was either with that 2 man (we rarely caught the mirage alone) or zergs. Guess we'll find out soon enough whether the nerfs will truly go through or not, but if they do I might stick to core for a while.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 2, 2019

    @Lighter.5631 said:
    pretty sure half of holos are actually warrior mains
    i mean it is literally warrior with light saber and has tons of weapons in one set

    It's literally Warrior except it has a burst heal and cleanse on demand.

    Also it is a Warrior with Stealth.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • Iozeph.5617Iozeph.5617 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 4, 2019

    @ellesee.8297 said:
    Ya'll kill me with all this praise for holosmith as good as nades been to you. Back when you was core engi where was holosmith? You don't abandon ya folks that's been down from day one. You got a little xpac now so you too good for shrapnel nades? You gotta drop at least 12 hip shots chaith style for holosmith, but nades used to be 1500 range AND you get carpel tunnel from kit swapping. A lot of ya'll forgot where you came from and it's sad... Not me though. Nade kit until the day I die.

  • Matoro.9708Matoro.9708 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    Lol I find the rifle slow as kitten to use.

    Did manage to get one decent 1v1 this evening out of the engie (vs mirage), most other fights was either with that 2 man (we rarely caught the mirage alone) or zergs. Guess we'll find out soon enough whether the nerfs will truly go through or not, but if they do I might stick to core for a while.

    I saw frag shot used once at the start and then at the end when he was downed and you could space properly. On a kitless build, I doubt this would've gone as well. Skill 3 against mesmer is great though, I can't argue that.

    Society either needs a turret rework or to free bobby schmurda and I wonder which comes first?

  • Klypto.1703Klypto.1703 Member ✭✭✭

    The biggest problem is when the class you play gets over tuned you know something to destroy the whole class is incoming.

  • Matoro.9708Matoro.9708 Member ✭✭✭

    Holosmith should've been a warrior spec. Imagine if that bar was adrenaline. Really activates the almonds.

    Society either needs a turret rework or to free bobby schmurda and I wonder which comes first?

  • @Yasai.3549 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:
    pretty sure half of holos are actually warrior mains
    i mean it is literally warrior with light saber and has tons of weapons in one set

    It's literally Warrior except it has a burst heal and cleanse on demand.

    Also it is a Warrior with Stealth.

    Only one build plays like a Warrior. Some Other builds don't feel like Warrior. At least to me anyway

  • I'm back to playing condi core in wvw dire/trailblazer p/p grenadeer
    Egun/Tkit/Gkit yea yeah

    Screw the meta. I wanted to go back to having fun!

    Sparkr's Wonderful World of Engineering - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEONFRaJV2u2f12ytXEir9A

  • Rezzet.3614Rezzet.3614 Member ✭✭✭

    gib me back mine kit and 1500 range nades

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'm really not sure why everyone feels like being elitist. I started playing engineer when I was 23, I'm now 30. My fingers are way less comfortable playing the kit piano than they were. We need to acknowledge that core engineer is a mish mash of random ideas that don't fit a cohesive train of thought. Both elite specs have some cohesion to them, core engineer does not.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • coro.3176coro.3176 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 5, 2019

    @Peutrifectus.4830 said:
    I'm back to playing condi core in wvw dire/trailblazer p/p grenadeer
    Egun/Tkit/Gkit yea yeah

    Screw the meta. I wanted to go back to having fun!

    Sure.. it's all fun until you realize that you're actually doing net negative damage to a zerg or even small comped group in WvW as all your conditions get converted to boons every second.
    .. and you can't touch most classes with cleanse traits in small skirmishes or 1v1s because your main condi application is on medium-long cooldowns and their cleanse isn't
    .. and it takes way longer to kill your targets in PvP, giving them time to stall on the point for those critical ticks
    .. and you take more damage from retaliation than you deal from grenades
    .. and you can't spec Scrapper for sustain or utility any more

    fun..

    I guess it is rewarding when you finally kill someone. I mean, it should be. You have to outplay them often 5 times over before they actually go down compared to power holo.

  • Matoro.9708Matoro.9708 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    Both elite specs have some cohesion to them, core engineer does not.

    In some sense, given that Engineer is 'the jack of all trades', that statement could be seen as entirely the opposite. Both Scrapper and Holosmith are more condensed, but that comes (in my opinion) at a cost to the original idea of Engineer. The elite specs both are now tuned in some sense to be bruisers and front line melee fighters, this to me is ugly, not just for the overlap and loss of identity between the two specs themselves, but the departure itself from what made (for me) the profession interesting. Engi is often the adaptable guy, not locked into one play style, and the only thing that lets the elite specs do so as well, is the core stuff. If that play style comes at the cost of the value of each ability, or in some cases entire types cough turrets cough, maybe this is 'balanced'. The writing is on the wall, I just hope Anet learns the lessons and can make something both interesting and viable at the same time, not one or the other.

    Society either needs a turret rework or to free bobby schmurda and I wonder which comes first?

  • You get it @Matoro.9708 , core engi does have a cohesion on its aesthetics, is just that the skills are so bad.
    Like, for example grenades, why is there a trait that makes them travel faster? Do rangers need to aim their arrows? Do deadeyes need to calculate the wind resistance and ballistics of their proyectiles? No, of course not, it's a fantasy game, why not make grenades connect easily? Make traits something interesting, not about fixing the flaws of base design.
    Of course, we could go on and on about different engi skills, we should, maybe, but that's it for now.

  • @ellesee.8297 said:
    Ya'll kill me with all this praise for holosmith as good as nades been to you. Back when you was core engi where was holosmith? You don't abandon ya folks that's been down from day one. You got a little xpac now so you too good for shrapnel nades? You gotta drop at least 12 hip shots chaith style for holosmith, but nades used to be 1500 range AND you get carpel tunnel from kit swapping. A lot of ya'll forgot where you came from and it's sad... Not me though. Nade kit until the day I die.

    How do you setup ?

  • EdwinLi.1284EdwinLi.1284 Member ✭✭
    edited September 8, 2019

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

  • @EdwinLi.1284 said:

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

    Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo .

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @EdwinLi.1284 said:

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

    Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo .

    I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @EdwinLi.1284 said:

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

    Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo .

    I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS.

    how do you build it ?

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @EdwinLi.1284 said:

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

    Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo .

    I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS.

    how do you build it ?

    https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/engineer/holosmith/condition/

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @EdwinLi.1284 said:

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

    Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo .

    I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS.

    how do you build it ?

    https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/engineer/holosmith/condition/

    No stunbreak, no condi clean ....

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @PierPiero.9142 said:

    @EdwinLi.1284 said:

    @Prinzsecond.4863 said:
    Uhm... I play core with kits, I play scrapper with kits and I play holo with kits....
    Uhm... I play condi core, condi scrapper, power scrapper, power holo, celestial holo
    Uhm... I play meele builds, ranged builds, offensive builds, defensive builds
    All of them have decent condi cleanse, are hard to be kited and provide high mobility, and all of them are hella fun to play...at least in WvW roaming.

    Holosmith can be implemented in a range of builds, no need to stick to the boring meta builds.

    This is very true but certain people are not willing to try to get creative with their builds thus they rather stick to the Meta over getting a it creative with what can be made.

    Holosmith is fine for players who want a alternative to spamming Grenades in a Power build but it has potential in a condition build aswell to build Burn condition with Grenade conditions and pistol conditions.

    The mind is the greatest weapon because it is where creativity to how can someone be killed is made.


    As for the Elite Spec itself for me, well I am still waiting on something else a bit more creative with the Elite Spec that is not "spam kits' and Ignore Main Weapon.

    a Elite Spec that is deisnged to sacrifice Kits to modify the Main Weapon is still a interesting one I hope they may one day add since as a Engineer, the character should have a Elite Spec that gives them the ability to focus on Main Weapon by Modifying it using the Kits to perform the type of role they want such as if Rifle gets modified with Grenade and Bomb kit, it would gain 5 new Rifle skills that focus on Power Explosive Damage but if you modify the Rifle with Grenade Kit and Flamethrower kit, the Rifle gets 5 New skills that focus on Condition Explosive Burn Damage. Along with if you Modify the Rile with ELite Mortor kit with Tool Kit, it gives the Rifle 5 new skills that makes it into a Power Damage Railgun.

    Holo is not good with a condi setup .... it is better core engi condi than holo condi ihmo. For a condi setup with pistols you need firearms , so you have to take holo and firearms .... if you take also explosive you are of paper but nades without granedier are not viable ihmo .

    I disagree. Condi holo is superior, if only because it's way easier on the fingers for roughly equivalent DPS.

    how do you build it ?

    https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/engineer/holosmith/condition/

    No stunbreak, no condi clean ....

    It's meant for PvE.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • I don't know about you guys, but I like to win.

    I know people try to be elitist about engineer but engineer core is not good in any game mode.

    Holosmith is simple yes, but the damage and results is there.

    You can try to handicap your self to look pro or cool but I'll take holosmith and try to win.

    I hate when people say engineer is a Jack of all trades.

    Guardian is the real Jack of all trades. They provide stab, blocks, can do burning conditions, and can tank heal dps.

    Engineer should move away from being a Jack of all trades. We need to be strong in spvp and meta in WvW pvp.

    I love engineer and love the class but I want to see it succeed too. Other classes have gotten stronger over the years and engineer is still behind. They need to overhaul the class and give it nice power spikes.

    Over the years, patch updates have baked so much power in all the professions except engineer.

    Scrapper looks nice and holosmith is doing alright but classic core engineer is not updated with the power spikes of the other classes.

    Engineer just needs more damage and healing as well as a battle combat theme.

    Maybe make engineer effective in soloing or make him good at supporting 2 allies. Or maybe make him a glass cannon.

    Engineer is the least popular class and it's also not very meta in much of the game.

    Any ways that's my take on engineers.

  • Undo.5091Undo.5091 Member ✭✭✭

    I think it’s because there hasn’t been a frandly engineer to help everyone out.

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 18, 2019

    @Undo.5091 said:
    I think it’s because there hasn’t been a frandly engineer to help everyone out.

    Hey look buddy, I'm an engineer. That means I solve problems, not problems like "What is beauty?" Because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of philosophy.

    I solve practical problems, for instance: how am I going to stop some mean mother Hubbard from tearing me a structurally superfluous be-hind?

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

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