Charr Invasion westward to Orr and Lion Arch — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Charr Invasion westward to Orr and Lion Arch

Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

the Charr after defeating Ascalon went to Orr. But did they past through Lion Arch? I dont see anything about it on the GW1W on Lion Arch.

I ask because I see https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ascalon_Settlement which also imply the movement west for others as well. Would be surprised that Lion Arch would go untouched by the threat of the Charr.

Also looking at the events of the Foefire and The Searing,
How did the Charr make amends for all of this in such a short period of time leading into GW2?

Comments

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    the Charr after defeating Ascalon went to Orr. But did they past through Lion Arch? I dont see anything about it on the GW1W on Lion Arch.

    I ask because I see https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ascalon_Settlement which also imply the movement west for others as well. Would be surprised that Lion Arch would go untouched by the threat of the Charr.

    Also looking at the events of the Foefire and The Searing,
    How did the Charr make amends for all of this in such a short period of time leading into GW2?

    There was two invasion forces. One passed through the far shiverpeaks and invaded south into Kryta. The Krytan royal family fled and disappeared, and the white mantle+Mursaat turned the charr army back. The other army stormed through Ascalon and went for Orr, and was destroyed in the Cataclysm. Lion's Arch was untouched by that invasion.

    Ascalon settlement was founded years later, when a group of people there fled to Kryta for hope of survival.

    It's been 250 years, and Kryta was (for the most part) unaffected by the Charr. The Charr invasion did cause a corrupt/cowardly king to flee and the white mantle business, but Kryta emerged after all that strong. Ascalon is basically a dead human nation now, if you want to be technical. The charr never made "amends" for the searing because they didn't have to. They sought a cease-fire to stop an endless war when they had bigger threats appearing (the brand) and the humans had to recover an artifact to make it possible. There are people who hold onto the grudges, but as we see in Divinities Reach (timeframe: start of personal story) one minister replying to anothers comment about helping Ebonhawke against the charr. "The searing is ancient history. Get over it."

    Also with humanity originally invading Ascalon and driving out the charr, it's seen by some (out of game at least) as a "Welp, they are even now." type deal.

  • Narcemus.1348Narcemus.1348 Member ✭✭✭

    @Kalavier.1097 said:
    Also with humanity originally invading Ascalon and driving out the charr, it's seen by some (out of game at least) as a "Welp, they are even now." type deal.

    To answer the OP question, before diverging, the basic explanation for "amends" that we are given is that the travesties of the charr (mostly the searing) were done at the hands of the Flame Legion who forced all other charr to do their bidding. The current chart now fight against those Flame Legion members so they are to a degree redeemable, though that doesn't mean that they regret conquering Ascalon or anything.

    I agreed with your statements up until this point. Everyone who takes that mentality acts like the charr were some peaceful, loving natives to Ascalon and the brutal fierce humans came in and destroyed everything they had built. The charr were and still are a race of warmongers who fought and took everything that they wanted. They conquered the Blood Legion homelands and Ascalon from unknown owners (likely to have been the dwarves from the Catacombs of Kathandrax story). They were no more owners of Ascalon than the humans who owned and held that land for something like 1000 years. In the end the Charr were just angry that they had met a race that could stand against them and succeed.

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    why was Lion Arch untouched?

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 9, 2019

    the timeline of major events of Tyria is kinda weird, nations are created, destroyed, colonies founded or become a kingdom in sometimes 50 years!
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Timeline

    About how lions arch not touched, we should guess if they exists at time, in timeline theres not the date of creation, the first mention to lions arch in timeline is when zaithan "flooded" it as consequence of rising of Orr in 1219.

    is everything fast paced, the personal history begins 9 years after Jennah was crowned as the queen.

    "It's a testament to the folly of the humans and their gods. They say Arah was sacred, but all I see is one big dragon nest."(Rytlock Brimstone)

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 9, 2019

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    why was Lion Arch untouched?

    The current iteration of LA didn't exist back then. The LA of that time was flooded by Zhaitan and is still at the bottom of the Bay in current LA.
    I don't think it's commented anywhere whether the Charr got to LA or not. Just waiting on @Konig Des Todes.2086 to come and tell us all there is to know.

  • Narcemus.1348Narcemus.1348 Member ✭✭✭

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    why was Lion Arch untouched?

    To my understanding, the Charr invaded from the North, since they came through the Far Shiverpeaks. This means that they likely didn't end up sweeping far enough south before Saul D'Alessio countered them with the White Mantle. We know from the story that the last battle where the Charr were broken happened up north of the visited Krytan civilization near the city of Dementra.

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 9, 2019

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    why was Lion Arch untouched?

    The invasion force into Kryta never made it past Demetra (southwestern Harathi Hinterlands).

    They didn't touch LA because they were killed before they could.

    The rest as @Kalavier.1097 said.

    @ugrakarma.9416 said:
    the timeline of major events of Tyria is kinda weird, nations are created, destroyed, colonies founded or become a kingdom in sometimes 50 years!
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Timeline

    About how lions arch not touched, we should guess if they exists at time, in timeline theres not the date of creation, the first mention to lions arch in timeline is when zaithan "flooded" it as consequence of rising of Orr in 1219.

    is everything fast paced, the personal history begins 9 years after Jennah was crowned as the queen.

    Lion's Arch was the capital of Kryta and one of the first city ports established during Mazdak's rule. It was turned into King Doric's summer estate after Kryta lost its colonization war against Orr (something we have little details about).

    No nation or colony exists for a mere 50 years except for the colony of Elona established in the Crystal Desert by Turai Ossa. The timeline doesn't mention all lore because we don't have exact dates for a lot of things.

    @Yannir.4132 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    why was Lion Arch untouched?

    The current iteration of LA didn't exist back then. The LA of that time was flooded by Zhaitan and is still at the bottom of the Bay in current LA.
    I don't think it's commented anywhere whether the Charr got to LA or not. Just waiting on @Konig Des Todes.2086 to come and tell us all there is to know.

    Zhaitan rose in 1219 AE. The charr invasion was in 1071 AE. LA was not sunk during GW1 events. It was a major city then too. Just not pirate ran.

    Not saying all there is to know because Kalavier got almost all of it as pertaining to OP, and I'm on a phone atm.

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  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Narcemus.1348 said:

    @Kalavier.1097 said:
    Also with humanity originally invading Ascalon and driving out the charr, it's seen by some (out of game at least) as a "Welp, they are even now." type deal.

    To answer the OP question, before diverging, the basic explanation for "amends" that we are given is that the travesties of the charr (mostly the searing) were done at the hands of the Flame Legion who forced all other charr to do their bidding. The current chart now fight against those Flame Legion members so they are to a degree redeemable, though that doesn't mean that they regret conquering Ascalon or anything.

    I agreed with your statements up until this point. Everyone who takes that mentality acts like the charr were some peaceful, loving natives to Ascalon and the brutal fierce humans came in and destroyed everything they had built. The charr were and still are a race of warmongers who fought and took everything that they wanted. They conquered the Blood Legion homelands and Ascalon from unknown owners (likely to have been the dwarves from the Catacombs of Kathandrax story). They were no more owners of Ascalon than the humans who owned and held that land for something like 1000 years. In the end the Charr were just angry that they had met a race that could stand against them and succeed.

    I was meaning it far more in a sense of "Humans were jerks to the Charr, the Charr responded with also being a jerk. At this point in time the people who care about the issue are those with live in a corner of Ascalon. The rest of humanity in Kryta generally doesn't care so much about continuing the war/reclaiming Ascalon over ending the war so resources don't have to be funneled constantly over to Ebonhawke."

    The Charr are also evolving. Unlike the Orcs of warcraft, they actually use their brains and have grown.

    Sure, they don't regret taking back Ascalon, but everybody in the world can see the kingdom of Ascalon was doomed under the insane leadership of Adelbern, and for the Charr they viewed it as reclamation. Course, the truth of that period of history is slowly coming out within the Priory and Iron Legion. It was a war, they don't feel sorry for winning it. And most of the sane Ascalon people were already long gone by that point to Ebonhawke or Kryta.

  • @Kalavier.1097 said:
    It was a war, they don't feel sorry for winning it. And most of the sane Ascalon people were already long gone by that point to Ebonhawke or Kryta.

    That's the sum of it. And it wasn't for nothing. The humans fought tooth and nail and kept pace with the charr. Circumstance and concession ultimately led to an official place for humanity in Ascalon (Ebonhawk) and it's not like the charr are xenophobic.

    You have Ebonhawk and the greater charr lands with a people who aren't unreasonable or crazy. Even Bangar is going to have a bunch of non-charr stomping around in the Blood Legion Homelands.

    Really interested in how that's going to play out with a PC human and a PC charr.

    According to the neat magazine thing they did Rytlock of all people may end up doing something to get the legions riled up and talking about a Khan-Ur again. Might have to do with the whole decking his imperator thing that we got a sneak peak at, but who can say.

  • @CETheLucid.3964 said:

    @Kalavier.1097 said:
    It was a war, they don't feel sorry for winning it. And most of the sane Ascalon people were already long gone by that point to Ebonhawke or Kryta.

    That's the sum of it. And it wasn't for nothing. The humans fought tooth and nail and kept pace with the charr. Circumstance and concession ultimately led to an official place for humanity in Ascalon (Ebonhawk) and it's not like the charr are xenophobic.

    You have Ebonhawk and the greater charr lands with a people who aren't unreasonable or crazy. Even Bangar is going to have a bunch of non-charr stomping around in the Blood Legion Homelands.

    Really interested in how that's going to play out with a PC human and a PC charr.

    According to the neat magazine thing they did Rytlock of all people may end up doing something to get the legions riled up and talking about a Khan-Ur again. Might have to do with the whole decking his imperator thing that we got a sneak peak at, but who can say.

    Well, every time Rytlock got a promotion is was by something insulting him to his face, and then being killed by him.

    Bangar is also being presented as somebody who we thought was a wildcard berserker, but is (as far as we have glimpsed) a charismatic, fairly intelligent individual. I saw a blurb somewhere that his hatred of humanity and other races isn't blind xenophobia, but rooted in history and interactions. So he's probably somewhat learned in history too.

  • @Kalavier.1097 said:

    Well, every time Rytlock got a promotion is was by something insulting him to his face, and then being killed by him.

    Rytlock's class change from warrior to revenant makes sense now?

  • @Kalavier.1097 said:
    Bangar is also being presented as somebody who we thought was a wildcard berserker, but is (as far as we have glimpsed) a charismatic, fairly intelligent individual. I saw a blurb somewhere that his hatred of humanity and other races isn't blind xenophobia, but rooted in history and interactions. So he's probably somewhat learned in history too.

    Yeah, sounds like they're making Bangar a "charr Joko" but with insults instead of jokes. Leaves it unclear whether he's friend or foe and I like that.

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  • Pax.3548Pax.3548 Member ✭✭✭

    Even though the charr practically destroyed 2 human kindgoms , they suffered massive losses in their invasion, as Kalavier said, the charr invasion force consisted in 2 armies, one went south towards ascalon and then, after the searing, contiued south directly towards Orr but was completely wiped out by the cataclysm, while the second army went west through the far north shiverpeaks, and then south towards Kryta, but the army was annhilated by Saul D'Alessio and the mursaat. Military speaking, humanity , as drained as it was because of the guildwars, sure made the charr suffer for their conquest

  • Narcemus.1348Narcemus.1348 Member ✭✭✭
    edited September 11, 2019

    @Pax.3548 said:
    Even though the charr practically destroyed 2 human kindgoms , they suffered massive losses in their invasion, as Kalavier said, the charr invasion force consisted in 2 armies, one went south towards ascalon and then, after the searing, contiued south directly towards Orr but was completely wiped out by the cataclysm, while the second army went west through the far north shiverpeaks, and then south towards Kryta, but the army was annhilated by Saul D'Alessio and the mursaat. Military speaking, humanity , as drained as it was because of the guildwars, sure made the charr suffer for their conquest

    Very true, just to add a bit to that, what remained of the Orrian invasion returned to ascalon to find that what remained of the humans were still fighting to their dying breath. They had assumed that Ascalon was broken, and were very wrong to this day. They also had elite groups of humans behind enemy lines sabotaging their plans and killing their Flame Legion leaders. No one can say that humanity didn't give them a run for their money, and while the humans had the cataclysm and the Mursaat that helped push out the charr, the charr themselves couldn't have gotten in without the Titans.

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