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Do you think it would be good if one of the LW episode maps is made to be ported as WvW and PVP map?


Vancho.8750

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Maybe one of the LW episodes should come like PvP update some story then it sends you to do some pvp stuff. Open world map with story that is somehow copied as WvW map in the mists and part of it is cut out floating in Spvp as 2v2 3v3, conquest , reworked stronghold map anything really. The spvp map could be like a mission from the story like defend the lord, kill the bad guy and in pvp people take the place of NPCs that attack or defend.Since every time i see them add cool boss in the story and i say to myself that would have been cool raid/dungeon/fractal and felt like such a waste, but now with strike missions they do have addressed that nagging feeling.Some of the words they used seem like WvW and Spvp are done deal and that rubs me the wrong way.Do you think it would be cool if they reuse the map in multiple modes so it doesn't waste manpower and still update parts of the game?EDIT: Since people don't want to read the whole thing.THE STORY DOES NOT NEED TO BE CONNECTED TO THE PVP TO BE PROGRESSED, but there should be pvp wvw related story like the warclaw or the legendary backpack with stuff to do in the modes.

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Being forced to PvP at some point in the PvE levelling / story / whatever is a reason to quit games.If after seven years you suddenly cannot progress in the story without forced PvP... That's not going to be accepted, I assure you. :)

And I do like PvP in GW2. I still don't want it to be forced. OTOH, mixing it into optional achievements and collections may be cool. As long as it remains optional.

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@"WhatLiesBeneath.9018" said:No because WvW and PvP maps needs to be balanced in a whole different way, PvE maps doesnt need any balance at all.

It goes even further then that. WvW maps are fundamentally designed for ground movement only, and special considerations are made for gliding decent. All of the PvE mounts can break this in a way that its counter productive to any type of event design built around the map layout. Preventing that by obstacles addresses that issue, but compounds a problem in WvW that would create too many choke points for the wrong reasons. The only way this would work is to disable all the mounts, except Warclaw, so all the traversal conflicts are avoided. However, side lanes then start becoming a point of contention. PvP/WvW maps need to funnel players around longer paths to control timing, PvE maps on the other hand need bypasses because players expect to be able to avoid things. To this day, I see still people complaining about Drytop's routing and WP discovery sequence, since anything not in a straight line is consider "obtuse" in people's eyes.

Edge of the Mists "functionally" does what the OP is talking about. But WvW players largely hate fighting in it, because the fight guilds keep perpetuating the stigma that all WvW fights should be Open Field GvG. And PvE players hate moving around it, because you can't bypass obstacles (by design).

And for the record... PvE maps actually need a lot more balance, because players tend to have, and expect, more freedom of movement within them. Ignoring the need for it doesn't mean the need ceases to exist. For instance, both the Roller Beetle and Skyscale maps are different from all previous maps in order for those mount's abilities to make sense. The Roller Beetle tracks in Tyria also lead to a few small modifications to the map, to ensure the beetles had a clear path to follow. Griffon breaks almost every map up to when the Roller Beetle was introduced, but is almost stymied in the maps after it. Dragon Fall has a lot uneven obstacles, mixing long vertical and horizontal requirements that the Skyscale does handle but the Griffon can't.

Then theres the meta events. Lane arrangement, lane partitioning, side lanes, congregation points, split phases, intended traversal, mastery traversal, fight mechanics, siege mechanics (if present), boss mechanics, reinforcement method (respawn distance, time to travel, etc).... all areas which are very easy to mess up by themselves, and even easier to mess up in event synergy. Just looking at older World Boss fights and Core Tyria metas compared to Newer metas, or even "fixed" versions of existing ones. Orr is a time capsule of various half finished ideas, cleaver attempts to fix events without changing them, and events that break on a regular basis. Its entire structure was designed as part of a back to back push/pull through various sections; but had no inherent reset event/timer, and no mechanism to make them flow smoothly between maps. Orr today has most of its event chains isolated from each other, which made it a prime farming spot for a number of years (including during HOT).

I can say without a doubt that the LS maps are wildly inconsistent in how successful their meta's were as one-time experiences, much less repeat ones. And thats ignoring how mounts affected all of HOT/LS3's Content block.

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@Fenella.2634 said:Being forced to PvP at some point in the PvE levelling / story / whatever is a reason to quit games.If after seven years you suddenly cannot progress in the story without forced PvP... That's not going to be accepted, I assure you. :)

And I do like PvP in GW2. I still don't want it to be forced. OTOH, mixing it into optional achievements and collections may be cool. As long as it remains optional.

Ignoring the partial suggestion of adding story based or forced pvp, using the pve maps, empty of all pve elements and having them as a pvp or wvw map within those actual modes - no interference with story or pve at all.

On a purely theoretical level, i can see the potential. It could make for some fun custom pvp maps or free for alls and avoid the contententious issue of open world pvp which needs to stay away from the game.They could rotate them as well.

On a technical level it prob isn’t feasible though

To be clear...no to pvp in a pve game world. Just, no

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@Fenella.2634 said:

@Vancho.8750 said:Maybe one of the LW episodes should come like PvP update some story then it sends you to do some pvp stuff.That sounds like forced PvP to me, no? @Randulf.7614 ?

Copying maps here and there between modes I don't mind, but I doubt it would be very playable.

I glossed over that too quickly. I’ve edited my post accordingly to correct my inaccuracy

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Something like Southsun Survival but use all the PvE maps. Make it a yearly festival/event. Perhaps without the health drain, but pure event mechanics so definitely without class skills. Title Achieve for winning on each/every map. Participation achieve (annual) for all maps. Add bonus loot boxes to the scavengable items drop table.

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No, there are dedicated teams working on those game modes we’ve been told, and they ought to develop more maps for their own game modes. Anet recently said conquest was the bread and butter of PvP, well great, maybe add maps more frequently then? And maybe another borderlands so WvW doesn’t have two alpine ones.

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What the hell is going on with you PvP people.You open 4,374,862 threads asking about bringing PvP to PvE.And every time you guys get a clear "NO"

You guys are lucky that certain words are not allowed in this forum or you would get an even stronger response.

So i try a last time

HELL NO, stay out of our PvE world nobody wants or needs you here !!!

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Why are all focusing on the do some pvp thing i was talking about collection thing or something like the backpack or some special event to unlock pvp armors and weapons, infusions. novelties like the pose thing. You get your usual LW Quests and on top of that some PVP quests unlock with the episode even a special boss event where it is controlled by people like in Evolve in A PVP MAP.The whole point is to make a map and use it in multiple modes or part of it. A story instance that can be morphed into an arena so it is not in "beta" for years.And no i don't want PvP in PVE i just want to reuse some resources for PvP and WvW, cause i think this is the only way to get some layout changes to make it feel little bit fresher and maybe fix some problems in the layout in WvW.You know that Anet doesn't go back to old places if they don't have something connected to the new content.

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@Fenella.2634 said:Being forced to PvP at some point in the PvE levelling / story / whatever is a reason to quit games.If after seven years you suddenly cannot progress in the story without forced PvP... That's not going to be accepted, I assure you. :)

And I do like PvP in GW2. I still don't want it to be forced. OTOH, mixing it into optional achievements and collections may be cool. As long as it remains optional.

Don't you need Gift of Battle for legendary? Is there a work around? Let me know

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@Knighthonor.4061 said:

@Fenella.2634 said:Being forced to PvP at some point in the PvE levelling / story / whatever is a reason to quit games.If after seven years you suddenly cannot progress in the story without forced PvP... That's not going to be accepted, I assure you. :)

And I do like PvP in GW2. I still don't want it to be forced. OTOH, mixing it into optional achievements and collections may be cool. As long as it remains optional.

Don't you need Gift of Battle for legendary? Is there a work around? Let me knowEnter WvW do the dailies get the pots exit. A lot of times you don't even see enemy players.

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@"Vancho.8750" said:Why are all focusing on the do some pvp thing i was talking about collection thing or something like the backpack or some special event to unlock pvp armors and weapons, infusions. novelties like the pose thing. You get your usual LW Quests and on top of that some PVP quests unlock with the episode even a special boss event where it is controlled by people like in Evolve in A PVP MAP.The whole point is to make a map and use it in multiple modes or part of it. A story instance that can be morphed into an arena so it is not in "beta" for years.And no i don't want PvP in PVE i just want to reuse some resources for PvP and WvW, cause i think this is the only way to get some layout changes to make it feel little bit fresher and maybe fix some problems in the layout in WvW.You know that Anet doesn't go back to old places if they don't have something connected to the new content.

As long as it is completely optional and not required to complete the story.

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@Vancho.8750 said:

@Fenella.2634 said:Being forced to PvP at some point in the PvE levelling / story / whatever is a reason to quit games.If after seven years you suddenly cannot progress in the story without forced PvP... That's not going to be accepted, I assure you. :)

And I do like PvP in GW2. I still don't want it to be forced. OTOH, mixing it into optional achievements and collections may be cool. As long as it remains optional.

Don't you need Gift of Battle for legendary? Is there a work around? Let me knowEnter WvW do the dailies get the pots exit. A lot of times you don't even see enemy players.

Boy oh boy I been doing it wrong

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@Knighthonor.4061 said:

@Fenella.2634 said:Being forced to PvP at some point in the PvE levelling / story / whatever is a reason to quit games.If after seven years you suddenly cannot progress in the story without forced PvP... That's not going to be accepted, I assure you. :)

And I do like PvP in GW2. I still don't want it to be forced. OTOH, mixing it into optional achievements and collections may be cool. As long as it remains optional.

Don't you need Gift of Battle for legendary? Is there a work around? Let me knowWhat does this have to do with anything? :) I don't need legendaries for the story, they are optional. As I said, I do like PvP here and I do some WvW, too, but I want to be able to progress with the story without being forced to change game modes.

Mixing in some PvP into LW achievements - I don't mind that, as long as the story in itself is not concerned. Optional stuff like Warclaw, GoB is fine with me.

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@"Vancho.8750" said:Why are all focusing on the do some pvp thing i was talking about collection thing or something like the backpack or some special event to unlock pvp armors and weapons, infusions. novelties like the pose thing.Because it was not really clear from your original posting and having read a lot of "PvP in PvE" threads lately, it seemed like another one of those. :)

The whole point is to make a map and use it in multiple modes or part of it. A story instance that can be morphed into an arena so it is not in "beta" for years.So, different versions of the same map basically? I think WvW really needs new maps anyway, I'd be fine with copies of PvE maps in general. However, Anet would have to consider WvW then (or Conquest) when designing the map. Each party has to have a roughly equal starting zone and fair chances. This could be a bit boring for the PvE version, then, but not even necessarily. I think with Dragon Fall they kind of already did that. It has its three areas with roughly equal ressources, plus a "neutral" area.Of course, mounts are a problem right now, if you want to make a version of such a map for PvP or WvW. For DF, maybe it would be easier to create a new map from scratch, compared to trying to modify DF to be traversable without mounts.

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For living world? I think a lot of the casul player base would quit over this type of thing being tied to the main story and PvE life.

Anything revolving around PvP in PvE needs to have a "flag me for PvP" system, then maybe have achievements associated to incentives it.

I think it would be neat if you had farming trains but some people just flagged themselves for "Player Killing", either waiting for spawns, or getting bold and turning it on while killing bosses. Actually the latter could be one of the achievement chains.

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@Fenella.2634 said:

@"Vancho.8750" said:Why are all focusing on the do some pvp thing i was talking about collection thing or something like the backpack or some special event to unlock pvp armors and weapons, infusions. novelties like the pose thing.Because it was not really clear from your original posting and having read a lot of "PvP in PvE" threads lately, it seemed like another one of those. :)

The whole point is to make a map and use it in multiple modes or part of it. A story instance that can be morphed into an arena so it is not in "beta" for years.So, different versions of the same map basically? I think WvW really needs new maps anyway, I'd be fine with copies of PvE maps in general. However, Anet would have to consider WvW then (or Conquest) when designing the map. Each party has to have a roughly equal starting zone and fair chances. This could be a bit boring for the PvE version, then, but not even necessarily. I think with Dragon Fall they kind of already did that. It has its three areas with roughly equal ressources, plus a "neutral" area.Of course, mounts are a problem right now, if you want to make a version of such a map for PvP or WvW. For DF, maybe it would be easier to create a new map from scratch, compared to trying to modify DF to be traversable without mounts.Something like Dragon fall is exactly that, most of it is traversable with gimmicks like oakheart and shrooms, but one part has to be open no mans land for blob vs blob objectives while the edges are more suited for guerrilla warfare with gimmicks that shred large zergs and it is suitable for smaller groups, maybe this zone will be hard to get through because the same movement mechanics. People dislike the dessert borderlands cause they don't have easy access to zerg vs zerg there (while i consider that Arenanet has catered way too much to this crowd, and in the wrong way by making everywhere their playground, i think they do need their special place).For SPVP there could be instance build for the story about a tournament a blood ring of sorts and you get to reuse it.On the PVE side it will be like dragon fall 3 areas with dead zone in the middle that opens up for the large meta event.The PVP team that is in charge of SPVP and WvW seems to be only mechanics oriented and the environment artists are funneled into LW, Raids and Fractals so having them craft multipurpose maps is probably the only way to see some fixes and changes in the PvP modes. Most of it is an excuse to touch up old content as new one since the policy is that old content is done deal.

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