Is this bruiser damage? I think there needs to be a might limit in pvp. — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Is this bruiser damage? I think there needs to be a might limit in pvp.

Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

8.56k prime light beam.

Dude was also just sustaining everything we threw at them.

This damage and tankiness is why I don't think it is a fair class.

very good mobility as well

jeesh.....

Unblockable, cast time of a dodge with quickness, big initial damage, respectable pulsing damage and burning. 10 pulses.

Oh and it launches you too. cd starts at 60s? and ways to lower that?

If they cast from stealth where is the warning?

Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Thief is my obsession.

<1

Comments

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 5, 2019

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    8.56k prime light beam.

    Dude was also just sustaining everything we threw at them.

    This damage and tankiness is why I don't think it is a fair class.

    very good mobility as well

    jeesh.....

    Unblockable, cast time of a dodge with quickness, big initial damage, respectable pulsing damage and burning. 10 pulses.

    Oh and it launches you too. cd starts at 60s? and ways to lower that?

    If they cast from stealth where is the warning?

    You should have edited out your skill bar, now people know it is a Thief poiting it out and nobody will give a f***, in fact your issue will probably get covered up by a whole sh** load of whataboutism.

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 5, 2019

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    8.56k prime light beam.

    Dude was also just sustaining everything we threw at them.

    This damage and tankiness is why I don't think it is a fair class.

    very good mobility as well

    jeesh.....

    Unblockable, cast time of a dodge with quickness, big initial damage, respectable pulsing damage and burning. 10 pulses.

    Oh and it launches you too. cd starts at 60s? and ways to lower that?

    If they cast from stealth where is the warning?

    dont forget that it hits several times, so aegis doesnt work :D or stability :D also 1200 range so no running away!
    and its a channel so it tracks people in stealth! you stealthed after engi? you still better dodge becouse he might blast your kitten anyways :D

    EDIT respect for playing d/p thief, not all heroes wear capes!

  • Fortus.6175Fortus.6175 Member ✭✭✭

    its u> @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    8.56k prime light beam.

    Dude was also just sustaining everything we threw at them.

    This damage and tankiness is why I don't think it is a fair class.

    very good mobility as well

    jeesh.....

    Unblockable, cast time of a dodge with quickness, big initial damage, respectable pulsing damage and burning. 10 pulses.

    Oh and it launches you too. cd starts at 60s? and ways to lower that?

    If they cast from stealth where is the warning?

    dont forget that it hits several times, so aegis doesnt work :D or stability :D also 1200 range so no running away!
    and its a channel so it tracks people in stealth! you stealthed after engi? you still better dodge becouse he might blast your kitten anyways :D

    EDIT respect for playing d/p thief, not all heroes wear capes!

    Its unblockable so aegis wouldnt do anything to save you either way. Also, one of the shorter CD ultimates in the game (60 seconds), off the top of my head only guardians have shorter ones)

  • Arkantos.7460Arkantos.7460 Member ✭✭✭

    yez prime holo beam needs indeed some serious nerfs ... no more unblockable for sure
    also holoneeds his stabi ripped off

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    -> Critical hit from a 60s elite skill
    -> 8.5k damage

    Checks out. Plenty of non-elite big hits do that kind of damage, and have much lower cooldowns.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    8.56k prime light beam.

    Dude was also just sustaining everything we threw at them.

    This damage and tankiness is why I don't think it is a fair class.

    very good mobility as well

    jeesh.....

    Unblockable, cast time of a dodge with quickness, big initial damage, respectable pulsing damage and burning. 10 pulses.

    Oh and it launches you too. cd starts at 60s? and ways to lower that?

    If they cast from stealth where is the warning?

    dont forget that it hits several times, so aegis doesnt work :D or stability :D also 1200 range so no running away!
    and its a channel so it tracks people in stealth! you stealthed after engi? you still better dodge becouse he might blast your kitten anyways :D

    EDIT respect for playing d/p thief, not all heroes wear capes!

    Nobody can wear capes.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Ryan.9387 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    -> Critical hit from a 60s elite skill
    -> 8.5k damage

    Checks out. Plenty of non-elite big hits do that kind of damage, and have much lower cooldowns.

    no it doesn't

    it's unblockable

    has pulsing damage

    pulsoing burn

    launches foes

    last 10s

    1200 range

    and like you said a 60 sec base cd.

    And completely irrelevant if you just dodge the super obvious animation.

    But I see some other problems, such as you getting hit by holo 3, then getting hit by holo 5, then the elite. Where was your stunbreak, why not dodge anything?

    Looks to me like you got outplayed.

    No they went into stealth while I was picking up an ally they down with similar damage (still tanky asf) and started that kitten, well after we took them to like 5% health, only to come back full health and busting this out.

    The fight went that far and stunbreaks were exhausted just fighting this cat.

    This was a kd with shockwave, with quickness and the cast time is less than 3/4 s for the plb with that.

    Also, the animation is not obvious when it is in stealth.

    Jeez man.

    Looks to me like you go play holo more, I'll keep with the others chipping away at it each balance and hopefully in two more years it will be where it is needed.

    Edit: Next time, I'll just clip the damage only. So I can just make up whatever story I want.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    "Assassin's" would still do more damage than this. More curious about your stats/build than theirs.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    "Assassin's" would still do more damage than this. More curious about your stats/build than theirs.

    I'm not referring to gw1 assassins .

    I'm talking about damage types:

    • high damage, no tanking (assassin, dps focus)
    • medium damage, medium tanking (bruiser, off tank)
    • low damage, high tanking (tank, bunker)

    What are holo, spellbreaker, and soulbeast supposed to be?

    I think I was on this build. (marauders and lynx) I was wearing all armor pieces too.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YdMQ2JOuLprTA-z5IeKpoAyUI0rIobJgjHA

    It was not a 1 v 1, and this build is not meant for that.

    I guess I could also complain about demolisher amulet too, it is a bit of out of place.

    edit: in the picture, I am not in the same game anymore, I scrolled up to take the screen shot.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Lighter.5631Lighter.5631 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    you talking about prot holo? where he tanks tons of stuff and has 25 might and does kitten tons of damage?
    yea i think that build is more cheese then rifle elixir holo and need tone down, i think prot holo needs to do less damage then rifle elixir

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    "Assassin's" would still do more damage than this. More curious about your stats/build than theirs.

    I'm not referring to gw1 assassins .

    I'm talking about damage types:

    • high damage, no tanking (assassin, dps focus)
    • medium damage, medium tanking (bruiser, off tank)
    • low damage, high tanking (tank, bunker)

    What are holo, spellbreaker, and soulbeast supposed to be?

    This much was obvious but they aren't as defined is this game as they are in mobas hence the quotation marks.

    Gw2 , by design, isn't so clear cut that you can pigeon hole a class or a spec into one things.

    I think I was on this build. (marauders and lynx) I was wearing all armor pieces too.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YdMQ2JOuLprTA-z5IeKpoAyUI0rIobJgjHA

    It was not a 1 v 1, and this build is not meant for that.

    You're also playing full glass. Pretty much any build short of someone built full tank would hit hard since you're essentially taking "true damage".

    I guess I could also complain about demolisher amulet too, it is a bit of out of place.

    The amulet is pretty much fine. Also considering you've recently posted in a thread about bringing things back , removing things shouldn't be on your agenda.

    The game is filled with problems and some things that need balancing but what you're complaining about I don't think is one of them.

    Based on your description of the situation you got caught unaware and got combo'd and died.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    "Assassin's" would still do more damage than this. More curious about your stats/build than theirs.

    I'm not referring to gw1 assassins .

    I'm talking about damage types:

    • high damage, no tanking (assassin, dps focus)
    • medium damage, medium tanking (bruiser, off tank)
    • low damage, high tanking (tank, bunker)

    What are holo, spellbreaker, and soulbeast supposed to be?

    This much was obvious but they aren't as defined is this game as they are in mobas hence the quotation marks.

    Gw2 , by design, isn't so clear cut that you can pigeon hole a class or a spec into one things.

    I think I was on this build. (marauders and lynx) I was wearing all armor pieces too.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YdMQ2JOuLprTA-z5IeKpoAyUI0rIobJgjHA

    It was not a 1 v 1, and this build is not meant for that.

    You're also playing full glass. Pretty much any build short of someone built full tank would hit hard since you're essentially taking "true damage".

    I guess I could also complain about demolisher amulet too, it is a bit of out of place.

    The amulet is pretty much fine. Also considering you've recently posted in a thread about bringing things back , removing things shouldn't be on your agenda.

    The game is filled with problems and some things that need balancing but what you're complaining about I don't think is one of them.

    Based on your description of the situation you got caught unaware and got combo'd and died.

    Thief is always full glass I guess then.

    If you are referring to traits I pick...

    What could have made the damage less?

    The first 2 hits dont drop me below 50% health, so no acrobatics save, the other hit, plb was enough to down me.

    Thief doesn't have protection without ecto, stealing it, or an ally share.

    The dude fought 2 of us, he ran away with s, stealth.

    I picking ally up, he come out with corona, shockwave, into prime light beam....

    Had his damge for his class been unboosted by 25 might, I would have survived.

    Also, the guy was super tanky and had plenty of get out jail cards.

    How did it get there?

    How can he do so much damge and soak up so much?

    Too much reward, not enough risk.

    I said bring back rock dog..that's the troll rune...lol...sarcasm not detected.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I made an attack on the light golem with no might. (chosen runes to guarantee a crit)

    4.4k

    vs.

    8.56k

    the lower might be higher with a differnet rune, but the difference shows what 25 might does, it is a spec changer.

    you can be a tank, and still do wrecking ball damage

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    -> Critical hit from a 60s elite skill
    -> 8.5k damage

    Checks out. Plenty of non-elite big hits do that kind of damage, and have much lower cooldowns.

    no it doesn't

    it's unblockable

    has pulsing damage

    pulsoing burn

    launches foes

    last 10s

    1200 range

    and like you said a 60 sec base cd.

    Yeah. As I said, it's an elite skill. Several non-elites hit harder, but aren't unblockables or knockbacks.

    Hence... it's an elite. Honestly, I'm not sure what about that is confusing.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    Oh just you wait till people find out about Core Warrior, that will be something to post about.

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    /nvm 15chars im done

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I made an attack on the light golem with no might. (chosen runes to guarantee a crit)

    4.4k

    vs.

    8.56k

    the lower might be higher with a differnet rune, but the difference shows what 25 might does, it is a spec changer.

    you can be a tank, and still do wrecking ball damage

    What's this misleading comparison? 25 might does not double your damage. You have no heat, no boons ...you lack pretty much any damage modifier that would have been present in your encounter.

    PLB would have still hit you for over 6k+ without any might at all if the same conditions were met. The combo probably would have still killed you. Even if it didn't the following attack would have. The combo would have finished you considering over the course of , even with quickness, 2-3seconds you did nothing to defend yourself with the two stun breaks on your bar.

    You were full glass and situationally made a bad play by going for the res. You got re-engaged on, took the full opening burst, and died due to your lack of environmental and
    combat awarenesss thinking they wouldn't come back.

    The problem holo has is it's sustain not it's damage.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    /nvm 15chars im done

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • ArthurDent.9538ArthurDent.9538 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Out of all the things to complain about with Holo, plb is one of the weakest things to go after. It's got a 1.25 sec cast time, this is an easy dodge even with quickness. If used from stealth that is another story but that is more of a stealth problem as it has the same effect on all hard hitting skills. We should start complaining about grave digger next since it hits just as hard for same cast time /s.

  • Lighter.5631Lighter.5631 Member ✭✭✭

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    Oh just you wait till people find out about Core Warrior, that will be something to post about.

    tell me about it. core tactic war is more meme then actually good in my book

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    /nvm 15chars im done

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Lighter.5631Lighter.5631 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

    if s/d hit as hard as warrior, there will be no balance lol, there's a reason why poison thief can take down a splb without even being touch in less then 30 seconds

  • Sigmoid.7082Sigmoid.7082 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I made an attack on the light golem with no might. (chosen runes to guarantee a crit)

    4.4k

    vs.

    8.56k

    the lower might be higher with a differnet rune, but the difference shows what 25 might does, it is a spec changer.

    you can be a tank, and still do wrecking ball damage

    What's this misleading comparison? 25 might does not double your damage. You have no heat, no boons ...you lack pretty much any damage modifier that would have been present in your encounter.

    PLB would have still hit you for over 6k+ without any might at all if the same conditions were met. The combo probably would have still killed you. Even if it didn't the following attack would have. The combo would have finished you considering over the course of , even with quickness, 2-3seconds you did nothing to defend yourself with the two stun breaks on your bar.

    You were full glass and situationally made a bad play by going for the res. You got re-engaged on, took the full opening burst, and died due to your lack of environmental and
    combat awarenesss thinking they wouldn't come back.

    The problem holo has is it's sustain not it's damage.

    I thought they would come back, not expecting to get hit for all my health about 1.5 secs out of stealth from a super tanky spec.

    But you keep on defending it.

    It's not just sustain, it is also damage.

    edit: lol 15% more damage from heat would be 660 more on top of 4400 and if it crit that would be about 5.6k max without the might....with the other attacks also being lower....

    i think holo could be left alone if they take away the ridiculous might gain, even with sustain.

    I said heat and other boons as well as vulnerability. You do realise there are other damage modifiers outside of lasers edge in a typical holo build along with might and vulnerability generation? You know what traits do what on holo at least right? Did you just go to the holo line and find the 15% from lasers edge and think that was it?

    Again 25 might is not a double damage boost. You're post saying it's fine on reaper because it dies easier is evident that 25 might is not the problem.

    This just goes back to my point that this post isn't about might generation else you would have a problem with it. It's complaining about holo.

    Holo has its balance problems but the damage overall really isn't one of them.

    You also made bad chooses and played poorly in a situation you , apparently, knew could be coming. Getting punished for poor play and bad choices isn't cause for a misplaced nerf thread.

    Would you have made the same thread about Soul Spiral if you got caught and combo'd the same way unaware by a reaper with might?

  • Lighter.5631Lighter.5631 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    25might can never change a bruiser to an assassin, a bruiser is always a bruiser.
    an assassin's defining trait is can insta spike some one from far away through teleport..and has path skipping abilities and able to stick to target so they can finish low target easily..
    not doing big damage..
    a bruiser's defining trait is damage, without damage, bruiser wouldnt be threat to anyone at all, may as well just go FB instead or just full bunker that does nothing but annoy people. if an assassin wouldn't feeel threatened by a bruiser's damage on point, then there's no point in being a bruiser aka side noder

    tho i do agree some build are doing more damage then some other build of the same level in the same class.

  • SeikeNz.3526SeikeNz.3526 Member ✭✭✭

    the guy saying that holo dmg is ok i loled, their sustain and dmg is a problem, at least they nerfed the range for the area knockdown and now you dont fall after random atks, but if you face tank a holo you going to die in 2 hits even as a tank build

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I think it's funny how some of you are trying to discredit the photo or me and call it a misplay, when I am talking about the damage.

    Whether I got hit or not, a bruiser should not hit for almost 9k off of one hit.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭

    The cooldown could be increased due to how the class can evade spam with Power Wrench. Reducing the amount of synergy that makes the build dominate with all the CC already available along Stability in between the DPS sections.

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

    if s/d hit as hard as warrior, there will be no balance lol, there's a reason why poison thief can take down a splb without even being touch in less then 30 seconds

    I'm talking power s/d and power d/p. Condi thief is cheese for sure but people are playing it right now cuz thief power builds hit like pure garbage unless it's a malicious backstab from stealth. Maybe if thief had some decent weapon damage people wouldn't have flocked to the condi DD build when the DA trait was changed. There is no way bruiser classes or specs should be doing more dps with their weapons or bursts than a glassy rogue but alas this is gw2 lol it's one of many many special things found here :)

  • Vagrant.7206Vagrant.7206 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I think it's funny how some of you are trying to discredit the photo or me and call it a misplay, when I am talking about the damage.

    Whether I got hit or not, a bruiser should not hit for almost 9k off of one hit.

    Uhh... Maul, Worldly Impact, Soul Spiral, Eviscerate, Rampage, Ray of Judgement, Backstab, etc. etc. can do damage like that with crits and damage modifiers. Again, I fail to see how PLB is particularly noteworthy in these regards.

    • Do I think activating PLB should unstealth you? Yes, I do. That would be appropriate.
    • Do I think its damage is overtuned? Not compared to other specs.
    • Do I think it's powercreeped? Yeah, it's definitely powercreeped compared to core. Just compare it to supply crate.
    • Is it egregious for an elite skill? No, I don't think so.

    The great god Lagki demands sacrifice!

  • Ferus.3165Ferus.3165 Member ✭✭✭

    60 sec cd for one single attack... one dodge (and thief has broken amounts of these) and the skill is rendered useless. The skill is fine as it is. Casting it while stealthed is another issue, but that is more of a problem because of thief than because of holo.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    "Assassin's" would still do more damage than this. More curious about your stats/build than theirs.

    I'm not referring to gw1 assassins .

    I'm talking about damage types:

    • high damage, no tanking (assassin, dps focus)
    • medium damage, medium tanking (bruiser, off tank)
    • low damage, high tanking (tank, bunker)

    What are holo, spellbreaker, and soulbeast supposed to be?

    I think I was on this build. (marauders and lynx) I was wearing all armor pieces too.

    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PawAgqVlNw2YdMQ2JOuLprTA-z5IeKpoAyUI0rIobJgjHA

    It was not a 1 v 1, and this build is not meant for that.

    I guess I could also complain about demolisher amulet too, it is a bit of out of place.

    edit: in the picture, I am not in the same game anymore, I scrolled up to take the screen shot.

    I remember being on berk amulet cheesy build and warrior hit me for 7,2k with dodge. suprised the hell out of me, but kinda makes me wonder what the actual kitten is wrong with this game lol.

  • AngelLovesFredrik.6741AngelLovesFredrik.6741 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I think it's funny how some of you are trying to discredit the photo or me and call it a misplay, when I am talking about the damage.

    Whether I got hit or not, a bruiser should not hit for almost 9k off of one hit.

    Uhh... Maul, Worldly Impact, Soul Spiral, Eviscerate, Rampage, Ray of Judgement, Backstab, etc. etc. can do damage like that with crits and damage modifiers. Again, I fail to see how PLB is particularly noteworthy in these regards.

    • Do I think activating PLB should unstealth you? Yes, I do. That would be appropriate.
    • Do I think its damage is overtuned? Not compared to other specs.
    • Do I think it's powercreeped? Yeah, it's definitely powercreeped compared to core. Just compare it to supply crate.
    • Is it egregious for an elite skill? No, I don't think so.

    Maul, worldly impact, soul spiral are all melee skills. The rest are single target. Very few of these are also unblockable.
    Most is also damage over a few seconds (Ray of judgement in particular as you can't speed it up with quickness) so that is an awful comparison.

    There is also no reason why the field should not only tick burn, but also around 1.1k damage. But also last for 10 seconds. Which other ability persists for that long? I guess there are a few, but none of which are front-loaded with that much damage and utility.

    ~ God Tier Guardian

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @AngelLovesFredrik.6741 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I think it's funny how some of you are trying to discredit the photo or me and call it a misplay, when I am talking about the damage.

    Whether I got hit or not, a bruiser should not hit for almost 9k off of one hit.

    Uhh... Maul, Worldly Impact, Soul Spiral, Eviscerate, Rampage, Ray of Judgement, Backstab, etc. etc. can do damage like that with crits and damage modifiers. Again, I fail to see how PLB is particularly noteworthy in these regards.

    • Do I think activating PLB should unstealth you? Yes, I do. That would be appropriate.
    • Do I think its damage is overtuned? Not compared to other specs.
    • Do I think it's powercreeped? Yeah, it's definitely powercreeped compared to core. Just compare it to supply crate.
    • Is it egregious for an elite skill? No, I don't think so.

    Maul, worldly impact, soul spiral are all melee skills. The rest are single target. Very few of these are also unblockable.
    Most is also damage over a few seconds (Ray of judgement in particular as you can't speed it up with quickness) so that is an awful comparison.

    There is also no reason why the field should not only tick burn, but also around 1.1k damage. But also last for 10 seconds. Which other ability persists for that long? I guess there are a few, but none of which are front-loaded with that much damage and utility.

    PLB also has the same cast time and almost the same animation as kill shot.

    Don't get me wrong I think PLB is stacked, being unblockable CC with a similar damage coefficient to kill shot, then again it's an elite on a 60s CD while kill shot can be used a lot more.

    I know apples and oranges but they're very similar skills and in this game what isn't dumbed down and power crept? That's not me saying I like it btw, just I gave up caring a long time ago when it became apparent there's no will from the company to change this policy.

  • @apharma.3741 said:

    @AngelLovesFredrik.6741 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I think it's funny how some of you are trying to discredit the photo or me and call it a misplay, when I am talking about the damage.

    Whether I got hit or not, a bruiser should not hit for almost 9k off of one hit.

    Uhh... Maul, Worldly Impact, Soul Spiral, Eviscerate, Rampage, Ray of Judgement, Backstab, etc. etc. can do damage like that with crits and damage modifiers. Again, I fail to see how PLB is particularly noteworthy in these regards.

    • Do I think activating PLB should unstealth you? Yes, I do. That would be appropriate.
    • Do I think its damage is overtuned? Not compared to other specs.
    • Do I think it's powercreeped? Yeah, it's definitely powercreeped compared to core. Just compare it to supply crate.
    • Is it egregious for an elite skill? No, I don't think so.

    Maul, worldly impact, soul spiral are all melee skills. The rest are single target. Very few of these are also unblockable.
    Most is also damage over a few seconds (Ray of judgement in particular as you can't speed it up with quickness) so that is an awful comparison.

    There is also no reason why the field should not only tick burn, but also around 1.1k damage. But also last for 10 seconds. Which other ability persists for that long? I guess there are a few, but none of which are front-loaded with that much damage and utility.

    PLB also has the same cast time and almost the same animation as kill shot.

    Don't get me wrong I think PLB is stacked, being unblockable CC with a similar damage coefficient to kill shot, then again it's an elite on a 60s CD while kill shot can be used a lot more.

    I know apples and oranges but they're very similar skills and in this game what isn't dumbed down and power crept? That's not me saying I like it btw, just I gave up caring a long time ago when it became apparent there's no will from the company to change this policy.

    While I agree that elites should be stronger than normal abilities. The major issue isn't plb. It's the class it's attached too. If it was the the only, or one of few high-threat abilities you need to dodge (like killshot) it would more or less be fine. It's just the entire package that does way too much.

    ~ God Tier Guardian

  • Once, a warrior hit me 2 times in my thief with 3k each one ......when he dodge..... sadeness. :s

    Have i to dodge....his dodge ??? =)

    Troll since 1982.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @AngelLovesFredrik.6741 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @AngelLovesFredrik.6741 said:

    @Vagrant.7206 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:
    I think it's funny how some of you are trying to discredit the photo or me and call it a misplay, when I am talking about the damage.

    Whether I got hit or not, a bruiser should not hit for almost 9k off of one hit.

    Uhh... Maul, Worldly Impact, Soul Spiral, Eviscerate, Rampage, Ray of Judgement, Backstab, etc. etc. can do damage like that with crits and damage modifiers. Again, I fail to see how PLB is particularly noteworthy in these regards.

    • Do I think activating PLB should unstealth you? Yes, I do. That would be appropriate.
    • Do I think its damage is overtuned? Not compared to other specs.
    • Do I think it's powercreeped? Yeah, it's definitely powercreeped compared to core. Just compare it to supply crate.
    • Is it egregious for an elite skill? No, I don't think so.

    Maul, worldly impact, soul spiral are all melee skills. The rest are single target. Very few of these are also unblockable.
    Most is also damage over a few seconds (Ray of judgement in particular as you can't speed it up with quickness) so that is an awful comparison.

    There is also no reason why the field should not only tick burn, but also around 1.1k damage. But also last for 10 seconds. Which other ability persists for that long? I guess there are a few, but none of which are front-loaded with that much damage and utility.

    PLB also has the same cast time and almost the same animation as kill shot.

    Don't get me wrong I think PLB is stacked, being unblockable CC with a similar damage coefficient to kill shot, then again it's an elite on a 60s CD while kill shot can be used a lot more.

    I know apples and oranges but they're very similar skills and in this game what isn't dumbed down and power crept? That's not me saying I like it btw, just I gave up caring a long time ago when it became apparent there's no will from the company to change this policy.

    While I agree that elites should be stronger than normal abilities. The major issue isn't plb. It's the class it's attached too. If it was the the only, or one of few high-threat abilities you need to dodge (like killshot) it would more or less be fine. It's just the entire package that does way too much.

    Yep and I agree but welcome to PoF, everything is too much and no-one has shown any will to sort out the mess it's in as demonstrated by repeated buffs to tempest and ele and many other reworks to aspects that are "underpowered" in the current meta. Just sit back and make choo choo sounds.

  • Lighter.5631Lighter.5631 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

    if s/d hit as hard as warrior, there will be no balance lol, there's a reason why poison thief can take down a splb without even being touch in less then 30 seconds

    I'm talking power s/d and power d/p. Condi thief is cheese for sure but people are playing it right now cuz thief power builds hit like pure garbage unless it's a malicious backstab from stealth. Maybe if thief had some decent weapon damage people wouldn't have flocked to the condi DD build when the DA trait was changed. There is no way bruiser classes or specs should be doing more dps with their weapons or bursts than a glassy rogue but alas this is gw2 lol it's one of many many special things found here :)

    Im exactly talking about power s/d, im only mentioning poison thief for the sole reason of exampling how thief can land damage without ever being touched by melee classes, if a power s/d deals bruiser warrior damage, tell me how there will be balance.

    as i already said above, assassin's trait is not big damage, but spikes and mobility and ability to stick to target and finish low target. people really don't think

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

    if s/d hit as hard as warrior, there will be no balance lol, there's a reason why poison thief can take down a splb without even being touch in less then 30 seconds

    I'm talking power s/d and power d/p. Condi thief is cheese for sure but people are playing it right now cuz thief power builds hit like pure garbage unless it's a malicious backstab from stealth. Maybe if thief had some decent weapon damage people wouldn't have flocked to the condi DD build when the DA trait was changed. There is no way bruiser classes or specs should be doing more dps with their weapons or bursts than a glassy rogue but alas this is gw2 lol it's one of many many special things found here :)

    Im exactly talking about power s/d, im only mentioning poison thief for the sole reason of exampling how thief can land damage without ever being touched by melee classes

    U take power s/d or d/p and go hammer on someone without using a backstab burst or rely on assassins sig to have SOME type of dps than compare it to most classes warrior,holo or slb and tell me how it goes. With a full power S/d or d/p u can slice and dice someone with a 1000 cuts but it's no where near the efficiency of other classes hence why thief players opt for either the stealth back stab playstyle or the s2 +1 playstyle chipping away at a opponents health that's already injured then porting back out when pressured lol
    Anyone who thinks thief has decent dps outside of stealth back stab,rifle DE burst doesn't really play the class and is looking at it from the other side not really knowing what they're talking about and are blind to those facts by the dislike for the class. In wvw u can literally run behind half the classes auto attacking continually with skills thrown in between on s/d and d/p on full power builds and the opponent will keep running like ur a misquote lol but if u stealth back stab especially malicious than u can burst for a decent amount. Rifle burst and bound with assassin signet popped can do decent dps to but other than that u got noodle dps. I've followed behind warriors, guards and scrappers that just run for like 2 minutes strait as I continually hammered on them as the ran until the simply ran into their keep lol that's ridiculous for a rogue class.

  • Lighter.5631Lighter.5631 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

    if s/d hit as hard as warrior, there will be no balance lol, there's a reason why poison thief can take down a splb without even being touch in less then 30 seconds

    I'm talking power s/d and power d/p. Condi thief is cheese for sure but people are playing it right now cuz thief power builds hit like pure garbage unless it's a malicious backstab from stealth. Maybe if thief had some decent weapon damage people wouldn't have flocked to the condi DD build when the DA trait was changed. There is no way bruiser classes or specs should be doing more dps with their weapons or bursts than a glassy rogue but alas this is gw2 lol it's one of many many special things found here :)

    Im exactly talking about power s/d, im only mentioning poison thief for the sole reason of exampling how thief can land damage without ever being touched by melee classes

    U take power s/d or d/p and go hammer on someone without using a backstab burst or rely on assassins sig to have SOME type of dps than compare it to most classes warrior,holo or slb and tell me how it goes. With a full power S/d or d/p u can slice and dice someone with a 1000 cuts but it's no where near the efficiency of other classes hence why thief players opt for either the stealth back stab playstyle or the s2 +1 playstyle chipping away at a opponents health that's already injured then porting back out when pressured lol
    Anyone who thinks thief has decent dps outside of stealth back stab,rifle DE burst doesn't really play the class and is looking at it from the other side not really knowing what they're talking about and are blind to those facts by the dislike for the class. In wvw u can literally run behind half the classes auto attacking continually with skills thrown in between on s/d and d/p on full power builds and the opponent will keep running like ur a misquote lol but if u stealth back stab especially malicious than u can burst for a decent amount. Rifle burst and bound with assassin signet popped can do decent dps to but other than that u got noodle dps. I've followed behind warriors, guards and scrappers that just run for like 2 minutes strait as I continually hammered on them as the ran until the simply ran into their keep lol that's ridiculous for a rogue class.

    not comment about anything other then your bad comparison of bruisers and assassin.
    damage is the edge bruiser have over assassin, assassin with the mobility and disengage and ability to stick to target and insta spike damage, it should never do bruiser damage.
    also now you are talking about how pvp should balance around 1v1 random encounters in wvw? they don't even share the same skill numbers.
    doesnt matter tho, you really need to learn to think of the other side, for example if a guard or a war followed you and try to hit you, but they can't because you are gone lol....
    assassin sig is literally the trade off for less assassin type ability aka easy escape/more mobility for more damage.

  • Alatar.7364Alatar.7364 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Alatar.7364 said:

    @Crab Fear.1624 said:

    @Sigmoid.7082 said:
    This thread is complaint about holo disguised as a complain about might.

    There are many skills that do similar damage or much more and can potentially leave you open to or set up further bigger damage.

    Actually I'll post some about the spellbreakers too.

    Recently got hit for a throw boulder at 11k and the follow ups with 8k.

    The dodge hit me for about 5k.

    It's a complaint about bruisers, might gain.

    If you are a bruiser, you shouldn't do assassin level damage.

    Oh just you wait till people find out about Core Warrior, that will be something to post about.

    tell me about it. core tactic war is more meme then actually good in my book

    Not talking about Tactics rework. Talking about the old core build that has almost always been here. Now its beginning to flood PvP like crazy because people realized how insane its dmg is while its sustain and mobility is also very good.

    ~ I Aear cân ven na mar

  • Curennos.9307Curennos.9307 Member ✭✭✭
    edited October 6, 2019

    Damage is out of control.

    Warrior has a baseline/minor/whatever the small auto-traits are called trait equivalent to a Thief's elite spec grandmaster trait. Holo is like rampage: the class. Yadda yadda.

    People when these things are pointed out: Lol screw all thieves

    Suffer well, Mr Crab.

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:

    @Lighter.5631 said:

    @Psycoprophet.8107 said:
    Compare holo's, warrior, splb, slb, guards average weapon dps on its skills and the dps of all their burst rotations to the rogue of the game lmao. Wonder if u do more dps auto attack chaining with warrior and holo with their boons than a s/d thief or especially a d/p thief? Cuz it sure seem like I hit far harder on my warrior per hit than I do my thief yet while actually being able to take a lot of hits. Arenanet have kittened up not only each class independently but each class in comparison to each other are so far from being balanced it's crazy. I dunno if it's a combination of trying to appease its community with not really understanding their game due to lack of actual playtime but regarding pvp this games classes need a major overhaul that will surely never come.

    if s/d hit as hard as warrior, there will be no balance lol, there's a reason why poison thief can take down a splb without even being touch in less then 30 seconds

    I'm talking power s/d and power d/p. Condi thief is cheese for sure but people are playing it right now cuz thief power builds hit like pure garbage unless it's a malicious backstab from stealth. Maybe if thief had some decent weapon damage people wouldn't have flocked to the condi DD build when the DA trait was changed. There is no way bruiser classes or specs should be doing more dps with their weapons or bursts than a glassy rogue but alas this is gw2 lol it's one of many many special things found here :)

    Im exactly talking about power s/d, im only mentioning poison thief for the sole reason of exampling how thief can land damage without ever being touched by melee classes

    U take power s/d or d/p and go hammer on someone without using a backstab burst or rely on assassins sig to have SOME type of dps than compare it to most classes warrior,holo or slb and tell me how it goes. With a full power S/d or d/p u can slice and dice someone with a 1000 cuts but it's no where near the efficiency of other classes hence why thief players opt for either the stealth back stab playstyle or the s2 +1 playstyle chipping away at a opponents health that's already injured then porting back out when pressured lol
    Anyone who thinks thief has decent dps outside of stealth back stab,rifle DE burst doesn't really play the class and is looking at it from the other side not really knowing what they're talking about and are blind to those facts by the dislike for the class. In wvw u can literally run behind half the classes auto attacking continually with skills thrown in between on s/d and d/p on full power builds and the opponent will keep running like ur a misquote lol but if u stealth back stab especially malicious than u can burst for a decent amount. Rifle burst and bound with assassin signet popped can do decent dps to but other than that u got noodle dps. I've followed behind warriors, guards and scrappers that just run for like 2 minutes strait as I continually hammered on them as the ran until the simply ran into their keep lol that's ridiculous for a rogue class.

    not comment about anything other then your bad comparison of bruisers and assassin.
    damage is the edge bruiser have over assassin, assassin with the mobility and disengage and ability to stick to target and insta spike damage, it should never do bruiser damage.
    also now you are talking about how pvp should balance around 1v1 random encounters in wvw? they don't even share the same skill numbers.
    doesnt matter tho, you really need to learn to think of the other side, for example if a guard or a war followed you and try to hit you, but they can't because you are gone lol....
    assassin sig is literally the trade off for less assassin type ability aka easy escape/more mobility for more damage.

    Lol no assassins usually have more burst than bruisers but bruisers have more sustained dps due to being able to stay in the fight longer. Usually rogue like are high burst dos with mobility as the need to do their dps fast and get out fast if pressured. Bruisers should not have more and fast dps than a rogue

  • Excuse me, what is the referrence point?
    It is impossible to agree/disagree when there is nothing to compare it to.
    When comparing, please list all the advantages of meta build of each spec you wish to compare. Also why you compared given specs in particular, would be nice to know.

    Otherwise, it is just a whining.

  • Crab Fear.1624Crab Fear.1624 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Greyjoy.5167 said:
    Excuse me, what is the referrence point?
    It is impossible to agree/disagree when there is nothing to compare it to.
    When comparing, please list all the advantages of meta build of each spec you wish to compare. Also why you compared given specs in particular, would be nice to know.

    Otherwise, it is just a whining.

    Read through the thread.

    Soon™ ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

    Thief is my obsession.

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