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Design flaw about daredevil main damage skill + teleportation


DeerHunter.4129

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Normally when you use Daredevils main skill, skill number 2 "weakening strikes".. its causing 3 hits on your target. But it has major technical issues that i dont think are designed on purpose. Skills where thief teleports (swipe aka steal skill of DD, shadow step to foe, pull your foe to you) all are skills that pure melee class needs badly, but when daredevil teleports to his enemy or pulls the enemy to him and uses his main damage skill it fails. And it fails in a way that doesnt seem to be implemented on purpose. What i mean is that thief kind of charges forward through his target and missing 2/3 of his hits.. your target can be stunned, or immobilized or downed etc, yet your thief still just charges forward and missing most of his damage.. For your information normally the skill charges forward and stops going forward whenever there is enemy on front of you, so all your 3 hits from that skill hits your target.. but after teleporting to enemy, or enemy to you it doesnt recognize that the enemy is in front of you so it goes through the enemy.. its kind of a bug or at least it doesnt seem logical design.¨

Overall end result is that by the time i have spent all my initiative, about 50-70% of the hits of that skill has missed because of this.. and if i dont use teleporting skills, how am i supposed to catch any targets as pure melee class.

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@"DeerHunter.4129" said:Normally when you use Daredevils main skill, skill number 2 "weakening strikes".. its causing 3 hits on your target. But it has major technical issues that i dont think are designed on purpose. Skills where thief teleports (swipe aka steal skill of DD, shadow step to foe, pull your foe to you) all are skills that pure melee class needs badly, but when daredevil teleports to his enemy or pulls the enemy to him and uses his main damage skill it fails. And it fails in a way that doesnt seem to be implemented on purpose. What i mean is that thief kind of charges forward through his target and missing 2/3 of his hits.. your target can be stunned, or immobilized or downed etc, yet your thief still just charges forward and missing most of his damage.. For your information normally the skill charges forward and stops going forward whenever there is enemy on front of you, so all your 3 hits from that skill hits your target.. but after teleporting to enemy, or enemy to you it doesnt recognize that the enemy is in front of you so it goes through the enemy.. its kind of a bug or at least it doesnt seem logical design.¨

Overall end result is that by the time i have spent all my initiative, about 50-70% of the hits of that skill has missed because of this.. and if i dont use teleporting skills, how am i supposed to catch any targets as pure melee class.

just vault -> steal to chunk people for 50% hp

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Staff is a decent weapon in pve, but it is more of a defensive weapon in pvp with damage potential, instead of being offensive.You know this because chase potential is low.However, it is really poor on the defense.Staff three would be better like the spear skill 9 tail strike.I say lower the damage on vault(perhaps by 40-50%), increase casting speed and cripple (2s)on hit. Increase range to 750. Same initiative.

But that's just a dream.

The only changes I think thief will get anytime soon is the murdering of condi thief.

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My point being, staff would be functional design even on offensive gameplay... but it requires teleport skills or pulling your enemy to you... and fixing this issue.. i mean what the fuck, i miss over 50% or my main damage skill due to how the skill works, there is nothing player can do about it, what kind of person designs such flawed system. The issue is same in PVE, you pull enemy to you, or you teleport to enemy and if you attack him with your main skill, you just go 6metres through it, missing 2/3 of your hits... it doesnt make sense because without teleportation, all 3 hits lands your target.

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@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@"DeerHunter.4129" said:Normally when you use Daredevils main skill, skill number 2 "weakening strikes".. its causing 3 hits on your target. But it has major technical issues that i dont think are designed on purpose. Skills where thief teleports (swipe aka steal skill of DD, shadow step to foe, pull your foe to you) all are skills that pure melee class needs badly, but when daredevil teleports to his enemy or pulls the enemy to him and uses his main damage skill it fails. And it fails in a way that doesnt seem to be implemented on purpose. What i mean is that thief kind of charges forward through his target and missing 2/3 of his hits.. your target can be stunned, or immobilized or downed etc, yet your thief still just charges forward and missing most of his damage.. For your information normally the skill charges forward and stops going forward whenever there is enemy on front of you, so all your 3 hits from that skill hits your target.. but after teleporting to enemy, or enemy to you it doesnt recognize that the enemy is in front of you so it goes through the enemy.. its kind of a bug or at least it doesnt seem logical design.¨

Overall end result is that by the time i have spent all my initiative, about 50-70% of the hits of that skill has missed because of this.. and if i dont use teleporting skills, how am i supposed to catch any targets as pure melee class.

just vault -> steal to chunk people for 50% hpThat was adressed in a patch, on Vault;
December 11, 2018

The damage of this attack will no longer occur if the thief shadowsteps after the skill has begun.

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@Markri.9475 said:

@"DeerHunter.4129" said:Normally when you use Daredevils main skill, skill number 2 "weakening strikes".. its causing 3 hits on your target. But it has major technical issues that i dont think are designed on purpose. Skills where thief teleports (swipe aka steal skill of DD, shadow step to foe, pull your foe to you) all are skills that pure melee class needs badly, but when daredevil teleports to his enemy or pulls the enemy to him and uses his main damage skill it fails. And it fails in a way that doesnt seem to be implemented on purpose. What i mean is that thief kind of charges forward through his target and missing 2/3 of his hits.. your target can be stunned, or immobilized or downed etc, yet your thief still just charges forward and missing most of his damage.. For your information normally the skill charges forward and stops going forward whenever there is enemy on front of you, so all your 3 hits from that skill hits your target.. but after teleporting to enemy, or enemy to you it doesnt recognize that the enemy is in front of you so it goes through the enemy.. its kind of a bug or at least it doesnt seem logical design.¨

Overall end result is that by the time i have spent all my initiative, about 50-70% of the hits of that skill has missed because of this.. and if i dont use teleporting skills, how am i supposed to catch any targets as pure melee class.

just vault -> steal to chunk people for 50% hpThat was adressed in a patch, on Vault;
December 11, 2018

The damage of this attack will no longer occur if the thief shadowsteps after the skill has begun.

tell that to the guy that kept doing it repeatedly in pvp matches :D

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Debilitating Arc has a hefty chunk of cripple attached to it. Also, if you jump and then use the skill - NOT the jumping timing that has you jump and evade backwards to eliminate vulnerability frames, do it even faster than that - you can jump -> strike -> evade in place. It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place with a melee strike that cripples. Very useful for getting cripple on a kiting opponent without having the skill you use to do so forcing you AWAY in a horrendously counterproductive manner.

What I usually do is vault in (or just use staff 4 if they have some sort of defense going), apply cripple and such, and THEN use steal -> Weakening Charge. I find steal -> Charge combo misses the most (by which I just...WHIRL right past someone) if I'm coming at them from the sides. Directly from the front seems to be the best, or attacking when they're moving away from whereer you might be attacking from.

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Part of playing any game is to understand mechanics and taking note of animation timing. In an arcade fighting game (i.e. Street Fighter) you have to time your attacks else you'll miss the certain area of your target where you can deal a lot of damage or denying them from blocking your attacks. If you mistimed your attacks, you won't get the expected favorable result.

The Thief profession works in the similar way. You have to sometimes wait for the animation to finish before following up with your attacks. Sometimes that delays are there by design, which to be honest have frustrated many Thieves ever since (i.e. Heartseeker's after cast delay).

So you have to understand that you have to control the urge to juggle your opponent midair because it won't work in this game. Even though I agree that you should be able to, it's just not how this game is design, thus I won't think they will change that anytime soon.

As for weakening charge, you have to literally wait for their feet to touch the ground when pulling and yours to touch the ground when teleporting (due to aftercast delay) before you can do anything to them. This is the flaw of the game engine's inability to process everything so the game is designed to give the engine time to process, thus the delays. In other games with similar interactions and amount of effects that are being processed in real time (i.e. Destiny 2), I have not experience the design flaw that exists in GW2. GW2's engine is just an old design using old technology that is now struggling to keep up with our beastly computers.

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@"Curennos.9307" said:It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place

I'm still waiting for the "dodge roll" on Deadeye while kneeling to be a dodge-in-place by default (unless a movement key is held). Who wants to get into a good overlook position on a wall/cliff (where your shots are not obstructed), only to have to roll backwards (away from your firing position) to get access to your big hitting attack???

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@Kageseigi.2150 said:

@"Curennos.9307" said:It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place

I'm still waiting for the "dodge roll" on Deadeye while kneeling to be a dodge-in-place by default (unless movement key's are held). Who wants to get into a good overlook position on a wall/cliff (where your shots are not obstructed), only to have to roll backwards (away from your firing position) to get access to your big hitting attack???

I never knew how much I needed this before you brought it up. Yes pls.

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@Kageseigi.2150 said:

@"Curennos.9307" said:It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place

I'm still waiting for the "dodge roll" on Deadeye while kneeling to be a dodge-in-place by default (unless a movement key is held). Who wants to get into a good overlook position on a wall/cliff (where your shots are not obstructed), only to have to roll backwards (away from your firing position) to get access to your big hitting attack???

I've asked for that before, didn't seem like anyone was into it. I would still like to have some way to dodge in place in Kneel for when you have a good perch but I have to admit I like rolling over Snipers Cover sometimes.

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@Kageseigi.2150 said:

@"Curennos.9307" said:It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place

I'm still waiting for the "dodge roll" on Deadeye while kneeling to be a dodge-in-place by default (unless a movement key is held). Who wants to get into a good overlook position on a wall/cliff (where your shots are not obstructed), only to have to roll backwards (away from your firing position) to get access to your big hitting attack???

I don't think there's any reason NOT to implement something like that :D

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@Kageseigi.2150 said:

@"Curennos.9307" said:It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place

I'm still waiting for the "dodge roll" on Deadeye while kneeling to be a dodge-in-place by default (unless a movement key is held). Who wants to get into a good overlook position on a wall/cliff (where your shots are not obstructed), only to have to roll backwards (away from your firing position) to get access to your big hitting attack???

Why not just gain a Shadow's Cloak instead of dodge rolling in place just like how Mirage's Cloak works? Same effect as dodging, but without the positioning, only when kneeling of course.

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@Sir Vincent III.1286 said:

@"Curennos.9307" said:It basically turns the skill into a dodge-in-place

I'm still waiting for the "dodge roll" on Deadeye while kneeling to be a dodge-in-place by default (unless a movement key is held). Who wants to get into a good overlook position on a wall/cliff (where your shots are not obstructed), only to have to roll backwards (away from your firing position) to get access to your big hitting attack???

Why not just gain a Shadow's Cloak instead of dodge rolling in place just like how Mirage's Cloak works? Same effect as dodging, but without the positioning, only when kneeling of course.

Without making it busted like MC with increased dodge duration and CC negation, this comes at a pretty big cost since if used nearby an opponent while not on a perch, you become very easy to just AoE bomb since your position doesn't change. Ever simply walk out of Meteor Shower, for example?

I'd personally take expending a charge of SM for a perched shot than losing my ground-level repositioning.

And if you're camping a perched spot nobody can fight back on, well, that's kinda just bad design. Even FPS games are deliberately designed to force snipers to move around a lot by making their perches very easy to access and return fire into/acquire LoS away from for most of the map.

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