Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Reaching the Potential of Guild Wars 2 World vs World


awaken.2134

Recommended Posts

Just like many people here, I have been playing video games for quite a while and I have discovered which games fit me and which don't. With this said, one game, or in this case game mode, has risen above them all for me. This game mode is Guild Wars 2 World verse World.

I feel this game has the potential to become a major force within the gaming industry. There are very few games that offer mmo pvp combat with groups of these sizes and gameplay that is this much fun (in my opinion).

I thought I'd share some ideas that could make this mode more popular and more fresh to the daily player. I'm sure it may not be possible to support many of my ideas so go easy on me.

The first objective is to remove barriers to entry for new players. I believe that the first step should be to remove the equipment and level barrier for new players. Many new players have very low stats or all out glassy gear making them die very easily. Allowing them access to an easy to obtain stat changeable exotic set could answer this problem. The equipment would be WvW stat specific unlike pvp. If they like the game mode, they can work towards ascending through a reward track of some kind.

Add builds, guides, and videos (similar to metabattle) to the game interface. Players rate which builds/guides/videos are best (similar to Dota 2).

Have a guild recruitment list so new and experienced players can find guilds that suit their playstyle (similar to eve). New players get needed gameplay help. Experienced players find needed experienced fight guilds. Being in guilds/being in comms are also important in having a good experience in WvW.

Built in VOIP (discord) similar to CS:GO or Dota 2. As said above, making it easier for people to be in comms makes for a more exciting experience in WvW. Their will of course be options to mute, kick and even ban people depending on if you're the commander, lieutenant, guild leader, etc.

Allow new users to gain access to auto loot, mounts and gliders. This auto loot will allow new users to make the much needed gold when starting out. The mount and glider will help newbies follow commanders when moving from fight to fight. It would be bad for the commander to have to go into a fight without his full force with him.

Increase size and visibility of wvw entry button. Make it easier to choose which link to follow when on wvw map selection screen. Possibly get rid of eotm and consolidate wvw maps. Have a "jump into the battle" button. Have Newbie and experienced interfaces for joining maps. Similar to Team Fortress 2 one can click to auto find a server or find a server manually. Also remove small leave mist button and replace with bigger, more visible leave button.

Every few months we could have a different season which introduces a new map to the game. The players vote on which map they want. This will keep the gameplay fresh and fun.

Put in 15 man Guild vs Guild matchmaking system (with spectator mode). Guilds can schedule times to meet up within about the week. (similar to CEVO tournament system in CS:GO). An ELO ranking system is in place. A guild as well as a player can have stats (in game arc dps, will talk about later). The gvg system will go season to season. The system has the capability of being an esports. Although GvG's aren't the best for out of game spectators, usually experienced players will have fun watching the matches.

Guild and personal stats: A system that shows damage, healing, cleanses and strips as well as other data, similar to arc dps, would help in matchmaking for GvG system.

As the years have passed I feel that most players play for the fights, not necessarily the sieging that takes place. I offer the idea of making maps with less objectives to defend and attack and make for a terrain that allows for fights happening more often as well as making fights more exciting.

Red vs Blue server balance system (Alliance vs Horde example): The goal of this system is to keep maps populated and fights relatively fair. Servers (maguuma exp) will be split into either red team or blue team. Similar to our current repairing system, sides would be balanced every few weeks with a certain set of servers on each side. By having two sides instead of an array of servers within tiers, we can fill up maps more easily, especially in off hours (OCX, SEA, EU). This is done by having maps ordered from top the bottom, the top being the most populated map and the bottom being the least populated map. Instead of only having 2 servers to play against (within tier), you would have 6 servers to play against (plus smaller servers) for each side (red vs blue). This system would also has a reservation system to allow guilds access to populated maps during prime time. What this system would do would be similar to a restaurant, guilds can reserve a time on a populated map like a restaurant reservation. To stop guilds from making more reservations than they need, a penalty system should be in place to make sure guilds make it to their reserved time slot and actually use them.

I have some more ideas for the game in general but these are just a few ideas I have for WvW.

I think it's extremely important to keep the game mode fresh and entertaining and I hope my ideas can help.

Contact me for questions and thoughts. Email is alistairsw@gmail.com

-awaken

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Sovereign.1093" said:hire this guy

Lol, based on what? He just freely gave out his ideas. While it would be great to improve the new player experience (the "tutorials" have been lacking) much of these changes won't be practical in scope for the immediate future. We don't even have alliances...so I doubt ANET will get right on these.

D:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

+1 !

1) And allow each Roamer to equip a ''becon'' that :a) Disturb the map/yell chat with some ''pink grafity'' like Scarlet's messages (and later on some1 else stole it and inmplanted on Jinx...) .b) Show on the minimapc) Selfdamage if more than 3 ppl are around.That way Roamers have a role , rather than picking on stranglers only.

2) Put some npcs is various map locations , that allows you to buy an item for 1,5 silver from A-NPC and sell it for a difference price in B-NCP , or try to cmombine it with a second item from C-NCP and sell it to D-NPC for huge amount of silver (of mount-bazzoka) . If the D-NPC has too many items , the reward money is reduced , and you must find another formula/path. Or any other ingame currency - but contribute to the server score

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@"Sovereign.1093" said:hire this guy

Lol, based on what? He just freely gave out his ideas. While it would be great to improve the new player experience (the "tutorials" have been lacking) much of these changes won't be practical in scope for the immediate future. We don't even have alliances...so I doubt ANET will get right on these.

D:

it is my opinion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes! 100% to everything on this.ANET! I know you have been burnt in the past with your decisions like Red BL, Mount, Gliding(not all of these were bad in the end)But you NEED to take chances on some stuff.Not everyone is gonna like drastic changes to maps or systems such as seasons again or how tiers are done. But at this point it is beyond needed. Quit listening to the 80% player base that hops into WvW once every 2 months. Start listening to the 20% that actually calls his game mode our home.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The first objective is to remove barriers to entry for new players. I believe that the first step should be to remove the equipment and level barrier for new players. Many new players have very low stats or all out glassy gear making them die very easily. Allowing them access to an easy to obtain stat changeable exotic set could answer this problem. The equipment would be WvW stat specific unlike pvp. If they like the game mode, they can work towards ascending through a reward track of some kind.

Allow new users to gain access to auto loot, mounts and gliders. This auto loot will allow new users to make the much needed gold when starting out. The mount and glider will help newbies follow commanders when moving from fight to fight. It would be bad for the commander to have to go into a fight without his full force with him.

I like both these ideas in general but maybe just limited these "account boons" (upscale to lvl 80, free exotic gear, access to gliding, warclaw, autoloot and maybe other wvw masteries) while playing on EotM. This would give new players the opportunity to get more or less the full wvw experience without having to put in 100+ hours on the regular maps and could also work as an incentive for f2p players to purchase PoF for unlocking the Warclaw, gliding and non-core stats.

EotM is barely played these days and its initial purpose of acting as overflow while queueing is basically obsolete. New players could start playing there without having to socially integrate into specific servers and it could act as recruitment place for wvw guilds as well, if their commanders tag up there every once in a while to take new players on their hand and teach them the ropes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As much as people say they're only about the fights, watch most avoid fights if it's structured and scheduled like spvp, especially if rankings are posted. People and guilds in WvW do want something to fight over and they want the wild card of anything going wrong and the openness to adapt. It also sounds like your ranking and matchup system would match like minded guilds with same compositions and execution. Your system also sounds like it would break up all of those new players we just now made a nice UI for from the few guilds who would rank themselves and who might actually teach those new players something.

I think what you would like, and it doesn't sound bad, is to have a larger spvp match mode for guilds and everyone else can just keep playing wvw. I'd rather just have an open world pvp server but I don't see that happening at this point.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’m on it @XenesisII.1540!

My comments will be bolded

@"awaken.2134" said:Just like many people here, I have been playing video games for quite a while and I have discovered which games fit me and which don't. With this said, one game, or in this case game mode, has risen above them all for me. This game mode is Guild Wars 2 World verse World.

I feel this game has the potential to become a major force within the gaming industry. There are very few games that offer mmo pvp combat with groups of these sizes and gameplay that is this much fun (in my opinion). Yes, with a completely new engine.

I thought I'd share some ideas that could make this mode more popular and more fresh to the daily player. I'm sure it may not be possible to support many of my ideas so go easy on me. Ty for sharing!

The first objective is to remove barriers to entry for new players. I believe that the first step should be to remove the equipment and level barrier for new players. Many new players have very low stats or all out glassy gear making them die very easily. Allowing them access to an easy to obtain stat changeable exotic set could answer this problem. The equipment would be WvW stat specific unlike pvp. If they like the game mode, they can work towards ascending through a reward track of some kind. Unfortunately this won’t be done. For the past 7 years players have made and used game, and real life, resources to create and get gears. All new players can start in exotics, or play forever in exotics.

Add builds, guides, and videos (similar to metabattle) to the game interface. Players rate which builds/guides/videos are best (similar to Dota 2). There are too many build variables to do this properly. And would be a waste of resources for the devs, especially since when we already have things like meta battle and the build makers.

Have a guild recruitment list so new and experienced players can find guilds that suit their playstyle (similar to eve). New players get needed gameplay help. Experienced players find needed experienced fight guilds. Being in guilds/being in comms are also important in having a good experience in WvW. We have functioned just fine on this front for the past 7 years. You’ll see guild recruiters in-game. Players can ask around in-game. There is also a forum section devoted to looking for guilds.

Built in VOIP (discord) similar to CS:GO or Dota 2. As said above, making it easier for people to be in comms makes for a more exciting experience in WvW. Their will of course be options to mute, kick and even ban people depending on if you're the commander, lieutenant, guild leader, etc. Would be a waste of resources since we have free 3rd party voice chat options already.

Allow new users to gain access to auto loot, mounts and gliders. This auto loot will allow new users to make the much needed gold when starting out. The mount and glider will help newbies follow commanders when moving from fight to fight. It would be bad for the commander to have to go into a fight without his full force with him. That would probably be a good QoL feature to have.

Increase size and visibility of wvw entry button. Make it easier to choose which link to follow when on wvw map selection screen. Possibly get rid of eotm and consolidate wvw maps. Have a "jump into the battle" button. Have Newbie and experienced interfaces for joining maps. Similar to Team Fortress 2 one can click to auto find a server or find a server manually. Also remove small leave mist button and replace with bigger, more visible leave button. Servers are going away when Alliances drops. This mode is modeled after an RvR game, where multiple maps are in play 24/7. Removing maps will not be healthy for this mode.

Every few months we could have a different season which introduces a new map to the game. The players vote on which map they want. This will keep the gameplay fresh and fun. Look up “World Restructuring” so you can learn about what is coming.

Put in 15 man Guild vs Guild matchmaking system (with spectator mode). Guilds can schedule times to meet up within about the week. (similar to CEVO tournament system in CS:GO). An ELO ranking system is in place. A guild as well as a player can have stats (in game arc dps, will talk about later). The gvg system will go season to season. The system has the capability of being an esports. Although GvG's aren't the best for out of game spectators, usually experienced players will have fun watching the matches. GvG stuff falls more on to the Spvp side of the game. You should ask about it there.

Guild and personal stats: A system that shows damage, healing, cleanses and strips as well as other data, similar to arc dps, would help in matchmaking for GvG system. GvG stuff falls more on to the Spvp side of the game. You should ask about it there.

As the years have passed I feel that most players play for the fights, not necessarily the sieging that takes place. I offer the idea of making maps with less objectives to defend and attack and make for a terrain that allows for fights happening more often as well as making fights more exciting. Players are in wvw for multiple reasons, and wvw maps offer multiple ways to play. I don’t see issues with structures and siege for these RvR maps.

Red vs Blue server balance system (Alliance vs Horde example): The goal of this system is to keep maps populated and fights relatively fair. Servers (maguuma exp) will be split into either red team or blue team. Similar to our current repairing system, sides would be balanced every few weeks with a certain set of servers on each side. By having two sides instead of an array of servers within tiers, we can fill up maps more easily, especially in off hours (OCX, SEA, EU). This is done by having maps ordered from top the bottom, the top being the most populated map and the bottom being the least populated map. Instead of only having 2 servers to play against (within tier), you would have 6 servers to play against (plus smaller servers) for each side (red vs blue). This system would also has a reservation system to allow guilds access to populated maps during prime time. What this system would do would be similar to a restaurant, guilds can reserve a time on a populated map like a restaurant reservation. To stop guilds from making more reservations than they need, a penalty system should be in place to make sure guilds make it to their reserved time slot and actually use them. WvW was modeled after DAoC, which was a 3 sided Realm vs Realm vs Realm game. WvW will not be made into a 2 sided game mode. 2 sided modes also end up less “balanced” than 3 sides.

I have some more ideas for the game in general but these are just a few ideas I have for WvW.

I think it's extremely important to keep the game mode fresh and entertaining and I hope my ideas can help.

Contact me for questions and thoughts. Email is alistairsw@gmail.com

-awaken

Have a great one!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You know I dont even bother reading these types of posts.After 7 years of neglect, I do not expect anything from Anet!The old archived forum was full of suggestions, of which Anet took no heed.

I still play with my guild, if my guild still didnt play, I would not be playing this game.Simple as.But even our numbers have halved, and players continue to move on to other games slowly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The exotic gear from the WvW armorer and weaponsmith are in for an update, since they only have a very limited list of stats.
The different sets could all be replaced by a single set of weapons, armor and trinkets with selectable stats that can switch stats with a consumable, like Bloodstone trinkets and Mists trinkets.
Since stat-selectable gear now depends on owned content, it'll also encourage getting the expansion and living world chapters.Or it could be a new tab in the armorer, and keep the ones with fixed stats as a cheaper alternative.

Guild recruitment could also be improved by having a list of recruiting messages in a new tab the LFG panel.
Guilds would set themselves to recruit like this:

  • Go to Roster tab.
  • Click a new "Set recruitment message" button that would appear next to the Search/invite textboxt.
  • That opens a new small panel opens with 2 input boxes and 3 buttons (Start Recruiting, Stop Recruiting, and Cancel)
    1. Input recruitment message in the first box.
    2. In the second box, type a series of tags separated by commas. Under this second box there will be a list of suggested tags based on a word cloud generated by what tags players input first, plus a series of tags already set beforehand, like PvE, PvP, WvW, PvX, Newbie-friendly, Hardcore, Casual, Potato, etc. Basically like how Steam allows players to tag games. Clicking these suggested tabs will add them to the text box.
  • Click the 'Start Recruiting' button in the message, and the guild gets registered as recruiting.
  • To remove the recruitment message and stop recruiting, open the panel again and click "Stop recruitment".Then players could go to the guild panel and click in an empty guild slot, and there would be a large "Search for a guild" button after the Guild description message that appears in empty guild slots. When they click the button, that'll take them to the guild search tab in the LFG panel. They would also be able to open the LFG panel directly and switch to the guild tabOnce in the Guild LFG, they'll be able to search for guilds by typing a list of tags separated by commas in the search bar at the top. The search will also have a list of suggested tags, but collapsed so they don't get in the way of the list. Click a little arrow next to the search bar to expand the list of tags, click the tags to add them to the search, collapse the tag box, and press search, and the player gets a list of all guilds with those tags.
    It could also be possible to filter out tags by adding a minus sign - before the tag.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is my perspective on some of the suggestions that caught my attention. Keep in mind I'm not a game designer at Anet so I don't know how they do things over there, but I am a game designer by trade.

@awaken.2134 said:The first objective is to remove barriers to entry for new players. I believe that the first step should be to remove the equipment and level barrier for new players. Many new players have very low stats or all out glassy gear making them die very easily.

Removing barriers of entry is a great idea. However, that requires resources for user experience and user interface design in addition to potential engineering support. It will also require tutorializing and explaining the game mode and all the major aspects about it.

Add builds, guides, and videos (similar to metabattle) to the game interface. Players rate which builds/guides/videos are best (similar to Dota 2).

While this would be neat, it would incredibly expensive because anything having community run ratings means there has to be some form of moderation going on. That takes developer resources. I'm not saying it's a bad suggestion, but I am saying these things cost money. One major pain point I immediately noticed is the need to detect and mitigate review bombing and brigading.

You also made mention of video playback. That could be incredibly risky because the two immediate options off the top of my head would either have to link to external locations such as youtube (and if the video is removed or the site is down, your S.O.L) or store it on a server-which costs money and resources for server space and maintenance.

Games like Devil May Cry V can get away with doing this because the videos are stored locally on the machine. You can't cost-effectively do that in a live game unless it was designed for it from day one.

Have a guild recruitment list so new and experienced players can find guilds that suit their playstyle (similar to eve). New players get needed gameplay help. Experienced players find needed experienced fight guilds. Being in guilds/being in comms are also important in having a good experience in WvW.

A guild finder menu would be very cool, but I imagine there would have to be some level of developer moderation because posting messages means text. We all know how awful people can be on the internet if they think they can get away with it. I imagine a feature like this would be moderately expensive to work on, but this sounds like a really cool feature.

Built in VOIP (discord) similar to CS:GO or Dota 2. As said above, making it easier for people to be in comms makes for a more exciting experience in WvW. Their will of course be options to mute, kick and even ban people depending on if you're the commander, lieutenant, guild leader, etc.

That's very likely incredibly expensive to do for what is most likely a small subsection of a population. Built in VOIP requires pouring over other application documentation in addition to setting up the UI and audio to support it. Also, not everyone uses or even has a mic or wants to speak or even wants to hear other people.

Every few months we could have a different season which introduces a new map to the game. The players vote on which map they want. This will keep the gameplay fresh and fun.

Making a map is incredibly expensive. Introducing a new one each season (I'm assuming you're talking every 3 months) and you'd need a massive environment art, QA, and level design team. That's highly unlikely to happen given Anet's recent staffing changes and the fact that they're more likely to release PvE content over WvW content.

Put in 15 man Guild vs Guild matchmaking system (with spectator mode). Guilds can schedule times to meet up within about the week. (similar to CEVO tournament system in CS:GO). An ELO ranking system is in place. A guild as well as a player can have stats (in game arc dps, will talk about later). The gvg system will go season to season. The system has the capability of being an esports. Although GvG's aren't the best for out of game spectators, usually experienced players will have fun watching the matches.

GvG is structured PvP because you're suggesting allowing groups of players to organize and fight each other in what I assume to be mode specific maps. WvW is about three different groups vying for control of territory.

As for eSports capability, personally, I think it'd be a better use of resources to focus on making the game and state of pvp balance better before focusing on trying to make it an eSport. If you were around back in 2012, you'd recall the attempt at making PvP an eSport. It didn't go that well.

As the years have passed I feel that most players play for the fights, not necessarily the sieging that takes place. I offer the idea of making maps with less objectives to defend and attack and make for a terrain that allows for fights happening more often as well as making fights more exciting.

Red vs Blue server balance system (Alliance vs Horde example): The goal of this system is to keep maps populated and fights relatively fair. Servers (maguuma exp) will be split into either red team or blue team. Similar to our current repairing system, sides would be balanced every few weeks with a certain set of servers on each side. By having two sides instead of an array of servers within tiers, we can fill up maps more easily, especially in off hours (OCX, SEA, EU). This is done by having maps ordered from top the bottom, the top being the most populated map and the bottom being the least populated map. Instead of only having 2 servers to play against (within tier), you would have 6 servers to play against (plus smaller servers) for each side (red vs blue). This system would also has a reservation system to allow guilds access to populated maps during prime time. What this system would do would be similar to a restaurant, guilds can reserve a time on a populated map like a restaurant reservation. To stop guilds from making more reservations than they need, a penalty system should be in place to make sure guilds make it to their reserved time slot and actually use them.

This suggestion sounds expensive to an insane degree and effectively sounds like a complete redesign of an entire game mode.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@GDchiaScrub.3241 said:

@"Sovereign.1093" said:hire this guy

Lol, based on what? He just freely gave out his ideas. While it would be great to improve the new player experience (the "tutorials" have been lacking) much of these changes won't be practical in scope for the immediate future. We don't even have alliances...so I doubt ANET will get right on these.

D:

That's the thing.. this is more of what they should have done from the get-go.. not something to be implemented now (nor will it likely be done during alliances).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You have some great ideas here Awaken.

I agree with most ideas, though, Swagger, is correct on a few points (in game comms, 2 sided matchups instead of the 3 way matchups we have).In any PvP environment, it needs to stay fresh with constant changes. Most of your ideas would assist WvW in being more user friendly and potentially increasing traffic to the game mode.

I hope ANet hasn't decided it is too late to make changes and bring players back, because it really isn't.

As for GvG, I am all for it and have wanted structured GvG basically since the game came out. I agree this is more suited to sPvP than WvW. I would want to track stats, have an easy way to find teams, set wagers, use a simple build creation like sPvP has and have a matchmaking system that can pair teams across any server.

Many people have given up on ANet making changes, but those are the people accepting the game to remain as it is. People speaking out like this is important for the chance of change, if we don't do it, then it may never happen.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Sovereign.1093 said:hire this guy

Worst sort of GD hires are those who:1.) Propose ideas without giving regard to scope and feasibility. Just the built-in VOIP and 15-man GvG matchmaking alone will probably cost man-months of UI, client and server engineering.2.) Don't understand the reason behind previous design decisions. The level limit is not just because the WvW environment is a lot less forgiving to a player who isn't even familiar with the basic mechanics and navigation of the game and their own build. It's also to prevent abuse such as players from setting up new free accounts to spy on enemy worlds or use it to afk and clog enemy world queues.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some QoL sure but when you get past that what is described is not WvW. Yet people gobble it up and shower it with thumbs. This is why I fear for the future of WvW if Anet starts "listening" closer to the forums. But then again if alliances take 5 years, this will take 50+ years and I'll be too dead to care.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@awaken.2134 said:I believe that the first step should be to remove the equipment and level barrier for new playersWell, WvW was meant as endgame content after defeating Zhaitan and maybe a few dungeons. And this is what I strongly recomment to new players. To learn the Game Basics first before entering wvw, fractals or raids.Luring Level 2 Newbies with zero knowledge how to even control the game into WvW is not a good thing

Link to comment
Share on other sites

opinions of somebody who's run guilds and been server leadership and shit over the years; it's like late af though so it'll be ramble-y.

@awaken.2134 said:Add builds, guides, and videos (similar to metabattle) to the game interface. Players rate which builds/guides/videos are best (similar to Dota 2).

Kind of shotgunning, but re: the above, and the suggestion bits about voice in game, arc in game, etc: This is not an inherently bad kind of suggestion but I don't think it'd actually do a whole lot. Joining a discord is something that is like, really, really not hard. And if people really want to learn how to play (builds/guides/etc) they are likely the kind of person who is smart enough to like, reach out. Metabattle builds are a great source of information definitely, but they're only really useful to people who understand what's going on, ie: aren't new. For the people who need the ground level basics, pub commanders and guild recruitment are generally the way to go atm, as most servers to my knowledge have stopped doing general public training events outside of "raid with the pub tag and learn to not die from experience". To that end there's already systems in-game (wvw lfg) and out-game (discord @here) which people commonly use to communicate and rally. To short it, the kinds of people who would need a suggestion of putting things like metabattle builds, or voice (discord) into GW2 natively, are the kinds of people who likely wouldn't use those resources anyway.

I feel you in that WvW needs to be mindful of it's entry-experience and how it treats new players, but from training hundreds/thousands of new kids to the mode over the years, these are features which would not have helped me get people battle ready over that time period. Giving arc to a new player is like giving a gold/min chart to somebody who's in their first 10 games of LoL/DotA. They'll look at it, look back at you, and say "well I know this means things important, a better number is better, but that doesn't change that I don't know how to get there". And it's also not what you should want that player to be focusing on either at that point. They should be focusing on learning what their abilities do, how to not die, where the shop is, etc. Relating back to WvW, this is a whole lot of positioning and learning to value your own life, while learning to work as a team member willing to risk that life for the team. Aka: Learning how to position in a way which lets you support allies/bomb enemies, while not dying, and also being able to follow through on commander's calls to keep with the group and keep doing your job (while still not dying!). There are tricks to this which can be taught in guides, but a lot of where people actually figure this out, especially in 2019, is from learning via experience and feedback from veteran players around them. For people who have watched any WvW vids with commander comms, or maybe that Noody video of famous WvW people, they've probably heard the various styles commanders use to try and influence the players following them to be better. MOBAs need built-in systems to train new players because there's no real way for players to effectively teach each other in games, there's no time to set up voice to each other in a match, it's fast paced, it's action. WvW is not that. There is always time to reflect, to learn, and grow with other players around you. Leveraging the strengths of what makes MMOs unique is what makes them special, and it's what WvW has, that MOBAs don't.

@awaken.2134 said:Put in 15 man Guild vs Guild matchmaking system (with spectator mode).

The GvG scene is largely dead, again. EU has some going on I think, but most of the NA guilds have retired. It'd be like trying to matchmake LoL 5man groups but only allowing half of NA LCS teams to queue into it, it'd be THAT bad, if not worse. At that point, simply manually organizing scrims, is actually better for those players. This will likely be the case through to next spring, when Roy or somebody tries kicking up something again. If we can even manage that as a community, due to the constant shrinkage. At this point not only is the GvG guild scene dropping off (again), but normal WvW guilds are now dropping in fairly horrific numbers as well. Which is incredibly alarming and I'm hoping Arenanet's announcements this week towards WvW are them realizing just how in danger their mode is, and that they actually put in the effort to deal with it.

What the GvG community has wanted since 2012 is really simple: A reliable place to fight. Guild Hall uses PvE ruleset which means the balance is poo (it's also small). EotM/OS only work depending on your relative server colors. OS is actually amazing when you're in the same tier, and if Anet just plopped that arena into a space where it could be accessed for GvG openly across tiers/colors/etc, that's like, solid gold. That's all that's wanted. It has built in stands already for spectators to watch and doesn't have those stupid cannons/brush that the EotM normal fight spot has.

@awaken.2134 said:Guild and personal stats: A system that shows damage, healing, cleanses and strips as well as other data, similar to arc dps, would help in matchmaking for GvG system.

These kinds of stats mean largely nothing in a grand scheme. The WvW meta is stale af, but there's just enough build diversity to where (example) strips/damage can vary enough between necro builds, and (example2) healing vs boon application vary enough between guardian playstyles, where these stats can't cross over guild boundaries. Or even necessarily beyond specific rounds. When Fort Aspenwood and Crystal Desert fought each other by bringing everybody they could find on their respective servers who cared to scrim into EotM for a few hours, they changed builds between rounds. To adjust strips v damage, heals v boons, etc, to better suit their needs for that fight. Different guilds will have different start points in this way, with different guilds valuing different things more, depending on what they feel they need. So there's no real good benchmark to try to cross-compare over time. LoL/etc get away with it because builds are all within the game and effectively comparable. you can't choose Ezreal's abilities. He's just always a girl. How you use those abilities gives you better/worse performance. Not only do builds influence heavily what you're doing and to what numbers, but it's also worth noting that WvW is so much more of an...'army' style than a MOBA like LoL/DotA, that individual stats don't always matter to a victory. Aka, while we praise battle heroes of war for sometimes heroic efforts, it's not one guy shooting a billion dudes that wins a fight, its how well his unit actually worked to accomplish their goals through teamwork. And teamwork is not something that shows in stats. If people worked enough as a team to not stand in enemy bombs, do you penalize them by judging their cleanses as inferior to the group which ate that shit and had to cleanse it off? Am I a worse scrapper than somebody running the meme mortar build because he had 6x the cleanses I did, even though that build depends upon not having key functionality (stealth) expected of scrapper in the current meta, which does not graph at all in a way which matters? Ezreal always shoots the same laser bolt, and while it's purpose can change he's always doing the same tasks, to the same ends, thus playing him can be rated against how effective others were at the tasks that are Ezreal. That's not how GW2 works, and it's not how WvW works.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...