The No Pain, No Gain mistlock instability — Guild Wars 2 Forums

The No Pain, No Gain mistlock instability

Hi, i am a renegade main from the EU high-end fractal guild "Discretize"

I lose any desire to do a fractal run if i see either of the Challenge mode fractals (Nightmare 99 and Shattered observatory 100) with No pain no gain because having to play Mallyx to strip the boons (which is the optimal way to do it if you still want to have good individual boss and fractal clear times) denies you from playing the build to it's full potential and locks you into being just an alacrity and soulcleave bot which is soul-crushing for anyone that loves the build.

Currently No Pain No Gain grants any enemy you hit 10 stacks of Might, Protection and Fury for 20 seconds, meaning they will permanently have all three unless you corrupt, or strip them. the biggest obstruction to getting a good kill time with this instability is of course the Protection, which HAS to be stripped in a power-based composition.
Stripping boons with this instability active will grant you a pathetic amount of lifesteal and damage that is almost completely insignificant.
Currently the best ways of dealing with No Pain No Gain in the meta (Quickness firebrand, Alacrity renegade, Banner Berserker, Soulbeast and Weaver) composition are in order:

1) Making the Alacrity renegade swap one of his legends to Mallyx and using Banish enchantment every 20 seconds
2) Swapping out the Weaver for a power Reaper that strips the boons with the 4th greatsword ability (Nightfall) and with Well of Corruption
3) Having the Banner Berserker swap to Banner Spellbreaker that strips boons with Crowd control and dagger skills (this option is placed below 1 and 2 because of how powerful berserker is, dealing almost as much damage as the DPS builds)

My suggestions for this instability:

a) Replace the protection in the list of boons with another like Quickness or Resistance
b) Make the instability true to it's name and add a real "gain" after the pain such as "you deal 5% more damage against boonless foes"
c) Remove it.
I look forward to reading suggestions and thoughts from others about this mistlock instability
Thank you for reading

Comments

  • @ASY.6082 said:
    "I like playing my class a certain way and this mechanics stops me from doing so, pls remove" -Rubby

    i know right

  • agree mister rubby

    minecrafter

  • Yeah it really is unlucky that players have to do sth else than repeating same rota over and over on each phase, but fotm is basically player vs instabilities mode in 2019 so that's how it's doomed to be sometimes.

    Also replacing protection with resistance would be like the worst thing anet could do about it, imagine all the poor condi people...

  • Nephalem.8921Nephalem.8921 Member ✭✭✭

    The ones having no problem with the instability are either not playing ren or the type of player that only auto attacks on ren anyways. Npng reduces ren to a boonstrip bot but this happens aswell when ressistance is needed. Mallyx is simply not a fun to use legend. Everything costs tons of energy on mallyx and since ren needs that even for weaponskills all he can do is aa while using that.
    At least npng only ruins rens gameplay experience. Social awkwardness ruins everyones day. Always so much fun when people get pushed in the dmg zone on ensyl or snowblind, or chaos or thaumanova, or sirens reef, or... The problem is that the current fractal team can only test them with 1-2 healers in t1 so they dont know how much cancer they become with multiple of the cancer league instabs without a healer.
    Again, you dont play around npng. You force the ren to be a boonstrip bot and do no dps in the process. It doesn't affect the other 4players at all.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Nephalem.8921 said:
    snip

    So, don't use ren for strips?

    The issue is not with NPNG, but rather with how the renegade class is designed. Not all content can and should be design around the 1 class which is a total outlier in design.

  • Taygus.4571Taygus.4571 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 27, 2019

    Get a reaper dps to boon strip. solved.

    You don't have to have a meta party for fast fractals. Especially if you dont want to have to adapt your role for different instabilities.

  • There's a bunch of instabs that ruin people's day, but what else can anet do to make content in which bosses do 0 dmg "challenging"? Let's add some passive condis, debuffs or stuff like social awkwardness!

    One might say that actually removing instabilities and increasing bosses damage would eventually turn 2019 fotm from meme into actual content, BUT that'd mean people would have to use dodge button from time to time, so it can't be! Imagine all the times people would have to interrupt their rotation, but most importantly the moment when they would realise that you can't take a healer into t4 and afk outheal everything anymore. Also that would mean reddit would change from "pls easy mode raid" into "pls i cant do t3 but I deserve loot". So you know anet would have to make t4 difficulty back into t2 one, then add new world boss, 10min of ls episode and throw us some fancy bl ticket weapon skin and 2 new outfits. And ofc buff guard.

    Rip good times when you could go into fotm and actually have fun playing vs bosses, not vs afflicted+toxic trial or w/e else u rng, and some random trashmob labeled "legendary" or w/e running around you that hits u for 10% hp or so.

  • Glider.5792Glider.5792 Member ✭✭✭

    Meanwhile to me, this is one of fav instabs, just cause it forces your to change the build :shrug:

    I miss my Spb...

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeFWMeskOJhk8N-SvOFCJXA
    Fractal speed kills, raids, Black Lion Chest Openings, random.

  • Asum.4960Asum.4960 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I have to say I don't enjoy Alacrigade all that much in general, but personally actually feel like it's more fun with NPNG, as it makes me feel like I'm are having more of an impact besides just breaking breakbars and pressing that Alacrity button.

    But in general, as a FB "main", I enjoy things that make me switch up the way I play between different Fractals, Instabilities or bosses, or at least I did when we had proper Templates. It keeps things fresh and interesting, as well as feeling rewarding for putting that extra thought and effort into it.

    The Instabilities I don't like are the ones for which you don't have to adjust anything since they just serve as a minor annoyance, have no impact at all, or at worst lack any counter play anyway.

    NPNG imo is one of the few good ones.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • Hex.2579Hex.2579 Member ✭✭✭

    First world problem.
    This is actually one of my favorite instabilities because people have to adjust to deal with it.
    No pain no gain, right? You gain fractal clear time, you have to deal with the pain.
    And as far as the other classes in your comp, yours is the only one makes more sense to change even if it locks you in a playstyle you don't want to play.
    The whole 'ooh it takes a bit to deal with this instability, I don't like that, remove it' vibe is a bit much.

  • Lottie.5370Lottie.5370 Member ✭✭✭

    I agree completely, I hate being locked into Mallyx because of this instability.

    I have a slightly different idea, a bit similar to Boon Overload - instead of Protection apply Quickness or Alacrity (so it applies just offensive boons), and increase the might stacks to 25, but have your party deal 5% more damage for each boon on the enemy (or simply a flat 5% if the enemy has a boon). This makes the enemies deal more damage, which can either be stripped if the party is struggling with incoming damage, or be rewarding for players that are able to deal with it.

  • Resistance

    So enemy will resist 25 stacks of vulnerability and you wont get soft CC from conditions AND a bit of damage from conditions.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭

    I also play rene in cms+t4. Don't see any problem.
    also in my part always 1+ necro. Why someone think what in meta non exist necro this not my issue.
    Solution: less read "meta webs" + more play.

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lottie.5370 said:
    I agree completely, I hate being locked into Mallyx because of this instability.

    I have a slightly different idea, a bit similar to Boon Overload - instead of Protection apply Quickness or Alacrity (so it applies just offensive boons), and increase the might stacks to 25, but have your party deal 5% more damage for each boon on the enemy (or simply a flat 5% if the enemy has a boon). This makes the enemies deal more damage, which can either be stripped if the party is struggling with incoming damage, or be rewarding for players that are able to deal with it.

    most instabs are about: if u play around instab u get some benefit from it. ur solution gives - if u ignore instab u can kill faster which is kinda bad imo.
    so u could for example change npng to "Might, fury, (anything except retal or prot). Enemy receives x % increased incoming damage for y seconds, for each boon stripped." all new cancer fractals would become bearable during npng

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • ZeftheWicked.3076ZeftheWicked.3076 Member ✭✭✭✭

    That horrible to just grab a necro into your party? The grand meta overlord will come and rain fire and brimstone onto your kitten for having a necro in your party?

  • It does feels very unrewarding to play Renegade and having to take Mallyx just to deal with NPNG only to gain basically nothing when the boons do get stripped. Even though you could deal with it by bringing a Necro or Spb, it feels as though that hinders optimal fractal setup/DPS without much reward just to deal with this instability.

    As people have mentioned above, well-designed instabilities can pose a threat while making the player feel rewarded at the same time. Boon Overload is a great example of this as it increases incoming damage but also lets supports take way less boon duration gear. Along those lines then, some changes off the top of my head could be:

    • No Pain No Gain: enemies receive might, fury, protection periodically; stripping a boon increases the enemy's damage taken by 3% per boon
    • We Bleed Fire: enemies create flaming missiles periodically; evading/blocking a missile reduces incoming damage by 30% for 10 seconds
©2010–2018 ArenaNet, LLC. All rights reserved. Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2, Heart of Thorns, Guild Wars 2: Path of Fire, ArenaNet, NCSOFT, the Interlocking NC Logo, and all associated logos and designs are trademarks or registered trademarks of NCSOFT Corporation. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.