Official Feedback Thread about Build and Equipment Templates - Page 11 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Official Feedback Thread about Build and Equipment Templates

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  • As far as I'm concerned cost is one of the worst things about this system. The unlocks should be account wide. With the amount of alts people have, the cost is way too high with the existing implementation. Builds are not the same as bag storage. While the equipment tab is convenient, it wasn't really expected since most people have lots of bag storage so you're not really giving value there. That would go a long way to appease the hardcore players.

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @patrickmaciel.1876 said:

    @Stephane Lo Presti.7258 said:
    We want to acknowledge that we are reading the feedback expressed in this thread and the other forums threads about the Build and Equipment Templates. We are discussing this feedback internally to determine how we can address it.

    Thanks for the answer. We hope ANET could be more close to the community and listen us more frequently. We need you and you need us. We need to be partners not enemies.

    About that build template:
    I hope you guys release this feature for free, with a normal limitation, example: 10 equipment/set build + 10 skills/traits build per character for free.
    if you want more than 10, than you pay.

    Im ok with pay IF I PAID FOR AN REALLY EXTRA feature, example: its normal to have 20 equipament builds? NOPE, its not. So if you want to be that crazy, pay for that. But have 10 builds its super normal. Everything that is "normal" it has to be free.

    10 builds per character is a decent amount, because we have PVE, PVP and WvW. Most of us have minimum 3 builds for each mode. MINIMUM.
    The bests scenario is: 10 builds for each mode: 10 for pvp, 10 for pve, 10 for WvW. THIS IS REALLY WORKS.

    When I say "build" I mean equipment/set + skills/traits. So... equipment set + skill/trait build.

    Sorry for my terrible english.

    That sounds like a super insane amount to me and 5+ builds further than "normal". I have lots of gear in the bank or on characters but having more than a couple "active" builds pre-templates was rare. Hell on some characters I have a single build, because it's for a single purpose (such as having a p/p DE for pewpewing open world PvE - if I feel like going into WvW with a thief... I have another set up for that). Having 30 builds in total and taking into account you mean gear AND build is just straight up bonkers level of commitment to different builds. I mean I'm sure some people still have that for some reason, but I would not consider it "super normal".

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • YMIHere.9580YMIHere.9580 Member ✭✭
    edited November 2, 2019

    It's far too expensive. People don't like the amount of templates that are available to buy, but they are still pointing out how expensive it is using this limited number of templates. As far as the design I like it. I don't have legendaries though, so I'm a little out of my depth on this "runes/sigils popping out" issue. Seems like you could just leave them in the last equipped item/setting if they become unlinked.

  • Simo.6819Simo.6819 Member ✭✭
    edited November 3, 2019

    So , my feedback is kinda confused, switches very quick between builds or gear sets , with both ascended or leggy sets, too bad , whenever you want to play another class with that leggy armor set, you gotta remove it from previous character template in order to deposit the leggy armor in bank, and all the template is gone

    Kebab [Kill] - WSR

  • All in all, glad to have more versatility, and inventory space. I understand all the angry folks, but it strikes me as quite similar to the levels of hype whenever new stuff drops, so...grain of salt. My thoughts:

    • Templates should be manually saved and loaded, not autosave at the literal drop of a hat. Like the name implies.
    • Gear and Build templates should be linked. If I'm swapping gear, I'm swapping skills.
    • Templates should auto swap for WvW and PvP. These slots should also be free.
    • Legendary gear should allow different skins, runes, and sigils in different slots. Legendary gear wasn't "nerfed", but it is less functional than Ascended right now.
    • Per character unlocks are dumb lol. I already wasted my free slot because I didn't expect this level of shill for 500 gems.

    Anywho. Thanks for getting these out. Hopefully we can talk more, as community and devs. I think most angry players just want to be heard.

  • Klypto.1703Klypto.1703 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 3, 2019

    Reminds me with the second class choice and not tied to weapon skills I had over 1500 assassin builds saved in the original game. Along with the pigeon holing with how elite specs work making it where usually one non-elite spec and the elite spec are mandatory so besides the current problems with the build templates. You've also got it where anet has screwed themselves over in a thousand directions on if they were determined to make money off this they had already failed in doing so where most builds are just copies over another build with one difference in the trait options. So I can see why O'brien left along with the greed with this template system it also goes against the very brand of Anet to play as you want more so on the way weapons work there really isn't any build diversity you know exactly what abilities your enemy has just by knowing what class they are elite spec doesn't really matter it just makes it easier to identify. So this template system just magnifies how badly the game has been managed and the balance is practically non-existent. So I hope you are listening you create a game that goes from over 1500 options for a single class down to practically 1 and you wonder why people quit over balance and such.

    Edit: I hope they are doing something that is going to completely amaze me in the near future because as of the past 12 months a gear grinding mmorpg seems more fun. Might have to start calling this game Depression Wars 2.

  • I'm assuming that Anet will not change anything about the template system - not for a while anyway. So what we need is a way to make the best of what we have.
    Having played with templates now I'm finding what I need more than anything else is a way to organise build and equipment templates properly - a way to bring them together to make changing a simple one click or one key event. One way to do this is to have an organiser UI: I'm going to call it the Loadout Menu to make it easy to refer to. It needs to be something easy to use like a drop down list of Loadouts (each capable of having a hotkey).

    Players would assign the following:

    • User Defined Name - so you know what the Loadout is for
    • Character - to apply the Loadout to
    • Build - which of the character build templates you want to use
    • Equipment - which of the character equipment templates you want to use
    • Default - selectable PvE, WvW, or PvP field. Setting this loads this Loadout when the character enters this game mode. If no default is set for a game mode, the current Loadout is used.

    To use it, either:
    1. call up the Loadout menu (single key press) and select the dropdown Loadout you want for your character. The UI should put current character Loadouts at the top of the list, sorted by used defined name.
    2. press the hotkey for the Loadout you want to apply. This would be quicker but relies on remembering what you have assigned to each hotkey.

    Since Loadouts simply link existing things (character, build template number, equipment template number, game mode) they can be stored locally and therefore can be free and unlimited in number.

    TLDR - this idea provides the following benefits with minimal change to the existing structure:

    • Defaults for specific game modes
    • Links build and equipment templates
    • Single hotkey swapping
    • Helps players organise their options for builds and equipment in an easy to use way.
  • Cuks.8241Cuks.8241 Member ✭✭✭
    1. Why 2 separate systems for build templates? It just seems weird. One, account wide system would do the job just fine. Sorted by profession - only logged profession builds available.
    2. Three free builds per character and some account wide is just not enough. It's not even an improvement to what we had with builds for WvW, PVE and PVP just different. Build is just a short string of text that can be stored locally. You already have the system in place. Build templates should encourage people to try new builds, make more gear sets, make game more enjoyable. Now it feels like you purposely complicated the system so you can monetize it. Monetize gear templates, those are OK as they are new storage space and something new. Build templates should be limitless, easy to use and dirt cheap or free. Now they are none of that.
    3. Gear templates are OK for me. But I don't share gear between characters, don't know how that works.
  • NeroBoron.7285NeroBoron.7285 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 3, 2019

    Finally Build Templates! Sadly a little bit dissapointing :(

    The great thing we can finally load and share builds easily :)

    Let's come to the why it's a big dissapointment for me:
    A.) I have to load my correct game mode build manually now when I switch between wvw and pve
    B.) Build Template Tabs are totally unnecessary, just use Build Storage instead like in GW1 and load everytime from that menu. Why? You don't have to remember which number which build is or mouse over it for the name. Further a Build Template Tab Slot costs 300 Gems and is charackter bound, and a pack of 3 Build Storage Slots costs 500 Gems and is account bound. I don't see any benefit of using the Build Template Slots. It just makes it unnecessary complicated. Just remove it and give everyone 3 Build Storage Slots per Charakter for free. And of course lift the limitation of 24? build storage slots.
    C.) Equipment Templates ... hmm I don't know, well it's a great idea that it takes lesser inventory space, but I just don't like the Tab System specially there are way to few Tabs and unintuitive to use with the numbers, can't be searched etc... Specially when i have only slightly different gear for two different builds like another weapon and two other trinkets I won't spend that valuable slot for it. Just use the existing slot and swap it manually every time. So basically i would use a slot for healer equipment, for moderate power equipment, for full berserker equipment, for a condi equipment and for a hybrid equipment etc only. That feels kinda kitten. An equipment storage would be more helpful for me where i can store all slightly modified versions.

    So currently i only use equipment slot 1 for wvw and slot 2 for pve. I don't use build template tabs at all. I just use the build storage and load everything from there (Have to mention that i currently only store the templates of 1 char there)

  • Equipment template links (chat codes)
    Build Links for posting traits & skills are great but only half of a build.
    I'm trying to suggest a similar method to convey the other gear related half of the build to other players for information purposes only.
    The equipment template link should include:
    - weapon types with sigils for the two weapon sets
    - used runes
    - points invested in the different basic stats from power to concentration (not derived stats like health, armor etc.)
    -- since different stats are often chosen for the individual weapon sets this should be reflected. So maybe the stat points should be listed separately for weapon set one, weapon set two and the rest (armor and trinkets)
    Note: Aquatic items could be excluded from this since under water combat is nearly irrelevant at the moment. Also Agony Resistance doesn't need to be listed as it is determined by the fractal level.

  • patrickmaciel.1876patrickmaciel.1876 Member ✭✭
    edited November 3, 2019

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    Sorry for my terrible english.

    That sounds like a super insane amount to me and 5+ builds further than "normal". I have lots of gear in the bank or on characters but having more than a couple "active" builds pre-templates was rare. Hell on some characters I have a single build, because it's for a single purpose (such as having a p/p DE for pewpewing open world PvE - if I feel like going into WvW with a thief... I have another set up for that). Having 30 builds in total and taking into account you mean gear AND build is just straight up bonkers level of commitment to different builds. I mean I'm sure some people still have that for some reason, but I would not consider it "super normal".

    Look, I have my main ranger:

    PVE:

    • open world solo: 1 set, 1 build
    • meta event: 1 set, 1 build
    • open world training/guide/farming (champs, etc): 1 set, 1 build

    Fractal

    • condi duration: 1 set, 1 build
    • dps: 1 set, 1 build
    • healer/toughness/hydrid: 1 set, 1 build

    RAID

    • condi duration: 1 set, 1 build
    • dps: 1 set, 1 build
    • healer/toughness/hydrid: 1 set, 1 build

    WvW

    • roaming > condi x zerk: 1 set, 1 build
    • roaming > zerk: 1 set, 1 build
    • roaming > survival: 1 set, 1 build
    • zerg front: 1 set, 1 build
    • zerg middle: 1 set, 1 build

    14 sets, 14 builds.

    Calm down, I will explain: In my real situation I have only 8 sets, not 14. Why? Because its impossible to carry all the sets, so I need to keep back to bank to swap everytime = thats boring and stressfull.

    "Oh Patrick, why you not share equipment?" = Because the runes and sigils are different and for differente purposes. Its impossible use same set condi, for fractal, raid, open world, solo, etc. For every situation, you have a different set, rune, sigil and build. And Im not a hardcore player Im very casual, but use the same build is terrible for a good experience (in my opinion of course).

    And if I have 1 character for each type of build/game mode? (like I really have). Forget the main characeter, my main do everything in the game of course, lets talk about single purpouse characters:

    Soulbeast condition

    PVE:

    • open world solo: 1 set, 1 build
    • meta event: 1 set, 1 build
    • open world training/guide/farming (champs, etc): 1 set, 1 build

    Fractal

    • condi duration: 1 set, 1 build
    • condi survival/hybrid: 1 set, 1 build (like if you need more dps or my vitality)

    RAID

    • condi duration: 1 set, 1 build
    • condi survival/hybrid: 1 set, 1 build (like if you need more dps or my vitality)

    WvW

    • roaming > condi x dps: 1 set, 1 build
    • roaming > full condi: 1 set, 1 build
    • roaming > survival: 1 set, 1 build
    • zerg front: 1 set, 1 build
    • zerg middle: 1 set, 1 build

    12 sets, 12 builds

    This, for one type of "set", like: condition, zerk, healer, etc. I have this character that is focused only on condition (a soulbeast pure condition), and even focusing only on that, it still varies the equipment depending on the situation.

    I like to play that way because the gameplay never feel the same for me.
    Playing using the same set, same rune, same sigil, same skills and same traits is boring and you will get tired in a short time (my opinion).

    So I never play in the same way. Every situation, game, mode, boss, etc, have a different set.


    Other situation: BALANCE PATCH. When balance happens, set's change, build change, everthing change. In the first moment I cant destroy all my stuffs, I need to keep the same set and build and test the "new build with the balance patch".

  • The funny part about equipment templates is that if you want to switch between weapons in a build for different scenarios you have three options.

    • Either have an equipment template for each weapon loadlout, which is kinda silly.
    • Open equipment template each time you want to switch weapons if they're linked between templates, which for legendaries means selecting stats, sigils and infusions.
    • Have tons of weapons in your inventory, that can't be legendary, due to stat and sigil issue. And swap from inventory.

    All of these defeat the gains that were described we gain with templates which are inventory space and convenience.

  • you know the other issue I have is the fact that you are all set to sell another 4 build slots as soon as it suits you and even when found out there is complete silence. Just another tactic for another money grab down the line when people get frustrated enough to buy.

  • well well, Anet how about making purchases account wide ? 2900 gem is still cool for you and guess what? I might be buying more slots if you add them too. Think about it. This is a great offer patch the game if you accept it ty take care.

  • ItWasntMe.7102ItWasntMe.7102 Member
    edited November 3, 2019

    bug that spits out all of my sigils & infusions with 2nd slot weapon in the (2nd) storage tab is not useful.

  • @patrickmaciel.1876 said:
    Other situation: BALANCE PATCH. When balance happens, set's change, build change, everthing change. In the first moment I cant destroy all my stuffs, I need to keep the same set and build and test the "new build with the balance patch".

    This is a really great point - following skill/balance updates there is really a ton of theorycrafting and trying out of new builds. One of the best part of GW1 templates was that you really could work on crafting whole team compositions, checking the synergy, tweaking some builds and retesting ad nauseum and then start from that point easily on the next balance update. While GW2 isn't as reliant on the team comp, the current setup for these build/skill templates feels very limiting, even just to experiment with builds to kitten around with.

    I don't mind spending some amount for large chunks of template slots (which should really include both build+skills) - say 25-30 a purchase of 300-500 gems or so? - since this is primarily a QoL upgrade. That's about what I would expect to need for1 character/class across game modes.

    I haven't had much time to play with the template system as it currently is, but overall it feels rather clunky and unintuitive. I keep overwriting things that I don't mean to, and most builds are very equipment-dependent as well. I don't personally see the value in having 2 separate types (build/skills and equipment).

  • Nick.5276Nick.5276 Member ✭✭

    One marketing tactic is to implement the worst possible option so that when you implement the "Improved" one customers feel relief and maybe even generosity towards you.
    Lets hope GW2 developers are not going to settle for something so underhanded.

  • Gopaka.7839Gopaka.7839 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 4, 2019

    1.Being able to put different skins/dyes on legendary armor set on multiple equipment templates.
    2.Being able to use legendary on more than one character.
    3. Being able to use one keybind to swap both equipment and build template that work as one at once.

    For the first point. It's fashion wars and it's legendary. At this point I don't feel my legendary armor legendary anymore. The system is forcing me to put ascended set to the other equipment tabs if I want to swap the look like the normal people using ascended only, but if I do so then legendary == ascended.

    For the second point. By putting legendary armor/weapon/trinket in the equipment template of a character, I bind it to this character. If I remove it from that character and transfer it to another, like I used to do, I'll break my build using that armor/weapon/trinket. If the system is sucking my legendary items in the "cloud", why not being able to get them used by another character?

    For the third point it's simple... 6 equpment templates + 6 build templates == 12 keybinds. Having an option to put equipment and build templates work together can lower the keybinds from 6 to 12, and the clicking of keys from 2-4 to 1-2.

    Extra Point 4. Put two extra equipment and build templates for WvW and PvP so we can have what has been stolen from us.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Not sure if this is intended or not. When switching builds between my Weaver and Tempest and then back again, the Weaver build doesn't remember which attunements were previously selected. Seems to take whatever the Tempest was last using. I don't see this type of issue with swapping between my Ranger/Druid with regard to the selected pets.

    So, it would be nice when swapping back to my Weaver that the attunements remained what they were prior to swapping to another build.

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • @StrYdeR.2459 said:
    My biggest problem is that ANet had an "ACTUAL TEMPLATE" of what the community was expecting as a"bare minimum" of build templates if they were to look at the DeltaConnected developed solution (ARC Templates).

    I think an Actual Template would be, at the bare minimum, something deliberately saved as a template, as a "saved configuration." Kind of like a backup. And on load, if all the stuff was in inventory, that would be what was loaded. It would not care what your current build looked like or what changes had been made. What you saved is what you saved.

    Create an Armory
    Each paid account would receive for free a 20 slot Armory - expandable to something like 200 slots via gems at a rate equivalent to bag slot expansion (3-400 gems / 20 slots). This Armory would be the basis for equipment storage, and the means to monetize a portion of the templates. Armory expansion would be the ONLY portion of templates monetized, as it effectually shared storage. The Armory would be account wide storage, and allow for easy sharing of equipment, infusions, runes, etc. between characters
    Each piece of equipment, rune, sigil, infusion, etc. when equipped would have an option (via a check-box that you could default to on or off) to be returned to the armory when unequipped. Each equipped item would be able to be edited in the hero panel to change your preference on where the item goes - for example if you change your mind and want your equipped sword to stay in your inventory rather than returning to the armory as you initially selected - you would drill into the item and un-tick the "return to armory" box. Equipment, et al. that is unequipped without being flagged as "return to armory" would be moved to that characters inventory when unequipped.

    I think this is a great idea. 20 slots should be enough to hold an entire set of gear.
    I would modify it slightly: Just as we use the bank to hold additional stuff we don't carry with us all the time, the bank could hold extra Armories we don't currently carry (perhaps it's a set for that one configuration you almost never play). I think the slot limit could be modified for holding Armories (as some people mentioned, some characters have 12 separate builds). Perhaps they could be named by the player (WvW Condi, Raids Condi, Open World Power, etc).
    Perhaps an "unequip all to empty armory" would be a good addition, too.

    Release an Actual Build Template System
    Builds in GW2 are complex, in that a build involve traits, equipment c/w runes, sigils & infusions, and skills. Each of these forms an interlocking part of an actual build - so why separate them?

    If a build was loaded that required equipment, the first equipment pass would look in the characters inventory. The second pass would look in the armory. If the equipment was not found in either - the user would be notified that part of their builds "equipment (XX) could not be located." Honestly - this is a problem for the user to solve - as it isn't up to ANet to manage where the player puts their stuff.

    Absolutely agreed.

  • @KablamoBoom.5938 said:
    All in all, glad to have more versatility, and inventory space. I understand all the angry folks, but it strikes me as quite similar to the levels of hype whenever new stuff drops, so...grain of salt. My thoughts:

    • Templates should be manually saved and loaded, not autosave at the literal drop of a hat. Like the name implies.

    Correct. That's one reason I'm perturbed. What was promised (templates) is not what was delivered (current loadout = "template").
    Not so much salt as a grain, though. Many people have very valid complaints. The system as delivered bollixed up a lot of stuff.

    Hopefully we can talk more, as community and devs. I think most angry players just want to be heard.

    Heard and heeded. Not just heard.
    A-net got to where it's gotten by heeding the voices of its customers, the players. We (I think most of us voicing our opinions on this matter) would like them to continue that tradition.

  • neoteo.3975neoteo.3975 Member ✭✭
    edited November 5, 2019

    Took me a while to understand there are tabs for skills and tabs for equipment, but after i set up the short cut keys, I'm in love with this new free feature, thank you very much.

  • arielwind.8921arielwind.8921 Member ✭✭✭

    @neoteo.3975 said:
    Took me a while to understand there are tabs for skills and tabs for equipment, but after i set up the short cut keys, I'm in love with this new free feature, thank you very much.

    I agree. I'm kinda glad ArenaNet did ban third-party template and has native one. It works pretty well for me, except Revenant since switching template removes previous utility skill location. I've never thought Gw2 even needed templates while this 7 years though.

  • I will preface this to say I've never used build templates or ArcDPS. I'm one of those characters that currently just plays one build, though I'm sure that will change in the future. I came back to GW2 after being incredibly disappointed with Fallout 76. Watching Bethesda destroy that game one update at a time has been honestly sad. But let's look at what ANet has done. You allowed players to use a free system to switch templates which worked well, and despite massive amounts of negative feedback implemented your own heavily monetized system with less functionality. I mean, why do you need any more feedback to ignore? What did you seriously think would happen? I am so sick of gaming companies giving into greed, then when there is a huge outcry they kitten out some generic apology but still don't change anything. You did this because you wanted to make money, and I seriously hope no one buys into this. I've met and talked with many dedicated players who have no issues with spending money on this game.. much more than I ever will. They deserve better treatment than this. Another thing that always left a bad taste in my mouth is the Living World content moneygate. I preordered GW2 and installed it on the first day it released. But somehow, I now have to pay for content that was released during a time period I did not play just because I didn't log in once every few months. How do you defend that? I mean I could justify that if you were only charging newer players for that content, players who didn't pay $60 for the retail release. And is it some coincidence that these locked out maps have some of the best farming in the game? We aren't stupid. Quit treating us that way.

  • My feedback is more about the concequences of Build Templates.
    I doubt it's just me, but since the introduction of Build Templates, my loading screens have become much slower. It takes forever to load in maps.
    It could offcourse have different reasons, but I suspect the extra storage being transfered to the map you're going to, is the cause.

  • Balthazzarr.1349Balthazzarr.1349 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I do enjoy the new template system to a point. I wish the gear and specializations were linked though. Also, I will NOT pay for extra slots. I agree that the cost of these is simply TOO MUCH. This really means something coming from a person who buys too many things in this game just because I like “shinies”. This shiny simply isn’t worth the gems.

    Just another WvW lifer who'll never say die... while dying again and again!

  • My 2c:

    1. Please allow equipment and build templates to be linked together. These two are often intrinsically connected; for example, I have a 'template' for thief daredevil which uses staff and has the daredevil trait-line. I have another 'template' which is deadeye. Each of these 'templates' comprised of an equipment and build template, and the way you've done this I have to switch both templates to effectively get my meta-template. Yes, there are hotkeys and yes it's not a deal-breaker but it's also an arbitrary split that just creates confusion and extra clicks. A single template combining both equipment and traits would have achieved everything you've got now and with less confusion. I don't expect a drastic change, just an extra option to link the two.

    2. Please allow an outfit to be assigned to an equipment template. For example, I have a daredevil template and the mage knight outfit would go great with it. It'd be so nice if switching to this template automatically turned on the outfit. This would be a great boon to role-playing.

  • Gah!!! I knew this would be a bad idea. Please fix the autosaving of skill bars into templates. Anytime I tweak a skill I lose my build template. Anytime I swap a weapon out, I lose my equipment template. That means the first "template" slot is not a template at all, just a reflection of your bar. It makes no sense. You don't need to add a save buttons or change your ui or anything, just disconnect the autosave from skill bar and template.

    PLEASE!

  • Amon.5042Amon.5042 Member
    edited November 6, 2019

    Would be much better in terms of pricing for all template/loadout packages to be account bound, not character bound.

  • Alin.2468Alin.2468 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 6, 2019

    Anet, you forgot to put outfits in loadouts, so that each loadout would have different outfit if possible. I really want outfits included in loadouts (aka equipment templates), and I am willing to pay whatever it takes for each unlocked outfit in each equipment template. I know you want this too, Anet. Please add this into game.

    One man's trash is another man's treasure.

  • I missed templates since the very release of GW2. I valued them in GW1 very much and I used them often. I was very happy to see them implemented in GW2 - finally a strong argument to come back to GW2 after a long pause.
    Due to the utterly overpriced template system, I feel I am overcharged, might even call it ripped off, for a thing I consider absolutely basic. This alienated me and made me abstain from even considering to come back. At release, I might even bought it, since I had years to use it. But buying now? For only a few months to use until I pause again? No. It has a price that is not justified, not even a little.

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