Official Feedback Thread about Build and Equipment Templates - Page 18 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Official Feedback Thread about Build and Equipment Templates

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  • Klypto.1703Klypto.1703 Member ✭✭✭

    My two biggest problems with this is first that if you like to play rev if you switch builds its like a puzzle re-arranging every single skill where it is supposed to be in the build template. Then after that hoping and praying that when you press the button that it is actually the skill that is being shown. So this system for playing rev is like gambling at the roulette table when you try to use a skill. Then also wierd kitten happens if you need to switch legendary pieces out because it may show you have infusions but then not actually have any at all and have to go find out exactly where these infusions are located if you play a lot of different characters.

    So overall I had become bored with the game but then this build system made it entirely too frustrating to even bother with this game anymore. I would love to know whose great idea it was to say hey lets make it where it automatically strips every upgrade out of your legendary items and play hide and seek with them. So I guess the bigger picture here is that they want players to stop spending money on legendary items and replace them back with ascended(great job anet but I am kind of too annoyed to do that).

  • @Rubi Bayer.8493 said:
    Hi all, I have some more news for you. Like I mentioned in last week's post, we had a list of updates we felt confident we could start working on and planned to give you an update on that list early in the new year. That has changed because one of the updates to build and equipment templates will be ready earlier than expected.

    We've been working on an update that will automatically switch your build and equipment templates when you enter or exit PvE, WvW, or PvP. The game will remember which build and equipment template tabs were last active when you return to a game mode.

    Also, PvP equipment will be integrated into all Equipment Templates, which will bring all of your equipment management into one convenient place. Our current plan is to add a new button to the equipment menu to view the PvP equipment slots in each template. By doing this, it means you to be able to manage your PvP equipment whenever you like, even outside of PvP game modes. Because PvP equipment is very different from normal inventory items, it will not take any space away from your standard equipment.

    This update to Build and Equipment Templates will go live on December 3. We'll still follow with another update early in the new year.

    I am happy to see this update. Happy it see it coming, it solves the only part of build templates that was a direct downgrade in functionality for me. Now I have the same three equipment "templates" (PvE, PvP and WvW) I had before the build templates released but I can use the PvP one I did not needed for another build. Happy to see it coming earlier than I expected. And happy to see communication about it.

  • Mikuchan.7261Mikuchan.7261 Member ✭✭✭

    @Rubi Bayer.8493 said:
    Hi all, I have some more news for you. Like I mentioned in last week's post, we had a list of updates we felt confident we could start working on and planned to give you an update on that list early in the new year. That has changed because one of the updates to build and equipment templates will be ready earlier than expected.

    We've been working on an update that will automatically switch your build and equipment templates when you enter or exit PvE, WvW, or PvP. The game will remember which build and equipment template tabs were last active when you return to a game mode.

    Also, PvP equipment will be integrated into all Equipment Templates, which will bring all of your equipment management into one convenient place. Our current plan is to add a new button to the equipment menu to view the PvP equipment slots in each template. By doing this, it means you to be able to manage your PvP equipment whenever you like, even outside of PvP game modes. Because PvP equipment is very different from normal inventory items, it will not take any space away from your standard equipment.

    This update to Build and Equipment Templates will go live on December 3. We'll still follow with another update early in the new year.

    Thank you!
    These are some nice improvements assuming care is taken to implement them in a way such that they don't become distruptive in other ways.

    However now there have been 2 replies (which is good) without any word about people's concern over the monetization and other major issues (which is not as good).
    It'd be very nice if we could have a word on what is planned to happen with that.
    I get the "when it's done" or "when it's done enough" idea, but these are issues that could maybe be expedited a bit, for the sake of calming people down and preventing people from leaving and/or spreading sadness.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27, 2019

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @Kravey.4563 said:
    Among all the problems brought by templates the biggest one wasn't addressed - AGGRESSIVE MONETIZATION. It's obvious to me now you're not going to address it anyway. I will not pay for that. You are not having my gems. No. Just no.
    No.

    Well, the whole thing was obviously specifically designed for monetization. I don't think the devs who developed it didn't know a system similar to ArcDPS (which I never used) wouldn't have been more practical and overall the better way to go - with real templates instead of loadouts, no slot and saving option limits, and builds and equipment being linked. Separating builds and gear made for more loadouts, and this loadout system made for less convenience unless you buy more slots, which you pay for per slot per character. This was all calculated, no doubt about it.

    That's probably why they added equipment storage: they thought it would appease people as a QoL feature, just as they thought being able to use upgrades in several loadouts at once would be a QoL addition. They missed two important factors: the additional hassle another equipment location and the separate handling of upgrades would cause, and the vast inventory space we have nowadays.

    Beating the dead horse here, so to speak. No business makes extra features and doesn't intend to ROI on it. Monetization isn't something that needs to be bug-fixed though so that's sort of a side-issue.

    The issue at hand is how much build storage and templates cost: prior to their release it was mentioned that it would be in line with bank tabs (i.e. 600 gems = 30 slots) and bag slots (i.e. 20 slots up to 32 slots for 400 gems).

    What equipment templates ended up being was a bit more than that at 500 gems, which could possibly be justified in that they are hotkeyed and can hold "up to 60 items" when you include the infusions and upgrades that aren't held separate from armor/weapons/trinkets. People with legendary armor , weapons, & trinkets in multiple templates get ripped off a bit in that you can't have different wardrobe appearances and don't save on inventory spaces. What many are forgetting is that by eliminating the items from inventory, there's fewer variables involved for Arenanet to deal with since the location of an item in inventory is not a concern. Not deleting items was stated as a priority during development and the overflow result when encumbered shows this. Equipment templates are probably the way they are due to Berserker's + Viper's fitting the majority of a PvE-only userbase. Two is the bare minimum in order to showcase the feature.

    Build templates at 300 gems are likely priced due to their hotkey function, but due to not being bound to game mode (i.e. PvE, PvP, WvW) there isn't an incentive over character slots for most PvE or WvW players as it isn't an account-wide unlock. For PvP since you can't swap builds mid-match there isn't a reason to purchase any over build storage. The best way this could be rectified without going accountwide unlock is having 1 or 2 PvE-only, 1 WvW, 1 PvP build template as the default given combination , with greater maximum build storage given to all players. Obviously an account-wide unlock is more appealing and would be similar to additional crafting license (800 gems).

    Build storage is the most egregious portion of the system, because it doesn't do anything special: you're paying 500 gems ($6.25) for storage of 3 chatcodes which is mobile freemium level pricing. Given there's 9 classes there really should be a minimum of 9 given "for free" instead of the 3+3 free for the first month(s) , along with far greater amounts per purchase. The fact that there is 6x for purchase (at 3 each, up to 24 total) means it's way overpriced when it could have easily been up to two purchases and 9 slots per purchase if 24 is a technical hard limit. The best way to rectify this is to increase build storage size (if 9 packs it would go up to 60 total instead of 24 , as 6+54=60 while 6+18=24) and retroactively give everyone a pack of 9 that purchased a pack of 3. If it were truly in line with a bank tab (which admittedly has higher complexity due to more variables than 3 traitlines and 1-2-3) we'd see something similar to around 350 to 400 gems for 18 storage. When you frame it that way, it looks horrific.

  • kharmin.7683kharmin.7683 Member ✭✭✭✭

    In a game where one can play, earn gold, convert to gems and never have to spend any real money, we have complaints about extreme or excessive monetization?

    I am a very casual player.
    Very.
    Casual.

  • fra.5241fra.5241 Member ✭✭
    edited December 3, 2019

    This is what I hate about it: slots soulbound on unlock and high prices per item.
    I was remembering Guild Wars 1 while I wrote this one. People were capable to save/load builds and equipments easly without worrying about money. Anyway, I can understand the worries of a company like Arenanet, therefore I appreciate this Template System as it is (excluding that I said above).

  • sorry, tldr
    how about to make this build storage to a list of "role" builds those are combinations of trait builds and gear. and give the role build switching the hotkeys

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Infusion.7149 said:
    Beating the dead horse here, so to speak.

    I wasn't beating a dead horse, I was merely explaining that the design clearly shows that it was specifically made for monetization, so anyone complaining about that is beating the dead horse. ;) Had they had the best possible design in mind and not how to make the most money out of it, it would have been designed similar to ArcDPS.

    As for the cost: yes, it is too high, but that doesn't matter, because eventually those slots will be on sale for anyone who feels okay with supporting this design.

  • Aaralyna.3104Aaralyna.3104 Member ✭✭✭✭

    And yet still no word on fixing the revenant bugs caused by these templates. Its a full gamble to play on revenant atm (skills resetting, weapons sometimes just change by themselves unasked and I didn't even change legendaries in my play coz it would screw up every position of skill)... I am starting to loose faith in this game as it affects basic gameplay and its taking ages to even acknowledge they are working on a fix and will be high priority.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Aaralyna.3104 said:
    And yet still no word on fixing the revenant bugs caused by these templates.

    I'm sure this will be taken care of with the upcoming patch.

  • @Infusion.7149 said:

    The issue at hand is how much build storage and templates cost: prior to their release it was mentioned that it would be in line with bank tabs (i.e. 600 gems = 30 slots) and bag slots (i.e. 20 slots up to 32 slots for 400 gems).

    Not even just that.
    500Gem+300Gem = 800Gem = A character slot
    I don't see any reason to buy those "loadout" instead of just getting 1 more character slot which will give me much much more benefit from every aspect.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 29, 2019

    @Nick.5276 said:

    @Ashantara.8731 said:

    @Aaralyna.3104 said:
    And yet still no word on fixing the revenant bugs caused by these templates.

    I'm sure this will be taken care of with the upcoming patch.

    I'm sure a lot of people thought the feedback before release would have been listened to but nope. I'm sure a lot of people thought the build system would be as good if not better than arcdps but nope. I'm sure a lot of people thought the basic class abilities would be a-ok with the build system but nope. I'm sure a lot of people thought the cost would be reasonable but nope.

    They've fluffed everything else are you willing to stand on that line and take the risk?

    You must have completely missed my extensive criticism of ANet's version of a templates system in this and other threads, or you wouldn't be asking me that question in such an agitated way. ;)

    All I said is that I believe they will take care of the Rev skill issue sooner than most other issues as it directly hampers gameplay to a certain extent. So yes, I do believe this is one of the first things that will get fixed.

    Could I be wrong about it? Of course, I am not the Oracle of Delphi after all.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 29, 2019

    Utilities order getting resented.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 30, 2019

    @susana.7814 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:
    In a game where one can play, earn gold, convert to gems and never have to spend any real money, we have complaints about extreme or excessive monetization?

    Do you know how long it will take to farm 30k gems worth of gold? The complaints are justified and i think you know that.

    Not relevant. The gem-gold exchange is not meant to completely circumvent all transactions. The fact that it can is already a problem within the system.

    The build/equipment templates are meant as quality of life features which players who are interested in can, but do not have to purchase. You can enjoy the game without invesnting any money in additional features. If you decide to cheap out and spend 0 money on the game while still desiring the feature, you are already not the target audience and not a high value/priority customer.

    Going forward from that: obviously quality of life features need to then be improved or adressed if they do not match up with what build tempaltes provide. That should be a top priotiry. This means bug fixing, reestablishing past functionality and improving on the system as good as possible.

    TL;DR:
    There is customers who are worth keeping happy, and customers who are worth keeping happy but with less priority. Bringing features in line with valuable customers desires/demands is a top priority. Every one else gets attention once the afformentioned group has been satisfied via subsidizing resources for non revenue generating player pools . Might sound harsh, but that's how the real world works.

  • @Rubi Bayer.8493 said:
    We've been working on an update that will automatically switch your build and equipment templates when you enter or exit PvE, WvW, or PvP. The game will remember which build and equipment template tabs were last active when you return to a game mode.

    Sorry, but are you sure that this function wont confuse a lot of players in the first place? Shortly going into WvW or PVP lobby will switch the build and slot? People may be confused when there weapon change and will switch it back, messing with their build and so on.

    The problem is that your templates are loadout and every change will mess with it. So maybe you just gave us back the three loadouts and start giving us the free three template builds that you have been promised to us?

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @Cyninja.2954 said:
    TL;DR:
    There is customers who are worth keeping happy, and customers who are worth keeping happy but with less priority.

    TL:DR:
    There are whales, and there are players who aren't.

    I wasn't talking about whales, but yes, those do allow quite a few players to play this game without any charge, even if I personally am not a fan of this type of exploitation.

    I was more refering to casual customers who occasionally spend money on something they enjoy, and those who want everything for free and more.

  • Virdo.1540Virdo.1540 Member ✭✭✭

    @Rubi Bayer.8493 said:
    Hi all, I have some more news for you. Like I mentioned in last week's post, we had a list of updates we felt confident we could start working on and planned to give you an update on that list early in the new year. That has changed because one of the updates to build and equipment templates will be ready earlier than expected.

    We've been working on an update that will automatically switch your build and equipment templates when you enter or exit PvE, WvW, or PvP. The game will remember which build and equipment template tabs were last active when you return to a game mode.

    Also, PvP equipment will be integrated into all Equipment Templates, which will bring all of your equipment management into one convenient place. Our current plan is to add a new button to the equipment menu to view the PvP equipment slots in each template. By doing this, it means you to be able to manage your PvP equipment whenever you like, even outside of PvP game modes. Because PvP equipment is very different from normal inventory items, it will not take any space away from your standard equipment.

    This update to Build and Equipment Templates will go live on December 3. We'll still follow with another update early in the new year.

    please give us wardrobe templates too :bleep_bloop:

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 30, 2019

    @BadHealer.3608 said:

    @Rubi Bayer.8493 said:
    We've been working on an update that will automatically switch your build and equipment templates when you enter or exit PvE, WvW, or PvP. The game will remember which build and equipment template tabs were last active when you return to a game mode.

    Sorry, but are you sure that this function wont confuse a lot of players in the first place? Shortly going into WvW or PVP lobby will switch the build and slot? People may be confused when there weapon change and will switch it back, messing with their build and so on.

    The problem is that your templates are loadout and every change will mess with it. So maybe you just gave us back the three loadouts and start giving us the free three template builds that you have been promised to us?

    Wait, why on earth would you be confused? Isnt the very reason people want automatic switches because they are getting confused now? We want the game to change our weapons and builds.

    And if people dont want it to do that (someone mentioned a tickbox to "disable" this feature, which is downright silly)... just use 1 build across all modes then. Simple as that.

    Dont look a gift Asura in the mouth.
    No seriously, dont. Shark teeth.

  • So much work for nothing, too bad.
    I can not imagine that someone spends so much money for it. Whether it works now or not.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 30, 2019

    @Faish.4238 said:

    @Cyninja.2954 said:

    @susana.7814 said:

    @kharmin.7683 said:
    In a game where one can play, earn gold, convert to gems and never have to spend any real money, we have complaints about extreme or excessive monetization?

    Do you know how long it will take to farm 30k gems worth of gold? The complaints are justified and i think you know that.

    Not relevant. The gem-gold exchange is not meant to completely circumvent all transactions. The fact that it can is already a problem within the system.

    [...] If you decide to cheap out and spend 0 money on the game while still desiring the feature, you are already not the target audience and not a high value/priority customer.

    [...]

    TL;DR:
    There is customers who are worth keeping happy, and customers who are worth keeping happy but with less priority. Bringing features in line with valuable customers desires/demands is a top priority. Every one else gets attention once the afformentioned group has been satisfied via subsidizing resources for non revenue generating player pools . Might sound harsh, but that's how the real world works.

    I don't think you understand how gold/gem exchange works. All gems there are first bought with real money, then donated to the system (in exchange for gold) by players who bought them. Therefore, regardless if you bough gems with $$$ or gold, ANet is still getting paid for every gem store transaction.

    I am fully aware how the exchange works. I've explained how the exchange works often enough to others on the forum. I was replying to a player who complained that it is to expensive to exchange gold to gems to get all the upgrades they desire. You either exchange gold to gems, and thus increase the incentive for other players to convert gems to gold (ideally for Arenanet by having the other player buy those gems with real currency) or you buy the gems directly. You don't get to complain about both.

    @Faish.4238 said:
    While gold to gem ratio fluctuates, price is always proportional, so if something is too expensive with real money, it is also too expensive with gold. Don't talk like gold is worthless and limitless supply, because gold/gem exchange rate shows otherwise: 1 dollar/euro/pound/etc can only buy you X amount of gold.

    The gold to gem ratio fluctuates due to the amount of conversion between both real currency and gems (which has a fixed value if we discount occasional sales) which are fed into the exchange, previous owned gems which get exchanged and gold which gets exchanged. I'm not saying gold is worthless. What I said was: you either support the game by buying gems and getting the upgrades, or you accept that an increased amount of players convert gold to gems, thus creating unfavorable exchange rates for others who wish to exchange gold (while at the same time incentivising players to get gems for real currency and exchange those for gold with more favorable rates).

    While players exchanging gold to gems does benefit Arenanet and their revenue eventually, this still requires another player to actually exchange gems to gold from real currency acquisition. If you are relying on others to fund Arenanet so you get to keep favorable rates, you are out of luck.

    @Faish.4238 said:
    Also note that people don't just say "it's too expensive", but they also point out there are other items in gem store that offer more value (character slots, arguably bag slots).

    Yes, and the is up for personal taste and could be argued for or against. In that case vote with your wallet and don't get the upgrades or get prefered upgrades instead. Again, none of thsee upgrades are necessary or required.

    We are getting off topic though. I was just pointing out that some players expectations are outlandish, especially from the fraction of "I bought the game 7 years ago, I have provided enough investment".

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 30, 2019

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @Cyninja.2954 said:
    TL;DR:
    There is customers who are worth keeping happy, and customers who are worth keeping happy but with less priority.

    TL:DR:
    There are whales, and there are players who aren't.

    It's safe to say that there are limits for whales, too, if you're feeling cheated. You have to ask yourself: "Isn't this an impertinent way to make me invest money in this game, because the cost-benefit ratio is completely imbalanced and outrageous?" - If your answer is "Yes", then you're not going to pay for this "QoL feature", regardless of whether you're financially capeable of doing so or not.

  • BadHealer.3608BadHealer.3608 Member ✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    And if people dont want it to do that (someone mentioned a tickbox to "disable" this feature, which is downright silly)... just use 1 build across all modes then. Simple as that.

    Yeah, I really thinkg that this way you will be such a completive player. Just use one build everywhere, since this "templates" build updates does make everything so much better.

    Sorry I need to go on and scream a little more 66666666666666666666666 at my Revant. Maybe it will help some day.

  • Dreamy Lu.3865Dreamy Lu.3865 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    It came too late. I hardly use it because I have by now one char for each build I need. So my experience is limited. However, one thing is annoying to me with my wvw char using such templates: If I have changed something for whatever reason (mostly to adapt to a specific situation), when I map travel from EBG to a bl, I lose it. It changes my setup back to the original template. So of course, I can set it up again, no worries, but a change of map in WvW is quite common, and that becomes rapidly annoying.

    Officer of Equinox Solstice [TIME] / Singapore-Based International PvX Guild
    WvW server: Henge of Denravi
    https://discord.gg/P5dj7fd

  • Blueberry.8095Blueberry.8095 Member ✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Asum.4960 said:
    GW2 is all about horizontal progression.
    Arc Templates encapsulated that perfectly by not making you more powerful at any one thing, but allowing you to instead become specialised at more and more things over time with investment, allowing you to gear up and learn a vast array of builds for more and more scenarios, no matter how niche, while crucially also providing the tools to seamlessly swap between them. Which in turn also encouraged players to seek out and master more and more gamemodes and content within them, drastically increasing the longevity of the game.

    Upon reflecting on why this patch had such a massively negative impact on my (and many other's I know) desire to even just keep playing, I came to the conclusion that in my opinion Anet took out the primary progression system for many veteran players of the game when they shut down Arc, just to replace it with a monetization scheme, an almost absurdly heavy handed one at that. While even with full investment of a couple hundred euros/dollars, it still stops far short from replacing the functionality, and with that necessary service for the game, that Arc provided, in pretty much every regard.

    I truly think this "template" patch was the most damaging thing that happened to the hardcore scene of the game since launch, and that says a lot among all the missteps and lack of content we stuck through with.

    As much as I appreciate that we eventually got any response at all, that can't make up for the fact that it completely missed the mark and only talked about eventually months down the line just fixing the most preliminary issues, while completely avoiding the issue of how flawed to the core almost everything about the implementation is, from lack of functionality to massively overbearing monetization for such a vital feature for many, and how much damage that caused to some of the most invested playerbase.

    This resonates with me so much! Everything you said is exactly what I thought... Like what I've said in my feedback, I wasn't even a veteran player, but I've met people who would teach me how to raid (training), teach me how to use more builds in different situations, but yet the tripple monetization with the character-bound unlock and the clunkiness of the system makes me sad. I wanted to use the system more but the cost has prevented me from acquiring any... Like... some of the builds not only would use slightly different traits, but also would exchange few pieces of gear for example into a tankier build, therefore I'd need 1 build template + 1 gear template for that build, that's like 300 + 500 = 800 gems, how does it even make sense for that price? It really should be "half that price" AND "account-wide unlock" for "BOTH build + gear" and unlock up to 10-20 templates.

    Not only how much it cost, but it was also the character-bound unlock that has stopped me from progressing further into as in to broaden my build selection. I'm supposed I can really buy more character slot if I really need to, but then wouldn't it defeats the existance of the build template? Doesn't it want more players to be willing to buy more slots/use the system that you've spend so much time and efford to create? Wouldn't a reasonable price and a reasonable option (such as account wide unlock & charge only 1-way but not split into 3-ways) attract more players to actually buy them?

  • Mithos.9023Mithos.9023 Member ✭✭✭

    Now while some adjustments are on the way I am still not in the slightest satisfied. With what is coming it really seems like no major changes will come no matter how terrible the foundation of this system is.
    Now I want to bring a point that is controversial, but I believe that, as long as we stick to “gear” we will never have good build system, because “gear” is the main clue print why builds and switching builds is a hassle. And the current system tries to fix it by giving us more gear slots which leads to more gear management instead of less.

    • First point runes and sigils. As long as these are tied to gear, we will never have good flexibility. No matter what you do as long as the sigil is tied to a weapon the weapon is only useful for one build only. Instead of having said weapon with a different sigil used for a different build. But here we come to the next problem. As long as the attributes are tied to a weapon the flexibility is again limited. I need the attribute and not the weapon per se. So a system that would manage attributes/runes/sigil would instead of shuffling gear would be superior in any way.
    • The gear management this game offers is again terrible. And the point is it was never good for the last 7 years, if at all the new templates, loadouts sorry, shows just how bad it really is.
      Example:

    The current manager is highly inefficient. It lists everything no matter how unimportant it is for your build. While I believe an attribute wardrobe would be much better than gear slots I would at least ask if we could have an option to hide all stuff depending on rarities or an option to exclude non soulbound/character bound items.
    Now for a small riddle. Guess me the attributes of the 4 marked items.

    Correct, none. All of them are not selected yet.

    Now what I see as a problem with our gear focused system is that it shows not what is needed. For build management it is highly unimportant what skin an item has. The information that is needed on the first look should be the attributes. These define the build not that it is from the aetherblade set or that its color is red. For the look a new editor would be a better potion. Often already suggested a template where you select your skins and it is changed either alone or even bind it to build templates.
    I also think two of the main problem we have with the current build loadouts are just overshadowing the underlying issue of gear. That we only have loadouts and not true templates as so many wanted to have them is, I believe an issue of gear. Gear are more or less physical items so the moment I remove them to the inventory they are gone from the template as there is nothing that could be saved in the template to remember what was on the current position. How should the system find it? For example, if it is given to another character how should the system save the item? Simple answer it can’t and will never. There are too many factors for a system to keep track of. What if the item is transmuted? Can it still fit in the template slot? What if it is on another character, should it just get it from there? What if the attributes are change? How should that be handled? Will it just be deleted from the template? Or should the template simply grab the next best item with the same attribute? But what if the rune/sigil of that one is not correct? Gear is simply a hindrance as it is a static object not metadata that could be saved to a template and be remembered even through change.
    The problem with legendary gear is also tied in this. While they seem more comfortable, a change that switches the item back to the inventory leads to all the problems described in the last paragraph. The system can’t track it and as long as we stay with gear as the build defining option this won’t change.
    These are some points I believe why the current gear system per se is terrible and the underling system should be changed. As long as the system is not touched the whole build issue as we got it, no matter the changes, will stay inflexible and a shallow shadow of what it should be. I still belief a wardrobe that would store attributes and a build editor that only overwrites the attributes/runes/sigil of your normal gear would be better in any way. Common gear would only act as a way to acquire unlocks of attributes or runes/sigils. Then we would have no interaction with your inventory, no more hassle with gear, true flexibility as nothing would be bound to anything permanent anymore.

  • BlackyWarsX.5384BlackyWarsX.5384 Member ✭✭
    edited December 4, 2019

    I won't let this thread be forgotten, pin it back to the front.

    New update: Since you now can hide stowed weapons, this adds another point to the (long) list of needed improvements to templates loadouts.

    • make the setting saved per template loadout. Right now, it's across all templates loadouts.
    • while at it, apply the same to helmet, gloves and backpack visibility.
  • Is this the right place to leave feedback about the new spvp equipment panel? Here goes:

    An spvp equipment panel is useless to me if I can't store a unique weapon set in there. Utterly useless. Sure, being able to see the amulet, rune, and sigils outside of the pvp lobby is nice, but those were already segregated from pve equipment so it never contributed to the clash between spvp and pve that we have now. The new equipment panel is, I repeat, utterly useless.

  • Fenella.2634Fenella.2634 Member ✭✭✭

    Thank you for bringing back the autoswitch per gamemode. I haven't tried it out yet, but I trust it works. :)
    This should restore most of the QoL for players without legendaries.

    @voltaicbore.8012 said:
    An spvp equipment panel is useless to me if I can't store a unique weapon set in there.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think we never stored weapons in the pvp build panel? So I don't see much of a downgrade here, just a small plus for not having to go to HoM for checking or changing the stats now. I mean sure, being able to store weapons would be even better, but for now I'm happy if something just works as intended without breaking the game someway or another.

    Any news about revenants?

  • @Fenella.2634 said:

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think we never stored weapons in the pvp build panel? So I don't see much of a downgrade here, just a small plus for not having to go to HoM for checking or changing the stats now. I mean sure, being able to store weapons would be even better, but for now I'm happy if something just works as intended without breaking the game someway or another.

    That is correct, but I never really called it a downgrade, not sure where you got that from. It's just that without the additional weapon storage capability, that panel is essentially useless to me, is all.

    Also, you seem to have missed the fact that your stats don't reflect the pvp amulet and runes in that panel.

    Finally, as sad as it is, I have to admit I'm in the same place you are regarding features working as intended without breaking the game. It's an extremely low standard, but it's what we have at the moment. I really do hope that the stats not changing to reflect pvp equipment in that screen is a bug, and not a feature.

  • With the release of capes I decided to set up two versions of one of my toons, one with a cape, one without, for difference situations and I found that because you've only separated the "equipment" tab into "templates", it's got the following consequences (in addition to all the other issues others have already listed):

    1. You can't have the back item visible in one equipment template and not another.

    2. You can't have the back item use different skins in different equipment templates to get around having it visible in all templates because of #1 above.

    3. You can't even have different colors on the same piece of equipment in different templates, so because of #1 and #2 above you're forced to have the same cape, looking exactly the same for all your templates. It's just ....disappointing.

    I can't stress how much I appreciate the addition of capes - but again it seems like another feature has been added without consideration how it interacts with existing functionality. Like the different teams making different parts of this game don't talk to each other.

  • Ashantara.8731Ashantara.8731 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Remembering hidden weapons per loadout?

    As it is now, when you hide a weapon in one loadout's weapon slot, the respective weapon slot in all other loadouts is automatically hiding the weapon there as well, even when it's a completely different weapon which you don't wish to hide.

    Will it become possible in later updates for the game to remember the selection per loadout instead of across all the loadouts? :)

  • skoda.4619skoda.4619 Member ✭✭
    edited December 5, 2019

    Got more bugs for you!

    1. If you have equipped a weapon that you can't use, you can't change it's skin. Let me give you an example: Active equipment slot on my elementalist has warhorn equipped, which i can't use because my build doesn't have tempest elite specialization, when i go to wardrobe and try to change it's skin it just says "You can't apply skin to an empty slot!". So i have to go and equip a build template that has tempest elite spec then i can change the skin.
    2. When you are in your hero equipment panel you can see all sigils/runes and infusions on the left side including linked sigils, runes and infusions, but if you click customize on the weapon or armor you can only see the sigils/runes and infusions in your inventory.
    3. When you equip a legendary weapon or armor that has sigils/runes or infusions on it and there are already same linked sigils/runes and infusions on another equipment panel all upgrades get unequipped and replaced with linked versions. So if I want to swap stuff in and out and don't want linked sigils in my weapons i have to select and equip them again every time.
    4. If i equip a weapon/armor that is already linked, can you just leave at least infusions in it and possibly sigils/runes? So i atleast have something in them and don't run around with under 150AR and no sigils.
  • Blueberry.8095Blueberry.8095 Member ✭✭
    edited December 6, 2019

    @AzureNightmare.3914 said:
    I may be beating a dead horse, but I still think the biggest problem is that you can only unlock tabs per character, not account. If the purchases for Equipment Tabs and Specs were account-wide, I'd be more tempted to buy them. If I only had to buy four more Equipment Template Slots for 2000 gold total and every single character I have, and will ever make will have six slots, most of my criticisms would be gone. I think these templates should either be dirt cheap per character ($10 can get you everything with a few gems left over), or account-wide purchases to justify their hard prices. With the prices you're charging, I can just buy character slots and make new toons to fulfill new purchases. Engineers and Elementalists having weapon swap now helps save on the space a bit, but it still much.

    I don't know. I never used ARC, I can't really compare how much better it was, and I'm a really casual PvE primary player. But there's something about the prices for these single purchases that just... don't feel right, honestly.

    Which is something a lot of people has been asking but were still not addressed.

    I too want account-wide unlock - if I unlock 1 slot on 1 character, the other characters also gain 1 slot, so each character now has 4 slots (including the 3 default slots). If not, I refuse to buy any just like I won't unlock bag slot that only unlock on 1 character but not the whole account.