The Voice and the Claw of the Fallen (spoiler!) — Guild Wars 2 Forums

The Voice and the Claw of the Fallen (spoiler!)

Can i post strike mission here? Im just going to do it. I just wanted to say that this instance is great. With Icebrood Construct i didnt had much hopes for this type of content. But this second strike mission really did hit the spot for me. I love it. Thanks ANet! Recorded a small footage of our first experiance. Well.. second one, cause first one was a duo to see how the encounter would be like to get a feeling for it. (Spoils at own risk!)

Comments

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Enjoyable fight. Haven't been in a successful group yet, so that's a plus compared to the last one. I'm sure some are finding it incredibly easy, but it's certainly harder than what I'm used to in game so that suits me just fine

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • LadyKitty.6120LadyKitty.6120 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2019

    The Kodan Duo is quite an interesting fight, yush. Kitty did it with some LFG squad as dps-esque support chronomancer and we killed them on first try though 7:56 CC bar almost wiped the squad ('cause like anywhere except at Mordy, nobody CC'd). We didn't have any healers in squad. Guess it works as halfway point towards raids as the stuff the bosses do are actually a lot more bothersome than what half of raid bosses have, but the damage from mechanics (except for CCs) isn't quite as punishing.
    This time there's actually a somewhat challenging DPS check if you want full loot (this LFG squad failed both gold and silver bonus). From what Kitty quickly mathed, the bosses seem to have about 9mil HP each according to the video she recorded.
    Timer for gold rewards is 3 minutes and you'd need about 60k squad cleave/30k avg. squad dps per boss to reach that.
    Timer for silver is 5 minutes and you'd need about 36k squad cleave/18k avg. squad dps per boss to reach that.
    Claw likes to jump and both bosses port around (including lots of time in the surrounding lava) so you can't exactly cleave them both full-time and dps uptime is probably a bit lower than Matt (which is already infamous for low melee dps uptime).
    So, if you actually want the gold rewards you might need at least slightly experienced squad of raiders/fractalers. Condi might be beneficial unless you're doing it with high-end raid squad with good burst dps (in which case the bosses would die in about 60-100 seconds, Kitty makes an educated guess).

    E: And as such, let the flood of "this strike mission too hard" begin.
    E2: Kitty now did it again and it actually seems like a mixmash of some previous raid bosses with bears having lb-DH and hammerwarr skill set. Bunch of damage pressure but no 1-shot mechs, smaller invidual hits from multitude of mechs and no arena aura. So from DPSer's perspective, this might actually be more difficult than W4b1-3, Gorseval and Sab (and certainly more annoying if you eat mechs and you're sturdy enough to survive lots of small hits). Kitty also recorded this run as healbrand with overwhelming heals.
    E3: Kitty now did it 4th time and apparently the bosses indeed have high toughness (like Kitty assumed) as some mirage was doing twice higher dps than some decent power dpsers.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who streams and records videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks and streams at twitch.tv/ladykittygw2 .

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @LadyKitty.6120 said:
    And as such, let the flood of "this strike mission too hard" begin.

    If/when that happens it would mean this strike mission is actually good content. Haven't tried it yet myself but from what I read it sounds really promising.

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    Let it sink in. I mean these are the first steps people take in the instance. In time, people will improve

  • The fight is actually fun and it might as well have been a Raidboss with some fine tuning. Mechanic wise they can keep up with some of the bosses already.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 20, 2019

    Silver seemed straightforward enough. Did it with 9 - I have no real dps to speak of being on my pvt warrior, so I might have just had a really good pug, but it seemed to go smoothly enough without much worry about mega dps.

    Gold would likely be beyond my contributing abilities, but that's kind how it should be to be honest

    It is a good fight though. It just need context and a reason to exist to round it out as perfect

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • zealex.9410zealex.9410 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @maddoctor.2738 said:

    @LadyKitty.6120 said:
    And as such, let the flood of "this strike mission too hard" begin.

    If/when that happens it would mean this strike mission is actually good content. Haven't tried it yet myself but from what I read it sounds really promising.

    It hasnt been soloed from what ive seen so far so thats a plus and supposedly the boneskinner is harder.

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    As i said before, these are the first steps people take in the instance. in time people will improve once they get familiar / comfortable with the encounter(s)

    @Krzysztof.5973 said:
    I'm just sad but not surprised that there is no CM.

    Well... it suppose to be entry level raiding. So dont expect difficult content.

    @zealex.9410 said:
    It hasnt been soloed from what ive seen so far so thats a plus and supposedly the boneskinner is harder.

    To my knowledge there are 3 SM bosses. Which will rotate every week. Boneskinner being one of them. We'll see i guess. Definitely looking forward to it tho

  • LadyKitty.6120LadyKitty.6120 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2019

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    As i said before, these are the first steps people take in the instance. in time people will improve once they get familiar / comfortable with the encounter(s)

    @Krzysztof.5973 said:
    I'm just sad but not surprised that there is no CM.

    Well... it suppose to be entry level raiding. So dont expect difficult content.

    @zealex.9410 said:
    It hasnt been soloed from what ive seen so far so thats a plus and supposedly the boneskinner is harder.

    To my knowledge there are 3 SM bosses. Which will rotate every week. Boneskinner being one of them. We'll see i guess. Definitely looking forward to it tho

    Kodan Bros is one, legendary Boneskinner is second and High Shaman is third strike mission and they said it'll rotate weekly, yush.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who streams and records videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks and streams at twitch.tv/ladykittygw2 .

  • Vinceman.4572Vinceman.4572 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Casual squads will barely finish this encounter on a regular basis and for ambitious groups it's still too easy.
    The only reason they are doing this is because they've already abandoned fractals & raids. Sad to see things going this way. The 3 strike missions could have been a new fractal or actually a raid but no this way it's easier to develop & to ship out to the players. I really cannot believe that this strategy will pay off to be sustainable for the future.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • Fun fight, finished on first try. The issue is having to wait for the Boneskinner and High Shaman fights. Wish it would've been somewhat (a bit?) harder, but I suppose it's hard enough for most people as is.

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    @LadyKitty.6120 said:
    Kodan Bros is one, legendary Boneskinner is second and High Shaman is third strike mission and they said it'll rotate weekly, yush.

    Which is what i said on the message you quoted me on ^^

    @Vinceman.4572 said:
    Casual squads will barely finish this encounter on a regular basis and for ambitious groups it's still too easy. The only reason they are doing this is because they've already abandoned fractals & raids. Sad to see things going this way. The 3 strike missions could have been a new fractal or actually a raid but no this way it's easier to develop & to ship out to the players. I really cannot believe that this strategy will pay off to be sustainable for the future.

    Maybe. I mean there are lot of people being bored of fractals, while there is a large group that doesnt want to bother with raids duo to w/e the reason. I think strike missions really fits into that niche place. Personally i like endgame content and thus it adds up to my daily "to-do" list.

  • LadyKitty.6120LadyKitty.6120 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2019

    Though there's prolly lots of organized squads which've got the gold reward, here's a video of an LFG run Kitty got the mission done in 2:30 (0:30 left on gold). This squad had lots of good dpsers and "focus one to 15% then swap focus the other to death, try to lure them together for cleave"-tactic seems to work very well.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who streams and records videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks and streams at twitch.tv/ladykittygw2 .

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2019

    @Vinceman.4572 said:
    Casual squads will barely finish this encounter on a regular basis and for ambitious groups it's still too easy.
    The only reason they are doing this is because they've already abandoned fractals & raids. Sad to see things going this way. The 3 strike missions could have been a new fractal or actually a raid but no this way it's easier to develop & to ship out to the players. I really cannot believe that this strategy will pay off to be sustainable for the future.

    I think Strike missions will pay off although it would be nice to tie a context for them to exist. They are a bit random right now even though I like this weeks fight a lot.

    It is a sustainable solution...however they need to be paired with continuing releases for the other instances. These are meant to to bridge the gap, but bridging the gap only works if there is something on the other side. If the cliff on the other side has eroded away, then they're just a random boss fight they could throw out into open world.

    I'm not playing much of fractals anymore (haven't enjoyed the last 3-4 releases) and I haven't raided...but success in these would tempt me to do more of the other instances

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Aaralyna.3104Aaralyna.3104 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Played this strike mission 3x. First on a public (big whipe and then when ppl were leaving someone thought it could be done in trio so was stuck to sit that out and ofcourse that would go nowhere). Then found a squad in lfg and joined that and they knew tacts (or well they mentioned kill together) and that went good. Same as yesterdays attempt via lfg. I never stepped any foot in raids, I never did more than 1st fractal in t2 once... I don't have a meta build on me either (gs zerker chrono) tho I did hug the group and take in some damage as ranged does more according skill description (tho boons may up for it at same time). Asked commander after if my dps was ok enough (as I expected to be a giant failure on that department) but got replied I did well and in line with all dps. (I don't use dps meters so). And I did enjoy this strike.

    The only thing I found was that there is every time only 1 strike mission advertised in lfg... Like where are all the lfg squads for them in EU? (prime time, map lfg)

    But I also have a question for the more experienced ppl that do raids normally. How big is the gap of skill and difficulty between this particular strike boss and the raids in the game? And could raids still be done in the same build setup I have kinda? I do have a sword/focus in secondary hand but as soon as I use that for some reason I am always dead (despite avoiding aoe's/front attacks and stand at side of boss or behind it and dodge when needed) so I stick to my familiar greatsword. Also, in the strike mission 1 boss shoots ranged.... But does the skill "Feedback" actually work on such enemies? I am using it coz I thought, its shoots ranged but I can't see if it actually reflects projectiles of the boss (lots of visual noise going on in screen). I know a bit of a noob question but have to get to learn such stuff somewhere lol.

  • @Aaralyna.3104 said:
    Played this strike mission 3x. First on a public (big whipe and then when ppl were leaving someone thought it could be done in trio so was stuck to sit that out and ofcourse that would go nowhere). Then found a squad in lfg and joined that and they knew tacts (or well they mentioned kill together) and that went good. Same as yesterdays attempt via lfg. I never stepped any foot in raids, I never did more than 1st fractal in t2 once... I don't have a meta build on me either (gs zerker chrono) tho I did hug the group and take in some damage as ranged does more according skill description (tho boons may up for it at same time). Asked commander after if my dps was ok enough (as I expected to be a giant failure on that department) but got replied I did well and in line with all dps. (I don't use dps meters so). And I did enjoy this strike.

    Since you like to play a gs zerker chrono you will probably be happy to hear that it is in fact a meta build.
    Just one nitpick. No matter what you do, unless you have to deal with a mechanic you always stack on the boss. Thats where you get boons and heals. Even if you go downstate, the squad can just press f to revive you and doesnt have to move around to get you.

    But I also have a question for the more experienced ppl that do raids normally. How big is the gap of skill and difficulty between this particular strike boss and the raids in the game?

    It really depends on the boss. Some Bosses are super easy. I would say the current strikemission is already more difficult than Mursaat. It could be more difficult than some other bosses, but it dies to fast for that. Some tiny adjustments (more hp, breakbar every 25% instead of a timer) and the strike could have been in a raid. It would still remain one of the easier bosses though.

    And could raids still be done in the same build setup I have kinda? I do have a sword/focus in secondary hand but as soon as I use that for some reason I am always dead (despite avoiding aoe's/front attacks and stand at side of boss or behind it and dodge when needed) so I stick to my familiar greatsword.

    Like i said, GS Zerker Chrono is a Meta build. You might have to do some adjustments depending on the rune/sigils/traits you currently have, but you might be fine for the most part. Just remember, as a gs zerker chrono you are a dps class. Your job is to do damage. Thats why you will want to take the traits that add more damage.
    As for survivability, try sword sword. Not only is it stronger, i also has a block and stacks might on you.

    Also, in the strike mission 1 boss shoots ranged.... But does the skill "Feedback" actually work on such enemies? I am using it coz I thought, its shoots ranged but I can't see if it actually reflects projectiles of the boss (lots of visual noise going on in screen). I know a bit of a noob question but have to get to learn such stuff somewhere lol.

    You wont take damage from his attacks when you have feedback up. I dont know if the skill actually reflects his attacks though. Everything related to projectiles in this game is just weird.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭

    @LadyKitty.6120 said:
    And as such, let the flood of "this strike mission too hard" begin.

    I think it was quite hard, but not too hard.
    I finished it with about one minute left on the timer, but we were only 8 people in there and two of the others were dead in the last few minutes.

    @LadyKitty.6120 said:
    Kodan Bros

    The Voice is supposed to be female, so it's not "bros".

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    I do wish add something on top of what @RaidsAreEasyAF.8652 said without stretching it too far. cause it does goes a bit off-topic. As someone that used to main Chrono since HoT., first thing i like to tell you is get more comfortable in melee zone. Or rather stay in the "packt" Cause that's where all the support and heals happens.

    Second, based on SC benchmarks the GS dps build is stronger, but dont take it as granted. Since these are done in an "sandboxed" environment. In a real scenario more then often you will end up being more efficient with the /sword & focus variant in endgame content. Especially outside raids (fracs, sm, dungeons etc). Overall the power Chrono relies heavily on phantasms as that is where the main damage comes from. So try to keep that up as much as possible.

    Lastly Feedback does indeed protect you from projectiles by reflecting it. However keep in mind these are not always the same. There are direct projectiles that you or foes directly shoot towards a target. For example ranger's rapid fire or ele's staff auto attack on fire attunement. These will reflect if it comes in contact with feedback. But other attacks that look like projectile, but is essentially ground target aoe will not. Examples are Arcing Arrow on warrior's longbow, or the grenades on engi. Another exception is when projectiles are/become unblockable. Some bosses do have this property. An example could also be when a warrior procs Signet of Might, before using longbow or rifle skills.

  • RaidsAreEasyAF.8652RaidsAreEasyAF.8652 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 22, 2019

    @GWMO.4785 said:
    Second, based on SC benchmarks the GS dps build is stronger, but dont take it as granted. Since these are done in an "sandboxed" environment. In a real scenario more then often you will end up being more efficient with the /sword & focus variant in endgame content. Especially outside raids (fracs, sm, dungeons etc). Overall the power Chrono relies heavily on phantasms as that is where the main damage comes from. So try to keep that up as much as possible.

    Sword Focus is better in bad groups because its usually played with the illusions traitline. That trailine offers easy access to quickness for yourself without losing any damage (well, technically thats lie because you miss out on some torment damage, but you are a power class anyway so its whatever).

    Considering that most of the time you run timewarp anyway (or you should run it) the group has to be really bad to make illusions better. Illusions is less damage and your focus phantasm can target other enemies. Enemies include tears on deimos and the poison floor on slothasor.

    Usually, what SC write on the website is really good and if you follow them and learn what they tell you to learn you will do so much better than pugs. If you really want to push out extra dps, you need to understand not only your class but also the encounter and adapt the rotation.

    I agree with everything else you´ve said though.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 23, 2019

    As someone who hasn't raided in this game, I am intrigued by comments that this is on par with some of the raid bosses. I didn't overly find this too difficult, so it is somewhat encouraging (mind you given my build, I'm thinking about how much I may have been carried).

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Aaralyna.3104Aaralyna.3104 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for the reactions guys, they are helpfull :)

  • Nephalem.8921Nephalem.8921 Member ✭✭✭

    @Randulf.7614 said:
    As someone who hasn't raided in this game, I am intrigued by comments that this is on par with some of the raid bosses. I didn't overly find this too difficult, so it is somewhat encouraging (mind you given my build, I'm thinking about how much I may have carried).

    Thats why a lot of the more hardcore players complain about raids. Most of them have cms but cms dont have any extra reward after you finished them once. Some of the cms feel like it should have been normal mode aswell because the boss lacks mechanics in normal. w4 b1-3, all of w7 for example. Especially w7 endboss feels like its missing something without the cm.

  • ArthurDent.9538ArthurDent.9538 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Randulf.7614 said:
    As someone who hasn't raided in this game, I am intrigued by comments that this is on par with some of the raid bosses. I didn't overly find this too difficult, so it is somewhat encouraging (mind you given my build, I'm thinking about how much I may have been carried).

    I personally disagree with the new strike being remotely on par with any of the raid bosses. There really just aren't any particularly punishing mechanics and the incoming damage is low overall. Regardless I enjoyed the fight, it had a nice flow to it, but it needs something that can really wipe groups to put it on par with raid bosses as basically everything can be healed through with little difficulty.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The new strike is entertaining.

    Mechanic wise, it's similar to some raid boss fight steps. It's far to short to compare it to any actual raid boss when faced by raid experienced players.

    Punishment wise, it's far below raids meaning you have a lot more leeway for making positiong errors, face tanking damage, ingoring mechanics, etc.

    Overall it's a good way of showing players: this is what it looks like to take on 10 man content in this game, you just might need to pay attention to mechanics more. I like it.

  • Asum.4960Asum.4960 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @GWMO.4785 said:
    Maybe. I mean there are lot of people being bored of fractals, while there is a large group that doesnt want to bother with raids duo to w/e the reason. I think strike missions really fits into that niche place. Personally i like endgame content and thus it adds up to my daily "to-do" list.

    I think that's mainly down to us not getting any content, rather than a flaw with Fractal's in of themselves.
    Fractal CM's are imo the best content in the game, but we haven't gotten a new one in almost 3 years, and there are only two of them.
    Doing the same two pieces of 10-15 minute content more or less daily for 3+ years will get quite boring, even if it's by far and wide the best content in the game.

    Even normal Fractals it seems like we won't be getting any new ones for a year, if ever again, which, considering it's been a year since the last one will mean even if we ever get another one it will probably have been around 2 years since that last piece of ~10 minute content.

    Raids are dying for much the same reasons.
    The content is fantastic, some of the best in the game, and people aren't tired of that type of content, just of doing that exact same content over and over and over without anything new on the horizon.

    Those dropping populations are a symptom of too little content, and the right approach to counter that would have been to develop more of it, rather than concluding dropping populations means lack of interest and therefor developing less.

    And while I agree that Strikes are a neat thing to fill a casual group content niche and I'm glad they exist, as they are something I've been suggesting for over 3 years I think, they aren't a replacement by any means, since even these new harder ones take maybe 5 minutes to figure out and then beat with a 3-5 player group of somewhat proficient players.
    It's not the same as forming and then getting together as community regularly to play together, forming bonds which keep players engaged in the game.

    Even if they may eventually serve as transitional content into endgame for some players, it does seem like there won't be anything left to transition into by the time the game gets to that place, considering how completely abandoned every piece of endgame and their communities are, since years at this point.

    On top of all of that with have the Build Loadout fiasco and what a tremendous hit that was for the hardcore community, just crushing the QoL which that content requires, making it quite annoying and frustrating to play, when players where already just barely holding on in the face of no new content, it's not surprising players for that content are falling off more rapidly than ever and jumping ship.
    But saying people are just bored of them is imo a bit reductive. We would love to keep playing, but with no new content and the game being actively made worse for us in favour of monetization, yea, we are quite "bored" of that.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • Blaeys.3102Blaeys.3102 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 24, 2019

    For what it is, it does the job and can be enjoyable. Ive been in early pugs that failed while my semi-organized guild group got gold pretty easily on the first try (about 1.5 minutes left on the gold timer).

    For me, the logical next step would be to add some kind of repeatable challenge mote - or, even better, scalable difficulty. Strike missions are something they can obviously add to the game more easily than full raids. If they take the extra step to add truly difficult tiers above and beyond what we have now, then they would have a sustainable model for challenging content that they could also update on a reasonable schedule.

    Ive been saying for years that raids needed more difficulty levels to appeal to larger groups. The same is true of strike missions - just in the other direction - and it would be a much more sustainable content model in GW2. With three levels, the lowest being what we have in strike missions now - the medium being what we see in most raid encounters now - and the most difficult being for only the most skilled of players, strike missions could actually accomplish what they said raids would (but never really did) years ago. And with 1-3 rotating fights with each living story drop, it would give players at multiple levels something to look forward to.

  • Vinceman.4572Vinceman.4572 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Since there's barely more than 1 lfg at the same time - if there's ever one - in EU I don't think we're on a logical step here. Even the easier version in Grothmar isn't populated and once you're in a group you see a lot of people with raid titles or fractal gods which is no surprise at all because those are the ones interested in any kind of instanced content they can get so far.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • Nephalem.8921Nephalem.8921 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vinceman.4572 said:
    Since there's barely more than 1 lfg at the same time - if there's ever one - in EU I don't think we're on a logical step here. Even the easier version in Grothmar isn't populated and once you're in a group you see a lot of people with raid titles or fractal gods which is no surprise at all because those are the ones interested in any kind of instanced content they can get so far.

    I wondered aswell and started own groups which filled within seconds even when nothing was in lfg at all. Either the lfg is full of lurkers or i got really lucky with my lfg 4times in a row.

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 24, 2019

    @Nephalem.8921 said:

    @Vinceman.4572 said:
    Since there's barely more than 1 lfg at the same time - if there's ever one - in EU I don't think we're on a logical step here. Even the easier version in Grothmar isn't populated and once you're in a group you see a lot of people with raid titles or fractal gods which is no surprise at all because those are the ones interested in any kind of instanced content they can get so far.

    I wondered aswell and started own groups which filled within seconds even when nothing was in lfg at all. Either the lfg is full of lurkers or i got really lucky with my lfg 4times in a row.

    It's probably a mix of multiple factors, very similar to dungeons.

    The best guess is:

    • as usual most players are unwilling to actually start their own groups but prefer to join, which leads to groups filling up quickly
    • there probably is semi static groups just filling up, which again leads to groups being full very fast
    • I doubt there is many statics since the content is not hard enough, but those too would need to be ommited

    Going by my own experience (I've only run the strike mission 1nce so far on wendnesday), we went in with 7 raiders and filled up the last 3 spots with randoms from LFG (because why not, the strike doesn't sacle so any additional dps is beneficial). The squad filled immediately. Interesting enough, also a reason to NOT implement scaling based on player count, since we would likely not taken a dice roll on randoms if the content had scaled up.

    Strikes as they are right now are in an interesting place. They are not interesting enough to hold the hardcore player bases attention, but are still to difficult for open world players with no instanced content experience. The rewards are lackluster at best. I guess it will take a while to see how the community adapts to them.

  • maxwelgm.4315maxwelgm.4315 Member ✭✭✭

    I had the chance to play Strike today and it was kind of nice. This is not going to ever be a popular opinion but I think they should have made raids like this when they first started them times ago. Hitting people with Vale Guardian AND the abysmal rewards right as everyone was cracking down on HoT being both too difficult and not rewarding enough was a huge mistake, only topped by the immense gap in content releases. The mode's population would probably be immensely higher by now and I very much doubt it would have seen as much backlash if we only ever had "Strike Missions". Legendary armor would have not been as controversial and all in all the playerbase would not see the mode as a divide among the playerbase (no such divide is seen with fractals for example because of the tiered structure). I think both raiders and non-raiders have not gotten much out of raids, even myself having played every raid several times and collected most skins/armor.

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    I think you misunderstood raids. The whole point of it was to be a challenging content. Which obviously came with its own rewards, but that was practically irrelevant. It was more about the content itself. Or at least that was the idea when they where first released. Unfortunately, the community did their usual whiny crying. And the difficulty got toned down as the power creep increased. Personally i find this a real shame as it takes away flavor of raids. But hey who am i compared to the average wimpy casuals right? Regardless, it is what it is now. And there for i find strike missions fitting nicely in that niche spot atm. its very casual friendly while it is slightly more engaging. And well.. its daily. So not complaining here.

  • ZDragon.3046ZDragon.3046 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The content is nice generally as some one who has done roughly over half the raid wings multiple times (slowly working to finish the last few) strikes or at least this one is nice. Its certainly easier for players to instantly recognize when you need to do something (break the defiance bar when they stand back to back) and adapt on the fly. If players know semi decent optimal rotations its also quite easy to get gold reward.

    I think the content is a good introduction to 10 man group content but its not the full experience of raid difficulty. Some key points that you need in raids are left unnecessary in strike missions with probable cause (no one wants to wait 20 mins for a kiter etc). That said experienced groups especially if they have a healer will just face tank damage and dps things down. While players new to the experience might have to learn how to actually avoid and do mechanics as their dps wont be optimal and their healing likely wont be as good.

    Ive seen people employing different strats but it seems the best way is to just dps 1 down to about 15% then do the same to the other then try to clap both when they are in the middle.
    Also helps if both sub squads have at least might / quickness providers but alacrity is not needed. :)

    Overall i love the back to back animations these guys do i have to say some times i wish we didnt break the bar so fast so i can watch them do those sick animations lol. I think the ice construct will have something similar with the snavir on his shoulder that we saw in the trailer.

  • maxwelgm.4315maxwelgm.4315 Member ✭✭✭

    @GWMO.4785 said:

    I think you misunderstood raids. The whole point of it was to be a challenging content. Which obviously came with its own rewards, but that was practically irrelevant. It was more about the content itself. Or at least that was the idea when they where first released. Unfortunately, the community did their usual whiny crying. And the difficulty got toned down as the power creep increased. Personally i find this a real shame as it takes away flavor of raids. But hey who am i compared to the average wimpy casuals right? Regardless, it is what it is now. And there for i find strike missions fitting nicely in that niche spot atm. its very casual friendly while it is slightly more engaging. And well.. its daily. So not complaining here.

    Oh I know that was the point, sorry for not making this clear. I'm actually saying they should never have had this point to begin with. I like challenging content in other games and in general, just don't think it ever had a place here. GW2 has an amazing learning curve and high skill ceiling as seen by the gap in raider benchmark vs average player DPS (same goes in PvP performance), but it's just not developed with that audience ever in mind. Even when it was, the backlash was intense enough that it might have been worth it to just have released Strikes all along. HoT was an overall mess regarding the playerbase reception when it first released and Raids as "challenging content for niche players" were part of this no doubt (remember they also effectively butchered PvP by attempting it to be E-Sports at the same time).

    Was it worth it? Well w123 were worth it the week each was released, w5 was extremely lackluster in amount of content but had quality, and now we have nothing in sight at all and no hopes since key people from the Fractal/Raids team left the company. So in long term I think raids were a pretty bad decision, with their current options being A) carrying on with the semi dead horse releasing raids at a snail's pace while diverting attention to Strikes, or B) taking them down the Dungeons path leaving a glaringly abandoned game mode with the 'intentional' legendary armor skins on top of it (which is why I think they'll go with A for at least a couple more mediocre wings).

  • CptAurellian.9537CptAurellian.9537 Member ✭✭✭✭

    You forget that GW2 was intended to have challenging PvE content - explorable dungeons and other vanilla stuff just did not live up to the expectations. HoT finally rectified that issue. It's obvious that they have chosen yet another direction some time ago and we'll see how it turns out in the end, though I'm pretty much with Vinceman in not expecting Strikes to become a success story.

    With regard to the current strike, I played it once and wasn't impressed. Boring, still faceroll easy and, of course, two blues and a green or so. With no new interesting content in the foreseeable future, I'll just follow others in the raid crowd and quit. ANet apparently isn't interested in retaining players like me anymore.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • I feel like new strike mission is almost perfect. I have been in fail group alot more than success kill. But, I am really enjoying it even fail attempt unlike raid is downright frustrating.

  • @Yellow Rainbow.6142 said:
    I feel like new strike mission is almost perfect. I have been in fail group alot more than success kill. But, I am really enjoying it even fail attempt unlike raid is downright frustrating.

    So whats the difference in wiping between a strike and a raid? What makes raids more frustrating to wipe at for you?

  • GWMO.4785GWMO.4785 Member ✭✭✭

    @RaidsAreEasyAF.8652 said:

    @Yellow Rainbow.6142 said:
    I feel like new strike mission is almost perfect. I have been in fail group alot more than success kill. But, I am really enjoying it even fail attempt unlike raid is downright frustrating.

    So whats the difference in wiping between a strike and a raid? What makes raids more frustrating to wipe at for you?

    Im geussing he means not killing fast enough to get the "golden chest". Otherwise i cant really see how one can fail this instance

  • Shikaru.7618Shikaru.7618 Member ✭✭✭

    @RaidsAreEasyAF.8652 said:

    @Yellow Rainbow.6142 said:
    I feel like new strike mission is almost perfect. I have been in fail group alot more than success kill. But, I am really enjoying it even fail attempt unlike raid is downright frustrating.

    So whats the difference in wiping between a strike and a raid? What makes raids more frustrating to wipe at for you?

    The lack of consequences from the commander for being bad and still getting silver rewards.

  • Linken.6345Linken.6345 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Shikaru.7618 said:

    @RaidsAreEasyAF.8652 said:

    @Yellow Rainbow.6142 said:
    I feel like new strike mission is almost perfect. I have been in fail group alot more than success kill. But, I am really enjoying it even fail attempt unlike raid is downright frustrating.

    So whats the difference in wiping between a strike and a raid? What makes raids more frustrating to wipe at for you?

    The lack of consequences from the commander for being bad and still getting silver rewards.

    Then your not wiping since that is everyone dying.