They did my girl wrong... [BIG SPOILERS] — Guild Wars 2 Forums

They did my girl wrong... [BIG SPOILERS]

Knuckle Joe.7408Knuckle Joe.7408 Member ✭✭✭
edited November 20, 2019 in Lore

What's up with the death of Almorra... that was a disgrace. Though a secondary, supporting character, Almorra has been with us since the beginning. She was far more important than other NPCs, yet some others like useless Eir at least have one last cinematic. She founded the vigil, she survived Kral's rise kitten, and you kill her off-screen just like that. Incredibly disssapointed and TBH kinda angry. So much potential wasted.

EDIT: Just noticed I posted this in lore. My bad lsot track of the subforum I was in, if a mod feels like this should be in general disc. please move!

Comments

  • Yeah...
    I mean...
    Yeah...
    Ain't much can be said of such a short story arc. 🤷‍♀️

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Her death was fine. Her arc was done and a lonely death in the mountains - whilst a somewhat overused fantasy trope - fitted extremely well with the brooding atmosphere. The reactions to her were perhaps a little more muted, however that’s kinda to be expected given the interacting NPCs were norn and charr.

    One of the few things I didn’t feel they got wrong in the episode

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    TBH, Almorra's story was done. There was only downhill for this character from here the moment of Kralkatorrik's death.

    Honestly, I wonder if there was a way to end her story that didn't result in any complaining, besides something related to Kralkatorrik's final battle.

    If Bangar is the one who buried her, that's at least an interesting final act between the two.

  • @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    4. Or perhaps worse, she gets the Zojja treatment and is just never, ever, mentioned again. Despite being a prominent figure.

    Pretty much in agreement with the post made by Konig but I'm highlighting this part of the post because if we're gonna talk about characters who were done wrong in the story, Zojja would be high on that list (I'd put her at top spot but I'll admit to being super-biased, heh). There's still no definitive conclusion about her status and all we have is a bunch of second-hand information/hearsay because the PC hasn't seen her since Bitter Harvest.

    Almorra at least had her story concluded in this episode.

    Asura fanatic.
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  • Westenev.5289Westenev.5289 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 20, 2019

    NGL, when I heard her at the start of EP1, I thought she was dead. Then I recalled the prologue, and how she was practically speed running through Grothmar Valley to get to vigil keep.

    Moral of the day: Speedrunning RPG's isn't great for one's health. Maybe if she stuck around for the balad of SOULKEEPER, she could have avoided a bad end...

  • Knuckle Joe.7408Knuckle Joe.7408 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 20, 2019

    I have no problem with her dying, it's just the way she died and the fact that it was offscreen, this felt more fitting for a novel/book death, but here you got a visual medium, and killing her offscreen just like that, despite being such an interesting character, was really dissapointing. she dedicated her life to fight elder dragons, and she should have died gloriously against an elder dragon itself, maybe Kralk like Konig said. It just feels incredibly lazy/dissapointing.

    I dunno about everyone but I've been expecting Almorra to go toe to toe with an elder dragon, or at least a very powerful champion of one, and die in the process, but nah, the founder of the vigil, arguably one of, if not the best Charr fighter, killed and left to freeze in some random corner.

  • Kalavier.1097Kalavier.1097 Member ✭✭✭

    @Arden.7480 said:
    Copy from another post concerning the same topic:

    No one is talking about sharing memories about her, just ranting about how she died. If you really like your character, you would honor his/her memory.

    I think that was a brutal death, and shows that you just won't get death according to your deeds, so it broke some stupid habit of writers that would make the whole episode just to kill a character for the sake of honorable death...

    So happy they broke this trope.

    By the description of her wounds, it sounded to me like the boneskinner killed her, and somebody else (Bangar?) buried her out of respect and to protect her body from the elements.

    But as said, how could they end her story and make people happy? (quoting what I said from a chat I'm in).

    "I'm with one guy(Konig), her story kinda finished with Kralk's death, and since she can't retire.. what else was there for her?
    And what ending could she get post Kralk that would make people happy?
    A valiant last stand like Forgal to let us escape? Staying back like Blish and dying when perhaps she didn't need to? Getting a desk job? Disappearing off-screen due to injuries and never coming back?
    Sadly, not every hero gets a heroic ending."

    If we found her wounded, she'd get sent back to Jora's Keep (or on a flight south if they don't trust Blood Legion entirely atm) and probably sit out the rest of the episode, or a few episodes. If they showed her fighting off hordes of Svanir and falling, it'd be heroic, but would it work? If she held the line so we could escape, what are we fleeing from? And why would a single Charr hold it back long enough?

    I mean hell, the two converted guildmates of Braham outright say "Your general has killed her last dragon." When asked what they did to Almorra after Jhavi tried to escape.

    Not all heroes get Heroic deaths. Not everybody is surrounded by friends and family.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This not finished yet, i hope the commander had a chance to make a brutal revenge to honor her. "i will discover who made this, i promise".

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • kasoki.5180kasoki.5180 Member ✭✭✭

    I have to admit I didn't even understand how she died, who killed her and who burried her.
    It is implied she was killed by Sons of Svanir and burried by Bangar, but it's all up in the air.

    But the biggest issue I have with this is if she has been dead "for some time" then how long was Jhavi actually in that cave? Timeline seems to be a bit off

  • @kasoki.5180 said:
    But the biggest issue I have with this is if she has been dead "for some time" then how long was Jhavi actually in that cave? Timeline seems to be a bit off

    Since before we received the call from Almorra. Jhavi was in that cave for a while - hours, possibly a couple days.

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

  • To be honest ...I had no idea who Almorra was. I've played every episode and expansion and I understand from discussions I've seen that she was important but...well, I just don't remember her. Maybe I'm just a very aloof pact commander and don't bother to remember the names or faces of allies and subordinates. But then again, I never asked to be pact commander. I was just a guy, trying to make his way in the world, maybe selling some Hirathi trinkets on the side. I'm no leader, no hero. I never asked to lead an army and kill dragons and gods and dead dudes who wear a lot of jewellery. I should be in a tavern somewhere getting drunk and listening to other guys telling tales of killing dragons... uh, what was I saying. Right. Sorry about Almorra. She sounds like she was a nice person. I'll avenge her or something.

  • flog.3485flog.3485 Member ✭✭✭

    Tin foil hat theory: what if it was Jhavi who buried almorra ?

  • Konig Des Todes.2086Konig Des Todes.2086 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 25, 2019

    @flog.3485 said:
    Tin foil hat theory: what if it was Jhavi who buried almorra ?

    Then she would have known. Or are you implying that Jhavi is a sleeper agent, somehow making her way up to Darkrime Delves and back south with zero visible tracks, and that Torrin and Olar were willing sacrificial pawns? Because that seems... unlikely. And stupidly convoluted - e.g., something they'd claim only if they decided to turn Jhavi into a sleeper after writing and releasing this episode.

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 25, 2019

    @flog.3485 said:
    Tin foil hat theory: what if it was Jhavi who buried almorra ?

    Will fall in a various "loops" of plot twists into a plot twists. first which intention? to make everyone think was Bangar did it?
    Also certain roles leaves some 'footprints', Jhavi doesnt seem designed to be some sort of "infiltrator".

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • Brycar.2651Brycar.2651 Member ✭✭✭

    I assumed ryland buried her and he was / is her double agent mole.

  • flog.3485flog.3485 Member ✭✭✭

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

    @flog.3485 said:
    Tin foil hat theory: what if it was Jhavi who buried almorra ?

    Then she would have known. Or are you implying that Jhavi is a sleeper agent, somehow making her way up to Darkrime Delves and back south with zero visible tracks, and that Torrin and Olar were willing sacrificial pawns? Because that seems... unlikely. And stupidly convoluted - e.g., something they'd claim only if they decided to turn Jhavi into a sleeper after writing and releasing this episode.

    Well I just wanted to say that we don’t know what almorra being dead “for quite some time” really means. And that it would be in the best interest of Jormag to have a sleeper agent close to the commanders’ circle of trust.
    Torrin and Olar don’t need to know everything, they are just fanatics that would be replaced by two another fanatics.

    But I agree with you, it seems highly unlikely.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭

    a bit "Offtopic" not so "offtopic" if u are charr the dialogue when we find the corpse is added with "your warband is proud of you".

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • Knuckle Joe.7408Knuckle Joe.7408 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 5, 2019

    With all due respect, I don't get you people. Why would you want a real life, soldier's, "boring" death in a fantasy story? There was so much potential to be taken with Almorra, something worth remembering, something that made you say WOW, I dunno. This "natural" soldier's death feels like an excuse to do less work. Like I said, it's just how in GoT we all had this expectation of a beloved character, the Black Fish, putting up a great fight, only to be killed offscreen.

    Perhaps the death wouldn't be so bad if we didn't just show up and welp, that's it for the Vigil's founder. Maybe an eulogy with a nice cinematic (hopefully we get that in next chapter). I DUNNO, anything but just her model lazily thrown there in that random spot.

    The entire history of Almorra has been fighting dragons, I was expecting her to die a glorious death fighting dragons because this is a cinematic, fantasy tale, not a history textbook.

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Tragedy's a form of pay-off in its own right, and while I don't feel they delivered on that particularly well with Almorra, I do see why they would go for it. (Especially when heroes failing to meet the expectations placed on them, and grappling with the resulting disappointment and scorn, seems like it's going to be something of a theme this season- Braham, Rytlock, even Bangar have had varying degrees of it just in the first two releases.)

    And, speaking for myself? This was quite a bit more memorable than most of the heroic deaths ANet has thrown at us. The obviously off voice com, spending a whole episode trying to catch up with her and figure out what was up with it, finding out that she was dead before we even arrived and that another entity entirely had spoken through her corpse without our knowing... again, there are places where the delivery failed the concept, but what they pulled off is still going to stick with me longer than, say, what happened to Trahearne.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭

    At least its give a opportunity to a glorious and bloody revenge.

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • whoeverxwins.1279whoeverxwins.1279 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 7, 2019

    I wonder if it was the boneskinner. I happened on an "event" near the keep. Had the event tag, so went to talk to the Vigil soldier. Suddenly she screamed, the boneskinner appeared, and killed her. The map honestly needs more of this to make the boneskinner creepier. So maybe it did get her. Wasn't the cave near the boneskinner's lair?

  • @whoeverxwins.1279 said:
    I wonder if it was the boneskinner. I happened on an "event" near the keep. Had the event tag, so went to talk to the Vigil soldier. Suddenly she screamed, the boneskinner appeared, and killed her. The map honestly needs more of this to make the boneskinner creepier. So maybe it did get her. Wasn't the cave near the boneskinner's lair?

    Jhavi was taken to the Boneskinner's lair. Where Almorra died was across the map.

    And there are multiple traps like that throughout the map. Like the buried vigil not far from that vigil recruit you found (further south); and there's an abandoned campfire near Aesgir's Legacy where the Boneskinner spawns.

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

  • @Kalavier.1097 said:

    @Konig Des Todes.2086 said:
    TBH, Almorra's story was done. There was only downhill for this character from here the moment of Kralkatorrik's death.

    Honestly, I wonder if there was a way to end her story that didn't result in any complaining, besides something related to Kralkatorrik's final battle.

    If Bangar is the one who buried her, that's at least an interesting final act between the two.

    I feel the same Bangar or Ryland had buried her.....

  • I have to say I knew she was dead from the get-go. Maybe it's being brought up on horror movies but when somebody you know calls you and talks to you in a slow, spooky voice you know it's not them. Even the PC knew it wasn't them. It's just some monster wearing their skin or something. She was dead before the episode started, so I never expected to see her die in front of me. As to whether her death was wasted or not heroic enough, I don't know. Eir's death wasn't heroic imho. It was pathetically executed, so maybe it's better for Almora that we didn't see her death. I'm not sure Anet could pull it off respectfully.

  • Perihen the Thawk.9527Perihen the Thawk.9527 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 12, 2019

    Maybe this is a bit too speculative, but I sort of have the feeling that Bangar might have killed her rather than the Svanir/Icebrood. She escaped from the Svanir, after all. I have a feeling Bangar's army was coming through and they found her. We already saw that Almorra and Bangar have a pretty tense relationship, and given that Almorra is the resident Dragonslayer, we can be pretty sure that she would not have approved of Bangar's plan to "tame" Jormag or whatever it is exactly he's gonna try to do.

    I think Almorra found out Bangar's plan and was going to throw a wrench in the whole thing somehow. And he killed her. She may not like him, she may think the plan is reckless, but she probably didn't expect her own imperator to attack her like that, so she was caught off guard. "Slash marks" could easily be Charr claws.

    But she's still Blood Legion, she's still Charr, so he felt some remorse and buried her. So far Bangar hasn't really done anything "villainous", he just has a really stupid plan that's going to get lots of people killed, but he does want to help his people. When we find out what happened, this will be the action that firmly pushes Bangar into "villain" territory.

    This is all just a hunch, but I can't shake the feeling that this is what they're setting up.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 13, 2019

    @Perihen the Thawk.9527 said:
    I think Almorra found out Bangar's plan and was going to throw a wrench in the whole thing somehow. And he killed her. She may not like him, she may think the plan is reckless, but she probably didn't expect her own imperator to attack her like that, so she was caught off guard. "Slash marks" could easily be Charr claws.

    very unlikely,
    A backstab style atack would unfit Bangar character build up too much. There is also a built-up around the "bangar is not that bad" being pushed by Crecia Stoneglow. But of course, we have a history of writers throwing plots before, and then the thing had a 180º turn and Bangar simple turn into "evil guy need killed asap", but til now it will be very unfit. A backstab atack will enable the full rage of commander and the others.

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • Aaron Ansari.1604Aaron Ansari.1604 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 13, 2019

    @ugrakarma.9416 said:

    @Perihen the Thawk.9527 said:
    I think Almorra found out Bangar's plan and was going to throw a wrench in the whole thing somehow. And he killed her. She may not like him, she may think the plan is reckless, but she probably didn't expect her own imperator to attack her like that, so she was caught off guard. "Slash marks" could easily be Charr claws.

    very unlikely,
    A backstab style atack would unfit Bangar character build up too much. There is also a built-up around the "bangar is not that bad" being pushed by Crecia Stoneglow. But of course, we have a history of writers throwing plots before, and then the thing had a 180º turn and Bangar simple turn into "evil guy need killed asap", but til now it will be very unfit. A backstab atack will enable the full rage of commander and the others.

    Maybe... but it wouldn't need to be a backstab, would it? Blood Legion has a proud tradition of personal challenges, fought to the death. If Almorra called him out in front of his closest supporters, I could see that devolving into a showdown, and considering what Almorra had just gone through, it wouldn't be any surprise if Bangar won it.

    R.I.P., Old Man of Auld Red Wharf. Gone but never forgotten.

  • I wouldn't say that a backstab style attack is unfitting of Bangar. He's a strategist, cunning and brutal. He makes deals behind the backs of his allies with their enemies. So why would a bit of steel-based treachery be beyond him when word-based treachery isn't?

    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.
    All these squares make a circle.

  • @Knuckle Joe.7408 said:
    What's up with the death of Almorra... that was a disgrace. Though a secondary, supporting character, Almorra has been with us since the beginning. She was far more important than other NPCs, yet some others like useless Eir at least have one last cinematic. She founded the vigil, she survived Kral's rise kitten, and you kill her off-screen just like that. Incredibly disssapointed and TBH kinda angry. So much potential wasted.

    EDIT: Just noticed I posted this in lore. My bad lsot track of the subforum I was in, if a mod feels like this should be in general disc. please move!

    Yawn. Hate to break it to you, Knuckle Joe, but aside from Almorra avoiding Kralkatorrik's branding I really didn't find her character all that interesting. And of course, no one in Anet was going to address that mystery. They just said she was "outside the dragonbrand". She was overdue to die, more likely. I guess Jormy just wanted Tom and Bobby to quit messing around.