For a future Elite spec, I would like another class to get Minions like Necro, or pet like Ranger — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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For a future Elite spec, I would like another class to get Minions like Necro, or pet like Ranger

Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

Comments

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Please no, ai's are annoying for player and opponent, they tried it with scrapper, and scrapped it, because it was so bad.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    Please no, ai's are annoying for player and opponent, they tried it with scrapper, and scrapped it, because it was so bad.

    Was so good that they had to remove it from guardian as well.

  • Lily.1935Lily.1935 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

    Pets are a profession mechanic, not a utility skill. I personally am perfectly fine with minions and things like Turrets and spirits being given to other classes, but pets are a no. Can't remove what makes Ranger unique.

    Who could have Minions? Engineer with highly technical Robot Minions using their utility skills in combination for some unique strategies, Elementalist with elemental minions that might be a bit lower in numbers but they could do something unique with it like each minion skill adds to a single powerful minion that warps and changes based on the skills added and element attuned, Revenant with extremely short lived minions that are more spammable with their energy system not sure how they could work exactly, but those would be my picks aside from Necromancer.

    As for Turrets? Ranger could have some interesting nature turrets which could be cool, not sure what they'd do but I imaging more along the lines of upgraded sylvari "turret" skills. There is also Elementalist which could drop totem like turrets which could almost act like short ranged banners as opposed to the more offensive nature of engineer, perhaps even act like the GW1 wards which could be a unique idea for a support spec for ele. Guardian could also gain turrets as well or even warrior.

    As for Spirits The necromancer could use spirits extremely well as could the elementalist. Revenant's mechanic unfortunately is antithetical to the mechanics that spirits require which is why we got renegade instead... Also they don't get shared utility types, something that frustrates me to no end. Guardian is the last one that could get spirits, since they've already had spirit weapons.

    I love summons. A lot of players don't. GW2 hasn't had good summon mechanics or counter play to summons. Which is a shame because I would really enjoy a proper Minion Master elite spec for necromancer especially.

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lily.1935 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

    Pets are a profession mechanic, not a utility skill. I personally am perfectly fine with minions and things like Turrets and spirits being given to other classes, but pets are a no. Can't remove what makes Ranger unique.

    Well Elite specs come with mechanics most of the time. Ranger Pet could be a mechanic for other classes if done in a unique way. By myself I have come up with a few Elite Spec ideas that use Pet(ranger mechanics) on a different non Ranger class. So if I could come up with that by myself, its possible for a team of developers to do the same, if not come up with more.

    Who could have Minions? Engineer with highly technical Robot Minions using their utility skills in combination for some unique strategies, Elementalist with elemental minions that might be a bit lower in numbers but they could do something unique with it like each minion skill adds to a single powerful minion that warps and changes based on the skills added and element attuned, Revenant with extremely short lived minions that are more spammable with their energy system not sure how they could work exactly, but those would be my picks aside from Necromancer.

    Many classes can have Minions, like some of the examples you mentioned.
    Warrior- Squires, Beast
    Guardian - Squires, Angels, Spirits
    Revenants - just about anything due to their Mist magic connection to time and alternate dimensions.

    Engineer- Robots
    Thief - Bandits, Demons
    Ranger- Beast, Spirits, Plant Creatures

    Elementalist- Elementals, Spirits, Arcane Creatures
    Necromancers- More Necro minions, Demons, Undead
    Mesmer- Band Members, Doppelganger

    As for Turrets? Ranger could have some interesting nature turrets which could be cool, not sure what they'd do but I imaging more along the lines of upgraded sylvari "turret" skills. There is also Elementalist which could drop totem like turrets which could almost act like short ranged banners as opposed to the more offensive nature of engineer, perhaps even act like the GW1 wards which could be a unique idea for a support spec for ele. Guardian could also gain turrets as well or even warrior.

    I had a number of Turret elite spec ideas for multiple classes as well.

    Warrior- Same steampunk turrets
    Guardian- Spirits
    Reventents- Steampunk Turrets and Spirits

    Ranger- Nature Plant Turrets
    Engineer- more engineer turrets
    Thief- Steampunk Turrets

    Necromancer- Bone Turrets
    Elementalist- Elemental Totems
    Mesmer- Orbs

    As for Spirits The necromancer could use spirits extremely well as could the elementalist. Revenant's mechanic unfortunately is antithetical to the mechanics that spirits require which is why we got renegade instead... Also they don't get shared utility types, something that frustrates me to no end. Guardian is the last one that could get spirits, since they've already had spirit weapons.

    I love summons. A lot of players don't. GW2 hasn't had good summon mechanics or counter play to summons. Which is a shame because I would really enjoy a proper Minion Master elite spec for necromancer especially.

  • Lily.1935Lily.1935 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Well Elite specs come with mechanics most of the time. Ranger Pet could be a mechanic for other classes if done in a unique way. By myself I have come up with a few Elite Spec ideas that use Pet(ranger mechanics) on a different non Ranger class. So if I could come up with that by myself, its possible for a team of developers to do the same, if not come up with more.

    Its not about whether or not Anet could make another class use pets, they absolutely could, its about class identity. The ranger's identity involves their wild companion. If another class got that it would strip away what makes the the ranger unique. Imagine if warriors got elemental attunments for example. Although that might be kinda cool looking it would undermine the identity of the elmentalist. Same problem here.

  • The idea is nice but without a reworking of this mechanic I wouldn't want to see it on any other profession.

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lily.1935 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Well Elite specs come with mechanics most of the time. Ranger Pet could be a mechanic for other classes if done in a unique way. By myself I have come up with a few Elite Spec ideas that use Pet(ranger mechanics) on a different non Ranger class. So if I could come up with that by myself, its possible for a team of developers to do the same, if not come up with more.

    Its not about whether or not Anet could make another class use pets, they absolutely could, its about class identity. The ranger's identity involves their wild companion. If another class got that it would strip away what makes the the ranger unique. Imagine if warriors got elemental attunments for example. Although that might be kinda cool looking it would undermine the identity of the elmentalist. Same problem here.

    Not at all. Because that's what Elite Specs been pretty much, GW2 version of dual classes. GW1 classes didn't have mechanics only the skills did. So it didn't need to cross up mechanics. But in GW2, Elite specs open things up.

    Looking at the identity argument, let's take a look at Warriors. What is Warrior's identity? Weapons and physical combat? Well if that's the case no class should get weapons and physical combat right?

    A Warrior with Elementalist Attunement could be unique in theme but mechanically identical, such as traditional stance dances for warriors in older MMOs. So not a reach.
    Same with "Pets". Again anything can be themed into a "Pet", and I use that term loosely here because when talking about Ranger pet I want to be clear that I am talking about the mechanics alone not specifically an animal like Rangers although it could still be an animal. Because Pets and Minions are different things in the game. I gave a few examples of a Warrior "pet" such as a Knight's Squire or a Beast. Can be anything honestly with the right imagination.

  • Yannir.4132Yannir.4132 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Lily.1935 said:
    Its not about whether or not Anet could make another class use pets, they absolutely could, its about class identity. The ranger's identity involves their wild companion. If another class got that it would strip away what makes the the ranger unique. Imagine if warriors got elemental attunments for example. Although that might be kinda cool looking it would undermine the identity of the elmentalist. Same problem here.

    Warlocks in WoW have a demonic companion and that doesn't take anything away from Hunters and their animal companions. I don't see how the same would somehow not apply to GW2. Ranger is the designated pet class of GW2 currently but I don't see why it would have to remain that way forever.

    Necromancer is probably the first in line to gain a pet mechanic. If they did gain a pet demon for example, they would likely just get a single pet with no swapping. Having a single pet practically requires that you are able to heal/resurrect your infernal friend, especially if the mechanic replaces DS. The Life Force mechanics of Necromancer convert excellently into the purpose of healing a companion.

    Funnily enough, Ranger is probably first in line to gain Minions. It would likely be some kind of aggressive druidic crittermancer that summons hordes of small animals against their opponents. Summoning a horde of Pocket Raptors against your opponents would be pretty dang cool.

  • LucianDK.8615LucianDK.8615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 23, 2019

    You dont want to gain necromancer pets. Since they are tied to utility skills, any time you get a transform that -isnt- shroud your minions gets deleted and put on cd. Furthermore mounting up or down sometimes deletes your pets as well, seems to be quite inconsistent about what precisely triggers it.

  • Aeolus.3615Aeolus.3615 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 23, 2019

    An heavy golem would be interesting, aka diablo3 big golem ;p

    Maybe with a bow or sword main.

  • I would like to see a ranger style necromancer elite that revolves around animal minions. Something where the necro has to acquire a pet before it can be used as a minion with the same full scope of pets as ranger has, but each pet minion brings a different skill & benefit that are similar to those of the same pet on ranger, with the life force mechanic being used for summoning the pet possibly with a trait for sharing damage from necro to pet, or something along those lines.

  • JohnWater.5760JohnWater.5760 Member ✭✭
    edited November 23, 2019

    Elementalista needs a rework
    Summoning the elementals like Necro
    Summoning weapons like Engineer

    @Moira Shalaar.5620 said:
    I would like to see a ranger style necromancer elite that revolves around animal minions. Something where the necro has to acquire a pet before it can be used as a minion with the same full scope of pets as ranger has, but each pet minion brings a different skill & benefit that are similar to those of the same pet on ranger, with the life force mechanic being used for summoning the pet possibly with a trait for sharing damage from necro to pet, or something along those lines.

    Amazing ideia.

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 24, 2019

    @Moira Shalaar.5620 said:
    I would like to see a ranger style necromancer elite that revolves around animal minions. Something where the necro has to acquire a pet before it can be used as a minion with the same full scope of pets as ranger has, but each pet minion brings a different skill & benefit that are similar to those of the same pet on ranger, with the life force mechanic being used for summoning the pet possibly with a trait for sharing damage from necro to pet, or something along those lines.

    Great idea, but I would make the necro pets unique for Necro and would like the task of unlocking them in the game world like Ranger. Different kind of creatures. Especially if something like this is released in an expansion with new Maps and stuff like that would be great to explore on necro and hunt down monsters to add to my Necro pets and use Life Force in some way to make the pets grow in power and consume life force when pet uses its skills.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27, 2019

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

    'Necromancers , calling on the spirits of the dead, and even death itself, to overpower enemies and assist allies.'

    'Rangers are unique in their ability to succeed with the help of, or even in spite of, their environment. Nature rituals allow them to manipulate the environment to hinder their enemies, or borrow the very power of creation to heal and aid their allies'

    'They are the only profession with the ability to charm animals, which then accompany them on their travels and assist them in battle, gaining experience and levels over time'

    No, thank you

  • @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

    'Necromancers , calling on the spirits of the dead, and even death itself, to overpower enemies and assist allies.'

    'Rangers are unique in their ability to succeed with the help of, or even in spite of, their environment. Nature rituals allow them to manipulate the environment to hinder their enemies, or borrow the very power of creation to heal and aid their allies'

    'They are the only profession with the ability to charm animals, which then accompany them on their travels and assist them in battle, gaining experience and levels over time'

    No, thank you

    Actually I wasn't thinking charming animals so much as raising dead animals as Pet minions. They are necromancers after all.

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Moira Shalaar.5620 said:

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

    'Necromancers , calling on the spirits of the dead, and even death itself, to overpower enemies and assist allies.'

    'Rangers are unique in their ability to succeed with the help of, or even in spite of, their environment. Nature rituals allow them to manipulate the environment to hinder their enemies, or borrow the very power of creation to heal and aid their allies'

    'They are the only profession with the ability to charm animals, which then accompany them on their travels and assist them in battle, gaining experience and levels over time'

    No, thank you

    Actually I wasn't thinking charming animals so much as raising dead animals as Pet minions. They are necromancers after all.

    I hear ya. I was thinking about creatures other than just animals though. Like other monsters and stuff.

  • I'd be fine with that too.

  • Thornwolf.9721Thornwolf.9721 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Necromancer: Warlock, demon summon which has three unique natures based on trait combinations in the tree. (Maybe could summon up to three of them)
    Revenant: ravager, an elite spec that makes it so whenever you legend swap you gain minions associated with that legend. The legend accompanying this elite spec could be Joko or any other being known to be able to summon anything withing the guild wars lore.
    Guardian: Ritualist, summons spirits and gains ashes to replace its virtues nuff said.
    Warrior: Monk, Gains the staff as a casting weapon and summons forth the ancestral spirits from beyond and uses their ancestral might to heal allies and smite foes.
    Engineer:Golem-mancer, nuff said.
    Elementalist: Shaman: summons elementals in hordes to do their dirty work.
    Ranger: Wicker-mancer: Summons wicker creatures to overwhelm enemies alongside their pet

    All are decent themes as to what we could good~ just ideas thrown out there but stuff im sure A-net will never do. Im fairly keen on the idea that we will never see another set of Specs, classes or anything.

  • Kas.3509Kas.3509 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 28, 2019

    I'd like that too! I love pet classes. (but I would love to see more specs for the game, at least 3 for each class).
    I'd also like mesmer to have specialization with permanent summon instead of 3 clones.
    Mesmer healer spec with bow with music involved - like a bard :D Mesmer and his illusionary harp/lute that follows him everywhere :lol:
    Maybe thief with his shadow would be interesting to see too?

  • I'd love a golemancer Engineer spec. Single pet with utilities or belt skills that activate through the golem. There's lots of cool ideas you could run with, with a golemancer.

    Sounds cool so obviously it won't happen.

  • Good. I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one that likes pet classes, and wants to see more elite builds that have them.

    Since this topic has come up, I think I'll go ahead and throw a few of my ideas in, while I have the chance.

    Rangers getting two permanent pets. Just because I like the idea of mixing and matching them to see which ones work well together. They could also get rifle to help range condi (since we lack good range condi on this class, and already have longbow for power builds). And maybe burst skills as our f5, that augment our pets in some way.

    Engineer getting a golem pet that they can get inside and turn into a mechsuit. Machine guns, missiles, maybe a mechsword for the auto attack chain. Sounds like it would be fun to play with.

    • They could also buff turrets more. Maybe allow them to cooldown while they're active. So instead of firing them and immediately destroying them, we could actually leave them out, and let them cooldown in the background. They don't move or have a lot of effect or damage. I don't see why they are so hamstringed by their design.

    Elementalist getting an permanent elemental pet that changes elements as the elementalist changes attunements. It gets different skills per element to keep its output flowing, just as an elementalist does with its attunements. That and some of elementalist's built in support would actually benefit something when the elementalist is alone and soloing.

    • They also could rework the two glyph of elementals to be much better.

    Necromancers getting a more minion focused build, or perhaps a bigger and more powerful minion would be nice. Though I don't really see them doing this.

    • Minions could get some more love though. New skins, for starters, so they aren't so kitten ugly. Lower cooldowns, faster summoning time, or even allow them to auto summon. Fleshworm may need a slight rework so it can follow the necro at a distance (Which would allow for its teleport to still be useful. It could break stuns and remove movement impairing conditions.)

    Guard's could have their virtue skills become permanent (divine?) spirits you summon, that embodies the themes of the virtues they stem from. Justice would be dps and fire. Resolve would be more healer support. Courage would be a tank and boons. Each having a command skill you could use corresponding to their associated virtues. That and like the elementalist, guard is a bit more group centric, so having your own little group, if even spirits, would be cool.

    Obviously these are all pet focused. But that is the topic, and, well, i love pets. They can be incredibly fun to play with.

    I sincerely hope there are new elite specializations coming very soon!

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Pets nah.. but Minions yes.

    I've long been a supporter of Summoner playstyles for other classes, specifically Elementalist mostly.
    I see no reason what so ever why Elementalist shouldn't be able to summon and maintain a small army of elemental constructs.

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Revanent.9715 said:
    Good. I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one that likes pet classes, and wants to see more elite builds that have them.

    Since this topic has come up, I think I'll go ahead and throw a few of my ideas in, while I have the chance.

    Rangers getting two permanent pets. Just because I like the idea of mixing and matching them to see which ones work well together. They could also get rifle to help range condi (since we lack good range condi on this class, and already have longbow for power builds). And maybe burst skills as our f5, that augment our pets in some way.

    Engineer getting a golem pet that they can get inside and turn into a mechsuit. Machine guns, missiles, maybe a mechsword for the auto attack chain. Sounds like it would be fun to play with.

    • They could also buff turrets more. Maybe allow them to cooldown while they're active. So instead of firing them and immediately destroying them, we could actually leave them out, and let them cooldown in the background. They don't move or have a lot of effect or damage. I don't see why they are so hamstringed by their design.

    Elementalist getting an permanent elemental pet that changes elements as the elementalist changes attunements. It gets different skills per element to keep its output flowing, just as an elementalist does with its attunements. That and some of elementalist's built in support would actually benefit something when the elementalist is alone and soloing.

    • They also could rework the two glyph of elementals to be much better.

    Necromancers getting a more minion focused build, or perhaps a bigger and more powerful minion would be nice. Though I don't really see them doing this.

    • Minions could get some more love though. New skins, for starters, so they aren't so kitten ugly. Lower cooldowns, faster summoning time, or even allow them to auto summon. Fleshworm may need a slight rework so it can follow the necro at a distance (Which would allow for its teleport to still be useful. It could break stuns and remove movement impairing conditions.)

    Guard's could have their virtue skills become permanent (divine?) spirits you summon, that embodies the themes of the virtues they stem from. Justice would be dps and fire. Resolve would be more healer support. Courage would be a tank and boons. Each having a command skill you could use corresponding to their associated virtues. That and like the elementalist, guard is a bit more group centric, so having your own little group, if even spirits, would be cool.

    Obviously these are all pet focused. But that is the topic, and, well, i love pets. They can be incredibly fun to play with.

    I sincerely hope there are new elite specializations coming very soon!

    this gave me an idea for Guardian Elite spec mechanics

  • Sarrs.4831Sarrs.4831 Member ✭✭✭
    edited November 29, 2019

    A while ago I thought a Golemancer spec for Engineers, which has a permanent Golem pet to replace the toolbelt, might be fun. You'd build a pet out of whichever utilities you use and it'll do its thing; you can command it to use Utility toolbelt skills. Whichever elite skill you take builds the 'base' of the golem; Elixir gives you a melee buffing golem, Supply Drop gives you a midrange golem with guns and flamethrowers, Mortar Kit gives you an artillery golem. Maybe you could have a GMaster trait that lets you hop into the mech and control it personally, like Taimi does, and you play like Dva.

  • Stephen.6312Stephen.6312 Member ✭✭✭

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:

    @Lily.1935 said:

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:
    Since elite specs are GW2's way of doing the dual class concept from the original game, I would like to see a new class elite spec, that introduce new minion skills similar to Necromancer minions to a different class, or a Pet like Ranger's pet concept to a different class, but with a different theme than being an Animal.

    Pets are a profession mechanic, not a utility skill. I personally am perfectly fine with minions and things like Turrets and spirits being given to other classes, but pets are a no. Can't remove what makes Ranger unique.

    Well Elite specs come with mechanics most of the time. Ranger Pet could be a mechanic for other classes if done in a unique way. By myself I have come up with a few Elite Spec ideas that use Pet(ranger mechanics) on a different non Ranger class. So if I could come up with that by myself, its possible for a team of developers to do the same, if not come up with more.

    Who could have Minions? Engineer with highly technical Robot Minions using their utility skills in combination for some unique strategies, Elementalist with elemental minions that might be a bit lower in numbers but they could do something unique with it like each minion skill adds to a single powerful minion that warps and changes based on the skills added and element attuned, Revenant with extremely short lived minions that are more spammable with their energy system not sure how they could work exactly, but those would be my picks aside from Necromancer.

    Many classes can have Minions, like some of the examples you mentioned.
    Warrior- Squires, Beast
    Guardian - Squires, Angels, Spirits
    Revenants - just about anything due to their Mist magic connection to time and alternate dimensions.

    Engineer- Robots
    Thief - Bandits, Demons
    Ranger- Beast, Spirits, Plant Creatures

    Elementalist- Elementals, Spirits, Arcane Creatures
    Necromancers- More Necro minions, Demons, Undead
    Mesmer- Band Members, Doppelganger

    As for Turrets? Ranger could have some interesting nature turrets which could be cool, not sure what they'd do but I imaging more along the lines of upgraded sylvari "turret" skills. There is also Elementalist which could drop totem like turrets which could almost act like short ranged banners as opposed to the more offensive nature of engineer, perhaps even act like the GW1 wards which could be a unique idea for a support spec for ele. Guardian could also gain turrets as well or even warrior.

    I had a number of Turret elite spec ideas for multiple classes as well.

    Warrior- Same steampunk turrets
    Guardian- Spirits
    Reventents- Steampunk Turrets and Spirits

    Ranger- Nature Plant Turrets
    Engineer- more engineer turrets
    Thief- Steampunk Turrets

    Necromancer- Bone Turrets
    Elementalist- Elemental Totems
    Mesmer- Orbs

    As for Spirits The necromancer could use spirits extremely well as could the elementalist. Revenant's mechanic unfortunately is antithetical to the mechanics that spirits require which is why we got renegade instead... Also they don't get shared utility types, something that frustrates me to no end. Guardian is the last one that could get spirits, since they've already had spirit weapons.

    I love summons. A lot of players don't. GW2 hasn't had good summon mechanics or counter play to summons. Which is a shame because I would really enjoy a proper Minion Master elite spec for necromancer especially.

    I love your creativity, but no. This would be a disaster for class identity.

  • LadyKitty.6120LadyKitty.6120 Member ✭✭✭

    We don't quite need more. Necro has minions, ranger has pet, mesmer has illusions, ele has elementals, thief has thief summon, engi kinda has turrets. Only warr and rene lack minion-like thing.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who streams and records videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks and streams at twitch.tv/ladykittygw2 .

  • Honestly Renegade would really fit the bill for a minion oriented type skillset. Kalla summons as they currently are are kinda awful, they're stuck in this weird limbo of being wells and actual minions and it just leads to scenarios like them getting CC'd and not doing anything, summoned to only die immediately or nobody actually standing in their AoE's so they don't end up doing anything in the long run or straight up not summoning them at all because of terrian issues. I'd say just rework the Kalla skills into full fledged minions, that way they're more useful and you can have an actual spooky charr warband fight with you, it's a win/win.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 15, 2020

    As other says, about Engineer Profession, I do to would like Engineer Profession to have pets 'minions'

    Golemancer sound interesting

  • Samug.6512Samug.6512 Member ✭✭✭

    Yes, let's give engi minions. Hmm, how about small flying copters that follow you and perform some action? Oh wait, they tried it and failed miserably.

    Oh, how about stationary robots that would improve area control? Oh wait... It's already here, they didn't even try.

    No. More. AI. Minions.

    [NUKE]

  • Knighthonor.4061Knighthonor.4061 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Samug.6512 said:
    Yes, let's give engi minions. Hmm, how about small flying copters that follow you and perform some action? Oh wait, they tried it and failed miserably.

    Oh, how about stationary robots that would improve area control? Oh wait... It's already here, they didn't even try.

    No. More. AI. Minions.

    Wait Gyros are considered Minions or wells that follow you? Oh wait

  • Samug.6512Samug.6512 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 15, 2020

    @Knighthonor.4061 said:

    @Samug.6512 said:
    Yes, let's give engi minions. Hmm, how about small flying copters that follow you and perform some action? Oh wait, they tried it and failed miserably.

    Oh, how about stationary robots that would improve area control? Oh wait... It's already here, they didn't even try.

    No. More. AI. Minions.

    Wait Gyros are considered Minions or wells that follow you? Oh wait

    Are you serious? Did you forget the 4 past years when gyros were separate entities? Why do you think they changed them to Wells?

    (I'm referring to that with the 1st part of my previous post in case you're still not following)

    [NUKE]

  • Stephen.6312Stephen.6312 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 15, 2020

    I think that you're suggestion is a terrible idea. The game is inundated with NPC-assisted DPS as it is. Ranger pets, although unique to the class, are a problem. Mesmer phantasms and clones are a problem. Necromancer minions, too. The list could probably be larger. But all of these "minions" represent an aspect of a class that interferes with core mechanics within the game. They were a bad concept and bringing in more won't change that.

  • Elementalist liferally just became this with Glyph of Lesser Elementals and Elemental. You can have upto 4 elementals at once.

  • Kodama.6453Kodama.6453 Member ✭✭✭

    I think the most likely candidates for such an elite spec would be the Thief or the Warrior.
    Every other class has some kind of minion mechanic already in the game.

    Revenant - Renegade summons
    Ranger - Pet and spirits
    Engineer - Turrets
    Elementalist - Elementals
    Necromancer - Minions
    Mesmer - Clones and Phantasms

    The Warrior has no units to summon at all and the Thief just has an elite skill.

  • @Moira Shalaar.5620 said:
    I would like to see a ranger style necromancer elite that revolves around animal minions. Something where the necro has to acquire a pet before it can be used as a minion with the same full scope of pets as ranger has, but each pet minion brings a different skill & benefit that are similar to those of the same pet on ranger, with the life force mechanic being used for summoning the pet possibly with a trait for sharing damage from necro to pet, or something along those lines.

    Why duplicate a Ranger as another profession's Elite? As Kodama notes, most classes already have minion mechanics. (Actually, they underestimate things: Engineers have two different minion mechanisms: Turrets in base, and Gyros (mobile Turrets) in an Elite spec.)

    Not to mention that minions and pets have been problematic in terms of behavior and reliability for a long time and building an Elite around them would probably not be a good idea mechanics-wise. And balancing pets is very hard: they can't do so much damage that you can stand back and have them defeat anything, but neither can the toon have so much damage that the pet simply puts you over the top. Pets are also not very compelling in general. They tend to distance you from active participation -- which sometimes you want, but in general it's a cancer that gives the whole profession a bad name. Specs that have pets or tough minions (Ranger, Necromancer) are generally regarded as lower skill and become boring after a while. (A pet/minion is never going to provide the interactivity that the player can provide via direct-control skills.)

    That said, with sufficient imagination, it just might work. For example, a Warrior might spec into "Commander" and basically give them some "soldiers" that they command. To avoid being overpowered, the Commander would have to lose stats, skills, etc, during any encounter that they used soldiers. Maybe a Commander's Mindset debuff, or something? That doesn't really appeal to me -- and I think most Warrior players would hate it, too -- but if there's no tradeoff you'd end up with weak minions that are just fodder.

  • Kodama.6453Kodama.6453 Member ✭✭✭

    @Druitt.7629 said:

    @Moira Shalaar.5620 said:
    I would like to see a ranger style necromancer elite that revolves around animal minions. Something where the necro has to acquire a pet before it can be used as a minion with the same full scope of pets as ranger has, but each pet minion brings a different skill & benefit that are similar to those of the same pet on ranger, with the life force mechanic being used for summoning the pet possibly with a trait for sharing damage from necro to pet, or something along those lines.

    Why duplicate a Ranger as another profession's Elite? As Kodama notes, most classes already have minion mechanics. (Actually, they underestimate things: Engineers have two different minion mechanisms: Turrets in base, and Gyros (mobile Turrets) in an Elite spec.)

    Not to mention that minions and pets have been problematic in terms of behavior and reliability for a long time and building an Elite around them would probably not be a good idea mechanics-wise. And balancing pets is very hard: they can't do so much damage that you can stand back and have them defeat anything, but neither can the toon have so much damage that the pet simply puts you over the top. Pets are also not very compelling in general. They tend to distance you from active participation -- which sometimes you want, but in general it's a cancer that gives the whole profession a bad name. Specs that have pets or tough minions (Ranger, Necromancer) are generally regarded as lower skill and become boring after a while. (A pet/minion is never going to provide the interactivity that the player can provide via direct-control skills.)

    That said, with sufficient imagination, it just might work. For example, a Warrior might spec into "Commander" and basically give them some "soldiers" that they command. To avoid being overpowered, the Commander would have to lose stats, skills, etc, during any encounter that they used soldiers. Maybe a Commander's Mindset debuff, or something? That doesn't really appeal to me -- and I think most Warrior players would hate it, too -- but if there's no tradeoff you'd end up with weak minions that are just fodder.

    Gyros used to be a minion type of skill, but they got changed into wells and therefore don't function like minions at all anymore.

  • Jheuloh.4109Jheuloh.4109 Member ✭✭
    edited March 14, 2020

    @Druitt.7629 said:
    Why duplicate a Ranger as another profession's Elite? As Kodama notes, most classes already have minion mechanics. (Actually, they underestimate things: Engineers have two different minion mechanisms: Turrets in base, and Gyros (mobile Turrets) in an Elite spec.)

    Not to mention that minions and pets have been problematic in terms of behavior and reliability for a long time and building an Elite around them would probably not be a good idea mechanics-wise. And balancing pets is very hard: they can't do so much damage that you can stand back and have them defeat anything, but neither can the toon have so much damage that the pet simply puts you over the top. Pets are also not very compelling in general. They tend to distance you from active participation -- which sometimes you want, but in general it's a cancer that gives the whole profession a bad name. Specs that have pets or tough minions (Ranger, Necromancer) are generally regarded as lower skill and become boring after a while. (A pet/minion is never going to provide the interactivity that the player can provide via direct-control skills.)

    That said, with sufficient imagination, it just might work. For example, a Warrior might spec into "Commander" and basically give them some "soldiers" that they command. To avoid being overpowered, the Commander would have to lose stats, skills, etc, during any encounter that they used soldiers. Maybe a Commander's Mindset debuff, or something? That doesn't really appeal to me -- and I think most Warrior players would hate it, too -- but if there's no tradeoff you'd end up with weak minions that are just fodder.

    On ranger pets, there was a missed opportunity for letting players manually activate their skills. (Putting aside the F2 skill.) To add insult to injury, most F2 skills are just damage bonuses that don't open up any interesting strategies.

    Something like the Smokescale has a knockdown ability (Good functionality being left to AI stupidity), Smoke Assault that lets it simultaneously evade and teleport to target (another great candidate for player control), and the 1 ability players actually can control; Smoke Field. It's an actual smoke field generated at the Smokescale's position, so I or player allies can use finishers with it.

    It might have been kinder on the balance team for pets/minions to be treated as living banners that do damage on top of delivering team buffs at the risk of being killed in combat. Tigers pounce & give Fury on F2, all Moas have an AOE healing ability(!) in their AI ability list and Fern Wolves have a healing howl as their F2 thing. The precedent is there but none of them have the potency and/or AOE range needed for allied players to reliably benefit from this stuff and nobody wants to stack around a stupid pet.