If you were a WvW developer for a year, in what order would you solve problems? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

If you were a WvW developer for a year, in what order would you solve problems?

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  • subversiontwo.7501subversiontwo.7501 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2019

    @Towelie.9504 and @Nemesis.9835 I have good news for you:

    • There already is a counter to stealths called reveals. They're pretty good and works against everything aside from one broken elite spec (that suffers from poor design more than balance)
    • They've just announced Warclaw rework for Q1 2020. Hopefully that means that they can stop wasting more time on that BS beyond those changes and hopefully the stomp goes away with it
    • The problem isn't the relinking it is the paid transfers. The relinking just provides flexibility to the paid transfers by shuffling the cheap servers around. I think most people don't understand that we would have had the current problems by now with or without relinking. Servers started dying when guilds started dying (and when the guilds that remained stopped transfering just to match up and started transfering to rebuild servers with other guilds and escape the dead weight building up; which built up with unaffiliation-centric crumbs off the update table, making guild/tag rebirth low)
    • Alliances is precisely aimed at achieving 3 and 4 so 5 does not seem plausible. 5 would likely mean the mode devolving back to primordial soup (aka. 2012)
    • Communication with "mainly wvw-players" most likely already happens it is just that it is much smaller in scope and you are not privy to it. You'd think you'd be apart of that group but you are not. Nore am I. Nore is it the only line of feedback and communication. It does however likely exist

    I think you guys need to dream bigger :)

  • Svarty.8019Svarty.8019 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2019

    @Towlie.9168 said:
    4. STOP RELINKING. (anet literlly cant control the population and if the try its a mess anyway. SO JUST STOP RELINKING and the community will balance it by itself)

    No. Relinking saved us from boring, empty matchups - sure, some of us (I'm one) enjoyed small-scale ninja stuff, but it's become a niche activity now that we have big, linked populations. The community doesn't magically balance itself - neoliberalism doesn't work.

    Thief OP? Better nerf Scourge ... again.
    Hashtag BlameMcLain

  • Diku.2546Diku.2546 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2020

    If your match-ups are boring...then move yourself...you can easily transfer yourself & not have to depend on ANet to Link you.

    Relinking of Servers & Languages is slowly poisoning the life out of our WvW game mode.

    The reality is that this type of Linking is systematically & methodologically killing off our Long-Term WvW ecosystem.

    Self-Proclaimed WvW Biologists insist that this is good for the WvW ecosystem, but they're ignorant in my opinion. Players like this only want somebody to do the Linking for them.

    Noob players before Server Linking previously migrated on their own as they matured in their understanding of WvW...typically from lower tier servers.

    Server Linking instead automatically dumps ALL players into the upper tiers regardless if they're prepared for WvW battles...where they're greedily eaten alive by the veteran sharks as zerg fodder.

    To the Self-Proclaimed WvW experts, veteran sharks, & trolls that didn't believe me then....

    I told you so...

    PREDICTION
    2016-06-11 - Over 3.5 Years Ago
    https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/WvW-Poll-6-June-World-Linking-Schedule-CLOSED/page/5

    FAILED
    Long Term WvW Ecosystem will depend upon ANet’s ability to skillfully manipulate Population & Score.


    Since then...I'll continue to plead that our WvW game mode can still be saved with a serious Step-by-Step Road Map & Vision to fix the things that carelessly is being damaged.

    When you damage an ecosystem...sometimes the right thing to do is to revert it back to what it was before...and hope nature takes hold & finds its course again.

    COMPREHENSIVE STEP-BY-STEP SOLUTION
    2019.10.05
    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/89449/wvg-world-vs-globes/p1

    ANet, please stop making poor decisions based on ignorance, wrong priorities, and "sunk costs".

    WvW needs a Serious Road Map & Concrete Vision to save this game mode that many of us love.

    Can we get past having all these recurring band-aid fix discussions that constantly go in circles & do absolutely NOTHING?

    Yours truly,
    Diku

    Credibility requires critical insight & time.

  • Towlie.9168Towlie.9168 Member ✭✭
    edited December 24, 2019

    @Svarty.8019 said:

    @Towlie.9168 said:
    4. STOP RELINKING. (anet literlly cant control the population and if the try its a mess anyway. SO JUST STOP RELINKING and the community will balance it by itself)

    No. Relinking saved us from boring, empty matchups - sure, some of us (I'm one) enjoyed small-scale ninja stuff, but it's become a niche activity now that we have big, linked populations. The community doesn't magically balance itself - neoliberalism doesn't work.

    i used the word balance, but its the wrong word. THE SERVERS DONT NEED TO BE BALANCED, like it was in the beginning and im pretty sure i can tell u why.
    Does it make it more exciting to fight 40v40 for a keep instead of 10v10 NO its just different. U had maybe even more lags anyway in a 40v40 fight.
    Before the linking i was on vabbi (low server) I still had fun on the server cuz the enemies were still kind of equal. After some time the server was kind of full dead awell as our opponents and wvw sadly died completly.
    After sometime they linked us with GH (GREAT DECISION) and WvW came back to life and i rly appreciated that decsion. (cuz linking dead servers with low populated servers makes sense)
    BUT WHY THE HELL u need to relink it over and over again?.... (TERRIBLE DECISION)
    If u want 50vs50vs50 fights lags and big qs go to the upper tiers.
    if u want nice smallscale fights and roam a lot go middle tier.
    If u rarly play wvw and dont want to play it to serious and competitive go lower tier.
    Its UR DECISION HOW U WANT TO PLAY WVW.

    I can tell u tryin to force ALL servers to be equal to have the same fightpower and population is literlly IMPOSSIBLE. If alliances will come out( just my opinion) but anet will destroy this mode completly

    JUST LINK the dead servers with the low populated servers (same language) and let it be. If another server dies link it with another low populated server.
    I dunno why there is a big drama and i dont know why ppl make rocketscience out of it.

    if u dont like ur situation on ur server in wvw TRANSFER...jesus

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    make wvw queue based like spvp

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • Maps are a joke, and the core system is the worst/simpliest boring thing i've ever seen in any RvR game; but since they wont rework that..

    1- No more stupid mounts
    2- Hub vendors moved to cities so people who enter WvW are ACTUALLY here to fight
    3-Make WvW meaningfull , structures should be way harder to take but should also take longer to build. Zerg trains is cancer
    4-Fix this boon spitting meta
    5-Gameplay in general should be slowed down. More risks/rewards move
    6-Find a real purpose to WvW competition other than just this stupid ladder no one cares about, make people wanna team up and actually win, other than just want to complete their kitten rewardpath. ACTUAL rewards at the end of a match up (maybe some great advancement in WvW XP and currencies towards legendary armor) AND no reward if your realm doesnt win.
    7- Rework this stupid WvW XP system that encourage zerging forts, as well as WvW rewards in general especially legendary armors which are a joke. How do you want to motivate people if they got 0 goal ?
    8- A real Alliance system (which won't happen ofc, they can't even add a proper build Template system what should i expect ?)

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭
    1. More mounts
    2. Air combat
    3. Climbing walls
    4. Gates walls less health
    5. Revert back to 5 ppl causing orange swords on gate
    6. 20 ppl in combat red swords to differentiate from 5
    7. No more 1v1v1 just a vs b
    8. Put 1 v1 v 1 in spvp
    9. Legendary weapons in wvw
    10. Can't make legendaries without completing wvw maps.
    11. All jumping puzzles like os.
    12. One eu vs na super gvg unique qualifier with unique rewards
    13. Beat devs in gvg event
    14. Make wvw the core of gw2

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • I'd remove mounts from WvW.

    Then my boss would say this isn't possible because they generate too much money via skins.

    Then I quickly realize the sad reality of the gaming industry and realize there's no hope.

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I'd add tournaments with unique titles rewards and feature the team in the front page.

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • I would implement a new tactics that would allow guilds to change the layout of captured areas.
    The ability to make open field paper walls using supply of course there would be some no build zones like in front of a gate.
    Allow guilds to give unique abilities to the lords that protect their property.
    The more upgraded the area the more PPT you would get for that entity. As things break down so does your PPT.

    I feel like this would give some ownership to captured areas and create both larger and smaller fights in different areas of the battlefield.

    My Trolling add:
    Introduce the Glider Claw that allows you to glide while mounted that has a new ability to nose dive down and pounce.

                                                              There is a 50% chance you will not agree with me and a 50% chance I will not agree with you
    
  • Kylden Ar.3724Kylden Ar.3724 Member ✭✭✭✭
    1. Alliances. Time for Blackgate to die.
    2. Warclaw out, War Yak in. It moves slow (base speed no Swiftness), but has lots of fast stacking (yet strippable) Stability, high HP (like, 20,000) but can tow siege to new locations. Because siege would be re-usable, reduce the rate that camps produce supply. This also would mean that towers/keeps upgrade slower.
    3. Since balance is going to be freaking impossible even with alliances due to sheer numbers and varity of gear, put the PvP system into WvW (but allow Infusion slots to still give their slight bonus so those that have them already are not screwed and it gives new players something to work towards). Also gets rid of the "cost of entry" for new blood so maybe more will try the mode.
    4. Fix walls so that defending from them is not a death sentence. Increase rewards for defending so people will defend more than Garrison.
    5. Decrease rewards for taking a paper tower/keep (to maybe at little as zero if it literally just came off RI), increase rewards for T2/T3. Encourage people to fight for bigger targets.
    6. So people will be willing to fight solo, grant participation (5 mins, as winning is 10) even if they lose a fight as long as they did damage back (like, even just 5-10% damage to account for someone getting jumped and barely having time to respond). I find that getting stomped and getting nothing is the most common reason for new players to WvW to tell me they are not coming back. Even losing PvP they can get something for trying.
    7. EotM - rebuild the map slightly (for less falling to death and a bit easier to navigate), and make a core part of WvW. Winning it would still grant supply. It would also grant a small amount of War Score, and the structures there would count toward the war score per pass.
    8. New Borderland map, so each Borderland was different. Update Desert and Alpine to be more consistent with each other, and the new map. Fix all siege LOS so that if a spot can attack a place, the same siege type can hit back (looking at you SWT/Bay area).

    How many times we gotta tell you GRIND IS NOT CONTENT there ANet?

    Leader of Tyrian Adventure Corp [TACO], [RaW][TACO] Alliance, Kaineng.

  • Just a starter list
    1 Underwater map
    2 Pips for scouts refreshing siege
    3 Balance aoe blob builds
    4 Greater number of pinch points and obstacle's to impead movement
    5 A tournament system
    6 Keep Tower and Camp upgrades cost something (Guild Favor of owning Guild )
    7 All upgrades to Keeps Towers and Camp's have to be manually requested by a player

    1. Alliance system or some variation of it to balance out the population.
    2. Class balance, along with bringing down DPS and sustain (together), mostly aimed at the spike DPS, so being 1 shot comboed would be rare, yet DPS would still be high enough (and burst builds would still exist) and sustain low enough that TTK doesn't get to high and become long boring fights.
    3. Other power creep that is not class related. Such as ascended food, not only does this make WvW more expensive, if you do not run it and face someone with it, the food can be strong enough to alter the outcome of a fight in a noticeable way. I would remove other foods from WvW, the WvW vendor with food would be the only food you could use in WvW. This would allow easier balance as it's WvW specific and allows people something to spend badges on.
    4. Rebalance Warclaw to be what it was stated to be, a mobility tool. Speed would be reduced to swiftness speeds, however there would no longer be a boost to people in their own territory, it would be the same across the board. It's current speed is to fast for the size of ABL and EBG. This would also ease the problem new players have in keeping up, maintaining perm swiftness might be hard for them, but at least possible to keep others in sight at least until they can get their own. More skins, not this dye with maybe an effect we have now, want your Warclaw to be a yak or quaggan? Here is a skin.
    5. Bring back some sort of supply (or other) cost for upgrades, since supply cost was removed the amount of siege in keeps has gone up because they have a lots of supply to work with and using it does not impact upgrading, walls are instantly repaired after a push etc etc As such, people are more willing to sit inside (even with equal numbers) on siege than push out, as they know they can stack siege and just repair the walls after. I do not want siege to be removed and I still want it to be effective, I just feel that turtling has become to common of a tactic resulting in stale game play.
    6. Increase rewards, while it is not as bad as it has been in the past, WvW still lags behind most PvE content in this area, there is no reason for this considering that WvW can have a much higher cost to play, big time if you are an active player or tag. Rewards would be higher for T3 caps, it would also increase based on defense, flipping an undefended T1 would be very low on the rewards scale. I would also work on QoL and reduce the "bag/box inception" that clutters your inventory.
    7. Speaking of inventory, dedicated (shared) space for blueprints etc, those spaces can be linked to hot keys, no more fumbling through your bags for that cata.
    8. More skins, gem store items that would allow for more customizing of guild siege, more designs, custom dyes etc. Allow claimed structures to be decorated, maybe even structure skins, layout etc would remain the same, it would ONLY be cosmetic, nothing that would affect game play.
    9. Tournaments, this is something that used to attract a lot of people, and I really enjoyed them, the stacking was annoying, however if done right and with the Alliance system in place, it should reduce that ability a good deal. It's not about being perfectly fair, as it probably never will be, it's about making it enjoyable and as even as can be expected.
    10. Work on cleaning up the maps, fixing bugs, "no line of sight" and "no valid path" issues etc. that have been here since release.

    "When you power creep the game and make it so that spam gameplay is nearly as effective as deep knowledge and nuance, the quality of players will decrease." -Exedore

  • As someone just getting into WVW, it's very hard to follow a commander or avoid being ganked by a group of roamers without a mount. I finally have my mount but it almost turned me off from wanting to continue playing the game mode. Maybe make the warclaw available to everyone or at least make earning the warclaw more feasible to people that are late to the game.

  • Dana.4760Dana.4760 Member
    edited January 4, 2020

    -Si fuera desarrolladora de McM-
    Como jugadora de muchos años en el server Bahía de Baruch en McM durante 7 años me gustaría decir lo siguiente:
    El día y la noche tienen muchas horas y muchos server son relinkeados y otros siempre están solos, unos tienen unas posibilidades horarias y otras, o cualidades que hacen que unas veces sea divertido y posible competir y otra es frustrante e imposible y no por ser mejor o peor sino porque no se miran los condicionantes desde el contexto. Sería importante atender opiniones de las personas que juegan en un server para reajustar o modificar condiciones.
    1. Equilibraría la población según horarios para que todos tengan mas o menos los mismos números y puedan así divertirse y competir.
    2. Contrataría comandantes, organizadores en todos los servers para cubrir todas las escaramuzas y todas las partes del juego, comandantes para combates altamente capacitados y los turnos serían de dos horas rotativas, roa, estructuras, vigías, profesores, aportaciones, etc. Es un tipo de juego único que bien organizado puede dejar mucha pasta al juego. Invirtiendo en ello las Alianzas podrían hacerse solo con organización interna del juego y gente capacitada para ello. Si pudiera invertiría seriamente en esto. Intentaría que siempre un mapa se dedicase a pelear y otro a subir estructuras sin descuidar ningún aspecto en el juego. Y un escuadrón defienda con buenos avisos.
    3. No pondría un tope en los rangos. Personas con mas de 10000 de rango ya no tiene mas puntuación o reconocimiento, eso lo ampliaría razonablemente.
    4. Haría un sistema de recompensas para jugadores que les motivase verdaderamente.
    5. Corregiría los problemas de funcionamiento técnico (lag, fps, etc)
    6. Tendría una plataforma de comunicación oficial por voz y chat comunitario para los servidores desde Arenanet con toda la info proporcionada por profesionales. Y desde ahí cada server sus canales según su API.
    7. Facilitaría asedio a los comandantes.
    8. Realizaría torneos en Borde de la Niebla y Sagrario para peleas de 20- 20 o 15 - 15 con buenos premios y reconocimientos.
    9. Motivaría cambios cada ciertos meses, ( server relinkeado) pero para todos los servers y no solo para algunos.

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Y'all are giving yourselves way too much credit lol. I doubt anyone here's a game dev or has such experience.
    I'd do the following:

    • Begin learning the system
    • Have a lot of meetings
    • Probably get into a heated debate with someone on the Systems team about the direction of the combat and class design.
    • Possibly get fired due to some choice words regarding the above discussion
    • Maybe be able to change consumables to only work from the provisioner's ones because T7 food is OP after figuring out how the engine works on a superficial level and with the time taken to get the changes through test and QA.
    • Be finished with my year of trying to learn how the engine works and fail to manage convincing any project leads anything, and accomplish next to nothing in the end.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.
    Quit/Inactive. No, you can't have my stuff.

  • Sovereign.1093Sovereign.1093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    tournaments wvw

    and dev gvg events.

    Not Even Coverage is the Only broken thing in WVW.

  • cobbah.3102cobbah.3102 Member ✭✭✭

    To dream the impossible dream and fix the game.

  • Redpawa.4108Redpawa.4108 Member ✭✭
    edited January 13, 2020

    Engine Work
    1. Server-side code optimization
    2. See if there can be any improvement to particle/player culling

    Gameplay Work
    1. Limit mounting up to controlled territory, in tandem with bonus controlled territory speed-buff removal
    2. Improve NPC scaling mechanics, Glass cannons standing on lords would be unadvised.
    3. Arrow Carts player cap removed.
    4. WvW trait overhaul. Think of the swap from pre-HOT traits to HOT+ traits (ofc without making room for elite WvW specs)

    Side Projects
    Run a community map creation competition. Entry categories are:

    • New maps
    • Themed reworks (eg. Misty Night for Halloween)
    • Map reworks

    Maps are voted on and then vetted, similar to weapon skins

  • joneirikb.7506joneirikb.7506 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:
    Y'all are giving yourselves way too much credit lol. I doubt anyone here's a game dev or has such experience.
    I'd do the following:

    • Begin learning the system
    • Have a lot of meetings
    • Probably get into a heated debate with someone on the Systems team about the direction of the combat and class design.
    • Possibly get fired due to some choice words regarding the above discussion
    • Maybe be able to change consumables to only work from the provisioner's ones because T7 food is OP after figuring out how the engine works on a superficial level and with the time taken to get the changes through test and QA.
    • Be finished with my year of trying to learn how the engine works and fail to manage convincing any project leads anything, and accomplish next to nothing in the end.

    Probably something like this.

    And considering balance isn't really in the WvW teams department I would probably start arguing to deal with scaling effects/skills more, and try to convince people that effect/skill scaling is largely a problem in WvW unlike the rest of the game (everything except raids are tuned for 5 man groups).

    And then try to lobby hard about trying to nerf various small power creeps (food stuff, objective buffs, etc).

    And by then the year is probably over.

    Elrik Noj (Norn Guardian, Kaineng [SIN][Owls])
    "Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth." - J. Michael Straczynski
    "GW2 is a MSOFGG: Mass Singleplayer Online Fashion Grinding Game" -me

  • 1 Just core or base skills
    2 Underwater map
    3 No MMO Trinity

  • Yasai.3549Yasai.3549 Member ✭✭✭

    Remove Downstate.

    Rework Stealth and Revealed.

    Remove EBG, and rework EotM to integrate SMC, fill in some terrain gaps here and there, and make the terrain more "obvious" as to what paths are connected to which floating islands.
    Why? I think mounting and gliding are just gimmicks in an "eternal battleground" and people should rely more on their army and coordination to fight.
    EotM also has more interesting terrain to fight on, making Zerg v Zergs more interesting and the commander with better map knowledge may prevail over a stronger force.

    Make a third Borderland so we do not have 2 Alpines.

    If I play a stupid build, I deserve to die.
    If I beat people on a stupid build, I deserve to get away with it.

  • subversiontwo.7501subversiontwo.7501 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 18, 2020

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:
    Y'all are giving yourselves way too much credit lol. I doubt anyone here's a game dev or has such experience.
    I'd do the following:

    • Begin learning the system
    • Have a lot of meetings
    • Probably get into a heated debate with someone on the Systems team about the direction of the combat and class design.
    • Possibly get fired due to some choice words regarding the above discussion
    • Maybe be able to change consumables to only work from the provisioner's ones because T7 food is OP after figuring out how the engine works on a superficial level and with the time taken to get the changes through test and QA.
    • Be finished with my year of trying to learn how the engine works and fail to manage convincing any project leads anything, and accomplish next to nothing in the end.

    I'm pretty sure I've said this before, but ...

    I think you'd be amazed by how many people from the gaming industry actually play games, both as a hobby next to their job and as apart of their job.

    I guess that the growth of the industry has saturated the field a bit and brought in a bit more variation of personalities but back in the day at least the MMO side of things used to be very inbred, so to speak.

    Also, the industry do tend to hire from the playerbase. The case of Cmc is hardly abnormal. So, having good ideas as a young player could lead you somewhere, possibly in the future even if it is rare and even more uncommon in this day and age.

    Still, you obviously don't have to work in the gaming industry to post in this thread :3 . Personally, I find it a bit refreshing that at least some people take themselves a bit more seriously for once on these forums, so they are all not about whiny shitposts.

  • DeceiverX.8361DeceiverX.8361 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @subversiontwo.7501 said:

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:
    Y'all are giving yourselves way too much credit lol. I doubt anyone here's a game dev or has such experience.
    I'd do the following:

    • Begin learning the system
    • Have a lot of meetings
    • Probably get into a heated debate with someone on the Systems team about the direction of the combat and class design.
    • Possibly get fired due to some choice words regarding the above discussion
    • Maybe be able to change consumables to only work from the provisioner's ones because T7 food is OP after figuring out how the engine works on a superficial level and with the time taken to get the changes through test and QA.
    • Be finished with my year of trying to learn how the engine works and fail to manage convincing any project leads anything, and accomplish next to nothing in the end.

    I'm pretty sure I've said this before, but ...

    I think you'd be amazed by how many people from the gaming industry actually play games, both as a hobby next to their job and as apart of their job.

    I guess that the growth of the industry has saturated the field a bit and brought in a bit more variation of personalities but back in the day at least the MMO side of things used to be very inbred, so to speak.

    Also, the industry do tend to hire from the playerbase. The case of Cmc is hardly abnormal. So, having good ideas as a young player could lead you somewhere, possibly in the future even if it is rare and even more uncommon in this day and age.

    Still, you obviously don't have to work in the gaming industry to post in this thread :3 . Personally, I find it a bit refreshing that at least some people take themselves a bit more seriously for once on these forums, so they are all not about whiny shitposts.

    I don't follow the point of your post. Yes, consumers of a product often go to become developers of said products, because consumers of products are almost always a superset of the developers of one such thing. There are more people who's flown on an airplane than aerospace engineers in the world. Hiring from people passionate about the product is usually good practice because you don't have to do as much company-specific knowledge transfer, which is generally expensive and requires a lot of oversight in order to maintain the standards that previously existed. It's why companies usually reach out to top players for QA jobs instead of development ones; they know the bugs and nuances already and only need to learn how to write reports. A developer needs to know the ins and outs of the game engine and good game design, which is in its own right a field of study. They don't often have the skills to create which depending on the quality of the studio, usually requires a minimum of a four-year degree at a pretty prestigious university or known skillset that's desired. You can't take a businessman and expect him to build an airplane because he's experienced flying a lot in his business career. it just doesn't work that way.

    I have a software engineering degree and a background in MMO administration and think the subject of game design is a very cool space to explore on little more than a casual, thought-experiment-and-cursory level, which is why I make suggestions in detail quite often, but know very little about pragmatic game development or creating complex and optimized netcode (as it's not a space I explore or have explored in my studies or career) nor do I have familiarity with game engines and actually creating working product outside the space of some very simple mods in the Creation Kit for Skyrim. I'm surely more qualified than 99% of the GW2 population, but that still does not make me qualified to fulfill a position, the same way a casual DIY'er who's fixed his home up a few times is less qualified to be an HVAC technician by trade and work on enterprise-level/massive buildings than the guy who say, is HVAC certified with a project-management background.

    The point of my post was to inject some humor and ground people a bit. Pretending like people would accomplish so much with such little time is a pretty massive slight to those who actually do the complex work of actually implementing it all. One developer isn't going to change a ton, especially when you consider that WvW devs don't have a lot of decision-making power, especially in regards to classes and core gameplay elements, which are really some of the biggest gripes people have with the format.

    Had the question been changed to "What would you do if you were the lead designer of GW2 for a year?" I probably would not have made my post at all, because having guaranteed decision-making power over others game-wide and doesn't really insult the people with the technical know-how by trivializing their jobs.

    You sure that Sniper idea is as good as you thought it was gonna be?
    Because I think my original idea is better.
    Quit/Inactive. No, you can't have my stuff.

  • subversiontwo.7501subversiontwo.7501 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 20, 2020

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:

    @subversiontwo.7501 said:

    @DeceiverX.8361 said:
    Y'all are giving yourselves way too much credit lol. I doubt anyone here's a game dev or has such experience.
    I'd do the following:

    • Begin learning the system
    • Have a lot of meetings
    • Probably get into a heated debate with someone on the Systems team about the direction of the combat and class design.
    • Possibly get fired due to some choice words regarding the above discussion
    • Maybe be able to change consumables to only work from the provisioner's ones because T7 food is OP after figuring out how the engine works on a superficial level and with the time taken to get the changes through test and QA.
    • Be finished with my year of trying to learn how the engine works and fail to manage convincing any project leads anything, and accomplish next to nothing in the end.

    I'm pretty sure I've said this before, but ...

    I think you'd be amazed by how many people from the gaming industry actually play games, both as a hobby next to their job and as apart of their job.

    I guess that the growth of the industry has saturated the field a bit and brought in a bit more variation of personalities but back in the day at least the MMO side of things used to be very inbred, so to speak.

    Also, the industry do tend to hire from the playerbase. The case of Cmc is hardly abnormal. So, having good ideas as a young player could lead you somewhere, possibly in the future even if it is rare and even more uncommon in this day and age.

    Still, you obviously don't have to work in the gaming industry to post in this thread :3 . Personally, I find it a bit refreshing that at least some people take themselves a bit more seriously for once on these forums, so they are all not about whiny shitposts.

    I don't follow the point of your post. Yes, consumers of a product often go to become developers of said products, because consumers of products are almost always a superset of the developers of one such thing. There are more people who's flown on an airplane than aerospace engineers in the world. Hiring from people passionate about the product is usually good practice because you don't have to do as much company-specific knowledge transfer, which is generally expensive and requires a lot of oversight in order to maintain the standards that previously existed. It's why companies usually reach out to top players for QA jobs instead of development ones; they know the bugs and nuances already and only need to learn how to write reports. A developer needs to know the ins and outs of the game engine and good game design, which is in its own right a field of study. They don't often have the skills to create which depending on the quality of the studio, usually requires a minimum of a four-year degree at a pretty prestigious university or known skillset that's desired. You can't take a businessman and expect him to build an airplane because he's experienced flying a lot in his business career. it just doesn't work that way.

    I have a software engineering degree and a background in MMO administration and think the subject of game design is a very cool space to explore on little more than a casual, thought-experiment-and-cursory level, which is why I make suggestions in detail quite often, but know very little about pragmatic game development or creating complex and optimized netcode (as it's not a space I explore or have explored in my studies or career) nor do I have familiarity with game engines and actually creating working product outside the space of some very simple mods in the Creation Kit for Skyrim. I'm surely more qualified than 99% of the GW2 population, but that still does not make me qualified to fulfill a position, the same way a casual DIY'er who's fixed his home up a few times is less qualified to be an HVAC technician by trade and work on enterprise-level/massive buildings than the guy who say, is HVAC certified with a project-management background.

    The point of my post was to inject some humor and ground people a bit. Pretending like people would accomplish so much with such little time is a pretty massive slight to those who actually do the complex work of actually implementing it all. One developer isn't going to change a ton, especially when you consider that WvW devs don't have a lot of decision-making power, especially in regards to classes and core gameplay elements, which are really some of the biggest gripes people have with the format.

    Had the question been changed to "What would you do if you were the lead designer of GW2 for a year?" I probably would not have made my post at all, because having guaranteed decision-making power over others game-wide and doesn't really insult the people with the technical know-how by trivializing their jobs.

    Like before when I revisted the thread, I was really unsure if I should be responding to your post but perhaps because of the complete opposite reason this time. Most people tend to take threads here too casually and just put out whatever oppinion currently held whereas you seem to read a bunch of things into both the OP and the responses that just isn't there and takes a good reach to misinterprete the intentions of. That makes it very hard to respond to you in a manner that is constructive and doesn't come off as nitpicking.

    My initial response to you was meant about as lighthearted as whatever you intended with the comment. For example, my first guild in GW2 had at least 10 game developers in it so game developers do play games and like talking about them. It was simply meant as a little eye-wink to your comment that people here were unlikely to be developers. Of course most people posting in a forum thread are not likely to be developers and nore do they have to be. The idea that they could be however is not as far-fetched as your attempt at a humorous shut-down would suggest. I think it was a tasteful way of suggesting to you that you shouldn't slam people for talking.

    That brings us to the discussion you are providing. I think you are forgetting where you are. Context is important. You are saying that former players are fit for QA and that something like that requires them to analyze and report. No one is suggesting they would do anything else in this thread. No one is even suggesting that they would do that. This is a game discussion forum and whatever framing and wishes were listed in the OP was simply meant to shape the discussion a little bit. The only thing people should do is discuss the game in this game discussion forum, hopefully with a little more effort than listing stuff that they would want.

    That ties into my last bit. I am sorry for making a title that offended you so gravely by suggesting that people could imagine that they were developers and giving it the suggested time frame of a year. I simply assumed that people would have the presence of mind to infer that it meant "What would you do if you had the ability to directly impact the prioritization of design stretches over a foreseeable future". That just wouldn't have made a very good thread title on a discussion forum (and should it require some non-offensive reality to it I guess it would exclude anyone who does not have managment access to back-office systems and the mandate to assemble teams). It is a good thing that it isn't a requirement to make forum posts or objectively insulting to industry professionals in any way shape or form, that would be very lonely.


    Meet the chief security forensics guy for Rockstar games.