[Vid] Who is arenanet trying to attract with mechanics like this? - Page 2 — Guild Wars 2 Forums

[Vid] Who is arenanet trying to attract with mechanics like this?

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  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 1, 2019

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    oh and btw, i want this kitten gone. I just dont wanna lose everything alongside it.
    anet has been ripping feathers from mesmer for a while now, not much of them left im afraid.

    until Anet return Mesmer Profession back to who they are called to be, nothing will ever change.

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mesmer&ved=2ahUKEwiEgsCwupXmAhUDWN8KHUXpAWQQFjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw31LL8-R2A2q-CCX9y8n5R8&cshid=1575237896054

    Anet biggest mistake was changing Mesmer Profession identity. So now we are witnessing the consequences of it and Anet can't stop it without returning them to their root

    -once you start messing with someone's identity, prepare for Chaos-

  • bravan.3876bravan.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 1, 2019

    @viquing.8254 said:

    @bravan.3876 said:

    @viquing.8254 said:

    @bravan.3876 said:

    @viquing.8254 said:
    @bravan.3876 : who is seriously playing inspiration since 2 years ?

    That doesn't matter when talking about the design of that traitline and how much skill ceiling it includes. That something doesn't or do get used never is any prove of it being or not being op, lame, easy or unhealthy mechanic (why ppl don't get that?).
    Player carry and team carry/conquest usefulness are two different things, they can correlate (like we have enough builds carry the player and are useful in conquest, most metabuilds are like that atm) but it doesn't need to correlate. That Countless NA guy inspiration signet invuln spam build is the best example. It doesn't shine in any role in conquest (can't rly hold caps in duels due to invuln frames, not enough dmg for a roaming or teamfight build, no teamsupport abilities etc), it has nearly zero impact on a match, all this build does well is holding bad players alive longer than they should stay alive. Good WvW and Duelbuild for low skilled ppl want easy wins in duels/ outnumbereds in gamemodes without the need to care for points and specific roles in conquest which need to be filled and no need to care for teamsynergy based on pointcapture mode. Maybe in Stronghold it could work.

    What's the purpose of inspiration then.

    I don't get this question, i just explained it. Also it is a low skill ceiling line just waiting for some meta changes to become relevant again and then provides another low skill ceiling build that will be useful in conquest, like we had during HoT. From HoT release to PoF release no Mesmer meta was running without Inspiration ever and that even after it got nerfed mid HoT. We are not save from that happens again and that for all classes, as long as low skill ceiling traitlines exist. I would rework almost all core defensive traitlines into something less passive and with higher skill ceiling, with more opportunity costs in dmg for the only active defense gets provided by them, also delete all unhealthy mechanics like PU/ Last Stand (what even seems to bug, it provides an immune to cc what is not intended when i read the tooltip, it should work like a stunbreak not like an immune so interrupt traits work and the warrior gets cced for like 0,01 sec but then automatically stunbreaks) not only Mesmers. Otherwise you will always have the problem on all classes, that you nerf one specific build and ppl just switch to the next lame kitten.

    What I mean is what did you want concretely as traits in inspiration ?
    You know that player always play the easiest way right (low ceiling.) and it will always be the case on every class ?

    I will pm you, it is going too far for that thread, also i would need to think about it first, i haven't created full alternative lines for those traitlines on all classes yet, because you know i have a job and until now don't get paid for doing balance work in GW2^^ If Anet will announce they consider something like that and ask forum for help and brainstorming i am the first start thinking deeper about how to actually rework stuff, but it is a bit too much work to do for whole traitlines to do it just for fun you know? I made alternative suggestions for single traits needed a hotfix, like old CI but didn't create full new traitlines. (As you can see how much i wrote about opportunity costs for defensive traitlines already i would write a book for each traitline, you sure you want to read that kitten? :joy: )

    Atm i would be happy with defensive traitlines get higher opportunity costs in dmg (like that a Chaosline Mesmer still can oneshot something is a joke, it should not be possible considering how much defense you get from Chaosline, like Superspeed, high stealth uptime, boonsustain, shorter cds on Manipulationskills like heal and Blink, even condiremove... actually ridiculous how much Chaosline offers). That could be done by something like statboni you get depending on the nature of the traitline as we had in core days. I know they removed them because they could not find a specific defensive or offensive nature for elite traitlines because they are mostly about adding new mechanics than about defense or offense (most elite traitlines offer both). You could solve that problem by making the player able to choose the stat boni after picking a traitline. Defensive traitlines only can choose between defensive statboni and offensive traitlines only between offensive statboni. You in general only allow statboni on the 2 core traitlines or you make elite traitlines be able to select from all stat bonis no matter their nature. Or you make the selection of stat boni in elite lines depending on the amount of offensive and defensive traits picked in the elite line and make elite lines only able to pick "minor stat boni" (like condiduration, ferocity, boon duration). You ofc have to give amulets/PvE armor overall less stats in return then.
    And delete completely passive traits like lesser stance procs in Defense traitline on Warrior or the autododge trait Instant Reflexes on Thief in Acrobatics but also offensive ones like Lesser Spinal Shivers for Necros. That would be a good start.

    And yes ofc i know most ppl will always use the easiest, i do the same, i am not one of the ppl get fun in winning by skill or losing by build. I just want to chill and don't need to have 5 times the skill or do 5 times the effort for the same reward than others. I am just a metabuild carried pleb like most ppl, but at least i know it and don't develop an ego over it. I would like to play more skillbased builds but only when others are forced to do the same. I hate to have build disadvantage (i am not talking about mechanically counters, that will always exist, don't get me wrong here). That is why i say i would rework most of the core defensive traitlines not only on Mesmer, so there will not be any low skill ceiling stuff left in that game, at least not in a form that it is more rewarding to play than a skillbased build by a good player. I don't mind to have some easier builds in this game to give new (and bad) ppl an easier start to learn but these builds should not be as rewarding or even more rewarding on higher skill lvl as skillful builds.

    "playing revenant is borderline exploiting" - up condimirage 2k18

  • As someone already said: these kind of builds shouldn't exist.

    But generally speaking, it's the 5-man premades in unranked that play it solely to farm new players that are the major reasons PvP population is on the decline, I'd imagine.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 1, 2019

    @NorthernRedStar.3054 said:
    As someone already said: these kind of builds shouldn't exist.

    But generally speaking, it's the 5-man premades in unranked that play it solely to farm new players that are the major reasons PvP population is on the decline, I'd imagine.

    'when you understandtand who your customers are, what they want, what they struggle with, it becomes a lot easier to see why customers are leaving your business'

    https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/93005/fed-up-with-unhealthy-mechanics-taking-a-break-until-fixed#latest

  • XECOR.2814XECOR.2814 Member ✭✭✭

    Its not fine atm and im sure anet will look into this. Just keep the suggestions positive.

  • Vicariuz.1605Vicariuz.1605 Member ✭✭✭

    @DeadlySynz.3471 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    what makes you think that starting player will face players that can pull this off?
    you ran into 5man premade, they could play kitten like 5x holo and steamroll you harder, exept you wouldnt even be able to fight back becouse the 1-2 skills you would somehow manage to land would deal 15% of their hp instead of 40%.
    you kept running out of spawn into 3 of them repeatedly instead of leaving with team what did you expect?
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.
    Ah not to mention they propably were communicating unlike your team. Sometimes its better to coordinate instead of complaining yes?

    They weren't talking about any of that; they were specifically talking about the burst they could do nothing about once it was in motion. Which they have a point, how is that type of attack (and player behavior) going to entice people into the game mode? Last time I checked.. PvP wasn't doing too good, perhaps a large portion of the blame can be placed squarely on the players that run those types of builds.

    no, players using builds available to them is not the reason, nor is their responsibility to not play strong builds.

    the reason why pvp is in a poor state is years of poor management by the developers of the game.

  • Mathias.9657Mathias.9657 Member ✭✭✭

    @Burnfall.9573 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    oh and btw, i want this kitten gone. I just dont wanna lose everything alongside it.
    anet has been ripping feathers from mesmer for a while now, not much of them left im afraid.

    until Anet return Mesmer Profession back to who they are called to be, nothing will ever change.

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mesmer&ved=2ahUKEwiEgsCwupXmAhUDWN8KHUXpAWQQFjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw31LL8-R2A2q-CCX9y8n5R8&cshid=1575237896054

    Anet biggest mistake was changing Mesmer Profession identity. So now we are witnessing the consequences of it and Anet can't stop it without returning them to their root

    -once you start messing with someone's identity, prepare for Chaos-

    Yeah but in GW2 every mechanic is basically the C-word by design. There is no way hexes (on top of condi) would be viable in the game LOL unless they change condi to be an appropriate and balanced mechanic like in GW1. Except for blind.. serious kitten blind in GW1.

    I hated mesmers even back then because I was a huge RA/TA player and SoM trash build that every scrub played really pissed me off. I mean that's like the condi mes of today, mesmers are just garbage players who depend on the most C-wordous of builds.

    Mesmer is literally just the highest form of being a garbage human being in a game possible. Even worse than cod campers with claymore and shotty. Hexes were ridiculously strong in GW1 too , not on the level of GW2 condi/power but pretty dang annoying and extremely effective both vs melee & caster depending on build.

    The difference being it took an entire group to focus a single target down in that amount of time, coordinated over voice comms. In GW2 a single person can do it. 10/10 design LUL. So glad we dropped that trAsH group play mentality from GW1, right ANet?

    MESMER MAIN SPOTTED

  • Lucentfir.7430Lucentfir.7430 Member ✭✭✭

    @Vicariuz.1605 said:

    @DeadlySynz.3471 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    what makes you think that starting player will face players that can pull this off?
    you ran into 5man premade, they could play kitten like 5x holo and steamroll you harder, exept you wouldnt even be able to fight back becouse the 1-2 skills you would somehow manage to land would deal 15% of their hp instead of 40%.
    you kept running out of spawn into 3 of them repeatedly instead of leaving with team what did you expect?
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.
    Ah not to mention they propably were communicating unlike your team. Sometimes its better to coordinate instead of complaining yes?

    They weren't talking about any of that; they were specifically talking about the burst they could do nothing about once it was in motion. Which they have a point, how is that type of attack (and player behavior) going to entice people into the game mode? Last time I checked.. PvP wasn't doing too good, perhaps a large portion of the blame can be placed squarely on the players that run those types of builds.

    no, players using builds available to them is not the reason, nor is their responsibility to not play strong builds.

    the reason why pvp is in a poor state is years of poor management by the developers of the game.

    ^ This.
    Years of mistakes and neglect, and all the dumb things(player caused) at the top end, of this game mode has had happen with it, it's in a worse state its ever been in. Things are only going to get worse.

  • Burnfall.9573Burnfall.9573 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Lucentfir.7430 said:

    @Vicariuz.1605 said:

    @DeadlySynz.3471 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    what makes you think that starting player will face players that can pull this off?
    you ran into 5man premade, they could play kitten like 5x holo and steamroll you harder, exept you wouldnt even be able to fight back becouse the 1-2 skills you would somehow manage to land would deal 15% of their hp instead of 40%.
    you kept running out of spawn into 3 of them repeatedly instead of leaving with team what did you expect?
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.
    Ah not to mention they propably were communicating unlike your team. Sometimes its better to coordinate instead of complaining yes?

    They weren't talking about any of that; they were specifically talking about the burst they could do nothing about once it was in motion. Which they have a point, how is that type of attack (and player behavior) going to entice people into the game mode? Last time I checked.. PvP wasn't doing too good, perhaps a large portion of the blame can be placed squarely on the players that run those types of builds.

    no, players using builds available to them is not the reason, nor is their responsibility to not play strong builds.

    the reason why pvp is in a poor state is years of poor management by the developers of the game.

    ^ This.
    Years of mistakes and neglect, and all the dumb things(player caused) at the top end, of this game mode has had happen with it, it's in a worse state its ever been in. Things are only going to get worse.

    You are correct

    Did you know just few day ago another Anet staff left the company? Even creative staffs are leaving on top of players whose fed up with Anet continual ignoring root cause problems of the game are leaving

    When Will It End?

  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.

    They won the game cuz mesmers targeted this salty necro and spawncamped him :D
    To salty necro: Attract new players? They want to attract new PVE players through...pvp...?10 iq

  • Trigr.6481Trigr.6481 Member ✭✭✭

    @DeadlySynz.3471 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    what makes you think that starting player will face players that can pull this off?
    you ran into 5man premade, they could play kitten like 5x holo and steamroll you harder, exept you wouldnt even be able to fight back becouse the 1-2 skills you would somehow manage to land would deal 15% of their hp instead of 40%.
    you kept running out of spawn into 3 of them repeatedly instead of leaving with team what did you expect?
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.
    Ah not to mention they propably were communicating unlike your team. Sometimes its better to coordinate instead of complaining yes?

    They weren't talking about any of that; they were specifically talking about the burst they could do nothing about once it was in motion. Which they have a point, how is that type of attack (and player behavior) going to entice people into the game mode? Last time I checked.. PvP wasn't doing too good, perhaps a large portion of the blame can be placed squarely on the players that run those types of builds.

    Wrong, in the end the blame is in the hands of the developers. You can't just expect the playerbase to police themselves, that's wishful thinking, but completely unrealistic. If there is something cheesy in any game, players are going to take advantage it until it's either balanced out or ceases to exist. And in gw2's case, they will typically nerf something completely unrelated, gutting the class in the process and patting themselves on the back, calling it fixed.

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.

    They won the game cuz mesmers targeted this salty necro and spawncamped him :D
    To salty necro: Attract new players? They want to attract new PVE players through...pvp...?10 iq

    My team "won", the only thing they were interested in was spawn camping with 4 mesmers

  • Liza.2758Liza.2758 Member ✭✭

    what really good about this video is OP saw 4 mesmers on other team and still decided to play necro.

    This is the dumb thing that always happens in rank game. people stupidly stick to their class like they are role playing in 2019

    i'm not defending this build but it could have been 4 mirages 4 Rev 4 pew pew ranger 4 core guard and you would get melt in 3 seconds anyway because u decided to play necro.

  • @Liza.2758 said:
    what really good about this video is OP saw 4 mesmers on other team and still decided to play necro.

    Not only that, but he just runs solo up to clocktower and YOLOs into certain death over and over again. Not that it matters, enemy team was just meme-ing. But this is a very good example of how not to play necromancer.

  • DeadlySynz.3471DeadlySynz.3471 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @DeadlySynz.3471 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    what makes you think that starting player will face players that can pull this off?
    you ran into 5man premade, they could play kitten like 5x holo and steamroll you harder, exept you wouldnt even be able to fight back becouse the 1-2 skills you would somehow manage to land would deal 15% of their hp instead of 40%.
    you kept running out of spawn into 3 of them repeatedly instead of leaving with team what did you expect?
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.
    Ah not to mention they propably were communicating unlike your team. Sometimes its better to coordinate instead of complaining yes?

    They weren't talking about any of that; they were specifically talking about the burst they could do nothing about once it was in motion. Which they have a point, how is that type of attack (and player behavior) going to entice people into the game mode? Last time I checked.. PvP wasn't doing too good, perhaps a large portion of the blame can be placed squarely on the players that run those types of builds.

    if new player, faces other new player on this build he will whoop his kitten.
    its actually one of the builds that you have to put some thought process into playing, when i was new getting bursted down wasnt a thing that discouraged me.
    fighting scrapper that took 0 damage, that legit generated perma 50% barrier while fighting against me did, it was the warriors that were hitting me for 10k while remaining untouchable, soulbeasts that pewpew for 10k from range while being tanky, firebrands that vomit aoe on nodes and YOU have to leave becouse its theirs now.

    Yes! This is what we call rock/paper/scissors, and something players seem to forget about. Instead of say... realizing their class (paper), has no chance against another class (scissors). So instead of players jumping on a proper class to deal with them (rock), they scream at Anet to nerf scissors into the ground.

    But this is beside the point at the moment, what exactly counters an insta-dead burst from a class from stealth? What exactly counters it? It doesn't matter how much thought goes into delivering the attack; if the attack is not counterable (mainly because you can't see it coming and your dead when they (or the clones appear). But in this case, what counters a mirage (this has been brought up before by many people). This has nothing to do with classes you can see coming with attacks you can see coming. You can see rangers coming at you with longbow, you can see warriors charging at you swinging, you can see firebrands and scourges spitting AoE all over the place, and you can see engineers hobbling around with barriers till the cows come home. This specifically has to do with classes that insta-down people from stealth, it's not counterable, because there is no such thing as permanent reveal.

    If one sees a mesmer in the area and goes stealth, it's reasonable to assume that a quick succession of attacks is coming. So anticipate and dodge, throw up blocks, throw up invulnerable, hell even leave. So what exactly does one do against an insta-death shot from something you can see (nor know is in the area?) What exactly does one bring to the table in anticipating an insta-down burst from a stealthed class when you have no idea where it is? Waste your reveal? Ya they weren't there, now what..

    At this stage in the game though, Anet won't be changing anything, and PvP largely have themselves to blame when it comes to the ghost town PvP is becoming. People can only fathom mesmer's for so long before growing tired of it, much like how people are growing tired of Firebrands and Scourges in WvW.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    about balance:
    Absolutely don't see something bad in this video. Perfect game-play and good balance. Exactly, this is real balance in good mmo games.
    If someone think that mesmer op - this is great - he/she can try it and take legend rank per few days.
    Welcome. No one can stop you !!!

    about toxicity:
    I pref keep separate chat, and during pvp I see only guild chat. Party/squad, and whispers on other tabs, ant mostly never not used and not switched, other chats is off at all. So no matter how me or others play I don't feel any toxicity at all.
    I just take pica and tea, and get fun with perfect game.

  • XenoSpyro.1780XenoSpyro.1780 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    Anet balance team be like : "Yo let's replicate the Time To Kill from Call of Duty."

    @Vagrant.7206 said:
    But everyone screamed about passives, so here we are.

    Then it looks like it's time to tear down the bursts and normalize damage below 5 digits.

    I'm in favor of just getting rid of Precision and Ferocity entirely (slightly boosting Power in trade), and on the condi side, delete the Condi stat. There's just too much stupid kitten being flung around in this game. Too much of everything On The Table™. This game is like a circus but all the clowns are on adderal and wearing RGB noses.

  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    TBH if you played it properly you could actually win the game.

    They won the game cuz mesmers targeted this salty necro and spawncamped him :D
    To salty necro: Attract new players? They want to attract new PVE players through...pvp...?10 iq

    My team "won", the only thing they were interested in was spawn camping with 4 mesmers

    O,rly? You did a good job running into 3-4 mesmers alone and zero reaction to use breakstun 12/10 gameplay. /s
    They made you and other 4 ppl cry for nerfs, they are winners :joy:
    Reasons why new players wont stay: the game is power crept to insanity, they would feel fallen behind compared to players who are playing for years and being destroyed over and over and eventually drop(its pve focused game lul).
    Seeking the balance? That CMC is a slave of "pro players" that ask for their opinion. "Rev is favored by the best players", "FB is going to stay the best support in the game and this wont change anytime soon" :joy::joy::joy:

  • in conclusion: trolling culture = low population

    And Anet caters to it

  • Ragnarox.9601Ragnarox.9601 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    who cares about mesmers, devs only play that and thief. Just nerf Firebrand! Why? cause mesmers can do it better.

  • Daishi.6027Daishi.6027 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    So does every build from mediocre to meta, along with everyone who is objectively better than new players; actively discourage them because they lose?
    Does anyone who smirfs or intentionally tanks their MMR in any other game actively discourage the players they dunk on?

    PvP population is low for several reasons, builds and balance are part of it sure; but that is one bit in a long run of symptoms to bigger core issues. As for the example itself if it wasn't Power mes it could have been anything else that equally invalidates the match- even more so when you have a premade vs newbs. If this is the basis we are using for "should not exist" I'm fine with that, but everything else, especially that which is more egregious than this example, needs to get Thanos snapped too.

    Our worst players from a year ago are going to obliterate anyone just joining now, despite our tiny population the floor of the worst PvPer is going to be significantly higher than any PvE casul who doesn't even know dodging is a mechanic.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭

    @Ragnarox.9601 said:
    who cares about mesmers, devs only play that and thief. Just nerf Firebrand! Why? cause mesmers can do it better.

    ? devs literally do everything in their power to avoiding nerfing firebrand.
    whenever they do get around nerfing something they make sure to buff something else
    There is a reason why guard is the best dps in pve, the best support in pve, easy to play.
    The best support in pvp too, and hes not getting nerfed :D
    Meanwhile "favourite" mesmer gets nerfed every single patch for years.
    LuL developers even buffed guard during no balance batch, just some QoL changes but guard special little snowflake gets dmg boost :D

  • @Daishi.6027 said:
    So does every build from mediocre to meta, along with everyone who is objectively better than new players; actively discourage them because they lose?
    Does anyone who smirfs or intentionally tanks their MMR in any other game actively discourage the players they dunk on?

    PvP population is low for several reasons, builds and balance are part of it sure; but that is one bit in a long run of symptoms to bigger core issues. As for the example itself if it wasn't Power mes it could have been anything else that equally invalidates the match- even more so when you have a premade vs newbs. If this is the basis we are using for "should not exist" I'm fine with that, but everything else, especially that which is more egregious than this example, needs to get Thanos snapped too.

    Our worst players from a year ago are going to obliterate anyone just joining now, despite our tiny population the floor of the worst PvPer is going to be significantly higher than any PvE casul who doesn't even know dodging is a mechanic.

    Partly right. If the game was more popular, newbs would have other newbs to play against, instead of players with 12 months experience demolishing them. And as someone pointed out popular games do more to discourage people trolling like this. And as you pointed out imbalance doesn't help the situation at all.

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    He was definitely outplayed, and he could have used a Revenant or anti cc and stun break he could bring with wells, and he got severely outplayed while also feeding the 3 or 4 mesmers that were camping him, so I am going to vote: Leave mesmers alone mostly, especially since if you got 2 or more players on you, you are going to die.

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I love the people saying I got outplayed, as if any of you could have done differently on any other class.

    Please, enlighten me oh lords of gold 3. What would you play to stop 4 mesmers from spawn camping your team?

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:

    I love the people saying I got outplayed as if any of you could have done differently on any other class.

    Please, enlighten me oh lords of gold 3. What would you play to stop 4 mesmers from spawn camping your team?

    First one yeah that was an impossible situation and you got ganked with 0 possibilities to react, but second and third you could have done better.
    2ND you can see mesmer waiting up top and you run into them and try to engage when necros aren't good at 1v1ing classes since they lack mobility and are a little glassy. It is known that necros need help from other classes because they aren't great with stun breaks and have little to no invulnerability abilities, and stuff like that. Furthermore, you need to try and figure out which is the real and which illusion isn't. Aoe effects work great versus mesmers I hear.
    3rd gank set up wurm teleport away and try to range them with staff. You literally ran right into the mesmers instead of doing something like wells or something with staff. You could see 2 mesmers there at the s

    By 4th one you had the right idea ranging them as much as you could and keeping away.

    pawn point and run into them feeding them points.

    You should have coordinated with allies or tried to.

    The mesmers are coordinating and all ganking you at the same time, so of course, you are going to get insta downed and destroyed.

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    I love the people saying I got outplayed, as if any of you could have done differently on any other class.

    Please, enlighten me oh lords of gold 3. What would you play to stop 4 mesmers from spawn camping your team?

    Tbh, the way you were YOLOing into every situation, predicting nothing, playing reactively but reacting slowly... I don't think a class swap would've made much difference.

  • Ubi.4136Ubi.4136 Member ✭✭✭✭

    All I saw in the video was lots of macros being used.

    Lost in the Maguuma (TC)
    For the geographically challenged, yes, Tarnished Coast is located IN the Maguuma Jungle.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Ubi.4136 said:
    All I saw in the video was lots of macros being used.

    If you think thats a macro then dunno what to tell you, 4-6 buttons in quick succesion is not something human should have to use macro for ye?
    to OP you shouldnt even try to leave spawn, if 3 of them afk outside you can just be at spawn and stare at them its 3 for 1.
    if you DO wanna leave, leave with a teammate, this mes build struggles after the burst, this video didnt showcase it becouse it was 3/4 vs 1 all the time.
    you should have switched build there, no reason to NOT use Paladin amulet.
    Even in paladins you would 3-4shot them, while being much harder to kill.
    Heck If I saw that team I would take
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rune_of_the_Undead_(PvP) + https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rabid_Amulet on mirage.
    People dont even try to adjust their builds, just use same kitten every game and wonder why they get clapped.

  • Dreddo.9865Dreddo.9865 Member ✭✭✭

    The existence of such Cheese builds like this one presented is one of the factors the mode is almost dead - it's more than obvious any new player facing this will be discouraged and stay away. While many established players have identified and criticized those phenomena in their streams, Anet never really reacted properly. In fact most balance patches were creating new issues rather than balancing things and moving towards a healthy competitive environment. Now that we have an almost dead mode they decided to create a specialized balancing team. I am afraid it's too late.

  • wow man the low iq here shouldn't surprise me, but it does. if you're saying op could have done better, you're missing the point. reread the op. its all about new players and their likelihood to stick around after getting hit with garbage like presented in the video.

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭✭

    This, and all other broken cheese builds. The guild I play with is purely PvE but they are all pretty dedicated players of other PvP games. They don't bother playing PvP in gw2 anymore because the of serious imbalance that even the newest of gamers could notice. The only reason I play it at all is because I like the legendary backpack and want to get it, not because I actually enjoy this horrible game mode.

    Depression and anxiety are the worst...

  • zoopop.5630zoopop.5630 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    few things to point out. Always be on staff first when u plan to engage on a mirage, and signets are probably the worse thing u can have at the moment as a core necro. Spec Armor would of helped a lot imo but not enough if u don't know how to kite them off / run to no teleport spots.

    Horrible match up but your spec alone doesn't help either.

  • Turkeyspit.3965Turkeyspit.3965 Member ✭✭✭✭

    About a year ago I joined a WvW pugmander from our link server (I think he was from EU?), and he mandated a small squad of specific comps/actions (eg, all Revs camped Dwarf for Inspiring to give stability), and he would draw the enemy pugs into attacking into our reflects and retal, and we woudl all laugh as half of the enemy squad just self-melted.

    On comms the commander made an interesting comment: "This game? This game is kitten. It only exists to troll people".

    And there it is.

  • ugrakarma.9416ugrakarma.9416 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    few things to point out. Always be on staff first when u plan to engage on a mirage, and signets are probably the worse thing u can have at the moment as a core necro. Spec Armor would of helped a lot imo but not enough if u don't know how to kite them off / run to no teleport spots.

    Horrible match up but your spec alone doesn't help either.

    also hes jumping into melee using axe. Axe at mid range is very efficient against mesmer, jumping into melle is suicide. even being a single target weapon just keep using #1 at "ghosts" til u figure out the real mesmer, then melt him with Axe #2

    main pvp: Khel the Undead(power reaper).

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭

    Meme unranked match, people running builds like this against anyone good enough to compensate for the predictable pattern would easily turn it around.

    Remember that Stealth is limited, they have to be close to you for one shoting and they only have few sustain utility that can be counted on one hand.

    Weakness against these people would easily turn the fight into your favor as well.

    With that in mind, look at how you played it out and see where your mistakes were made. Because there was a lot you could have done along with your team.

    It's a one shot, it sucks to dodge with lag, but you're not instantly dead if you do the right thing.

  • Bigpapasmurf.5623Bigpapasmurf.5623 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    Red = Dead...or someone runs away. Either way it's gone.
    twitch.tv/TRMC
    Lover of Jumping puzzles, Squirrels, WvW, and Taimi
    Co-Leader of SOmething inAPpropriate {SOAP}

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

  • Bigpapasmurf.5623Bigpapasmurf.5623 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    Red = Dead...or someone runs away. Either way it's gone.
    twitch.tv/TRMC
    Lover of Jumping puzzles, Squirrels, WvW, and Taimi
    Co-Leader of SOmething inAPpropriate {SOAP}

  • Odik.4587Odik.4587 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

  • bravan.3876bravan.3876 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    The Nia Mesmer is casting his reflect heal and the Necro just eats the the Rangers bow knockback which gets reflected. The Necro is in front of the Ranger and bodyblocks the projectile

    "playing revenant is borderline exploiting" - up condimirage 2k18

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    The first one the player couldn't see the mirage/mesmer whatever it was, and they were stunned and they went from 100-0% health.

    It's extremely overpowered to be able to cc someone and burst them down in like 3-4 seconds.

    The other times at least the necro saw the mesmer but chose stupidly to run right into them and yes they could react. To me, it seems kinda to be able to stealth someone and one shot. If a thief is not allowed why should mesmers? So I think mesmers should be nerfed in their ability to stealth kill cheaply and maybe look at their cc spam.

    If it's not fun for people to be thrown condies by a thief for instance or shot at range by DE, then mesmers shouldn't be allowed either. mesmers for the longest time have had some very unhealthy toxic stuff that until more recently didn't get nerfed, and its about time too.

    Now for firebrand nerfs, when are the nerfs to boon spam firebrand going to come?

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    It was actually around one second but that is still plenty of time to stun break/dodge. The issue here isn't if you have enough time to react, it's the player experience. The PvP player base is already so small it causes match making issues. If the interactions between professions is perceived as "toxic" (and I know many people do see it this way) it's not going to bring any people in. Even as a PvP player myself I would never suggest it to any other serious PvP gamer. Sure, these kind of builds are not "meta" but it's enough to frustrate a lot of the player base. You have to look at player skill like a normal distribution. Most players are not in the right end of the bell curve where what's "meta" matters. Most players are in the middle of the bell curve, which stuff like this can work and is seriously frustrating to play against.

    Btw, leave the "low iq" comments at home. There is already enough toxicity in PvP without them.

    Depression and anxiety are the worst...

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Zexanima.7851 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    It was actually around one second but that is still plenty of time to stun break/dodge. The issue here isn't if you have enough time to react, it's the player experience. The PvP player base is already so small it causes match making issues. If the interactions between professions is perceived as "toxic" (and I know many people do see it this way) it's not going to bring any people in. Even as a PvP player myself I would never suggest it to any other serious PvP gamer. Sure, these kind of builds are not "meta" but it's enough to frustrate a lot of the player base. You have to look at player skill like a normal distribution. Most players are not in the right end of the bell curve where what's "meta" matters. Most players are in the middle of the bell curve, which stuff like this can work and is seriously frustrating to play against.

    Btw, leave the "low iq" comments at home. There is already enough toxicity in PvP without them.

    He literally walked towards the mesmer and opened himself up. He coulda blinded the mesmer or something maybe even use wurm to escape and use some sort of well with stability to avoid being stunned but didn't, so he got farmed by the mesmers who were coordinating together.

    He shouldn't have jumped down and gone after mesmer, because as soon as he did, he fell right into the mesmer's trap.

    The third fourth 5th times and last time he did too. he got 1 kill but each time he opened himself up and left himself open to being cced by the enemy mesmers.

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭

    @Axl.8924 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    The first one the player couldn't see the mirage/mesmer whatever it was, and they were stunned and they went from 100-0% health.

    It's extremely overpowered to be able to cc someone and burst them down in like 3-4 seconds.

    The other times at least the necro saw the mesmer but chose stupidly to run right into them and yes they could react. To me, it seems kinda to be able to stealth someone and one shot. If a thief is not allowed why should mesmers? So I think mesmers should be nerfed in their ability to stealth kill cheaply and maybe look at their cc spam.

    If it's not fun for people to be thrown condies by a thief for instance or shot at range by DE, then mesmers shouldn't be allowed either. mesmers for the longest time have had some very unhealthy toxic stuff that until more recently didn't get nerfed, and its about time too.

    Now for firebrand nerfs, when are the nerfs to boon spam firebrand going to come?

    thief doesnt get to 1shot from stealth becouse thief doesnt have to sacrifice utility or traitlines to stealth.
    thief grabs d+p and stealths for 12s using what 18 ini?
    on top of that thief also has better mobility on top of that backstab doesnt have a cooldown so you can do this every 4-5s.
    On top of kitten like daggerstorm that on a berserker could land 10k+ hits while capping node im very glad its not possible on a thief of all classes.

    And mesmer CC is one of if not the most fair CC in all game, if you wanna look at unfair CC look at Pistol Whip.
    mesmers CC -> 0 or close to 0 dmg, and long cooldowns.
    CC of other classes has shorter cooldowns on top of dealing massive ammounts of damage.
    look at illusionary wave vs overcharged shot.
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Wave
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Overcharged_Shot
    3 times less damage.
    about 1/3 range.
    doesnt remove conditions.
    over twice the cooldown
    1/2s cast time vs 0 casttime.

    Also worth pointing out that thiefs backstab has 1200 range due to steal, thief doesnt have to use shadowstep to position backstab.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭

    @Axl.8924 said:

    @Zexanima.7851 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    It was actually around one second but that is still plenty of time to stun break/dodge. The issue here isn't if you have enough time to react, it's the player experience. The PvP player base is already so small it causes match making issues. If the interactions between professions is perceived as "toxic" (and I know many people do see it this way) it's not going to bring any people in. Even as a PvP player myself I would never suggest it to any other serious PvP gamer. Sure, these kind of builds are not "meta" but it's enough to frustrate a lot of the player base. You have to look at player skill like a normal distribution. Most players are not in the right end of the bell curve where what's "meta" matters. Most players are in the middle of the bell curve, which stuff like this can work and is seriously frustrating to play against.

    Btw, leave the "low iq" comments at home. There is already enough toxicity in PvP without them.

    He literally walked towards the mesmer and opened himself up. He coulda blinded the mesmer or something maybe even use wurm to escape and use some sort of well with stability to avoid being stunned but didn't, so he got farmed by the mesmers who were coordinating together.

    He shouldn't have jumped down and gone after mesmer, because as soon as he did, he fell right into the mesmer's trap.

    The third fourth 5th times and last time he did too. he got 1 kill but each time he opened himself up and left himself open to being cced by the enemy mesmers.

    TBH even first death should be avoided, I dont get why would he walk up there, against 5x 1shot mes I wouldnt not once go alone anywhere, just move as 2-3man blobs and thats it.

  • Zexanima.7851Zexanima.7851 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Axl.8924 said:

    @Zexanima.7851 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    It was actually around one second but that is still plenty of time to stun break/dodge. The issue here isn't if you have enough time to react, it's the player experience. The PvP player base is already so small it causes match making issues. If the interactions between professions is perceived as "toxic" (and I know many people do see it this way) it's not going to bring any people in. Even as a PvP player myself I would never suggest it to any other serious PvP gamer. Sure, these kind of builds are not "meta" but it's enough to frustrate a lot of the player base. You have to look at player skill like a normal distribution. Most players are not in the right end of the bell curve where what's "meta" matters. Most players are in the middle of the bell curve, which stuff like this can work and is seriously frustrating to play against.

    Btw, leave the "low iq" comments at home. There is already enough toxicity in PvP without them.

    He literally walked towards the mesmer and opened himself up. He coulda blinded the mesmer or something maybe even use wurm to escape and use some sort of well with stability to avoid being stunned but didn't, so he got farmed by the mesmers who were coordinating together.

    He shouldn't have jumped down and gone after mesmer, because as soon as he did, he fell right into the mesmer's trap.

    The third fourth 5th times and last time he did too. he got 1 kill but each time he opened himself up and left himself open to being cced by the enemy mesmers.

    I'm not disagreeing he could have played better and there is outplay potential to builds like this. The problem is that it's not healthy for the game and it's not a good experience for new players. There shouldn't be this barrier to entry for PvP where you have to learn about several different one shot builds just before you can start not dying in < 1second and actually start playing.

    Depression and anxiety are the worst...

  • RisenHowl.2419RisenHowl.2419 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    few things to point out. Always be on staff first when u plan to engage on a mirage, and signets are probably the worse thing u can have at the moment as a core necro. Spec Armor would of helped a lot imo but not enough if u don't know how to kite them off / run to no teleport spots.

    Horrible match up but your spec alone doesn't help either.

    @ugrakarma.9416 said:

    @zoopop.5630 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    few things to point out. Always be on staff first when u plan to engage on a mirage, and signets are probably the worse thing u can have at the moment as a core necro. Spec Armor would of helped a lot imo but not enough if u don't know how to kite them off / run to no teleport spots.

    Horrible match up but your spec alone doesn't help either.

    also hes jumping into melee using axe. Axe at mid range is very efficient against mesmer, jumping into melle is suicide. even being a single target weapon just keep using #1 at "ghosts" til u figure out the real mesmer, then melt him with Axe #2

    lmfao, tHaNkZ 4 aDvIcE!! There were 4 mesmers, i don't think it would matter worth a kitten what i'm using since i didn't have time to cast a single skill in the first place. At best i could've swapped to a defense spellbreaker if i had one built and ready to go, that would have given me 20 seconds to kill one before my defensive skills were all on CD. At the start of the match i didn't know if they were condi or power, this build would have worked very well against condi so i didn't swap to anything else. Once i realized they're all glass power, there wasn't a point in swapping.

    Maybe you guys don't get it, this was a no-win scenario. 'don't go into melee with axe'? like they aren't blinking into me with gs2 and engaging from stealth? Like when 4 mesmers use this cheesy kitten you have time to make any moves at all? The one time i got one alone i had no problems killing him, that's not possible with 4 of them.

    @Shao.7236 said:
    Meme unranked match, people running builds like this against anyone good enough to compensate for the predictable pattern would easily turn it around.

    Remember that Stealth is limited, they have to be close to you for one shoting and they only have few sustain utility that can be counted on one hand.

    Weakness against these people would easily turn the fight into your favor as well.

    With that in mind, look at how you played it out and see where your mistakes were made. Because there was a lot you could have done along with your team.

    It's a one shot, it sucks to dodge with lag, but you're not instantly dead if you do the right thing.

    With 4 of them, they can share stealth using mass invis. combined with personal stealth from torch and signet, they will always have the open. Unless you have a passive invuln, they will always one shot you. Get kitten real with this 'maybe you could put weakness on them!' nonsense. You can't dodge 4 stealth opens.

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    If your reaction time is perfect, you still get one shot by the other three mesmers. If you somehow manage to avoid all 4 gs2 combos, you now have no dodges against 4 mesmers. That's what you would call an impossible situation. The kind that stops people from playing this game mode and contributes to the low population.

    @Zexanima.7851 said:

    @Odik.4587 said:

    @Axl.8924 said:
    First one yeah that was an impossible situation

    If you are a slug and your reaction time is 3 seconds later then ye, impossible.

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

    @RisenHowl.2419 said:
    Let me preface this by saying yes, i understand it's a meme build. It's easy to kill when you have invuln for the initial burst. Just Dodge. Only bad players die against power mes. Bring a reveal. Watch the minimap. etc.

    GW2 pvp player population is at an all time low, imagine someone starting out in pvp running into this. Why on earth would they come back?

    Is it just me, or did the mes @ 4:34 knock you back twice with GS #5? How is that possible?

    oh yea, that was weird as kitten lol

    As a Mirage main who uses GS (not the 1 shot stun burst kind), I do not know how that is possible.

    Edit: Just thought of Chrono that can "rewind time" so CD's from the time its popped gets refreshed after, however it look more like a mirage

    I'm slightly surpised that everyone are blind or their iq is too low to see how necro got knocked by point blank into mirror xD

    It was actually around one second but that is still plenty of time to stun break/dodge. The issue here isn't if you have enough time to react, it's the player experience. The PvP player base is already so small it causes match making issues. If the interactions between professions is perceived as "toxic" (and I know many people do see it this way) it's not going to bring any people in. Even as a PvP player myself I would never suggest it to any other serious PvP gamer. Sure, these kind of builds are not "meta" but it's enough to frustrate a lot of the player base. You have to look at player skill like a normal distribution. Most players are not in the right end of the bell curve where what's "meta" matters. Most players are in the middle of the bell curve, which stuff like this can work and is seriously frustrating to play against.

    Btw, leave the "low iq" comments at home. There is already enough toxicity in PvP without them.

    Well said. I don't have any problems dealing with one or two of these in a game, but 4 is impossible to fight without a passive invuln to soak the damage.

  • Ragnarox.9601Ragnarox.9601 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 2, 2019

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @Ragnarox.9601 said:
    who cares about mesmers, devs only play that and thief. Just nerf Firebrand! Why? cause mesmers can do it better.

    ? devs literally do everything in their power to avoiding nerfing firebrand.
    whenever they do get around nerfing something they make sure to buff something else
    There is a reason why guard is the best dps in pve, the best support in pve, easy to play.
    The best support in pvp too, and hes not getting nerfed :D
    Meanwhile "favourite" mesmer gets nerfed every single patch for years.
    LuL developers even buffed guard during no balance batch, just some QoL changes but guard special little snowflake gets dmg boost :D

    They need to destroy mesmer oneshot build, this should not exist in any game. They need to put cds into f1 skills and nerf dmg output attacking from stealth by 50%. And bts firebrand/guard is nerfed every patch for last 5 years. They only buff meaningfull stuff like signets and spirit weapons that nobody use cause they are dead for 5 years.