Firebrand is OP

Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Edit: (values are actually 150 healing, toughness, and condi damage. Thank you to the observant people on this forum who quite quickly pointed out my unacceptable stupidity and incompetence)

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

I agree but ¯_(ツ)_/¯A lot of professions have equally broken builds and it has its counters like anything else. A good rev can make quick work of a FB.

Well duhhh......

firebrand is fine, we need to nerf those pesky mesmers first.

Condi teeeef OP Please nerf!

kinda wondering why firebrand is still OP even though tempest got nerfed into the ground when it was best support

maybe because the only support amulet now is menders?

@Zexanima.7851 said:I agree but ¯_(ツ)_/¯A lot of professions have equally broken builds and it has its counters like anything else. A good rev can make quick work of a FB.

Not like Firebrand. They are in a completely different universe when it comes to broken builds. The devs could spend the next 2 years nerfing at the same rate they have the other classes, and FB will still be in a completely different ball park of broken than any other class/build in the game. They are the very definition of a class that does way too much.

no tradeoff + strong instacast skill spam = fb

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

Can I play this mythical FB that runs ALL MAJOR traits at the same time? You even copied things from PvE that are split in sPvP and used the PvE values. The only thing a post like this does is shows how little you understand about sPvP and balance, and how pointless this post is.

@reikken.4961 said:kinda wondering why firebrand is still OP even though tempest got nerfed into the ground when it was best support

maybe because the only support amulet now is menders?

And even though the op has very little understanding, the topic is regarding condi dps FB. You are talking about support. It helps if your post has anything to do with the subject being discussed.

I really wish there is some sort of basic understanding test so people do not post kitten feedback on the forums.

it seems op but not everyone knows how to use fb. :pensive:

@otto.5684 said:I really wish there is some sort of basic understanding test so people do not post kitten feedback on the forums.But then you wouldnt have so many mesmer threads and such . Where is the fun? :confused:

Bring back glamour mesmer back with a good rework and see how this boon spam goes away with a mes + warr team.Firebrand is not op. It is ona different level. You are playing a multiplayer game yet firebrand plays a single player.

@otto.5684 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

Ok go for it. I did all the calculations in my head and am bound to have made mistakes. Please feel free to correct any split skills i mistakenly missed, and contribute to the discussion in a positive way. thanks.

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

@otto.5684 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

So let me get this straight.

You post a load of stuff that isn't true.

Someone calls you on that stuff being not true.

You say "why don't you contribute positively?".

?!?

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

All you've done is list the things that a class has, and then suggested that by having stuff it must be OP.

Look, I can do this too. You can do it for any class; just make a list of all of its traits and skills, with no comparison to other classes, and anything can sound OP.

Some fun Daredevil facts.

They get an additional 50 endurance that no other class gets.Heal 456 on dodge with 1s CD, which is better than warrior healing signet, just from a minor traitRemove Condi on dodge, 1s CDApply weakness after every dodgeGain an extra dodge on steal (lets ignore that this is using the PvE values eh? wHy DoN't YoU cOnTrIbUtE pOsItIvElY?!Applies 3 condis on dodgeRemove impairing conditions on dodgeLeap finisher on dodgeBoon rip every stealTorment on interruptMassive damage multipliersBandit's Defense gives better block than guardian AND low CD stunbreak?Better portal than mesmerSteal does confusionSteal does interruptInfinite escape on shortbowEtcEtcEtc

What's that you say? You can't take all of this stuff in the same build? wHy DoN't YoU cOnTrIbUtE pOsItIvElY?!

And does all of this stuff actually make daredevil OP, or is it just a pointless list of things the class can do, since every class needs to be able to do some thing?

Yes, FB has alot of Aegis; it's the classes base defence mechanic. It doesn't get evades or invulns or stealth or superspeed or channeled blocks. Okay, so lets take away Aegis. What FB skills are you going to add Evade to instead? Maybe a Stealth utility? Be sensible.

So your complaint is that FB is allowed to defend itself? What you really want is to be able to play against defenceless test-dummies that can't defend themselves or fight back, so you can farm free wins?

The salt is real

No matter the state of Firebrand, the “facts” are taken out of context.

This is like that time someone listed every effect Steal has and call it OP, while disingenuously using the premise of “just one skill” and disregarding the very much practical idea of weighing skills within a class, and also within the conquest mode, for its characteristics to be class-defining in a sPvP setting.

! Before I get called out as “Guardian Main”, I’ll declare that I am objectively trash on every class, I don’t have a main, and I don’t really oppose adjustments to classes. I just play regardless.

@Ragnar.4257 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

@otto.5684 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

Please, tell me where I made a mistake so I can correct it.

@Ragnar.4257 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

@otto.5684 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

Ive fixed the stat gain from quickness to the pvp values, which doesnt really change anything about what ive said.

Like Holo its alot of reward for little risk, mantras are instant cast just like mesmers allowing a plethora of skills to be used at the same time which can be very oppressive when used against you.

Firebrand just needs their mantras checked and a bit more risk added to them personally when using a tome. Do these things and they would be fine.

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Please, tell me where I made a mistake so I can correct it.

its just guard mains trying to discredit you. I read the first post and everything can be put on one build. ignore and move on.you actually forgot about mantra of truth, 3 blinds every 12 sec.the passive healing part isn't, its just healing.

OP is talking about symbolbrand that is plaguing the meta right now, not a condi dps FB and everything they stated is true about the build's damage and sustain. Its not some mythical build if you actually look at the post and not spam blindly.....
Maybe the part about 6 second slow every 10 sec is not completely accurate, probably a bit less.

@Ragnar.4257 said:

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Some fun FB facts.Aegis:Between mantra of solace, shield of judgement, and the f3 passive, FB gets roughly 2 aegis applications every 10 seconds.

CC:Between Axe 2&3, shield 5, and one use of heated rebuke (f1 chpt 3) per cooldown, FB gets roughly 2.5 hard cc every 10 seconds. With the stoic demeanor trait, this also means FB puts out roughly 6 seconds of slow every 10 seconds.

Quickness:Assuming the use of stalwart speed and swift scholar, FB gets almost 50% quickness uptime, which for some odd reason has a minor trait which gives 250 healing, 250 toughness, and 250 condi damage while the boon is active.

Additionally, FB can regularly output 6 condis on a target, regardless of being built for condi or power damage.All of this is assuming no use of cd reduction traits, and no use of renewed focus.And then there is passive healing through aegis, symbols, dodge roll.And also all their active defense skills, and other high impact boonsAnd their amazing condi clear/conversion.And also most of their skills are large aoe.

??????

Your assumptions are quite ludicrous. All ive ever hoped to see in gw2 is fair, skill based combat with minimal gimmicks and reasonable levels of counterplay to every build. All this post did was point out power creep of one of the elite specs. I am completely aware that other elite specs can be considered OP when looking at their skills, and I have always tried to have unbiased opinions regarding balance.

Also, guard has plenty of defensive skills outside of aegis, many of which are available to and used by the meta mantra bunker or symbolbrand builds.

The aegis/blind spam is pretty bloated right now. Being able to output heavy pressure is fine as long as you have to time the pressure. Right now Firebrand's can basically evade mid-cast since mantra's have no cast time once charged. Echo of Truth and Restoring Reprieve both need to either have their charge recharge (lol) time increased to 3 seconds or Echo of Truth should lose blind to open up the window for better counterplay.

@"Zagerus.8675" said:The aegis/blind spam is pretty bloated right now. Being able to output heavy pressure is fine as long as you have to time the pressure. Right now Firebrand's can basically evade mid-cast since mantra's have no cast time once charged. Echo of Truth and Restoring Reprieve both need to either have their charge recharge (lol) time increased to 3 seconds or Echo of Truth should lose blind to open up the window for better counterplay.

Whats annoying is you spam 5-10 hits, then use hard CC and oh now you got the aegis, nice! guess you dont get CC.