Can we please get a stat combination for pure support? — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Can we please get a stat combination for pure support?

There are unfulfilled stat combinations that many full service supports (those that are dedicated to boons and healing) might benefit from. Main healing power or concentration, with the other as an off stat, and vitality as the third stat.

Existing stat combinations with both healing power and concentration work, but aren't ideal. Harrier is main power, which is of no significant benefit to dedicated healers and pushes the support stats down into the secondary slots. Giver's suffers from the same issue while also affecting aggro in some fights (fine if you're the tank, but otherwise problematic). Minstrel is more flexible than giver's but still pumps toughness a lot. Plaguedoctor is nice as a building block for hybrids but doesn't give enough conc/healing power for dedicated supports.

Can you make do somehow with what's available? Certainly, and I have done so for 3 years of raids, but I would immediately switch over to Con+Heals/Vit or Heals+Conc/Vit if either were available. Those are the only three stats that I want as a pure support, so it would be nice to see them all available in the same package.

Like it or not, role specialization is here to stay in endgame content and it would be lovely if support mains got a proper stat combination for their jobs--something that isn't main toughness or a DPS stat.

(Purists can argue that vit is "wasted" but the dps increase for healers from unfocused dps stats is trivial and toughness produces the aforementioned aggro problems. So outside of speedrunning, vit seems like the least useless of the three for a pure healer. More options in this case to suit different purposes would be better.)

Comments

  • this. a thousand times this. having a stat combo that is pure support/healing would be amazing. Magi's could be considered to be however it doesn't include Concentration which is necessary for druids, might tempests, healbrands, boon thieves, and any other support class that gives boons. I run minstrel's now because it has the best overall usage of stats but then that puts me in the position of being tank as well because many classes that are meant to tank are using other stat combos that don't give them enough toughness to go higher than mine. I would really love to be able to join raids and maximize my efficiency as a healer with a healing primary stat and still have vitality and concentration WITHOUT it being necessary to maximize toughness as well.

  • LadyKitty.6120LadyKitty.6120 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2019

    They probably won't do that as it'd totally kill a bunch of other stat combos (harrier's, giver's, minstrel's, magi's, cleric's etc...). CondiHPconcexp would be another similar stat combo that'd be uberstrong if we had it. And ofc Powerhpfero would be nice for powerhealreaper.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who recorded videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks. Not active anymore.

  • Introduce a new stat named "Altruism" which is purely outgoing healing :^)

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Every stat combination consist at least 3 diffrent stats. What else, outside of conc and healing power, do u consider as support stats? Gw2 is all about maximising party dps, so by Going vitality u basicly kinda leech, same for toughness.
    Best u can do to support ur Group is to deal any dmg. Adding stats like power prec fero, healing power MAY shift meta anyhow (didnt do any theorycrafying, just guessing)

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2019

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    Every stat combination consist at least 3 diffrent stats. What else, outside of conc and healing power, do u consider as support stats? Gw2 is all about maximising party dps, so by Going vitality u basicly kinda leech, same for toughness.

    That's for open-world PvE and dungeons. Raids and T4 fractals use dedicated, non-DPSing healers, often in Magi gear.

    And WvW does exist, but who cares about that. :<

    Hannah | Daisuki[SUKI] Founder, Ehmry Bay, NA | 22 charas, 16k hours, 28k AP | ♀♥♀
    Mains Mariyuuna/Auramancer(PvE) & Terakura/Healbreaker(WvW) aka Henge of Denravi Silver Invader [SUKI]
    No need to be best, only good and kind.

  • Safandula.8723Safandula.8723 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hannelore.8153 said:

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    Every stat combination consist at least 3 diffrent stats. What else, outside of conc and healing power, do u consider as support stats? Gw2 is all about maximising party dps, so by Going vitality u basicly kinda leech, same for toughness.

    That's for open-world PvE and dungeons. Raids and T4 fractals use dedicated, non-DPSing healers, often in Magi gear.

    And WvW does exist, but who cares about that. :<

    @Hannelore.8153 said:

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    Every stat combination consist at least 3 diffrent stats. What else, outside of conc and healing power, do u consider as support stats? Gw2 is all about maximising party dps, so by Going vitality u basicly kinda leech, same for toughness.

    That's for open-world PvE and dungeons. Raids and T4 fractals use dedicated, non-DPSing healers, often in Magi gear.

    And WvW does exist, but who cares about that. :<

    sry didnt consider open world to much but imo, its easy enough to go harrier, u dont need much def stats. wvw actually has memestrel ( oh god how much i wish it disappear)

    make prepardness baseline plz

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2019

    @Hannelore.8153 said:

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    Every stat combination consist at least 3 diffrent stats. What else, outside of conc and healing power, do u consider as support stats? Gw2 is all about maximising party dps, so by Going vitality u basicly kinda leech, same for toughness.

    That's for open-world PvE and dungeons. Raids and T4 fractals use dedicated, non-DPSing healers, often in Magi gear.

    And WvW does exist, but who cares about that. :<

    In raids healers dont use magis, also healer dps matters

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 23, 2019

    Minstrel is an extremely inefficient support combination, it wastes alot of points in defense (mainly Toughness), and doesn't even have max Healing Power and Concentration is only a secondary stat on it, the only set where its main being Diviner's.

    Hannah | Daisuki[SUKI] Founder, Ehmry Bay, NA | 22 charas, 16k hours, 28k AP | ♀♥♀
    Mains Mariyuuna/Auramancer(PvE) & Terakura/Healbreaker(WvW) aka Henge of Denravi Silver Invader [SUKI]
    No need to be best, only good and kind.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 22, 2019

    @Hannelore.8153 said:
    Stop replying unless you know what you're talking about. I'm not in the mood today. You DON'T go full Harrier's because there's other ways to get boon duration, and Magi's is the only set with max Healing Power that doesn't draw aggro.

    Minstrel is an extremely inefficient support combination distribution, it wastes alot of points in defense (mainly Toughness), and doesn't even have max Healing Power and Concentration is only a secondary stat on it (the only set where its main being Diviner's).

    Replying to threads with misinformation just because you want to be right is not helpful. Its like you didn't even read OP's post.

    Looks harriers to me https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/ranger/druid/heal/
    Now stop this nonsense when it comes to raiding. Every meta healer use full harriers or harriers with 1-2 magis pieces. And yes, group dps matters which means that support classes dps matters aswell, thats why condi druid saw use in encounters that has less preasure.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • knite.1542knite.1542 Member ✭✭✭
    edited December 23, 2019

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:

    @Hannelore.8153 said:
    Stop replying unless you know what you're talking about. I'm not in the mood today. You DON'T go full Harrier's because there's other ways to get boon duration, and Magi's is the only set with max Healing Power that doesn't draw aggro.

    Minstrel is an extremely inefficient support combination distribution, it wastes alot of points in defense (mainly Toughness), and doesn't even have max Healing Power and Concentration is only a secondary stat on it (the only set where its main being Diviner's).

    Replying to threads with misinformation just because you want to be right is not helpful. Its like you didn't even read OP's post.

    Looks harriers to me https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/ranger/druid/heal/
    Now stop this nonsense when it comes to raiding. Every meta healer use full harriers or harriers with 1-2 magis pieces. And yes, group dps matters which means that support classes dps matters aswell, thats why condi druid saw use in encounters that has less preasure.

    Snow Crows clearly didn't consult Hannelore.8153 when they made those guides then. I guess they don't know what they are talking about.

    I wonder if Hannelore is in the mood today.

    If your team wins it's because of everyone else. If your team loses, blame the thief.
    ranger is OP but holo is more OP so its fine
    Why do this matter at all, you have people asking you why play so bad as fractal god?
    If they would pull that kitten on me, i would sue instantly. And i have enough time and money to finish that.
    Balance? More like a bunch of random nerfs done by interns.

  • MrForz.1953MrForz.1953 Member ✭✭✭

    I'm pretty sure these "inefficient" stat combinations were made on purpose to avoid full blown heal/boon bot builds that would do nothing else but that. There's potentially unhealthy stuff that could stem from a full support tank stat set in all game modes.

    Disgruntled Charr Engineer and Pirate - Jade Quarry

  • @Hannelore.8153 said:

    @Safandula.8723 said:
    Every stat combination consist at least 3 diffrent stats. What else, outside of conc and healing power, do u consider as support stats? Gw2 is all about maximising party dps, so by Going vitality u basicly kinda leech, same for toughness.

    That's for open-world PvE and dungeons. Raids and T4 fractals use dedicated, non-DPSing healers, often in Magi gear.

    And WvW does exist, but who cares about that. :<

    No raid uses non dpsing healers. Sure. You can go only healing and boons. You can go minstrel for chrono tank with 100% bd. Yet experianced chronos tank with 1251/1005 toughness and less bd to maximise dps. Healers do the same thing

  • I've been happily ignoring my dps as a minstrel druid for almost 3 years now. I've been in multiple statics and pug groups and in over 2,000 kills not one person has paid any attention to my personal dps. I've also yet to run into a single condi druid, except one that got kicked from a group because he wasn't providing might/heals. I recognize that my experience IS NOT fully representative of all raiders, but neither is that of speedrunners--most groups I've seen don't run those kinds of hyperaggressive comps, they have a proper tank and specialized healers. The only support that would about their dps is the firebrigade/offchrono/etc.

    Everyone would be completely free to keep using whatever existing stats they please if new ones get introduced. I would like the option to take a pure support stat because ignoring my dps and minmaxing for heals/boons has worked perfectly for me for raids and t4s. If it would break spvp, don't add it to spvp. Wvw I'm not sure of, but I would hazard a guess that minstrel could still be competitive with a 3-stat support combo there.

  • Katary.7096Katary.7096 Member ✭✭✭

    I'd say a pure support combination would boost concentration, healing power and expertise, not sure about the major though.

  • Nephalem.8921Nephalem.8921 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 23, 2019

    Minstrel isn't full support though. A lot of wasted stats on toughness + vit. T4 fractals is the essence of maximising support dps. Thats how you get < 3 sec skorvald phases and 30min full clears.

  • Asum.4960Asum.4960 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 24, 2019

    Currently healers with Harrier's and such are already way overhealing, so might as well take that extra power and contribute some damage.
    The only way to die in Raids with a competent support already is just terrible positioning or severely messing up mechanics, which won't change if you can outheal the usual damage by a magnitude of 5-20 instead of 3-8.

    For reference, some Raid Bosses like Samarog have an average pressure of just ~500 damage per second to the party. Some Healers currently can already heal for about 6000 Health per second with Harrier.
    More heals won't save more people in 99% of cases. What kills people is being off stack and failing mechanics, as healers already carry incredibly hard, making full support stat sets irrelevant.

    R.I.P. Build Templates, 15.10.2019

  • If you guys really wanted optimized stat set for support, it'd be HP+Condi/conc+exp or Power/hp+fero. Full heals and condi/power dps in same stat set but that'd be way too broken.
    And when it comes to maximizing dps as support, it's pretty much go diviner's/viper's with suitable runes or go harrier's / magi's / minstrel's. Especially when raiding, you're usually better off playing either dps-esque or heals as trait- and skillwise good healing and dps options are usually mutually exclusive and there's only a couple classes with well-functioning hybrid builds. Trying to greed dps with harrier's is kinda bad idea 'cause it lacks prec and fero to make it hit more than a wet cloth and quite often healer seriously greeding personal dps to add 1-2% to squad's total dps is more squad dps lost to lower scholar and boon uptimes. And if you use staff as healer even part-time, greeding is pretty much non-sense since staff skills in healing setup are the lowest damage you can do in this game.

    It's Kitty. The young lady who recorded videos playing various (non-)metabuilds. Raid/fractal videos at youtube.com/LadyKitty, Kittymarks test results at youtube.com/Kittymarks and tinyurl.com/Kittymarks. Not active anymore.

  • Opopanax.1803Opopanax.1803 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 25, 2019

    It doesnt make sense to me that they have:
    Minstrel- Tough/HP > Conc/Vit
    Givers- Tough > HP/Conc

    Why have toughness as a primary for healer/support for PVE? It is way more likely for you to pull aggro with a full set. It makes very little sense from the way that they have assigned threat. My only conclusion is that this is for PVP/WVW. So I think rolling out a new stat set would be nice.

    And as far as Snowcrows go: I get it, Harriers is great. But not all healers like running at ~13K HP. It dont think it would hurt anything, so why not give something like a modified Menders to pve [that has concentration instead of precision]?

    Power/HP > Conc/Vit would be good for PVE

  • borgs.6103borgs.6103 Member ✭✭✭

    Maybe they will add one. After all, they promised eXpANsIOn leVEL cOnTeNT, and new stat combos have always come with expansions.

    Check out the fable of the Boiling Frog.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    already done
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ventari's_Nomad_Insignia
    main Toughness
    minor Vitality
    minor Healing Power
    conc IF need it - from runes/sigils and food.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • Taygus.4571Taygus.4571 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @LadyKitty.6120 said:
    They probably won't do that as it'd totally kill a bunch of other stat combos (harrier's, giver's, minstrel's, magi's, cleric's etc...). CondiHPconcexp would be another similar stat combo that'd be uberstrong if we had it. And ofc Powerhpfero would be nice for powerhealreaper.

    there's already "dead stats" ..so what is more?

    and ir probably wont..as pure support isn't needed in good team.

    OP, I also want a healing concentration and vitality stat combo.

  • Taygus.4571Taygus.4571 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:
    already done
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ventari's_Nomad_Insignia
    main Toughness
    minor Vitality
    minor Healing Power
    conc IF need it - from runes/sigils and food.

    we want a support without toughness...as toughness means having to tank.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 29, 2019

    @Taygus.4571 said:
    we want a support without toughness...as toughness means having to tank.

    in gw2 no tanks as all. There is only "kiters", and they not always worry about toughness. So we need toughness for heals as primary stat, and we have it !!

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:

    @Taygus.4571 said:
    we want a support without toughness...as toughness means having to tank.

    in gw2 no tanks as all. There is only "kiters", and they not always worry about toughness. So we need toughness for heals as primary stat, and we have it !!

    What 😅 many raid bosses has toughness based tank aggro.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    What 😅 many raid bosses has toughness based tank aggro.

    If kiters don't have specific toughness runes why we should care that team's?

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 30, 2019

    @lare.5129 said:

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    What 😅 many raid bosses has toughness based tank aggro.

    If kiters don't have specific toughness runes why we should care that team's?

    Again, what? What are these weird kiters that you are talking about. Only in one raid boss there is this kiting mechanics where you MIGHT need to have some toughness (still less than tank has).
    And when it comes to tanking you always wanna do that with as low toughness as possible and thats why healers in raids should also run with 0 added toughness.

    Specific tougness runes? What are those, you might wanna check out the runes that tanks or healers use in raids. Now stop with this nonsense 😅

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 31, 2019

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    What are these weird kiters that you are talking about.

    kiters - is a someone who keep agro from boss.

    Only in one raid boss there is this kiting mechanics where you MIGHT need to have some toughness (still less than tank has).

    support should always have overcap toughness to be sure for more safe.

    And when it comes to tanking you always wanna do that with as low toughness as possible

    NO. You should have same 1:1 toughness as heal, PLUS toughness from runes and sometimes food.

    Specific tougness runes? What are those, you might wanna check out the runes that tanks or healers use in raids.

    I don't care if someone use not properly build or runes.

    I am expert of game play in GuildWars2, so I am sure that you don't have enough experience. You should try read guide. May be you will find my extended guides also.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 31, 2019

    @lare.5129 said:

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    What are these weird kiters that you are talking about.

    kiters - is a someone who keep agro from boss.

    Only in one raid boss there is this kiting mechanics where you MIGHT need to have some toughness (still less than tank has).

    support should always have overcap toughness to be sure for more safe.

    And when it comes to tanking you always wanna do that with as low toughness as possible

    NO. You should have same 1:1 toughness as heal, PLUS toughness from runes and sometimes food.

    Specific tougness runes? What are those, you might wanna check out the runes that tanks or healers use in raids.

    I don't care if someone use not properly build or runes.

    I am expert of game play in GuildWars2, so I am sure that you don't have enough experience. You should try read guide. May be you will find my extended guides also.

    And here i am with my 1k LIs without enough experience.
    Also are you saying that SC is not using proper gear on their tanks and heals? Everything you just said is just wrong and shows that you are the one without any experience when it comes to raiding.

    See, 1k toughness for heal https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/ranger/druid/heal/

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Also dont call you self an experienced player if you cant handle a strike mission.

    @lare.5129 said:
    yes, it too hard. We make squad, do 5 trying.. get nut luck. Raid over. Strike mission in Bjora s removed from my dayli content.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    And here i am with my 1k LIs without enough experience.

    yes, not enough. You also should have aprox 1k cms 100kp like me.

    Also are you saying that SC is not using proper gear on their tanks and heals?

    yer, SC use not proper gear. They propagate speed run style wiht variantion on each boss, without any grantee to success.

    fail build,t o get fast down to downstate after first wave of bleed of fire instability. That build is work only on few boses in raid, and absolutely uselees in orr dungeons, and fractals.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 31, 2019

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    Also dont call you self an experienced player if you cant handle a strike mission.

    This is one of greatest part of experience in GuildWars2 - don't prioritize that is to hard, and not profitable(or achivable), if u get any random players.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lare.5129 said:

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    And here i am with my 1k LIs without enough experience.

    yes, not enough. You also should have aprox 1k cms 100kp like me.

    Also are you saying that SC is not using proper gear on their tanks and heals?

    yer, SC use not proper gear. They propagate speed run style wiht variantion on each boss, without any grantee to success.

    fail build,t o get fast down to downstate after first wave of bleed of fire instability. That build is work only on few boses in raid, and absolutely uselees in orr dungeons, and fractals.

    Well we were talking about raid healers here as no1 who does fractals seriously dont take healers unless its absolutely must for some reason.

    For druid, its still very meta in raids, mostly because of 10men buffs instead of 5.
    Dungeons? Really, no1 use healers there.
    You are mostly talking about fractals and even with those same rule applies. For fractals you still wanna have power soulbeast, bannerslave, quickbrand, alacrigade and dps.. all of them with minimal toughness which you can clearly find you here: https://discretize.eu

    Now if you are talking about some meme play what you want fractals where you dont even try to skip mechanics with high burst dmg, cant comment that as i dont know how that works because min/maxing allways works better.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    Well we were talking about raid healers

    no, we were talking about healers for Fractals, Dungeons, and Raids.

    here as no1 who does fractals seriously dont take healers unless its absolutely must for some reason.

    we call this chill meta. Welcome to gw2 terminology.

    For druid, its still very meta in raids, mostly because of 10men buffs instead of 5.

    I say that druid dead ? no, I don't say that.

    Dungeons? Really, no1 use healers there.

    Do you do each day orr dungeons? No?

    You are mostly talking about fractals and even with those same rule applies.

    rules a not constants.

    For fractals you still wanna have power soulbeast, bannerslave, quickbrand, alacrigade and dps..

    few days ago I close cms whit as chrno, with druid combo. I was have choose - join as chrno, or collect new party 30-40 min. This is reality.

    all of them with minimal toughness which you can clearly find you here: https://discretize.eu

    this is "speedrunners", and reality exist in parallel mode for that.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 31, 2019

    @lare.5129 said:

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    Well we were talking about raid healers

    no, we were talking about healers for Fractals, Dungeons, and Raids.

    here as no1 who does fractals seriously dont take healers unless its absolutely must for some reason.

    we call this chill meta. Welcome to gw2 terminology.

    For druid, its still very meta in raids, mostly because of 10men buffs instead of 5.

    I say that druid dead ? no, I don't say that.

    Dungeons? Really, no1 use healers there.

    Do you do each day orr dungeons? No?

    You are mostly talking about fractals and even with those same rule applies.

    rules a not constants.

    For fractals you still wanna have power soulbeast, bannerslave, quickbrand, alacrigade and dps..

    few days ago I close cms whit as chrno, with druid combo. I was have choose - join as chrno, or collect new party 30-40 min. This is reality.

    all of them with minimal toughness which you can clearly find you here: https://discretize.eu

    this is "speedrunners", and reality exist in parallel mode for that.

    You said that you are experienced and now you are talking about chill runs ^^ ofc you can complete T4s even with 5 healers if you want to.

    Speedrun or chill meta, anyways toughness should stay low on every1.
    Its not reality if you have static.

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @sokeenoppa.5384 said:
    You said that you are experienced and now you are talking about chill runs ^^ ofc you can complete T4s even with 5 healers if you want to.

    yes, and this is main part for experienced too.

    Speedrun or chill meta, anyways toughness should stay low on every1.
    Its not reality if you have static.

    Sometimes we have 3 support from 5 in my static runs. Chill and fun.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • Vince.1695Vince.1695 Member ✭✭
    edited December 31, 2019

    @sokeenoppa.5384
    After reading his posts in other part of the forums I think we all here should agree explicitly that he is not a very experienced player in terms of builds and instanced content. His 1k CM kps are not true because that would have been impossible for him to obtain since he hadn't had any few weeks ago. Also I'm missing lots of logic in his posts, here and in the usual discussion forum. For me personally it's a waste of time to argue with him.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited December 31, 2019

    @Vince.1695 said:
    His 1k CM kps are not true because that would have been impossible for him to obtain since he hadn't had any few weeks ago.

    I don't have 1k. I say I have aprox 1k. This is 2 different things.
    And about you - don't be shine, share your api on https://killproof.me, because now looks that you kill mob only in Caledon Forest. So probably you also not understand too what is optimal stat combination for support.

    want solid balance ? - play chess.

  • maddoctor.2738maddoctor.2738 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dixie Cougar.2415 said:
    There are unfulfilled stat combinations that many full service supports (those that are dedicated to boons and healing) might benefit from. Main healing power or concentration, with the other as an off stat, and vitality as the third stat.

    Existing stat combinations with both healing power and concentration work, but aren't ideal. Harrier is main power, which is of no significant benefit to dedicated healers and pushes the support stats down into the secondary slots. Giver's suffers from the same issue while also affecting aggro in some fights (fine if you're the tank, but otherwise problematic). Minstrel is more flexible than giver's but still pumps toughness a lot. Plaguedoctor is nice as a building block for hybrids but doesn't give enough conc/healing power for dedicated supports.

    Can you make do somehow with what's available? Certainly, and I have done so for 3 years of raids, but I would immediately switch over to Con+Heals/Vit or Heals+Conc/Vit if either were available. Those are the only three stats that I want as a pure support, so it would be nice to see them all available in the same package.

    Like it or not, role specialization is here to stay in endgame content and it would be lovely if support mains got a proper stat combination for their jobs--something that isn't main toughness or a DPS stat.

    (Purists can argue that vit is "wasted" but the dps increase for healers from unfocused dps stats is trivial and toughness produces the aforementioned aggro problems. So outside of speedrunning, vit seems like the least useless of the three for a pure healer. More options in this case to suit different purposes would be better.)

    The reason the "meta" stat combinations have Power in them is because Power adds the most DPS. In fact it's better to have just Power over having Precision AND Ferocity at the same time. This is of course by design, so support builds can do -some- damage with just one stat, so Power is intentionally overblown. I'm curious on why you need Vitality though, having Power instead of Vitality means the support can provide damage for the group as well as... support. There are times, especially in Raid encounters when you aren't required to heal, and instead can provide some damage numbers, Power is there for that reason. Which is why Harrier is so good for a support. They add Toughness on many stat combinations with Healing Power for the synergy (Healing + taking less damage = more effective health) which is of course counter productive if you are not the tank, harming the team instead of helping.

    Now I can understand someone wanting to play a pure support build that deals no damage, although honestly in the current game I see little reason for it, except for training runs or when the team isn't yet experienced enough. More options is always good and if others find a pure support stat combination with Healing Power/ Concentration/ Vitality good I'm all for it.

  • @lare.5129 said:

    @Vince.1695 said:
    His 1k CM kps are not true because that would have been impossible for him to obtain since he hadn't had any few weeks ago.

    I don't have 1k. I say I have aprox 1k. This is 2 different things.
    And about you - don't be shine, share your api on https://killproof.me, because now looks that you kill mob only in Caledon Forest. So probably you also not understand too what is optimal stat combination for support.

    I'm here since 2013. Was speed running dungeons, fracs & raids and one of the first people to have the fractal god title.
    If you talk about supports having to take toughness you're not competent and we are done with the discussion here. Sorry mate, but you belong to another league. That's no problem but please don't spread nonsense and just enjoy your casual content. I won't judge you because of that. Have fun in the game.

  • sokeenoppa.5384sokeenoppa.5384 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Vince.1695 said:
    @sokeenoppa.5384
    After reading his posts in other part of the forums I think we all here should agree explicitly that he is not a very experienced player in terms of builds and instanced content. His 1k CM kps are not true because that would have been impossible for him to obtain since he hadn't had any few weeks ago. Also I'm missing lots of logic in his posts, here and in the usual discussion forum. For me personally it's a waste of time to argue with him.

    It was either netflix or this, kinda bored for netflix already😅

    I'll have two number 9s, a number 9 large, a number 6 with extra dip, a number 7, two number 45s, one with cheese, and a large soda.

  • DirtyDan.4759DirtyDan.4759 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 1, 2020

    Instead of wishing for more healing power, players should focus on not needing to get healed in the first place. Support builds are already disgustingly overpowered in this game.

  • Henry.5713Henry.5713 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Not going to talk about the need to run healing or tanky gear or the lack thereof.

    Just for the sake of having a discussion. We could consider a few options:

    3 stats

    • Healing Power (main)
    • Concentration
    • Power or Vitality/Toughness

    4 stats (power)

    • Healing Power (main)
    • Concentration (main)
    • Power
    • Precision

    4 stats (condition)

    • Healing Power (main)
    • Concentration (main)
    • Condition Damage
    • Expertise

    4 stats (a better Minstrel)

    • Healing Power (main)
    • Concentration (main)
    • Toughness
    • Vitality

    The most optimal would be a two-stat combination with a ratio of 70/30 - 60/40 between Heaing Power and Concentration.
    Just enough to max out your Boon Duration. Imagine 70/30 with the similar amount of overall stats of a three-stat set:

    (weapons)

    • 427 Healingpower
    • 182 Concentration

    That's a gain of 176 Healing Power (a gain of around 70%) over the main stat of a three-stat set (251) and an extra 248 Healing Power if compared to an off-stat (179). Now that would be a hillarious amount of healing.
    Silly and a complete waste in many cases but still a big buff if we consider passive healing trough Regeneration, Symbols, Bow of Truth, etc. and spammable skills such as Cosmic Ray and Desert Blossom or traits such as Selfless Daring.

    Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something. ~ Robert Heinlein