Does Range (soulbeast/core) have any place in WvW?

I understand that Ranger is not the ideal class for WvW specially zergs/blobs but what about the other aspects of WvW?

It definitely has a strong place in small group and solo. Quite effective in fact.

Of course, you need to know how to play it.

When new year ends. I might make one. Druid minstrel staff gs. Or axe warhorn. Why. For immobs and healing and smokescale. It has the potential as melee ranger.

Of course there are those who prefer to pew pew but rooting imobs are really important as ccs

Definitely has a place if you know how to play it. I’m welcomed in every squad I join because people know my play style.

If you are new to this class then seriously stay away from organized squads. You become a bag and ralley bot. Go roaming and havoc and hone your skills or use an accepted zerg class. Just imo ?

Every class have place in WvW. Just follow commander inside blob and push tab and some weapon skill like rabid fire.

This is really simple, for roaming (i.e. not facing multiple scrappers/firebrands/aura tempests or projectile hate) it's usable as soulbeast. Core ranger doesn't have that much burst at all. If you want a simple test: run soulbeast without merging with the pet, then merge and use it again. It's a simple fact that the massive bonus from merging with a ferocious pet (such a Smokescale or Arctodus) while running the beast mastery line makes up a large portion of soulbeast damage boosts , besides traits such as Ferocious Strength , Oppressive Superiority or using One Wolf Pack. If you use "Sic Em!" as a utility skill for example , even after nerfs the bonus while merging is a hefty +25% damage (the same is true for Greatsword 2 aka Maul).

For group play (anything over 5 people , as 5 people is a party not a squad) you really want to avoid running ranger because the only thing you'll provide the group is stance share (such as bear stance / dolyak stance for condi clear, moa stance for boons , and one wolf pack for group damage improvement). The problem with druids is your pet is still visible when your group is trying to use stealth gyro, so unless your group doesn't use stealth gyro or veils then you will be a hindrance. In addition, unlike scrappers or firebrands, druids need to build up astral force for the Celestial Avatar and the sustained healing really isn't as strong in a proper group comp versus say a heal tempest or a scrapper (since the med kit scales insanely with boons and incoming condis). Moreover, unless you plan on staying melee with Greatsword, shortbow/longbow/axe are almost all projectile so it's really difficult to be effective. Sword and dagger hit 2 and 3 targets respectively at melee range and aren't particularly stellar (dagger relies on slow ramp condi as well) so it isn't really worth bringing over another spellbreaker or another firebrand , scrapper (there's DPS gyros if you're just looking for damage), herald revenant, or even dragonhunter. The damage isn't going to be insane as staff daredevil Vault which hits 5 targets, for example.

@"Infusion.7149" said:This is really simple, for roaming (i.e. not facing multiple scrappers/firebrands/aura tempests or projectile hate) it's usable as soulbeast. Core ranger doesn't have that much burst at all. If you want a simple test: run soulbeast without merging with the pet, then merge and use it again. It's a simple fact that the massive bonus from merging with a ferocious pet (such a Smokescale or Arctodus) while running the beast mastery line makes up a large portion of soulbeast damage boosts , besides traits such as Ferocious Strength , Oppressive Superiority or using One Wolf Pack. If you use "Sic Em!" as a utility skill for example , even after nerfs the bonus while merging is a hefty +25% damage (the same is true for Greatsword 2 aka Maul).

For group play (anything over 5 people , as 5 people is a party not a squad) you really want to avoid running ranger because the only thing you'll provide the group is stance share (such as bear stance / dolyak stance for condi clear, moa stance for boons , and one wolf pack for group damage improvement). The problem with druids is your pet is still visible when your group is trying to use stealth gyro, so unless your group doesn't use stealth gyro or veils then you will be a hindrance. In addition, unlike scrappers or firebrands, druids need to build up astral force for the Celestial Avatar and the sustained healing really isn't as strong in a proper group comp versus say a heal tempest or a scrapper (since the med kit scales insanely with boons and incoming condis). Moreover, unless you plan on staying melee with Greatsword, shortbow/longbow/axe are almost all projectile so it's really difficult to be effective. Sword and dagger hit 2 and 3 targets respectively at melee range and aren't particularly stellar (dagger relies on slow ramp condi as well) so it isn't really worth bringing over another spellbreaker or another firebrand , scrapper (there's DPS gyros if you're just looking for damage), herald revenant, or even dragonhunter. The damage isn't going to be insane as staff daredevil Vault which hits 5 targets, for example.

I think pets are counted now and is stealth able.

Ofcourse, on SB, even if not if squad, you should zero those meteor shower eles and aim for necros or anyone that moved off tag or trying to catch up.Otherwise as roamer is very good.

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

you need to know how to play it.

That's the correct answer.Don't start on ranger, play it because you want some variety after establishing yourself.

@Sovereign.1093 said:

@"Infusion.7149" said:This is really simple, for roaming (i.e. not facing multiple scrappers/firebrands/aura tempests or projectile hate) it's usable as soulbeast. Core ranger doesn't have that much burst at all. If you want a simple test: run soulbeast without merging with the pet, then merge and use it again. It's a simple fact that the massive bonus from merging with a ferocious pet (such a Smokescale or Arctodus) while running the beast mastery line makes up a large portion of soulbeast damage boosts , besides traits such as Ferocious Strength , Oppressive Superiority or using One Wolf Pack. If you use "Sic Em!" as a utility skill for example , even after nerfs the bonus while merging is a hefty +25% damage (the same is true for Greatsword 2 aka Maul).

For group play (anything over 5 people , as 5 people is a party not a squad) you really want to avoid running ranger because the only thing you'll provide the group is stance share (such as bear stance / dolyak stance for condi clear, moa stance for boons , and one wolf pack for group damage improvement). The problem with druids is your pet is still visible when your group is trying to use stealth gyro, so unless your group doesn't use stealth gyro or veils then you will be a hindrance. In addition, unlike scrappers or firebrands, druids need to build up astral force for the Celestial Avatar and the sustained healing really isn't as strong in a proper group comp versus say a heal tempest or a scrapper (since the med kit scales insanely with boons and incoming condis). Moreover, unless you plan on staying melee with Greatsword, shortbow/longbow/axe are almost all projectile so it's really difficult to be effective. Sword and dagger hit 2 and 3 targets respectively at melee range and aren't particularly stellar (dagger relies on slow ramp condi as well) so it isn't really worth bringing over another spellbreaker or another firebrand , scrapper (there's DPS gyros if you're just looking for damage), herald revenant, or even dragonhunter. The damage isn't going to be insane as staff daredevil Vault which hits 5 targets, for example.

I tested it: the issue is that if you're not a soulbeast , I don't think blasted stealth counts the pets. Also, if you're relying on veil/stealth gyro it needs to be in the smoke field or walk through the veil. So while soulbeast is quite suboptimal but usable when merged, I wouldn't even bother with core ranger and druid is a worse version of scrapper/firebrand/tempest for groups because unlike PVE you won't be relying on spirits due to mobility , spirit health decay, and AoEs flying everywhere. You'd basically be pick team but without the spammable massive damage of staff daredevil or hammer revenant while eating tons of retal from Barrage/Rapid Fire if you use longbow.

@LetoII.3782 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

you need to know how to play it.

Rofl good one guys !

@Infusion.7149I see.

I want to make one so I can try druid imob. Maybe I can make it work. If not, well, I got my other wvw toons.

Only one I don't have now is a theif

For medium classes, staff daredevil or scrapper IMO

A good player roaming around on a SB is deadly. We were talking about SB's on BG recently, and we agreed they are much better these days due to the changes made to barrage (no LoS) for use in siege/havoc warfare. But, a good player can usually play anything quite effectively, and those players are almost always welcome in almost any zerg, on whatever class he is on.

Winning or losing a matchup doesnt actually do anything much these days, so class & public zerg requirements seems to be alot more relaxed than its ever been.

No and with good reason. Ranger is the worst class you can take into WvW. They have no reliable damage in Zergs, have no boon strip, can't apply anywhere near enough boons to be even remotely interesting and are worse than any other support overall. Even in roaming you are better off with with something like a mesmer or thief. Unless you like loosing and gifting enemy servers free points you don't pick ranger. Having allied rangers on a full wvw map is essentially a handicap to your server.

Currently Ranger is Trash tier. You should pick Guardian, necro, scrapper, rev or warrior for zerging and for roaming either mesmer or thief(which in addition to being strong can potentially open a portal for allies into enemy objectives).

@Leo.5829 said:No and with good reason. Ranger is the worst class you can take into WvW. They have no reliable damage in Zergs, have no boon strip, can't apply anywhere near enough boons to be even remotely interesting and are worse than any other support overall. Even in roaming you are better off with with something like a mesmer or thief. Unless you like loosing and gifting enemy servers free points you don't pick ranger. Having allied rangers on a full wvw map is essentially a handicap to your server.

Currently Ranger is Trash tier. You should pick Guardian, necro, scrapper, rev or warrior for zerging and for roaming either mesmer or thief(which in addition to being strong can potentially open a portal for allies into enemy objectives).OP said but what about other aspects of WvW.

And you're saying that a soulbeast would be trash tier vs say a scourge when roaming.

Which then again kind of make sense, since everybody knows that the scourge is by far the best roamer.

People are horrendous at keeping reflect uptime even in bigger groups so it's not too hard to get shots in. Rangers and such are excellent at picking off people who fall out of position. Against organized groups, they become much less effective because all you're blasting down are their pugs and often times this may be used as bait to get you.

In general, Ranger along with thief is one of the best classes to add to a fight when it comes to small scale as the chances are high you can demolish someone. I have friends of which have only played ranger for a few hours can quickly down someone after I tell them about the sic'em + rf combo. On the flip side if someone +1's you, it becomes rather painful.

Also please don't stand on top of walls firing at zergs. That doesn't do anything and just makes you likely to be yanked off and instagibbed.

@Justine.6351 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

you need to know how to play it.

Hey, people complain about ranger being bad AND overpowered, sometimes in the same thread.

There's a logical conclusion to be drawn from that evidence...

@Leo.5829 said:No and with good reason. Ranger is the worst class you can take into WvW. They have no reliable damage in Zergs, have no boon strip, can't apply anywhere near enough boons to be even remotely interesting and are worse than any other support overall. Even in roaming you are better off with with something like a mesmer or thief. Unless you like loosing and gifting enemy servers free points you don't pick ranger. Having allied rangers on a full wvw map is essentially a handicap to your server.

Currently Ranger is Trash tier. You should pick Guardian, necro, scrapper, rev or warrior for zerging and for roaming either mesmer or thief(which in addition to being strong can potentially open a portal for allies into enemy objectives).

This is absolutely false. Soulbeast isn’t good in zergs but is arguably the best roamer given the open field nature of wvw. Thieves get absolutely annihilated by good SB players, and doesn’t really have any bad matchups in open field. Also has the most kite potential on any class with all the stab and leaps and even has the longest range. I honestly hope it gets nerfed in small group/roaming situations.

Still hoping to test my minstrel druid after new year. Grrr arg

@Strider Pj.2193 said:It definitely has a strong place in small group and solo. Quite effective in fact.

Of course, you need to know how to play it.

I found lots of rangers that kept shooting inside ventari and guardian dome.

It never gets old, some with high wvw rank..

Yes they excel in roamer and havoc play. They are also great in a groups together doing stance sharing. In zerg play they are better acting as pincer movements and to thin out the others side's necros.

@LetoII.3782 said:

@Justine.6351 said:

@LetoII.3782 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:

you need to know how to play it.

That they are probably in a good state. If they were stated as OP and wanted, than you know they need adjusting.

@FunkyBassline.5289 said:

@Leo.5829 said:No and with good reason. Ranger is the worst class you can take into WvW. They have no reliable damage in Zergs, have no boon strip, can't apply anywhere near enough boons to be even remotely interesting and are worse than any other support overall. Even in roaming you are better off with with something like a mesmer or thief. Unless you like loosing and gifting enemy servers free points you don't pick ranger. Having allied rangers on a full wvw map is essentially a handicap to your server.

Currently Ranger is Trash tier. You should pick Guardian, necro, scrapper, rev or warrior for zerging and for roaming either mesmer or thief(which in addition to being strong can potentially open a portal for allies into enemy objectives).

This is totally true.I just fought a Soulbeast LB/Sword+WH with my Reaper.I landed 80-90% of my big hits and still LOST.His pet did at least 50% of the damage on me while I was keeping him locked down.Necros already have a hard time sticking to rangers.How is that fair he still got another animal kicking me from behind!?This injustice against necros must be resolved!

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Strider Pj.2193 said:It definitely has a strong place in small group and solo. Quite effective in fact.

Of course, you need to know how to play it.

It's to the point where taking permeating wrath and wall of reflect is a better choice then it really should be.