juno.1840 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 It's bigger than the dodge distance (300 per wiki). There's no counter-play if domed.Similar skills for reference:Static Field on Staff Air 5 has a radius of 180 (recent nerf-hammer recipient)Purging Flames has a radius of 240NULL Field (program much?) has a radius of 240Well of Corruption has a radius of 240So why does the death-dome have such a monstrous radius? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowywonders.1378 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Cus its an elite skill. What you list is not. That is one reason. there is more reasons too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWI.4127 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 It's a 0 range skill meaning the Warrior has to be right in the middle of it to cast a good one. The skills you listed are like 900+ range skills which don't need the caster to be in much danger. It has a whopping 1.5 second cast time with a huge tell It's an elite skill with a 90 second cooldown. Not some weapon or utility skill. Time Warp has the same radius for instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Time warp also has a 180 second CD on it. Not really comparable to a 90 second CD. Not to mention, pumping slow out every 2 seconds is not nearly as dangerous to the enemy as stripping their boons. Note I'm not calling for a nerf, but these skills aren't all that comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWI.4127 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 It's also 1200 range and you can cast it twice in a row with continuum shift. I feel like many classes with these ranged AoEs really don't appreciate how much the range helps. Anyway I wasn't saying Time Warp is stronger or just as strong, just the same AoE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 CS isn't baseline, and doesn't change the fact that pulsing slow is not nearly as dangerous as having your boons forcefully ripped from you. They just aren't all that comparable of skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWI.4127 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 @OriOri.8724 said:CS isn't baseline, and doesn't change the fact that pulsing slow is not nearly as dangerous as having your boons forcefully ripped from you. They just aren't all that comparable of skills. I wasn't trying to compare them, but I realize I did a bad job of conveying that in my last post. So I'll just say I agree they aren't comparable and just leave it at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Eh, I'd settle for reducing TW's radius a bit anyway, and Winds of Disenchantment, and any other long lasting AoE field. 360 is a huge radius, even for an elite skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PassionWhisky.3457 Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 OriOri dont Cry, u cant currupt boons when the radius its 200 or 240, its logic.. If u can dodge these Elite Skill its a Useless Skill .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Considering it doesn't corrupt any boon, and that its still an effective area of denial skill even at reduced radius, I don't really know why you felt the need to make that comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerby.1069 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 rip double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerby.1069 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 I also think the radius is fine as is. The arguments comparing different class abilities aren't valid. This game isn't balanced that way. You have to look at the class as a whole and the interaction with all the other abilities they have. I mean you can look at warrior shield 5 compared to everyone else's block skills.....and its crap...doesn't mean it needs a buff though.@Cerby.1069 said:@OriOri.8724 said:Time warp also has a 180 second CD on it. Not really comparable to a 90 second CD. Not to mention, pumping slow out every 2 seconds is not nearly as dangerous to the enemy as stripping their boons. Note I'm not calling for a nerf, but these skills aren't all that comparable.ummm you are forgetting the use of timewarp is the quickness.....50% higher dps for 10 people is no joke when cleaving a lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 @Cerby.1069 said:I also think the radius is fine as is. The arguments comparing different class abilities aren't valid. This game isn't balanced that way. You have to look at the class as a whole and the interaction with all the other abilities they have. I mean you can look at warrior shield 5 compared to everyone else's block skills.....and its crap...doesn't mean it needs a buff though.@Cerby.1069 said:@OriOri.8724 said:Time warp also has a 180 second CD on it. Not really comparable to a 90 second CD. Not to mention, pumping slow out every 2 seconds is not nearly as dangerous to the enemy as stripping their boons. Note I'm not calling for a nerf, but these skills aren't all that comparable.ummm you are forgetting the use of timewarp is the quickness.....50% higher dps for 10 people is no joke when cleaving a lord.when cleaving anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juno.1840 Posted October 13, 2017 Author Share Posted October 13, 2017 @Cerby.1069 said:I also think the radius is fine as is. The arguments comparing different class abilities aren't valid. This game isn't balanced that way. You have to look at the class as a whole and the interaction with all the other abilities they have. I mean you can look at warrior shield 5 compared to everyone else's block skills.....and its crap...doesn't mean it needs a buff though.Understood, and other responses seem upset at the skill range comparisons, but you didn't really say why the Winds of Change radius is fine... other than "I think it's fine as it is". So it didn't answer my question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerby.1069 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 @juno.1840 said:@Cerby.1069 said:I also think the radius is fine as is. The arguments comparing different class abilities aren't valid. This game isn't balanced that way. You have to look at the class as a whole and the interaction with all the other abilities they have. I mean you can look at warrior shield 5 compared to everyone else's block skills.....and its crap...doesn't mean it needs a buff though.Understood, and other responses seem upset at the skill range comparisons, but you didn't really say why the Winds of Change radius is fine... other than "I think it's fine as it is". So it didn't answer my question.Ok lets backtrack here so were on the same page:Your argument is that it is bad because its so much better compared to other profession skills of similar nature. My argument was that you can't compare that way to justify a nerf/buff.So given both our arguments cancel eachother out....you now want me to tell you why it is fine as is.And my answer to that is:I think its fine as is because noone has presented a valid argument otherwise.Alrighty? Alrighty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edu.6984 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriOri.8724 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 @Cerby.1069 said:I also think the radius is fine as is. The arguments comparing different class abilities aren't valid. This game isn't balanced that way. You have to look at the class as a whole and the interaction with all the other abilities they have. I mean you can look at warrior shield 5 compared to everyone else's block skills.....and its crap...doesn't mean it needs a buff though.@Cerby.1069 said:@OriOri.8724 said:Time warp also has a 180 second CD on it. Not really comparable to a 90 second CD. Not to mention, pumping slow out every 2 seconds is not nearly as dangerous to the enemy as stripping their boons. Note I'm not calling for a nerf, but these skills aren't all that comparable.ummm you are forgetting the use of timewarp is the quickness.....50% higher dps for 10 people is no joke when cleaving a lord.I didn't forget about quickness. I was trying to show how they aren't comparable. WoD is all about stripping their boons. TW pulses slow and quickness. 2 entirely different functions on those skills, not to mention WoD is arguably much more dangerous to enemies. Quicker attacks can still be dodged/blocked/evaded, not having resistance and stab in WvW means you're dead rather quickly though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choppy.4183 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 @xDudisx.5914 said:Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this.Tornado does damage, hard cc, and moves. Winds is a stationary bubble you can walk out of that removes a boon each half sec.Once Anet makes enemy Winds show a different colour, it's going to be even easier to know if you should move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juno.1840 Posted October 14, 2017 Author Share Posted October 14, 2017 @Cerby.1069 said:@juno.1840 said:@Cerby.1069 said:I also think the radius is fine as is. The arguments comparing different class abilities aren't valid. This game isn't balanced that way. You have to look at the class as a whole and the interaction with all the other abilities they have. I mean you can look at warrior shield 5 compared to everyone else's block skills.....and its crap...doesn't mean it needs a buff though.Understood, and other responses seem upset at the skill range comparisons, but you didn't really say why the Winds of Change radius is fine... other than "I think it's fine as it is". So it didn't answer my question.Ok lets backtrack here so were on the same page:Your argument is that it is bad because its so much better compared to other profession skills of similar nature. My argument was that you can't compare that way to justify a nerf/buff.So given both our arguments cancel eachother out....you now want me to tell you why it is fine as is.And my answer to that is:I think its fine as is because noone has presented a valid argument otherwise.Alrighty? AlrightyTechnically my post is a question on why the radius is so large. To answer the question requires some constructive response, preferably referencing existing skills or some metrics. Saying "I think the radius is fine" is not a constructive response. If I wanted a "vote" on the radius, I would have created a poll, not a question.From the data I provided, you can accurately surmise that I think the radius is too big. The backup I gave for that opinion is that the length of a dodge roll is 300, which is smaller than the radius, so you will have some boons stripped without the ability to counter the play. I referenced the ranges of other skills that have similar mechanics to further backup my argument. The only skill you've offered as a counter is Time Warp which is a buff, not an attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choppy.4183 Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 @juno.1840 said:From the data I provided, you can accurately surmise that I think the radius is too big. The backup I gave for that opinion is that the length of a dodge roll is 300, which is smaller than the radius, so you will have some boons stripped without the ability to counter the play. I referenced the ranges of other skills that have similar mechanics to further backup my argument. The only skill you've offered as a counter is Time Warp which is a buff, not an attack.But what's the consequence of still having 50' distance to travel after that dodge, assuming you were right on top of the SB when Winds was used? You've maybe lost one boon. The skill removes one boon per half second, and there's even a chance you could escape without losing that one boon (through a second dodge, port, etc). There's plenty of counterplay, and there's not much consequence for suffering such a limited time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edu.6984 Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 @Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this.Tornado does damage, hard cc, and moves. Winds is a stationary bubble you can walk out of that removes a boon each half sec.Once Anet makes enemy Winds show a different colour, it's going to be even easier to know if you should move.It also prevents you from using any utitlity, healing or weapon skill during its duration. Right now winds is by far the most overpowered elite skill on wvw. 1 single skill that forces the entire meta to go to pirate ship. No other class has an elite as impactfull as winds. Most elites have a longer cooldown and/or are weaker and very few are able to hit 5 targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choppy.4183 Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 @xDudisx.5914 said:@Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this.Tornado does damage, hard cc, and moves. Winds is a stationary bubble you can walk out of that removes a boon each half sec.Once Anet makes enemy Winds show a different colour, it's going to be even easier to know if you should move.It also prevents you from using any utitlity, healing or weapon skill during its duration. Right now winds is by far the most overpowered elite skill on wvw. 1 single skill that forces the entire meta to go to pirate ship. No other class has an elite as impactfull as winds. Most elites have a longer cooldown and/or are weaker and very few are able to hit 5 targets. What are you talking about? You can do all of those things, and no, pirate ship isn't the inevitable result. Just walk out of the thing.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Winds_of_Disenchantment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485 Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 @xDudisx.5914 said:@Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this.Tornado does damage, hard cc, and moves. Winds is a stationary bubble you can walk out of that removes a boon each half sec.Once Anet makes enemy Winds show a different colour, it's going to be even easier to know if you should move.It also prevents you from using any utitlity, healing or weapon skill during its duration. Right now winds is by far the most overpowered elite skill on wvw. 1 single skill that forces the entire meta to go to pirate ship. No other class has an elite as impactfull as winds. Most elites have a longer cooldown and/or are weaker and very few are able to hit 5 targets. it strips boons and stops projectiles... that is all it does.The lightning field does not daze unless leap finishers are used. What the hell are you even talking about? It does not do any damage by itself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edu.6984 Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 @Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:@Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this.Tornado does damage, hard cc, and moves. Winds is a stationary bubble you can walk out of that removes a boon each half sec.Once Anet makes enemy Winds show a different colour, it's going to be even easier to know if you should move.It also prevents you from using any utitlity, healing or weapon skill during its duration. Right now winds is by far the most overpowered elite skill on wvw. 1 single skill that forces the entire meta to go to pirate ship. No other class has an elite as impactfull as winds. Most elites have a longer cooldown and/or are weaker and very few are able to hit 5 targets. What are you talking about? You can do all of those things, and no, pirate ship isn't the inevitable result. Just walk out of the thing.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Winds_of_DisenchantmentCreate an area of calm where foes cannot receive boons..." You will not get boons from your utilities, healing or any of your skills. It complete negates lots of skills. What is a guardian shout if it will give no boons? Useless. Yes it is one of the reasons that reinforce pirate shit meta. The more you nerf stability, the harder it gets ti melee. After anet changed stab to stack stacks instead of durations the hammer trains pretty much disappear. Winds is just the final nail in the coffin. "Just walk out". In a 1v1 ok, but It is only 90s cd, huge aoe and hits 10 targets. In a zerg with a few warriors you can coordinate to always have one ready to drop one. It promotes stay away from the zerg, because getting close will strip all your boons and there is no counter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choppy.4183 Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 @xDudisx.5914 said:@Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:@Choppy.4183 said:@xDudisx.5914 said:Tornado is an elite skill on a higher cd and has a smaller radius. It is also cast around the caster.I say reduce winds radius and/or increase its cooldown. It is op as it is now. Not even scourge has such a broken skill like this.Tornado does damage, hard cc, and moves. Winds is a stationary bubble you can walk out of that removes a boon each half sec.Once Anet makes enemy Winds show a different colour, it's going to be even easier to know if you should move.It also prevents you from using any utitlity, healing or weapon skill during its duration. Right now winds is by far the most overpowered elite skill on wvw. 1 single skill that forces the entire meta to go to pirate ship. No other class has an elite as impactfull as winds. Most elites have a longer cooldown and/or are weaker and very few are able to hit 5 targets. What are you talking about? You can do all of those things, and no, pirate ship isn't the inevitable result. Just walk out of the thing.https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Winds_of_DisenchantmentCreate an area of calm where foes cannot receive boons..." You will not get boons from your utilities, healing or any of your skills. It complete negates lots of skills. What is a guardian shout if it will give no boons? Useless. Yes it is one of the reasons that reinforce pirate kitten meta. The more you nerf stability, the harder it gets ti melee. After anet changed stab to stack stacks instead of durations the hammer trains pretty much disappear. Winds is just the final nail in the coffin. "Just walk out". In a 1v1 ok, but It is only 90s cd, huge aoe and hits 10 targets. In a zerg with a few warriors you can coordinate to always have one ready to drop one. It promotes stay away from the zerg, because getting close will strip all your boons and there is no counter. Not receiving boons while standing in a giant bubble is nowhere near your claim that you can't use heals, utilities or weapon skills. The reason you're back to pirate ship is because your commanders have no imagination and your people have no talent beyond sitting on a tag spamming skills. Also, you can drop Winds on enemies too, so it's not as though you're in any sort of disadvantage. And the only way it's going to strip all of your boons is if you stay in it until all of your boons are gone. Don't do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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