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"The Meta" - Some mAT Numbers For You

Ragnar.4257Ragnar.4257 Member ✭✭✭
edited January 25, 2020 in PVP

In the name of science, here are the finalist and semi-finalist team compositions from the last 6 mATs.

Now some caveats on these:

  • I couldn't find a few of the team-compositions, in particular the first NA October mAT. If anyone has these, I'll merge them into the numbers.
  • Because of this, the comparison between EU and NA is not "like for like". A "10" on NA is equivalent to a "12" on EU.
  • It's important to understand the numbers in context. While 15 is a bigger number than 12, when it's out of a total of 205, the difference is meaningless.
  • If it says "Thief" or "Mesmer", it means "Core". Elites are specified separately.
  • mAT is not Ranked. It's a very different game, since you've got 5 people on voice-comms who have practiced together and specifically chosen their classes for a particular purpose as part of a 5-man team. In general, in this scenario it's better to be super-specialised for one purpose, rather than playing a self-sufficient, jack-of-all-trades which is often better for solo-Q in ranked, where you can't rely on your team-mates.
  • For the finalists, I took the compositions they used in the final, not any earlier rounds.
  • Remember that many of these will be the same players over and over in each tournament. It's not actually 205 different players counted here, its probably closer to 40.


So, some conclusions to draw from this:

  • Firebrand and Herald most represented, not hugely surprising
  • The FB numbers are waaaay higher in NA than in EU, especially when you look at the Duo numbers: 7 out of 18 NA teams were stacking FBs, while only 1 out of 23 EU teams did. FB is super-meta in NA, but is just one of the crowd in EU. You're 5x more likely to a face a double thief/DD in EU than you are a double FB, and nearly half of EU teams had no FB at all.
  • EU in general has a much wider spread of class representation
  • NA has a way bigger tendency to stack classes
  • Mirage and Holosmith still both very well represented, despite whines to the contrary
  • Thief/Daredevil and SpellB/Warrior are a big deal on EU, but are almost non-existent on NA. If you count Thief/DD/Deadeye together, it is by far the highest represented class on EU.
  • Rangers(+Elites) and Necros(+Elites) are almost nowhere to be seen on either side.
  • Weaver numbers are surprisingly low, despite how much attention they get from the community

It's interesting to me how different EU and NA are, especially how EU is all about Thief/Rev rotate-and-spike comps, while NA is all about spamming FBs, and how Thief/Warrior variants are big on EU but non-existent on NA.

This might also explain some differences in perception on the Forums about how strong certain comps are. Might it be the case that EU players are more concerned about how strong Thief is, and don't care about FB, while NA players are more concerned about how strong FB is and don't care about Thief?

It's certainly a different world from Ranked though. Ranger and Necro variants are a regular feature in my ranked games (P2/3) but just aren't represented here.

The full data breakdown:

Comments

  • bluri.2653bluri.2653 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Stats PogChamp

    www.twitch.tv/sindrener - Rank 55 Dragons/Orange Logo/Team Aggression

  • viquing.8254viquing.8254 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2020

    @Ragnar.4257 said:

    • Mirage and Holosmith still both very well represented, despite whines to the contrary

    2 mesmers(included mirages) over 24 players for EU last 6 1st .
    4 / 24 for EU 2nd.
    5 / 24 for NA 1st .
    3/ 24 for NA 2nd.

    That said, nice stats even if in some cases, it's more players dependants than class dependant. (mean you can give whatever class to certain players, they will still perform...).
    And as you said it highligh the class differences (and whine and comments.) between NA and EU.

  • aymnad.9023aymnad.9023 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2020

    Thanks a lot for those numbers. While I do not really look at mAT (because solo) this is important to see the difference between «solo queue" and "team queue" environment. Seeing EU and NA difference in numbers is also quite interesting because you sometimes hear about stuff on forums and have a completely different experience so you are not sure if the person is making stuff up or not.
    Edit : Checked how the "winners comp" have evolved too. That is quite funny because I did not expect some comps to be so close to what I can see in ranked (but maybe I am the only one surprised ^^)

  • Chaith.8256Chaith.8256 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Having played a good amount of Holo I am largely shaking my head at these Sword/Shield Holo comps I'm seeing on NA MaTs fairly often.

    Would be interesting to see MaT finalists vs semi-finalists.

    twitch.tv/chaithh
    Forum Lord Chaith

  • Math.5123Math.5123 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2020

    Edit: Didn't read. My bad.

    ~ God Tier Guardian

  • Trevor Boyer.6524Trevor Boyer.6524 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Thank you for doing this.

    ~ I left GW2 on 11/22/2020 due to widespread cheating and the lack of action to moderate it

  • saerni.2584saerni.2584 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Very nice job.

    Northern Shiverpeaks (NSP)
    Deadeye (Thief)
    Commandant of P/D and Apex Predator

  • wow some disgusting comps. thanks for the info.

    Te lazla otstara.

  • Kaburro.4712Kaburro.4712 Member ✭✭✭

    Another "Nerf Firebrand" topic.

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭

    What were the winning comps for January? I didn't catch the streams.

    Best Dressed Memser NA.

  • Raiden The Beast.3016Raiden The Beast.3016 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 26, 2020

    @mortrialus.3062 said:
    What were the winning comps for January? I didn't catch the streams.

    EU:
    2xteef
    Mirage
    SB
    Weaver

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭

    So looking at this meta and have deep and comprehensive knowledge of how Anet patches OP things, we can assume the coming balance patch will do the following changes:

    • Engineer will be nerfed.
    • Elementalist will be nerfed.
    • Firebrand will be buffed.
    • Herald will be buffed.
    • The tooltips for all other classes updated.
    • No other changes.

    gaggle - /ˈɡaɡ(ə)l/ - noun
    A disorderly group of Asura.
    "The gaggle of Asura tried to agree on whether a phase-shifted thermonuclear energy matrix was sufficiently powerful for a device capable of heating bread"

  • DanAlcedo.3281DanAlcedo.3281 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well... rev was only played ones in MaTs.

    Need a huge buff then

  • bluri.2653bluri.2653 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Dawdler.8521 said:
    So looking at this meta and have deep and comprehensive knowledge of how Anet patches OP things, we can assume the coming balance patch will do the following changes:

    • Engineer will be nerfed.
    • Elementalist will be nerfed.
    • Firebrand will be buffed.
    • Herald will be buffed.
    • The tooltips for all other classes updated.
    • No other changes.

    U forgot thief gets nerfed every patch :) or qol changes that are indirect nerfs

    www.twitch.tv/sindrener - Rank 55 Dragons/Orange Logo/Team Aggression

  • James.1065James.1065 Member ✭✭✭

    Based on previous expeirence and all this data, I am pretty sure that in the up coming balance patch in Feb FB's, holos, and mirage dont have to worry.

    Anet will ignore these facts and professions and instead choose to nerf necro/reaper for "being too sustainable" in melee fights or some other weak excuse -.-

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @James.1065 said:
    Based on previous expeirence and all this data, I am pretty sure that in the up coming balance patch in Feb FB's, holos, and mirage dont have to worry.

    Anet will ignore these facts and professions and instead choose to nerf necro/reaper for "being too sustainable" in melee fights or some other weak excuse -.-

    whats the point of this salty? mesmer is being nerfed every single patch.
    I dont see it stopping.

  • These results clearly indicate Soulbeast, Druid, and Ranger are in a good spot at the moment.

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Archon.6480 said:
    These results clearly indicate Soulbeast, Druid, and Ranger are in a good spot at the moment.

    But why are rangers so low then?

    Both soulbeast and druid are really low.

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • Tayga.3192Tayga.3192 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 26, 2020

    @Archon.6480 said:
    These results clearly indicate Soulbeast, Druid, and Ranger are in a good spot at the moment.

    These results clearly indicate any kind of Ranger is unfortunately very bad on a thief/rev meta.
    It was very good in Scourge/Firebrand meta though.

  • Falan.1839Falan.1839 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 26, 2020

    Good stats. The representation of Holo is unsurprisingly mostly from the older mATs in October and November, at least on EU. And even on NA it seems to be slowly vanishing as of January.

  • Tayga.3192Tayga.3192 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 26, 2020

    @Falan.1839 said:
    Good stats. The representation of Holo is unsurprisingly mostly from the older mATs in October and November, at least on EU. And even on NA it seems to be slowly vanishing as of January.

    Revenant becoming relevant is a huge factor for this. Same goes for S/D thieves, they changed to S/P and even D/P to have a chance at killing heralds and mirages. Even weavers and firebrands, to a lesser degree.

  • Tycura.1982Tycura.1982 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2020

    No love for warrior qq
    Ty for making this

  • Falan.1839Falan.1839 Member ✭✭✭

    @Tayga.3192 said:

    @Falan.1839 said:
    Good stats. The representation of Holo is unsurprisingly mostly from the older mATs in October and November, at least on EU. And even on NA it seems to be slowly vanishing as of January.

    Revenant becoming relevant is a huge factor for this. Same goes for S/D thieves, they changed to S/P and even D/P to have a chance at killing heralds and mirages. Even weavers and firebrands, to a lesser degree.

    Revenant was always relevant.

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭

    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

  • Tharan.9085Tharan.9085 Member ✭✭✭

    @DanAlcedo.3281 said:
    Well... rev was only played ones in MaTs.

    Need a huge buff then

    honestly, rev is quite weak without herald

  • FtoPScrub.5476FtoPScrub.5476 Member ✭✭✭

    Can't wait for everyone to point to unreliable data as unrefutable proof that x class is underpowered/overpowered

  • Dantheman.3589Dantheman.3589 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tayga.3192 said:

    @Falan.1839 said:
    Good stats. The representation of Holo is unsurprisingly mostly from the older mATs in October and November, at least on EU. And even on NA it seems to be slowly vanishing as of January.

    Revenant becoming relevant is a huge factor for this. Same goes for S/D thieves, they changed to S/P and even D/P to have a chance at killing heralds and mirages. Even weavers and firebrands, to a lesser degree.

    Supposedly core dp is a pretty matchup into revenant some won’t play it in ranked becuz of this, so they go dp DrD. I’m sure there’s still a chance to get kills on revs but I’m not sure if the purpose of dp in mats was to counter revs

  • bluri.2653bluri.2653 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

    U can run 5 of same class

    www.twitch.tv/sindrener - Rank 55 Dragons/Orange Logo/Team Aggression

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

    U can run 5 of same class

    I thought they changed that back in the esl days when 5 elementalists won finals? To a max of 2 off one class. Im confused.

  • bluri.2653bluri.2653 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

    U can run 5 of same class

    I thought they changed that back in the esl days when 5 elementalists won finals? To a max of 2 off one class. Im confused.

    Ye but that was inofficial rules. This is ingame events so obv theres no restrictions

    www.twitch.tv/sindrener - Rank 55 Dragons/Orange Logo/Team Aggression

  • RedShark.9548RedShark.9548 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

    U can run 5 of same class

    I thought they changed that back in the esl days when 5 elementalists won finals? To a max of 2 off one class. Im confused.

    Ye but that was inofficial rules. This is ingame events so obv theres no restrictions

    Oof, and here i was, thinking all that time they implemented it directly into the game lol. Since im not playing at's i didnt even bother checking, i do believe they should restrict that tho.

  • bluri.2653bluri.2653 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

    U can run 5 of same class

    I thought they changed that back in the esl days when 5 elementalists won finals? To a max of 2 off one class. Im confused.

    Ye but that was inofficial rules. This is ingame events so obv theres no restrictions

    Oof, and here i was, thinking all that time they implemented it directly into the game lol. Since im not playing at's i didnt even bother checking, i do believe they should restrict that tho.

    I would imo ban class stacking in general in ats/mats ye

    www.twitch.tv/sindrener - Rank 55 Dragons/Orange Logo/Team Aggression

  • Gamble.4580Gamble.4580 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 28, 2020

    The only people who care are the 00000.000001% of gw2 players who do them so you are talking to yourselfs. Make MAT quicker and worth doing and the players would join and invest more. It shocks me u guys waste your time doing them. 5v5 in-house would show skill better and be allot more fun than that wasted hour+. + there will always be a different meta for 5v5 premade and let’s say ranked what shines in one won’t shine in the other.

  • Avatar.3568Avatar.3568 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:

    @bluri.2653 said:

    @RedShark.9548 said:
    How come on NA nobember 2nd place has 3 firebrands? I thought 2 of the same class was the maximum? Is that wrong?

    U can run 5 of same class

    I thought they changed that back in the esl days when 5 elementalists won finals? To a max of 2 off one class. Im confused.

    Ye but that was inofficial rules. This is ingame events so obv theres no restrictions

    Oof, and here i was, thinking all that time they implemented it directly into the game lol. Since im not playing at's i didnt even bother checking, i do believe they should restrict that tho.

    I would imo ban class stacking in general in ats/mats ye

    Rip 5 ranger meta

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Gamble.4580 said:
    The only people who care are the 00000.000001% of gw2 players who do them so you are talking to yourselfs. Make MAT quicker and worth doing and the players would join and invest more. It shocks me u guys waste your time doing them. 5v5 in-house would show skill better and be allot more fun than that wasted hour+. + there will always be a different meta for 5v5 premade and let’s say ranked what shines in one won’t shine in the other.

    thats what I said on other thread, and something we were doing in NVO.
    PvP scene was as dead as its here.
    but all the geared/good players just went in together, made discord group. made in game group. and played premade 5v5s.
    much fun, + toxic bug abusing people were kicked out so only "normalish" people were around.
    Havent seen anyone do anything remotly close to that here so I assume nobody cares about equal 5v5 and just wants to get 500g and move on.