Drakkar - How Would You Improve the Fight? — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Drakkar - How Would You Improve the Fight?

I respect the team that developed Drakkar and thank them for new content (as always) however in my opinion the Drakkar world boss fight was a huge let down. This may have been because I heard, maybe wrongly, that this would be an encounter with the difficulty of Triple Trouble or Tequatl but instead we got another stack-on-foot HP sponge.

However I do believe all the ingredients are there for a harder fight without fundamentally changing the encounter and so I'm giving my ideas. If any of you have further thoughts feel free to post but be aware that requesting huge changes such as not being in the cave are not going to happen- realistic changes please. (FYI one of the plus points for me WAS the confined space- made for a different encounter.)

1) Less noise (less AOEs at most times) and up the damage of Drakkar's large scale AOE attacks but at set %HP times so people have a chance to get their block on and prepare. This creates a sense of impending doom as the HP 'timer' ticks down and forces players into defensive mode.

2) All other times we need localised AOE damage with heavy pushes and pulls into that damage that can be mitigated by clever movement. Chill should play a big part here.

3) More minions- elites and hard champs designed to take your focus away from the pushes, pulls and AOEs. Maybe with their own skills during a Drakkar invulnerable stage like in the Specimen Chamber (Sandswept Isle). They should also hit like trucks, not bicycles.

4) The stamps...slaps... thing Drakkar does with his hands(?) need to hurt more and maybe push back to a wall of elites at the back of the cave or damaging totems meaning jumping the icicles is recommended. This also takes the zerg away from the hands (may need to adjust the HP of Drakkar slightly lower to account for the lower DPS?).

5) The portal stage has a LOT of promise in this fight. All three gates up at the same time with the group forced to split between the three. The champs inside should be legendaries with unique skills per portal and they should NOT scale with player number (I've heard this is a thing, may be wrong). If I wanted to go further I'd add mechanics like, for example, mini light puzzles to create traps to then damage the legendary or a room with Jormag's ice on the ground in specific spots that change....the possibilities here are endless. Even have the possibility of failing to give Drakkar a specific buff.

6) The 'shield stages' should be a bigger thing IMO. Have the players destroy ice totems or something to power up the shield which then eventually explodes pushing Drakkar back into the ice wall. He swims around and we're then back in the fight.

These are just some off the top of my head and I'm no expert but I feel that these changes, while requiring an overhaul, would not involve drastic changes although I could be wrong. Feel free to add yours... unless you feel the fight was great! To each their own.

<1

Comments

  • Main issues that I see:

    • Too easy
    • Repetitive
    • Takes too long.
    • Lack of incentive

    Too easy: adding more unpredictable attacks, more dangerous AoE's , and simply bumping up some damage numbers would already help a lot. Also, the 3 raven portal bosses are ridiculously easy, actually make them combat worthy. And lastly, add more mobs spawning during the fight just to add pressure to players. I think people were expecting something on the levels of triple trouble, supposedly, that's what was said in a stream, though I can't quote that.
    Drakkar is an excellent chance to make proper use of the masteries in some way, but unfortunately, these add no value other than having that free CC that makes the shield bubble part kind of pointless...

    Repetitive: I think the biggest slap in the face was when drakkar retreats after 20%, it was really cool to transition mid fight to a different part of the map, added a lot of cinematic value, BUT THEN, when you are in this new area, the mechanics stay exactly the same! I think that's where people start getting annoyed/bored at the repetitive nature of the boss (already seen AFK farmers). He needs some unique mechanics after this stage, or after each phase really (after each raven portal).
    Also, the shield bubble part, where he attacks from the center, why exactly do we get in the shield bubble? Everyone does it out of instinct, but when I walked out of the bubble during this, nothing really happened, feels almost unintentional.

    Takes too long: I wouldn't mind this were it not for the 2 problems stated above. But even then, I think the battle could take a tiny bit less, bump down the hp a bit (not much), and it wouldn't feel as grindy to people. An event that takes approx 30 minutes, should stay relevant throughout the 30 minutes, otherwise we get the same problem as the eastern meta of bjora marches.

    Lack of incentive: no worthy rewards. Though I saw the devs mentioning that drakkar would be updated to be able to drop ascended gear, which is fantastic! What makes me sad though, is that, unlike the other dragon wordboss achievements, drakkar's achievements do not reward a backpack. Give us a backpack arenanet ;-(

    With all that being said, the boss is visually stunning, music is beautiful, the area where you fight him is awesome, overal a real wholesome experience, held back by flaws that could be easily fixed.

  • An idea I had floating around was (not only to boss fights, but to zones as well) is to completely change the environment you're in.

    Drakkar could be a good example for this: we are fighting under/in a frozen lake, so why not flood the area and have to fight him underwater after a certain % of its HP? But for that Arenanet would have to streamline underwater combat and skills with their terrestial counterpart, so your skills wouldn't be useless.

    One could extend this to completely change a map on certain conditions: failing a meta event could lead to whole sections of the map being flooded, caved in etc and this would open up another set of events to revert this.

  • That break bar needs to be buffed, it is broken too fast and easy.

  • Sir Alric.5078Sir Alric.5078 Member ✭✭✭

    @BlackyWarsX.5384 said:
    An idea I had floating around was (not only to boss fights, but to zones as well) is to completely change the environment you're in.

    Drakkar could be a good example for this: we are fighting under/in a frozen lake, so why not flood the area and have to fight him underwater after a certain % of its HP?

    I would love that, but sadly i can already hear the complains of the "We hate UW combat!" crowd even at the mere suggestion.

    Anyway, i stumbled on Drakkar boss fight while i was exploring the new map (or rather, the new portion of the old map) and i have to say it was a pretty cool boss fight visually, although i agree that it was a bit long and repetitive (it was pretty much the same fight over and over). It would be awesome if they changed it to have diffent mechanics after each phase (or at least the final phase). As for the difficulty, i don't know. I didn't go down even once during the fight (maybe because my P/P thief heals herself every time she inflicts damage) but i saw plenty of downed people around me.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2020

    Drakkar is very ok. Nice sound also!!!
    But may be it should easy,
    because in non prime time after some time it will be very hot challenge.
    Yes, now when we have hype and best dps players come it is fun, but let see in future also please!!
    I have strong feeling that roleplay players from our guilds can to much pressure on that world boss.

    So will believe it will be nerfed after half year for players who want complete achiv but not start story for some life reason.

  • lare.5129lare.5129 Member ✭✭✭✭

    now near current topic we also see topic "Please nerf thunderhead peaks south meta"
    It is easy predict that topic "Please nerf Drakkar" will be apply by someone in xx days.

  • They said there's a new "harder events" mechanic, that if you do some events and stuff it will spawn some harder events/versions, maybe Drakkar has one too, and we haven't found it yet.
    Or they could create one for Drakkar, so people would have to complete a lot of events in the map to spawn this "harder Drakkar" with more mechanics and better rewards, kinda like Silverwastes when you look at it.

  • Nightcore.5621Nightcore.5621 Member ✭✭✭

    The boss take almost a half haour to kill.. Is to long a fight

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2020

    @Cylokin.2560 said:
    That break bar needs to be buffed, it is broken too fast and easy.

    Remember, most players on map and at meta are of the more dedicated crowd currently. Just as with the last Bjora Marches map meta, expect more casual players (with less experience, there is also experienced casual players) to join into the meta over time. A very easy breakbar turns into a quite difficult breakbar with time and influx of less experienced players.

    Case in point, it took a couple of days for me to see a Bjora Marches map meta fail (the one with the giant needing to get chained), but now I've seen that one fail multiple times. This might also just be due to many players just not wanting to bother with chains (which says a lot when a full map can't even get 6-7 people to do chains).

  • DoRi Silvia.4159DoRi Silvia.4159 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 29, 2020

    I along with many pugs yesterday still put it down to being the best world boss so far, there is more interactions and takes a bit of effort to bring down.
    Yes I think the difficulty could go up but I think they are on the right track here.

    This whole episode actually felt like that anet was trying to get the casuals trained upto more harder content.. like the green circle mechanics very similar to vale guardians circles and the new strike just shows that they are really putting in am effort to familiarize players to more difficulty (yay!)

    I'd say overall well done anet ! Keep at it

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    One of the big things it needs to space players out. I had hoped the fight would be up on the surface of the lake, with it smashing it's way upwards. A large boss needs space so that we can see it, its mechanics, the telegraphs and not be hamstring by all the visual noise.

    Tequatl may be easy now, but it is at least a well constructed fight because it forces players into different positions in every part f the fight except the stun phase. The best fights fully separate the zerg into smaller groups - Marionette, Vinewrath, Gerent, TT etc. Even adding mechanics, Drakkar is in too confined an area to be able to see them to play against them.

    I'd also like to see the Whispers become a mechanic in some way as players fight to stay focused whilst being seduced. It would give extra character to the boss.

    Relocating the boss now is too late, so they need to find a way to add mechanics, but also make telegraphs fully visible to players esp in melee.

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • The design of Drakkar is amazing, that team did a wonderful job.
    As far as the mechanic of this meta... bleh...

    First of all the bugs:

    • The In Combat issue after a failed fight is NOT fixed. Multiple people had that issue. Relog is ONLY option. (In Combat is extremely buggy to begin with and needs an overhaul
    • The fact there's a room below it with enemy NPC's makes autotarget pick those sometimes. How that is even possible is beyond me, but the layered target bug where you target stuff accidentally through thick walls and floors is a long standing one, so in this case: Anet could and should have seen this one coming
    • Some mechanic put on you that prevents you from taking portals to Champs while under this influence that have timers up to 60 seconds is ridiculous. I already missed champions completely due to this extremely high cooldown. Therefor a bug in my eyes, (cannot be removed, cleansed)
    • Raven Portals that you cannot use to get out of there, but constantly reminds you with ugly bold popups that you need to train the Raven Flight (WHICH I HAVE TRAINED!)

    Then the mechanics of the fight...
    Nope... just Nope. It's same ol same ol... constant freeze to slow you down, constant rings to dodge and constant being feared like EVERY BOSS out there. Other than the champs you gotta go to through portals, there's nothing new there.
    Not offering ideas since the replies before me did a better job in that, than I can.

    Design Team: You did a great job
    Mechanics design: Too much copy/paste

  • I strongly disagree with those calling this boss "too easy" haha not even CLOSE to being true! I just logged off from a failed Drakkar fight because players didn't seem to understand a few things;

    • Don't stand under Drakkar's feet when he stomps (almost always kills everyone who stands there)
    • We are given 3 stages of portals/minions before the main boss to gather up the energy required to use the new powers on each type of creature AND Drakkar himself during the boss fight (Many people didn't seem to get this either)
    • You need a couple of the masteries completed for the Raven portals during the fight

    The one thing I will agree with is the boss fight is timely, being twice the length of Tequatl's boss fight on a slow map (14-16 mins). I believe he needs to be at 80% to start the 2nd phase of the fight, and it takes quite a few times breaking through the wall to get there. I think if they shortened this to him only breaking through 3 times until he hits the 80% mark it would be better. The fight overall is refreshing and I truly believe in redeemed the game from those complaining it "lacks content". Those are the ones who race through new stuff in a day then complain until more stuff is developed. Slow down and enjoy each part of the game as it was intended.

    I think Drakkar is well done, and the developers/designers should be proud of their work.

    X Archangel X - Jujubaka - X Juca X - Zophielbee - M I C H A E L L - R A P H A E L L - "For the spoons!" - Tequatl

  • Jimbru.6014Jimbru.6014 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2020

    I did the Drakkar fight exactly once. I was constantly losing target on him and attack kept turning off. Supremely annoying and artificially makes the fight longer. We should never lose target on a critter that kitten big.

  • Moradorin.6217Moradorin.6217 Member ✭✭✭

    Make it shorter

  • I hope they can revamp the model, it looks nothing like it was in GW1.

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Did it multiple times (one of each raven portal shrine) as well as joining on a fail map when it was minutes away from the end (people probably didn't CC with the special action).

    What I noticed is a group of about 15-20 is more efficient than a full 50 because the rooms are too small for that amount of people.

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Caitybee.3614 said:
    I strongly disagree with those calling this boss "too easy" haha not even CLOSE to being true! I just logged off from a failed Drakkar fight because players didn't seem to understand a few things;

    • Don't stand under Drakkar's feet when he stomps (almost always kills everyone who stands there)
    • We are given 3 stages of portals/minions before the main boss to gather up the energy required to use the new powers on each type of creature AND Drakkar himself during the boss fight (Many people didn't seem to get this either)
    • You need a couple of the masteries completed for the Raven portals during the fight

    The one thing I will agree with is the boss fight is timely, being twice the length of Tequatl's boss fight on a slow map (14-16 mins). I believe he needs to be at 80% to start the 2nd phase of the fight, and it takes quite a few times breaking through the wall to get there. I think if they shortened this to him only breaking through 3 times until he hits the 80% mark it would be better. The fight overall is refreshing and I truly believe in redeemed the game from those complaining it "lacks content". Those are the ones who race through new stuff in a day then complain until more stuff is developed. Slow down and enjoy each part of the game as it was intended.

    I think Drakkar is well done, and the developers/designers should be proud of their work.

    No masteries were required for the portals unless they changed it. It was basically a hp sponge, with a cc bar and portals anyone could enter who hadn’t already entered one.

    I would like to know if it actually has been changed to require masteries in some significant way because that will be a start towards redeeming this

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • cptaylor.2670cptaylor.2670 Member ✭✭✭✭

    The debuff to enter the portals is too long and I find that people just wait for it to expire to enter and kill the mob. Or the mob gets killed while you're waiting and you're just stuck there in the empty room during that time. The debuff just feels awkward and unnecessary.

    I think one thing that could be done is to have the Whisper of Jormag spawn while those portals are up, so you have this extra boss to fight while people are going into the portals to kill the champs. Gives them something to do, and the Whisper has a bit harder mechanics than Drakkar. Also keeps everyone from immediately rushing through the portal - though the aforementioned debuff may be their way of preventing Drakkar from despawning if everyone enters the portals and leaves the room empty.

    I enjoyed the fight from the one time I got to do it so far aside from that though. Drakkar's abilities aren't that intimidating though, so I can understand the disappointment with that. But ultimately what would that look like? More random aoe that does more damage? More mobs spawning in to help that need to be cleaved? More cones to avoid?

    I think one mechanic they could have particularly found useful with Jormag and the way Jormag corrupts is to create somekind of mind control mechanic. Certain players get targeted and their characters get taken over and must be taken down. Perhaps they use their slotted skills and cooldowns and have to be beaten down to like 20% health to be set free. As it is right now the only thing that happens is that we get turned into a block of ice, and I'm not even entirely sure that happens during the Drakkar fight.

    One issue with that mind control mechanic may be the way the game itself is coded though. Because it might involve temporarily replacing a player character with a copied npc - or something akin to the doppleganger. This may be easier in games like world of warcraft because of pre-existing logic that accounts for world pvp. Maybe it's just not something they can do without completely breaking some legacy code. If they did add something like this though, I could see it being a cool theme for a new elite spec for mesmer or something.

  • Thereon.3495Thereon.3495 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2020

    @cptaylor.2670 said:
    One issue with that mind control mechanic may be the way the game itself is coded though. Because it might involve temporarily replacing a player character with a copied npc - or something akin to the doppleganger.

    Place a doppleganger, fully stealth the copied player and remove all skills is perfectly do-able I'd think in relation to the code. Having the HP match the doppleganger and locking the camera to it for that specific player may be a stretch but I'd certainly love to see this as well.

    Maybe even have this happen to multiple players at a time, x% of the total number in the cave.

  • Joraan Adenard.2061Joraan Adenard.2061 Member ✭✭✭
    edited January 30, 2020

    I think this fight has great potential but it still has one fatal issue that makes this fight boring instead of thrilling.

    This issue is the combination of two characteristics of the fight :

    • Big HP sponge which makes the fight long and tedious
    • Repetitive mechanics all throughout the fight

    Taken separately, those issues are minor (a long fight can be fun with a variety of mechanics to overcome, and a repetitive fight can be fun if it's done quickly) but both together makes this fight far from enoyable.

    I believe the goal was to make the fight challenging. However, big HP bars are NOT challenging. They just make the fight longer and transforms it into a race against the timer when DPS isnt there. Failure should be a matter of mechanics and success should require communication. HP sponges dont accomplish that.

    To improve the fight, I would implement simple changes :

    • Reduce the amount of HP
    • Remove some boss attacks from the first phase of the fight, and add them gradually to the later phases as the fight advances (this should actually make the boss start easier and become more challenging, which is an effective way of making a fight more fun and impactful)
  • aspirine.6852aspirine.6852 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Moradorin.6217 said:
    Make it shorter

    ^^ this.

  • XYLO.7031XYLO.7031 Member ✭✭✭

    @aspirine.6852 said:

    @Moradorin.6217 said:
    Make it shorter

    ^^ this.

    I agree. It's not a raid boss and shouldn't be as complicated as one. If they make the open world bosses similar to raid boss mechanics, they may as well make raids open world metas so they can get more people on those maps.

    It could be around TT difficulty, but it isn't designed that way with the 3 heads. It's fine as is to me. Been with groups that failed because there wasn't enough DPS. I was in 3 so far that were successful. If by the 13 minute mark Drakkar has more than 50% HP, rip unless a flood of people come in. That's an opportunity for hero level DPS folks who can save those runs when they load in.

    As a side note, I'm really happy the boss doesn't interfere with the meta. They occur at different times: Drakkar at 5 after the hour, meta at :45. I can jump from Drakkar into the meta without hesitation.

    Eponymously known as 'Tanya' despite many alts
    Beetle Gymkhana @ Crimson Post Reset TT
    Home Course: Bloodtide Coast, Spiral Track aka Bloodtide Slide

  • Moradorin.6217Moradorin.6217 Member ✭✭✭

    @XYLO.7031 said:

    @aspirine.6852 said:

    @Moradorin.6217 said:
    Make it shorter

    ^^ this.

    I agree. It's not a raid boss and shouldn't be as complicated as one. If they make the open world bosses similar to raid boss mechanics, they may as well make raids open world metas so they can get more people on those maps.

    It could be around TT difficulty, but it isn't designed that way with the 3 heads. It's fine as is to me. Been with groups that failed because there wasn't enough DPS. I was in 3 so far that were successful. If by the 13 minute mark Drakkar has more than 50% HP, rip unless a flood of people come in. That's an opportunity for hero level DPS folks who can save those runs when they load in.

    As a side note, I'm really happy the boss doesn't interfere with the meta. They occur at different times: Drakkar at 5 after the hour, meta at :45. I can jump from Drakkar into the meta without hesitation.

    Yea I like that they are adding to the same map rather than making new maps for each episode and also glad that they are keeping the events from each episode as it grows. Personally, I think it is arguably a better design. Better because in LW4 it always felt like the previous maps go empty and therefore go to underused after the new map dropped. This way with people all still in a common instance it wont feel empty and should feel like we all have more to do with basically the same resources.

    As to the OP topic I just think the event can drag out a bit, I like that it has different things to do as it goes, it just feels like the slogging through damaging Drakkar takes too long unless everyone is using good Power builds, etc which in typical open world pve seems unnecessary.

  • either scale the escort better DOWN or seperate escort from fight.

    If you dont have 30+ people doing escort, you just run out of time.

    This boss will be ignored by most players very fast if ANET does not change this tight timer quickly.

  • Jimbru.6014Jimbru.6014 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    Two major things limiting DPS:
    - The need for almost constant movement and healing. IMHO at least one of Drakkar's abilities needs removed to give us some space.
    - The constant need to retarget and restart attacks. Seriously, Drakkar is almost the size of an Asura's ego. TARGETING SHOULD NOT BE LOST ON SOMETHING THAT BIG JUST BECAUSE HE MOVED HIS CLAWS FOR A MOMENT.

    Between those two things, it's pretty much impossible to run any sort of normal DPS rotation. Mash stuff off cooldown and pray is pretty much all you can do, while trying to stay alive through the sensory overload.

  • DaFishBob.6518DaFishBob.6518 Member ✭✭✭

    Don't light up the whole area with blue light during the last 25%, it obscures the visual cues for Drakkar's attacks.
    Allow using mismatched essence blasts as having multiple essence blasts available often leads to having the wrong kind of mob selected for the skill that decides to present itself.

  • well it's confirmed by stream guys, drakkar is getting mechanical updates along with its ascended boreal weapon drop chances.
    Thank you arenanet <3

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @BlackBullWings.2734 said:
    well it's confirmed by stream guys, drakkar is getting mechanical updates along with its ascended boreal weapon drop chances.
    Thank you arenanet <3

    Good news. Any further details from the stream about it?

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's hitboxes are a bit messy.
    They tend to keep vanishing frequently during the fight when it's legs move around.

    Since I play with piercing arrows this becomes a very annoying problem as I have to manually keep re-targeting the farthest leg during the fight or watch my damage output suffer significantly.

  • All this is based on the premise that all periods of the day is full of players or have organized groups, which, unfortunately, is not the case. See, I've been active in Bjora Marches since launching during 8-12h, joining in all Drakkar's meta possible for the achievements and, most of the time, the groups fail or succeed with just a few seconds left (one of them had beaten Drakkar having literally one second left).

    The reasons? Well, since the west side opened, instead of an increase in population, I noticed a drastic decreasing. Not in the sense of lacking players, there are players all around doing their stuff but just a handful of them take part of Drakkar's meta, unlike Icebrood's that used to have medium to big groups almost constantly. Reasons vary, but I could bet it's the extremely grinding achievements. Because of this, experienced commanders don't bother "raising their banners" (assuming one can switch tag on/off — I don't know, I still can't buy mine <_<) and those who do, aren't experienced, they're just players who bought the tag to be pinpointed on the map.

    Also, within this 8-12h period I've been playing, there's a vast amount of players who seem to not care about harder content and yet they still join in. As much as it hurts me because my main is a Reaper, I see a lot of Reapers playing Bjora Marches, but as much as I could notice in the heat of battle all them going full of minions. Don't take me wrong, minions do have their usefulness, but people don't understand ANet is slowly trying to bring the difficulty/complexity of Raids to PvE's bosses, maybe even in an attempt to incentivize players to do Raids themselves and, as such, minions' builds simply don't work due to their relatively low DPS. And therefore several metas I've been in failed, in a row (and this time is not my fault XD).

    In another topic, regarding improvements in loot with ascended items, much like in this one there were a lot of suggestions to increase difficulty. I was one of the supporters of that myself, although I think it should be just a slight change (otherwise we would have another Legendary Boneskinner that only closed groups can/want to do). However, now, I would reconsider because the majority of players are not ready for Drakkar's current state, much less if it becomes harder.

    Keriayn‌‌ | Asura | Necromancer
    Raven Evergloam | Human | Mesmer
    Astrid Bloodbourne | Norn | Guardian
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  • HnRkLnXqZ.1870HnRkLnXqZ.1870 Member ✭✭✭✭

    So we have a group of players who claims the fight to be too difficult. But on the other hand is another group who claims the fight to be too easy.
    Conclusion: balanced?

    I am fine with increasing the loot and making certain phases more engaging. The pre-event can be a little difficult with smaller scales. It would be also nice to have two different timers, one for the pre and one for the real fight.

    Complaining about the necessity of moving while fighting a boss is a bit meh. There is no challenge in stacking up in a single spot and launching your rotations.

    The only thing that bothers me about the fight: After 7+ years, we are still hitting paws.

    But even in the current state, I would give the Drakkar encounter a solid 8/10. Well done.

  • @Randulf.7614 said:

    @BlackBullWings.2734 said:
    well it's confirmed by stream guys, drakkar is getting mechanical updates along with its ascended boreal weapon drop chances.
    Thank you arenanet <3

    Good news. Any further details from the stream about it?

    we had some screenshots shown by the devs of the new ascended boreal weapons.
    they have a yellow glow and gold trim on certain parts.
    Also, they said the update would come on the 11th of february

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @BlackBullWings.2734 said:

    @Randulf.7614 said:

    @BlackBullWings.2734 said:
    well it's confirmed by stream guys, drakkar is getting mechanical updates along with its ascended boreal weapon drop chances.
    Thank you arenanet <3

    Good news. Any further details from the stream about it?

    we had some screenshots shown by the devs of the new ascended boreal weapons.
    they have a yellow glow and gold trim on certain parts.
    Also, they said the update would come on the 11th of february

    I meant the mechanics which is main interest. The rewards are irrelevant to me since the chance of a drop will likely be so remote I wont see one anyway

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .

  • Blur.3465Blur.3465 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    I am just going to copy/paste this from another comment of mine made on a different topic, but it's about how I imagined and would love to see the fight. Ironically, it was actually a dream I had so you can imagine how much I was hyped for this release, as Drakkar literally haunted me with its appearance in GW1 and the creepiness all around it:

    I had a dream a couple of months before the Patch came out...that we'd fight Drakkar on a frozen lake, where ice would crack and he'd hunt the players from the water. We'd all fall into the lake after it cracked and we'd have time limit to then climb on the floating ice to avoid some mechanics from him (being eaten or frozen to death while in the water), where at some point he'd come and destroy the frozen isles (Mordremoth style, like when he eats isles), then dive back inside. If you fall into the water, you'd slowly start freezing, so you had to climb back up on the floating ice isles again.

    I'd really love to see this, but I guess it's too late now
    ...I'm really not happy with the current fight we got.
    1. It doesn't give Drakkar the justice he deserves.
    2. It just...feels cluttered, hard to see, 'tight' and kinda claustrophobic.
    3. Visual noise is insane.
    4. Feels like Tequatl 2.0 just worse. The only good part is transition. Tired of smashing World Boss toes/claws.

    I had hoped we'd fight him on an open lake where he'd pop out of it and have phases where we burn him/attack him, phases where he destroys floating ice on which we stand, phases where we attack him underwater...
    Start of the fight could be just us standing on this icy lake and waiting for him, with him just swimming underneath us, seeing his silhouette..then he'd smash the ice and attack us.
    Man...this fight could've been so much cooler and better :(

    To add also:
    What happened to his model? Why is he not an underwater creature? What happened to his fins? Why does he have claws?
    Someone described him as a hairy crocodile and I can't help but laugh and approve...Drakkar's model should've stayed true to the GW1 concept, just tweaked a bit further...
    Model from GW1:

    I kept imagining, even back in GW1, scene where he'd eventually wake up...crack the ice and pop out. Drakkar was my favorite GW1 mystery. I'd often just go to that lake and look at that slumbering monster, just stare at it...with a lot of fear and imagining how awesome and scary it would be had he come to life.
    ...and then we had that mystery, creepiness and iconic boss/creature get completely ruined in GW2...I can't even describe the depths of my sadness.
    I guess my expectations were too high...
    I really expected they'd stay true to GW1 model and just update it to modern graphics with slight tweaks...no, instead we really got a whole new creature that has nothing to do with Drakkar we met in GW1...and a cluttered and eye-sore fight :(

  • Mortifera.6138Mortifera.6138 Member ✭✭✭

    @aspirine.6852 said:

    @Moradorin.6217 said:
    Make it shorter

    ^^ this.

    @aspirine.6852 said:

    @Moradorin.6217 said:
    Make it shorter

    ^^ this.

    About sums it up.

  • two fails, one very last second success, one last minute success.

    Drakkar's scaling is utterly off. People lose time during escort and they can't catch up again.

    If it is at 20min and 80% health, it will fail. And with a less than map-population you can't do it in time.

  • The Drakkar Fight punishes some builds, and favors others.
    After a few times now, I can more clearly answer what I do not like about the fight:

    • Clutter. Some AoE on the floor is so extreme that I cannot even shoot once, but am constantly dodging. The 1 skill on the deadeye - which has huge DPS on a glass Berserker build - has a cast time which is so long, that something will hit you while casting it.
    • Repeating mechanics: Specially the fearing and the blowing away... so often that stun breaks cannot deal with that. You'd need a max of 5 seconds cooldown on them
    • Targeting is a nightmare, you constantly loose target and the fact you can accidentally target things below the floor has not been solved (it's been years)
    • With 10 minutes to go in that fight, I can predict with 99% surtenty if it's gonna be a fail. Bad design. There's no point in continuing the fight if you know that far ahead if it's gonna fail.
    • Scaling is absurd
    • As I said before: Too much copy/paste
    • I also completely agree on the location. It's horrible
    • What's with the ring around this arena that harms you, even exiting a portal after killing a champ? (Even dodgeing through the gate, it still takes away 30% of my health. Why?!?!)
    • Why has the "in combat after fail" not been fixed yet? Seriously?

    Why is this fight designed with a surten class or build in mind? This is NOT a Raid. A Glass deadeye or Minion Power Reaper should have a place in this fight. It's Open World PVE, which -** in it's very nature** - means anyone should be able to join right there and then.

    I should not have to think. Ow meta starts, let me switch characters. That is PURE NONSENCE.

    To illustrate: Played on my reaper (No not minions but again, that should be irrelevant for PvE) never went down
    Played on my Glass Deadeye, went down 28 (yes twenty-eight) times... Has nothing to do with my skill, everything with the sheer amount of damage. Even when maxed dodge and evade, even when not even bothering with Drakkar himself but purely surviving, it's still hard, it's too hard for PvE.

    This exactly shows, in my oppinion, why this fight is OP. Yes I know a lot want harder fights... Then ask for a Drakkar Raid or Strike Mission. But don't punish the average PvE player.

  • Reduce the HP slightly lower so that you have more than 5 seconds left in order to beat it.
    Increase Drakkar and the mobs damage as well as add some more CC's to promote some movement around the map.
    Add more conditions like cripple, torment, bleeding.
    Make it so that some healers will be useful and punish mindless zerker spammers.

  • Caitybee.3614Caitybee.3614 Member ✭✭
    edited February 2, 2020

    Coming back to this after a few more runs of Drakkar and it's starting to show some flaws.

    From what I understand the phases move according to health % at these intervals; 80%, 60%, 40%, 20% and it seems to have difficulty scaling according to the size of the group of players fighting him. Of the last 3 Drakkar fights I was in, 2 failed from low dps/too much HP (possibly), and the 3rd that I was just attempting bugged out on us and ended right at the beginning (which I reported).
    After the 2nd minion appears (40% mark), there are sometimes way too many minions spawning on the field and it seems to be pointless at times since 90% of the players focus on Drakkar and the minions are just sort of hanging around. By the 3rd minion phase (20%) it's even more hectic and they mostly get in the way rather than posing a threat.

    Using melee up close on Drakkar is nearly impossible without taking significant damage from his feet unless you get in a good spot to avoid the stomping damage, or you wait for his "stun phases" after the 80% mark in the 2nd half of the arena. I brought this up in map chat, however instead of other players discussing creative ways to fight Drakkar, I was met with toxic responses (as usual). The toxic players try to be smart and are quick to dump on any content Anet launches in this game - I'm rather tired of this to be honest, and it makes it difficult for me to enjoy the game or have active discussions on how to improve the game.

    Drakkar's scaling should be considered for a rework, and his health needs some kind of nerf so smaller groups could still have a chance at beating him if they do it correctly. He spends too much time moving around inside the walls, and I think this is where we lose a lot of time that could be spent trying to get his health down before time runs out.

    Drakkar has potential that's for sure, and I can't wait to see what they implement in the future.

    @Blur.3465 I think they scaled down his size because he was too big.

    X Archangel X - Jujubaka - X Juca X - Zophielbee - M I C H A E L L - R A P H A E L L - "For the spoons!" - Tequatl

  • Perihen the Thawk.9527Perihen the Thawk.9527 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 2, 2020

    @lare.5129 said:
    Drakkar is very ok. Nice sound also!!!
    But may be it should easy,
    because in non prime time after some time it will be very hot challenge.
    Yes, now when we have hype and best dps players come it is fun, but let see in future also please!!
    I have strong feeling that roleplay players from our guilds can to much pressure on that world boss.

    So will believe it will be nerfed after half year for players who want complete achiv but not start story for some life reason.

    I think about this a lot. Almost every open world event they add seems easy on release day because you have a hundred players with you, but the events all seem to be scaled much better once the zerg moves on to the next map.

    I did the blizzard meta yesterday and it was actually really fun with most people distracted by shiny West Bjora. At first I thought the meta would fail because I was the only one building bonfires. But I advertised in map chat and a few people came and we got everything built. Then we took a beating in the blizzard because we had to spread out too thin. More players trickled in but we only had the two of us at the North Shrine and we lost it (put up a good fight, but we got swarmed once like 4 Mist portals were up, we couldn't spare anyone to go close them). Then a commander tag rolled in and we had just enough to hold West and South, even though the mobs kept getting in the circle and contesting, so it was a bit nerve-wracking.

    Long story short, we ended up taking out the Construct with only seconds to spare. I've never had that much fun doing the blizzard meta before, it was really awesome.

    So I make it a rule not to judge meta-events too harshly until a new map comes out and the zerg moves on. I'll wait and see how Drakkar feels when we don't have 100 people to fight it every cycle.

  • AliamRationem.5172AliamRationem.5172 Member ✭✭✭✭

    It's a cool-looking fight, but it's simply WAY too long and repetitive. I don't think it needs any further explanation or specific solutions. Just don't design bosses that take half an hour of repeating the same mechanics. Game development 101 here, right?

  • @Randulf.7614 said:

    @BlackBullWings.2734 said:

    @Randulf.7614 said:

    @BlackBullWings.2734 said:
    well it's confirmed by stream guys, drakkar is getting mechanical updates along with its ascended boreal weapon drop chances.
    Thank you arenanet <3

    Good news. Any further details from the stream about it?

    we had some screenshots shown by the devs of the new ascended boreal weapons.
    they have a yellow glow and gold trim on certain parts.
    Also, they said the update would come on the 11th of february

    I meant the mechanics which is main interest. The rewards are irrelevant to me since the chance of a drop will likely be so remote I wont see one anyway

    no mechanics announced

  • Zalani.9827Zalani.9827 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 2, 2020

    I feel that the meta timer should be changed, the escort should be its separate timer and event with the actual Drakkar fights with its own timer.

    It’s not a fun feeling watching the boss timer going down with you unable to do anything but watch Joradottir walk and talk.

    I actually like the fight itself, it’s pretty cool watching him jump out of the ice and then tracking his shadow to see where he goes next. I’m looking forward to the 11th changes.

    Jadis Narnia, Sylvari Ranger of [VoS]

    Praise Joko!

  • Fought Drakkar earlier since last night had the "disappearing act" glitch lol. The group I went with was large enough to get the DPS necessary to beat him in a decent time. However, the 1st minion didn't spawn properly at 60% because it seemed as if Drakkar's stomp mechanic overrode what it was suppose to do. We still won, but it was actually better not having 3 minions to fight. Saved us a lot of time.

    X Archangel X - Jujubaka - X Juca X - Zophielbee - M I C H A E L L - R A P H A E L L - "For the spoons!" - Tequatl

  • hugo.4705hugo.4705 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I find the first part of meta okay: the progress through tunnels and fighting mist portals incursions. After, it's not that awesome. There is too much copy-pasta of mechanics, long and boring because it's the same thing during 40%:
    -1 break ice projecting shards
    -2 stomp with feet shockwaves
    -3 ice cone attack
    -4 freezing 85% of arena

    The fight is unbalanced, the raven gate part is interesting but the champions are killed in two seconds, no special mechanics, not even legendary, it should at least occupy us 2-3 minutes for each, no need to make the hp of drakkar that high if this is to see only the four mechanics listed above.

    Second thing, what is the role of those kodans and vigil standing stupidly in previous cavern? They must go with us in last room, and so another mechanic: stop drakkar influencing the troops! Put svanir totems along that! Make us fight the corrupted troops!

    Shield is easy, after preventing drakkar to destroy shield, it can spawn champions disallowing us to access the raven gate. Use the shrines foes! The tornadoes, undying boneskinners, fallens!

    A phase can be added where Drakkar is moving under the ground popping out sometimes while spawning kind of geysers instead of putting it during gate... just remove no-gate buff and make the area deadly/ inflicting conditions during gate phase.

    It's just meh because it's just a big hp boss that do only 4 big things, it's way far bellow tequalt or shatter. Even claw of Jormag is more creative. Dunno see the map, use corrupted ice shard? Fog or snow storm?
    I'm not a lot against the location, but having it outside could allow more mechanic possibilities.

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  • did another Drakkar today, barely made it. It is becoming boring very very fast. 30min of spamming all your dps skills, nervously watching the timer is massively not-fun. It is boring. Really really boring. And if you fail, after over 30min? Well, you just wasted a good chunk of your allocated play time for a total disaster of an event. The loot is also underwhelming to the max for such a long event.

    Tequatl, Shatterer, Claw are fun. Branded Shatterer is fun too. Drakkar is not. Shatterer because it is rather quick (and branded because there is a lot of stuff going on), Teq, because you actually have to look at your feet during the first phase and the second and third are over quickly, Claw because you can go in on a healing build and still be usefull.

    All three/four put down damage, downing and killing players all the time, but all three are not tedious.

    Drakkar is. Really, this thing needs a total makeover. Lowering its HP to make it 20min of boredom instead of 30min of boredom would be a good start. But please do not end there.

    Auric Basin meta, Chak Gherent - they also take time. But they are not boring AND they feel kind of rewarding. Drakkar does not feel rewarding. Drakker feels 'you wasted 35 minutes of your 2h play time on this for nothing'.

    Pull it, remake it, anet. This mess really hurts the game.

  • guys, have you ever imagined if Anet built a mechanic never seen in gw2? I mean, imagine if they offered a type of combat in which the entire population would divide and attack Drakkar at two different points? Thus, half the population would attack the boss under water and the other half on the ground out of water. Since water combat is not as highly valued in gw2 (yet), I think it would be creative and more interesting.

  • Dante.1763Dante.1763 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lummuss.6850 said:
    guys, have you ever imagined if Anet built a mechanic never seen in gw2? I mean, imagine if they offered a type of combat in which the entire population would divide and attack Drakkar at two different points? Thus, half the population would attack the boss under water and the other half on the ground out of water. Since water combat is not as highly valued in gw2 (yet), I think it would be creative and more interesting.

    pretty much think its to late for that.

    I do think they need to nerf its HP so its not so -Boring-

    Amana Silentchild; My Main
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    Why GW is Called Guildwars

  • Randulf.7614Randulf.7614 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @lummuss.6850 said:
    guys, have you ever imagined if Anet built a mechanic never seen in gw2? I mean, imagine if they offered a type of combat in which the entire population would divide and attack Drakkar at two different points? Thus, half the population would attack the boss under water and the other half on the ground out of water. Since water combat is not as highly valued in gw2 (yet), I think it would be creative and more interesting.

    There have been a few suggestions I have liked which are variations on this theme. Lanes including an underwater one, split sections which get flooded, a surface fight where the lake breaks into islands and you forced into underwater and island attacks ala DRagonStand.

    Having any underwater sections probably doesn't have the wider appeal, but the creativity is far above what we were given. Very little thought or imagination went into this fight. This was a benchmark for where I think the team is at and it does feel like a lot of the innovation and imagination has been lost over the years.

    What sleep is here? What dreams there are in the unctuous coiling of the snakes mortal shuffling. weapon in my hand. My hand the arcing deathblow at the end of all things. The horror. The horror. I embrace it. . .