Revenant stunbreak on legend swap removal — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Revenant stunbreak on legend swap removal

torben.1532torben.1532 Member ✭✭✭
edited February 1, 2020 in PVP

Don’t go though with this, I got a feeling it’s gonna make the class semi unplayable.

Edit: A better way to nerf Revenant stunbreaks would be to either go through with the legends stunbreaks nerfed the way you guys did it OR the legend swap stunbreak getting removed.
if you do both it will be unplayable

<1

Comments

  • witcher.3197witcher.3197 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    Removing stun break from Invocation and Stability from Retribution is definitely gonna hurt every single build in a major way when it comes to surviving CC. Hope they revert them.

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    They did this too all classes, Stability and stunbreak nerfed across the board but in turn hard CC also lost damage so we'll see. It seems bad on paper, but while enemies will be able to lock you down more, they'll do far less damage.

    It seems ArenaNet is trying to get players to focus on disabling each other instead of destroying outright, like in DAoC. The nerfs to damage and healing means that players will be wittled down slowly instead of making miraculous recoveries, while CC keeps less important targets out of the fight for significant periods of time while more important targets are dealt with.

    I imagine the meta will change towards focusing down supports instead of DPSers.

    Hannah | Daisuki[SUKI] Founder, Ehmry Bay (formerly Jade Quarry) | Mains Mariyuuna/Tempest & Terakura/Spellbreaker | ♀♥♀

  • mortrialus.3062mortrialus.3062 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    I've been thinking about advocating nerfing this trait but couldn't think of a way to do so without changing the whole thing. And I'm pleasantly surprised they did decide to straight up change it.

    Glint Shiro is definitely too strong. But I don't think it's gross in terms of its overall damage, burst, or mobility. The main problem with Glint Shiro is that it has Team Fight carry damage like a scourge while having a defensive rotation that prevents it from being focused like a team fight damage carry.

    And a decent part of it is stun break on Legend Swap. Now it's not as bad Elusive Mind before it got exhaustion added to it. Even though the dodge rolls are an effective 10 second cooldown to refill an endurance bar, Mirage did pull a lot a head due to Adventure Runes and running Energy Sigil on both weapon sets as well as massive vigor uptime at the time... but Stun Break on Legend Swap is in it's league in terms of just too much stun break access. You literally just can't lock down a rev the way you can currently CC and contain something like a Holosmith, Necro/Reaper, Core Guardian, Core Warrior, ect ect.

    Best Dressed Memser NA.

  • Buran.3796Buran.3796 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Ovark.2514 said:
    I am very happy with this change. Revs are one of the slipperiest classes atm.

    Revs just got erased from PvP and WvW. With the nerfs in damage over all classes PvP will be again the realm of inmortal tanks, as was in the age of the celestial eles; since Revs lacks any good tank build and power Herald no longer will be able to kill other classes, they will njsut dissapear.

    The change will be even more drastic in WvW, since the only reason to run Revs in zergs was use the hammers and range, and after a year of nerfs in the damage of Colescence of Ruin + multiple bugs which made it unconsistent now they doubled the cooldown, effectively halving the damage. So no longer reason to use Revs in team composition. They aren't but Waarriors with slower attacks that need to pay energy cost on top of longer cooldowns...

  • mrauls.6519mrauls.6519 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Hannelore.8153 said:
    They did this too all classes, Stability and stunbreak nerfed across the board but in turn hard CC also lost damage so we'll see. It seems bad on paper, but while enemies will be able to lock you down more, they'll do far less damage.

    It seems ArenaNet is trying to get players to focus on disabling each other instead of destroying outright, like in DAoC. The nerfs to damage and healing means that players will be wittled down slowly instead of making miraculous recoveries, while CC keeps less important targets out of the fight for significant periods of time while more important targets are dealt with.

    I imagine the meta will change towards focusing down supports instead of DPSers.

    I hope you are right

  • I think removing this would have been fine if it was just this, but the hit to shiro and this together doesn't sound good. altho when you think about it they were both kind of op...

    Te lazla otstara.

  • torben.1532torben.1532 Member ✭✭✭

    I wouldn't even be mad About stunbreak nerfs but the way they did it was too much. Either get rid of legend swap stunbreak and leave the others as is or nerf the others and leave legend swap.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    No, this is needed, remember EVERYONE is getting this treatment in some way and if one class or skill gets missed by the hammer CMC, BenP and the rest of the devs we don't know about that have contributed to this shift are winding up.

  • torben.1532torben.1532 Member ✭✭✭

    @apahrma.3741 Keep in mind that you cant just slap the same procedure on every single class as each of them is fundamentally different

  • Buran.3796Buran.3796 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:
    Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

    Who cares about bursting anymore? you won't be able to beat 5 bunkers going for two control points. I don't think people will waste time in dps dealers anymore, since won't overcome team self-sustain.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

    I don't think

    Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

  • Buran.3796Buran.3796 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

    I don't think

    Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

    Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

    I don't think

    Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

    Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

    I think it's had individual tests on the skills to see if they're in the right range for damage but to test all class interplay and relationships between skill interactions, stats, runes, sigils etc is far beyond even a well run company for a patch designed to set a new power level.

    When it hits the playerbase of hundreds of thousands of people will be messing around with this, if we estimated they on average messed around for 3 hours each and said a conservative number of 100,000 players it's 300,000 hours of testing. How long would that take a team of 10 dedicated just to testing the changes? 30,000 hours or 375 days each.

    That's without mentioning the different viewpoints, processes of thought, plans and wonky builds that get made by such a number of people playing and finding what's broken.

    Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

  • torben.1532torben.1532 Member ✭✭✭

    The reason for why they showed what they intend to do is so People can give Feedback. That's exactly what my post is for.

  • Im not a Rev main at all, but to remove Both stub break and Stability access is a bit shortsighted.

    To those people complaining about revs stun break previously, remember Revs aren't able to select their skills. So unlike every other class they cannot put 2-3 stun breaks on their hotbar if needed.
    Not to mention Ventari doesn't have any stun breaks what so ever?... so stun break on legend swap was its only option.

  • Buran.3796Buran.3796 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:

    Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

    They nerfed the damage and the access to abilities, the HP of each class remains the same. You won't be able to kill bunkers; +1 builds will be replaced by tanks, bruisers and support classes. Also I dont want "go for it", I have a main with no viable builds in the incoming new meta. I didn't swap from Guardian to Rev in HoT to being forced to play a tank again...

  • LazySummer.2568LazySummer.2568 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 1, 2020

    Revs just need to think more carefully about saving their stunbreaks and energy for it instead of the current bs where they just spam Gaze of Darkness offensively for the broken instant cast blind + vul if they're in glint or spamming all their weapon skills for damage if they're in shrio because they can just legend swap to get away for free anyways. Good change.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

    I don't think

    Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

    Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

    I think it's had individual tests on the skills to see if they're in the right range for damage but to test all class interplay and relationships between skill interactions, stats, runes, sigils etc is far beyond even a well run company for a patch designed to set a new power level.

    When it hits the playerbase of hundreds of thousands of people will be messing around with this, if we estimated they on average messed around for 3 hours each and said a conservative number of 100,000 players it's 300,000 hours of testing. How long would that take a team of 10 dedicated just to testing the changes? 30,000 hours or 375 days each.

    That's without mentioning the different viewpoints, processes of thought, plans and wonky builds that get made by such a number of people playing and finding what's broken.

    Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

    I will give you an usefull life tip.
    anet is a company.
    If YOU as a reasonable person, think that company ( anet ) should use X resources for something.
    then take 1/4 of those resources and thats propably more then they used.
    If you think that 10 developers were testing these changes, then I bet no more then 3 made any serious effort.

  • apharma.3741apharma.3741 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:

    @Buran.3796 said:

    @apharma.3741 said:
    Ah the rev tears, this is funny. Revs have had this coming for a long time and if you think no-one will die you've become to used to not having to set up and align skills or co-ordinate damage.

    I don't think

    Snipped for relevance. This is applicable to everyone with complaints about their class losing stuff. Go back and read the beginning of the posts by CMC and Irenio.

    Did you think that this patch had any kind of testing? Most of ANet staff is devoted to produce content for the gem store while coasting the corpse; I doubt they even have 10 people (PvP designers) to play a full 5 vs 5 PvP match. Hell, the plantiff patch arrived two months ago and is still broken for the skill asigment for the legends in the Revenant...

    I think it's had individual tests on the skills to see if they're in the right range for damage but to test all class interplay and relationships between skill interactions, stats, runes, sigils etc is far beyond even a well run company for a patch designed to set a new power level.

    When it hits the playerbase of hundreds of thousands of people will be messing around with this, if we estimated they on average messed around for 3 hours each and said a conservative number of 100,000 players it's 300,000 hours of testing. How long would that take a team of 10 dedicated just to testing the changes? 30,000 hours or 375 days each.

    That's without mentioning the different viewpoints, processes of thought, plans and wonky builds that get made by such a number of people playing and finding what's broken.

    Basically it's impossible to reliably know the outcome of any individual change in the vast array of changes while pinning it down to just that or one of the other 900 other things that changed. So really if people actually stopped and thought about it they would realise just go for it and we will see what happens but be ready to help sort out the mess when it hits.

    I will give you an usefull life tip.
    anet is a company.
    If YOU as a reasonable person, think that company ( anet ) should use X resources for something.
    then take 1/4 of those resources and thats propably more then they used.
    If you think that 10 developers were testing these changes, then I bet no more then 3 made any serious effort.

    Let me give you some free advise, don't take for verbatim that which is a hypothetical. The numbers were to demonstrate how absurd asking for this to be tested is.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @apharma.3741
    i havent fully woken up yet but wanna say this.
    MUCH bigger companies, those that have 20x more developers dont test their kitten.

  • phokus.8934phokus.8934 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    @apharma.3741
    i havent fully woken up yet but wanna say this.
    MUCH bigger companies, those that have 20x more developers dont test their kitten.

    They create test plans and use RPA for most changes. UAT still occurs but not on every change because you’d never release in time.

  • Leonidrex.5649Leonidrex.5649 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @phokus.8934 said:

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    @apharma.3741
    i havent fully woken up yet but wanna say this.
    MUCH bigger companies, those that have 20x more developers dont test their kitten.

    They create test plans and use RPA for most changes. UAT still occurs but not on every change because you’d never release in time.

    they should make a test server, back in nvo we used to duel for 1hour to test the changes.
    REALLY quickly you could figure out if the changes were good or not.
    have 2 good players go at each other and it becomes clear who got shafted more and who got shafted less

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    With the coming patch, spamming CC's won't reward the same. So the removal is justified.

  • Eurantien.4632Eurantien.4632 Member ✭✭✭

    Stunbreaks and damage mitigation skills are being removed or getting increased cds across the board.

  • Arkantos.7460Arkantos.7460 Member ✭✭✭

    i will spam them with ventari blindness and chill on sidenodes, i dont care for their cc

  • NecroSummonsMors.7816NecroSummonsMors.7816 Member ✭✭✭
    edited February 2, 2020

    Just as foot in the grave, instead of removal they should have added a cd on it. So you can't really have it all the time, but if you play carefully you can have it when you need it. Ofc the rule would be that if i'm not cc and it is off cd, it should not get proc anyway(aka wasting the stunbreak), otherwise this suggestion would be pointless

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Stability and Stunbreaks already are underwhelming compared to the CC spam.
    I don't understand nerfing those without drastically reducing CC.

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:
    Stability and Stunbreaks already are underwhelming compared to the CC spam.
    I don't understand nerfing those without drastically reducing CC.

    CC's don't do any damage anyway, why would you spam it when you have a burst opportunity? See where it's going?

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    A free stunbreak every 10 seconds is very op, and they have other utility that stunbreak as well. No class should have that much. People are just used to being carried by abundant utility.

    Carried is subjective when the rest of the game have just as much control, they're just putting everything in a level playing field. Revenant in the current state of game without Empty Vessel would be extremely hard to play.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Shao.7236 said:

    @Fueki.4753 said:
    Stability and Stunbreaks already are underwhelming compared to the CC spam.
    I don't understand nerfing those without drastically reducing CC.

    CC's don't do any damage anyway, why would you spam it when you have a burst opportunity? See where it's going?

    You know there is something called team play, right? It's rare and continues to grow rarer, but it still exists.
    2 or 3 people chain-CC the enemies, while the rest burst them down, without any chance of fighting back.

  • Airdive.2613Airdive.2613 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    A free stunbreak every 10 seconds is very op

    It's not exactly "free", first you have to trait for it, then you have to swap legends (which is more important than weapon swap) and may end up stuck with a wrong legend for the entirety of next 10 seconds.

  • @Airdive.2613 said:

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    A free stunbreak every 10 seconds is very op

    It's not exactly "free", first you have to trait for it, then you have to swap legends (which is more important than weapon swap) and may end up stuck with a wrong legend for the entirety of next 10 seconds.

    Sure "free" is an exaggeration, but in combat you are swapping roughly every 10s anyways for energy, everyone takes invocation for damage anyways, and the stun break is a minor trait. The point is that you can rarely lock down a rev with cc because of how many stun breaks they have between empty vessel, shiro and glint. If you do manage to land a cc, they swap legends to break stun, and have 50 free energy to counterattack or kite away.

  • Psycoprophet.8107Psycoprophet.8107 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @torben.1532 said:
    @apahrma.3741 Keep in mind that you cant just slap the same procedure on every single class as each of them is fundamentally different

    This^
    The reason why this pass is going to be a mess. Anet just blanket nerfed everything as if everything was equal to begin with, good plan.

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2020

    everyone got their short stun break cd's nerfed or removed. berserker, druid, soulbeast, daredevil, necro, mes.

    Te lazla otstara.

  • Azure The Heartless.3261Azure The Heartless.3261 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2020

    @torben.1532 said:
    Don’t go though with this, I got a feeling it’s gonna make the class semi unplayable.

    Nah do it. Each legend has a stunbreak. Commit to using one of those.

    Meta Herald in its current state runs sword for unrelenting, staff for evade and block, and Shiro/Glint which both have flipover skills that remove stuns or discourage/blind followups.

    Having a break every 10 seconds was just icing on the cake.

    [Charr Noises]
    [I play every class!]
    [Fight me in the arena anytime!]

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

    @torben.1532 said:
    Don’t go though with this, I got a feeling it’s gonna make the class semi unplayable.

    Nah do it. Each legend has a stunbreak. Commit to using one of those.

    Meta Herald in its current state runs sword for unrelenting, staff for evade and block, and Shiro/Glint which both have flipover skills that remove stuns or discourage/blind followups.

    Having a break every 10 seconds was just icing on the cake.

    Just Ventari that despite having control over the Tablet to CC someone away while being CC'd, I still think that it needs a stunbreak for the sake of not being so easy to control in a teamfight.

  • Master Ketsu.4569Master Ketsu.4569 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4, 2020

    Losing that isn't so bad. Plus, they are gutting some of the low CD trait based stunbreaks on other classes so it's fine.

    Devestation/Retribution/Herald has a few decent playable builds. You just have to sort of "gitgud" and actually dodge those CCs.

    Here is a build that I have gotten to Plat III with:
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQNAscmn3guNSuQ7JRboVlsP0rS4IaWJ4EdsklNFS9F54H2DsgPsNAH4BA-jpxHQBBb/hAeCAuWZA/dIAAwDAQZHBAA
    *In some ways rune of resistance will be more reliable since Dragon elite is seeing a cooldown buff to make up for loss of damage.

    Here is a shield rev version that's a pretty good all around bruiser:
    http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmwAw6ZlpQMMLijdRdMMyjJSksCigl+lezH-z5gXKZGC9GBtnA5XA2NA

    The main three differences when playing ret/dev/herald over normal meta is that:
    A] Instead of Invocations +7% damage bonus when you have fury, this build gives you +10% damage against weakened targets, so you will want to start your damage combos off with either dragon breath ( this is why I run rising momentum on the first build since you wont have perm swiftness ) or a CC for optimal dps.
    B] You get good sustain out of channeling impossible odds, so try to use RS/PT less often. Channeling dragon elite facet can provide good sustain as well + movement speed from rising momentum if you don't have swiftness up.
    C] You don't get quickness on swap, so be smarter with your setups.

    The REAL problem with losing empty vessel is they are replacing it with a trait that is absolute kitten for Herald since Herald already stacks fury to the moon and back. And empty vessel is one of the biggest reasons you take invocation. So the first of these two builds could very well end up being the next meta for power shiro because invocation could very well end up becoming a sub par choice. The other problem is that Riposting shadows to 40 is a bad change for reasons I explained here.

  • changes are good, just look at recent AT meta

  • Xca.9721Xca.9721 Member ✭✭

    Let´s say you need a stunbreak while being on Glint, Facet of Darkness is on CD, you swap legend, use RS and you are already down on 10 energy.. I wish that at least the weapon skills didn´t use energy (since they already have a CD) so that we had more left for the utility skills. I get that certain legend skills do too much, but rather than increasing the energy cost, nerf the skill itself. It´s better to be able to use a decent skill more often than never using a rly good skill because it´s too expensive.

  • Master Ketsu.4569Master Ketsu.4569 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 10, 2020

    @Xca.9721 said:
    Let´s say you need a stunbreak while being on Glint, Facet of Darkness is on CD, you swap legend, use RS and you are already down on 10 energy.. I wish that at least the weapon skills didn´t use energy (since they already have a CD) so that we had more left for the utility skills. I get that certain legend skills do too much, but rather than increasing the energy cost, nerf the skill itself. It´s better to be able to use a decent skill more often than never using a rly good skill because it´s too expensive.

    That's why the real screw is 40e for Riposting shadows, which is an overnerf for the same reasons that Rite of the great dwarf and Jade Winds are rarely cast. The closer an e cost for a skill gets to 50 it exponentially removes the skill from play, not linearly. It's the equivalent to nerfing a 40s stunbreak on a cooldown focused class to 120s.

    So now if Revs choose shiro for a legend, they effectively only have 1 stunbreak, and another skill that trades a stun for a silence. No other skill is getting nerfed this hard, which says that either Anet isn't fully aware of just how prohibitive 40e cost is... or they sincerely believe riposting shadows to be the most broken skill in the game right now.

  • @Master Ketsu.4569 said:

    @Xca.9721 said:
    Let´s say you need a stunbreak while being on Glint, Facet of Darkness is on CD, you swap legend, use RS and you are already down on 10 energy.. I wish that at least the weapon skills didn´t use energy (since they already have a CD) so that we had more left for the utility skills. I get that certain legend skills do too much, but rather than increasing the energy cost, nerf the skill itself. It´s better to be able to use a decent skill more often than never using a rly good skill because it´s too expensive.

    That's why the real screw is 40e for Riposting shadows, which is an overnerf for the same reasons that Rite of the great dwarf and Jade Winds are rarely cast. The closer an e cost for a skill gets to 50 it exponentially removes the skill from play, not linearly.

    So now if Revs choose shiro for a legend, they effectively only have 1 stunbreak, and another skill that trades a stun for a silence. No other skill is getting nerfed this hard, which says that either Anet isn't fully aware of just how prohibitive 40e cost is... or they sincerely believe riposting shadows to be the most broken skill in the game right now.

    So now revs have to actually pay attention to their energy usage and not spam skills without a care? I dont see why that is a problem. RS still has no cd, restores some endurance, evades, removes immob, chill, cripple, and grants fury. Its still one of the best stun breaks in the game, and an additional 10 energy cost is just to try and keep it in line with other cd nerfs to stun breaks.

  • Fueki.4753Fueki.4753 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 9, 2020

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    So now revs have to actually pay attention to their energy usage and not spam skills without a care? I dont see why that is a problem.

    Revenants already have problem with Energy management and still get nerfed there.
    And yet Thieves barely need to pay attention to their resource, with Initiative only being on weapon skills and not being tied to cooldowns.
    They still are the single most oppressive and unfair profession to play against.

  • Shao.7236Shao.7236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fueki.4753 said:

    @Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:
    So now revs have to actually pay attention to their energy usage and not spam skills without a care? I dont see why that is a problem.

    Revenants already have problem with Energy management and still get nerfed there.
    And yet Thieves barely need to pay attention to their resource, with Initiative only being on weapon skills and not being tied to cooldowns.
    They still are the single most oppressive and unfair profession to play against.

    No they don't.. No they aren't..

    All these posts are all within the context of the current patch and not what it's going to be..

    SO MANY THINGS, are going to change.

    Let alone Annulment finally being removed.

    If they hadn't removed Empty Vessel, Revenants would have had an unfair momentum, like very unfair.

    Be real, nobody has the slightest clue and are afraid of what they don't know of. All these speculations are clueless and triggering everyone's spoiled habits, just retaliating in panic.

    Use those patch notes and critical thinking, envision what's to come. Thieves are not gonna be far ahead if at all.

  • lighter.2708lighter.2708 Member ✭✭
    edited February 9, 2020

    Nah uh, CC are literally effect-less on rev right now, revs are spamming gaze like it's free, because they have easy access to stunbreak with legend swap.
    not to mention shiro 0 CD stunbreak..also glint heal makes all CC pointless

  • Swagg.9236Swagg.9236 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Revenant is a not a class; it's a shallow, nostalgia-bait advertisement for an old expansion pack. Considering how, on top of this, it's basically just "other Thief" when it comes to what its buttons do, it never deserved to exist from the start.