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Add some actual challange to Group Events

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  • Amaranthe.3578Amaranthe.3578 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Trise.2865 said:

    @Amaranthe.3578 said:

    @Trise.2865 said:
    What does "challenge" mean, in this context?
    Longer TTK? Puzzle elements? Scripted immunity/phasing? Secondary event completion?
    Do you want to think harder, work harder, try harder, plan harder, die harder?

    I've actually given an example. Some basic mechanics that make mindless zerging impossible.

    So the definitive example is "do something".

    Well, at least jonerikb is actually trying...

    Read the original post again. Add basic mechanics like: two champs that have to die at the same time.

  • So, more Tarir, Triple Trouble-type Group Events. More "Wait at 2%, wait, wait, ok, now go, go, burn, go!"
    Ok, maybe we will see some in the upcoming Saga.

  • Amaranthe.3578Amaranthe.3578 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:
    So, more Tarir, Triple Trouble-type Group Events. More "Wait at 2%, wait, wait, ok, now go, go, burn, go!"
    Ok, maybe we will see some in the upcoming Saga.

    No, I was speaking about adding some basic mechanics for simple Group events in the open world.

  • Like what? You said "take down two Champions at the same time". Tarir and Triple Trouble use that mechanic, and the resulting 'conversation' is as posted. I thought the OP was about encouraging map/say/squad? chat through challenges.

  • Amaranthe.3578Amaranthe.3578 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:
    Like what? You said "take down two Champions at the same time". Tarir and Triple Trouble use that mechanic, and the resulting 'conversation' is as posted. I thought the OP was about encouraging map/say/squad? chat through challenges.

    The whole point of adding those mechanics to regular 10 people group events is to encourage people to communicate and not just mindlessly zerg the event down.

  • And what will they say besides, "wait for x percent, then go"?
    You've not given any mechanics besides 'kill two champs'. You've dismissed anything with more mechanics like Triple Trouble.

  • Obtena.7952Obtena.7952 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 10, 2020

    @Amaranthe.3578 said:

    @Trise.2865 said:

    @Amaranthe.3578 said:

    @Trise.2865 said:
    What does "challenge" mean, in this context?
    Longer TTK? Puzzle elements? Scripted immunity/phasing? Secondary event completion?
    Do you want to think harder, work harder, try harder, plan harder, die harder?

    I've actually given an example. Some basic mechanics that make mindless zerging impossible.

    So the definitive example is "do something".

    Well, at least jonerikb is actually trying...

    Read the original post again. Add basic mechanics like: two champs that have to die at the same time.

    You know the funny part ... that's got NOTHING to do with preventing zerging. We already got content like this, so what problem are you trying to fix?

    If you think balancing is only driven by performance and justified by comparisons to other classes then prepare to be educated:

    https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/balance-updates-the-heralds-near-future-and-pvp-league-season-13/

  • @Amaranthe.3578 said:

    @Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:
    Like what? You said "take down two Champions at the same time". Tarir and Triple Trouble use that mechanic, and the resulting 'conversation' is as posted. I thought the OP was about encouraging map/say/squad? chat through challenges.

    The whole point of adding those mechanics to regular 10 people group events is to encourage people to communicate and not just mindlessly zerg the event down.

    Wait a minute. I thought we were talking about open world group events? Those don't have any player-count. If you mean 10-man events, such as Strike Missions, don't they already have mechanics? And, Bounties have mechanics; again, I don't see a lot of chat, except maybe from a Commander to the squad. Of course, perhaps I miss it as I'm concentrating on the mechanics. /shrug

  • Blaeys.3102Blaeys.3102 Member ✭✭✭

    Ive mentioned this before, but there is a way they could implement more difficulty into open world while still accommodating the mindless zerg mode that many actually enjoy (even if they wont admit they enjoy it).

    The answer comes from guilds - specifically guild missions and the guild event flag. Give guilds the ability to trigger harder versions of open world content - either through the mission panel or with the guild event flag that can be constructed in the guild hall (the one that can be used to trigger Karka Queen, Tequatl or Triple Trouble outside the normal start times). Give guilds the ability to build three versions of the flag - easy, medium, hard - with easy being the current version. Then expand the flag to all of the world bosses and group dynamic events in the game.

    With a few dozen guilds out there triggering harder open world events (and offering some coordination behind them), it would create a more interesting world for everyone - even those not in guilds who might happen upon the events or find them in the LFG.

    The game is too easy right now - that is widely accepted. This is one way that can be remedied without disrupting the current nature of the game - offering a range of experiences for players in game.

  • Adding mechanics, making this more " challenging" -- however you want to cast it, will just drive people away. Triple trouble became doable because a guild dedicated itself to it, teq -- after its major overhaul -- was abandoned until some Blackgate guild dedicated itself to it. Shattered has been mostly abandoned as has the one on the Domain of Vabbi, both of which have unique mechanics that must be done to succeed. Even Silverwastes' flower monster. It's meta is rarely successful. Sure people do all three, but not consistently and not enough to be requently successful. In the case of Shatterer they reworked it's mechanics so hard, there needs to be a certain number of people there to even consider being successful, or the turrets easily get over run. It is hard to want to dedicate time on a boss when after an hour's work you get nothing to show for it. Even the newish ice giant. Once it was buffed, it rarely gets done. I spent hours on that map in recent weeks, and have only seen it down three or four times.

    Sure, I get people want a challenge, in order to pit themselves against something more to do and to get better. I do that all the time. It is why I bring all toons of all class through all types of content -- save for raids. (I have yet to find time to dedicate my self to that). But that need to see everyone playing to your expectations of their full potential is a you thing. Why must everyone March to the beat of your drum? Maybe skill spamming is the best they can do? And Anet does precious little to explain mechanics, and fellow players show contempt to anyone who doesn't know them. Heck, the only tutorial in I have really ever seen is the mechanic of the pre-match pvp screen. And having to look up youtube guides to understand content seems silly and a waste of play time, when you just want to play.

    The only suggestion I support is putting this harder content as guild content, but that mission system seems to also be ignored by most guilds I can't see that happening.

  • Gehenna.3625Gehenna.3625 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Amaranthe.3578 said:

    @Gehenna.3625 said:
    More challenge means fewer people show up...that's the reality of a casual oriented games. If people don't show up, then who are you going to talk to?

    Again, Im talking about a SLIGHT increase in challange. Just some VERY basic mechanics simply to prevent mindless zerging.

    Sure but a slight increase won't prevent mindless zerging. I've done the fight a few times now and in small groups it invariable fails and in larger groups we succeed quite easily. The elements I noticed are:
    More cc needed
    Champions have more HP
    Drakkar does more damage

    These three things mean essentially nothing in larger groups and make all the difference in smaller groups.

    So the end result is that it's still a zergfest and smaller groups now fail more regularly. That means that people will be turned off on this fight and will leave when they see the group is not that big. So zerg or gtfo in other words.

    The point is that the goal you describe to prevent mindless zerging has not been achieved and this failure comes at a cost of smaller groups failing. Where's the positive?

    "In my experience, if you can't say what you mean, you can never mean what you say. The details are everything." ~ Minister Durano