What if the functionality of Stealth is changed entirely.

Instead of totally removing the player from sight, they become transparent instead.

They will be untargetable and their player name and tag won't show, but faint silhouettes will be there when the stealthed player moves.

If they stay still or walk, they will disappear from view like normal.

Will this make Stealth less oppressive?

If a player is abusing stealth alot they will be detected by an experienced player, and being forced to walk to stay stealthed will keep the stealthed player's mobility limited.

Nah just make stealth not so spammy and have it 3 seconds tops. Not that hard

@hunkamania.7561 said:Nah just make stealth not so spammy and have it 3 seconds tops. Not that hard

So useless and not worth building for? No thanks.

@Yasai.3549 said:Instead of totally removing the player from sight, they become transparent instead.

They will be untargetable and their player name and tag won't show, but faint silhouettes will be there when the stealthed player moves.

If they stay still or walk, they will disappear from view like normal.

Will this make Stealth less oppressive?

If a player is abusing stealth alot they will be detected by an experienced player, and being forced to walk to stay stealthed will keep the stealthed player's mobility limited.

I thought of something similar long time ago. Using cloak while moving drains endurance slowly and standing still gives full invisibility but replenishes ur endurance over time. Then give thief a few non stackable full invisibility skills of 3 secs to allow for bursts. The community either wants it left as is but nerfed to uselessness or just deleted. Aside from invisibility users of course.

100%-50% transparent pulses

@Rod.6581 said:100%-50% transparent pulses

Lol so they'd basically be flickering? stealthy stealthy

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@Rod.6581 said:100%-50% transparent pulses

Yea, you are right. They should really just remove it from competitive modes.

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@hunkamania.7561 said:Nah just make stealth not so spammy and have it 3 seconds tops. Not that hard

I would ask for a different rules between stlealth and unstlealh.

The mechanic kinda borks up and makes players stop rendering just watch some supposed gvg’s all u can see is the enemy health bar, so imo that’s a mechanic that is actually f”””” up than working.

Same goes for thief’s when there’s lots of action, having to pay atention to combat log due players keep ataking culled and start dodging and request your team to bomb at ur position should not happen as well, but besides abusing from how bad stealth works to using cheats sometimes it’s doubtful wich metheod player is abusing.

Some cases the thief thinks it’s revelares to the taget but target client won’t receive that interaction, making the player that went out of stealth culled.

To avoid heavy reworks, I would prefer minor some changes to bow thief is revealed and get a long icd on how thief can remove marked, or maybe thebthebmarked remival just tied to the rifle usage.Something that could improve server and clients interaction rather than feel like a pkg is getting lost or delayed between clients.

Stealth it’s kinda fine”ish... just way to buggy and exploitable.... kinda like a early beta state game lol...

Pfft this isn't like the mesmer community where they'll bow down and even help you come up with ideas to nerf their own class, thieves won't give up a mm on nerfs, so don't bother.

So just delete stealth and end the 8 year discussion about it from both sides. Thieves will need to be given something to make up for not being able to perma stealth away from zergs hunting them of course, maybe another shadow portal that instantly ports to spawn even in combat from anywhere on the map, bringing 5 friends along also included.

Make stealth a boon instead of a mechanic.

"What if the functionality of Stealth is changed entirely" ?

Thieves and Mesmers will disappear :# :3

@XenesisII.1540 said:Pfft this isn't like the mesmer community where they'll bow down and even help you come up with ideas to nerf their own class, thieves won't give up a mm on nerfs, so don't bother.

So just delete stealth and end the 8 year discussion about it from both sides. Thieves will need to be given something to make up for not being able to perma stealth away from zergs hunting them of course, maybe another shadow portal that instantly ports to spawn even in combat from anywhere on the map, bringing 5 friends along also included.

Seems like it's always thieves in the wvw forum offering up suggestions to fix any thief build that get's out of hand for a patch. You don't have to flat out lie to make a point.

@kash.9213 said:

@XenesisII.1540 said:Pfft this isn't like the mesmer community where they'll bow down and even help you come up with ideas to nerf their own class, thieves won't give up a mm on nerfs, so don't bother.

So just delete stealth and end the 8 year discussion about it from both sides. Thieves will need to be given something to make up for not being able to perma stealth away from zergs hunting them of course, maybe another shadow portal that instantly ports to spawn even in combat from anywhere on the map, bringing 5 friends along also included.

Sure buddy whatever you say.

You know, more I think about it more I like the idea of adding more broken features to every class.

Elementalist - Earth Wall - Erecting a wall from the ground. And I'm talking about Desert BL Garri Boss Wall. Just a bit smaller ofc. So no stab can help you, BUT if you dps hard enough 20man blob can actually break it! True, this wall could be abused to lift allies across the wall. But since anet doesn't care about thief portal abuse, this shouldn't be a concern.

Revenant - Myst Rift - When enemies walk through rifts they are ported on random place in BL. Hey, this is a rift we talk about. Clearly a big tell, and it's your fault if you were in the middle of fight vs other blob and didn't even see it. Again enemies could teleport to your inner courtyards or even break maps, but that's the risk you take.

Engi - Siege Utilities - Same as turrets but drops siege weps. It's bothersome to go around contest camps and build those things anyways. Let's have a skill that just drops them!

Warrior - Unstopable - Same as rampage but you get even bigger and all skills affect 15 enemies. Can be traited to Godlike and increase that to 30 foes!

Out of ides for other classes. You add them.

Let's even make it racial!

Asura - Theta Golem - Has an ulti golem that is actually Alpha Golem (Can't make it Omega since we need those to remain relevant ofc)

Humans - Prayer to Balthazar - If more of them pray at the same time (10sec cast) then the summoned Balthazar is stronger. So if 50 humans pray they get a Tequatl strong Balthazar.

Chars - Ghosts of Ascalon - For every char there spawns one Champion Ascalon ghost that attacks random target (both friends and foes). They are angry after all! We all want to see more PvE in WvW anyways!!!

Sylvari - Mass Confusion - Mordremoth legacy and such. Enemies become vulnerable to friendly fire! They hit eachother with skills. Super fun!

Norn - Braham - Spawn a Braham to fight along you. But he then changes his mind and teams up with enemies. Only to change mind again and go back to helping you! All the time Taimi can be heard broadcasting thorugh communicator.

All this would have little to no impact to balance so they can adjust it in some minor patch or something.

@Yasai.3549 said:Instead of totally removing the player from sight, they become transparent instead.

They will be untargetable and their player name and tag won't show, but faint silhouettes will be there when the stealthed player moves.

Yeah, so all the AoE spam classes will be able to hit every single invisible player.

Will this make Stealth less oppressive?

Permastealth is not a good thing. But some seconds of invisibility does not create problems, if you know how to play and counter it.. Get better and stop to complain.

@SehferViega.8725 said:

Permastealth is not a good thing. But some seconds of invisibility does not create problems, if you know how to play and counter it.. Get better and stop to complain.

Highly obvious that this thread was created because of Permastealthing or regarding Thieves which can literally spam Stealth every other second.

There is a extreme fix to this, and that is to make Revealed last longer, but I'm sure players don't want that.

In fact, an extended Revealed will make players who like Stealth pick stuff like Revealed Training and Flickering Shadows more often, so heck, why not make Revealed 10 seconds.

revealed lasting longer is more sensible than this. the fact that's its only 3 sec in wvw is pretty ridiculous.

Talking about stealth.To me,the best stealth mechanic ever was on Archage: where it was kinda proximity based!?.Meaning that if u engage

• from behind i would not be able to see you untill the actual strike
• from the sides i could eventually see you the moment u get too close or strike
• from the front i could spot you way early compared to the sides

In WoW rogues can stealth only if out of combat and stay hidden untill they want.But when they are in combat they have 1 ability (if it is still that way) that lets them restealth while in combat.(with a long cd)In gw2 you dont have an abilitiy granting you an "always-on stealth untill you attack" like rogues in WoW,but there are several ways to gain a "timed" stealth,but since there are no timers on "how much stealth u can gain " you can either stack it untill u get a very generous ammount of invisibilit or spamming it to get invisbility every time u need (unless no energy),on top of that there are several bonuses u gen get when invisible via traits (regen,remove condition,crt chance....).

Thats is the problem,imo.Thats why i think people see Gw2 Stealth broken.

I main engineer (dont like holo atall,so i play vanilla or scrapper), and for istance,they removed "detection pulse"(remove stealth from enemies) from "sneak gyro" and they move it to "utility goggles" to make room to the "improved function gyro".That small change is a huge problem for me: now.If i want to have a small window to add pressure to a stealth profession i HAVE to take an utility skill i dont need (especially in has no place at all in my build) itself but only for the toolbelt of it.

In this situation stealth is getting really annoying to me,atleast before that stupid change i had a small window to act.Now my choice is:

1. Have an utility skill i dont need just to remove stealth from a target that can re-stealth 10 seconds later
2. No reveal atall but have actually a usefull utility.

@Aeolus.3615 said:

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@hunkamania.7561 said:Nah just make stealth not so spammy and have it 3 seconds tops. Not that hard

I honestly dont think DE or any thief should have a cancel reveal skill at all,DE elite should be reworked into something else. I will agree that's definitely OP and shouldn't have been added.

Longer revealed time like say 5 seconds is definitely justifiable.

@Yasai.3549 said:

@SehferViega.8725 said:

Permastealth is not a good thing. But some seconds of invisibility does not create problems, if you know how to play and counter it.. Get better and stop to complain.

If the revealed can also give -33% dmg reduction for the same duration without having to take the trait XD

There is no doubt it needs to be changed, but in order to change it, I guarantee you wouldn't like everything else that would have to be changed around it.

1. Stealth should be permanent, not cast over and over. You turn it on, it is on until you get in combat or turn it off.
2. Stealth should always move slower than normal run speed, roughly 60% of normal run speed unless traited, where roughly 85% should be good.edit note: mounted players would not see stealthed players.
3. Guards can see through stealth, roughly 240 radius around them. Marked debuff is removed, completely, including keep flips.
4. Players can see stealthed players when they are right on top of them. Radius should be small, but enough to allow counterplay, 80 or 120 or so.
5. Once in combat, players can not restealth until out of combat; DE elite would still allow 1 restealth in combat.
6. Revealed would be removed and replaced with an increase in radius you can see stealthed players around you. Reveal traps removed altogether.

Here is why people won't like the above, which is about the only way to really "fix/balance" stealth fairly.

7. All weapon skills would have to require a target, with no target, aoe's would be centered on the casters feet. No spamming skills to "find" stealthers.
8. The exception to point 7 is shortbow 5, thief will still need mobility, and unless they add wall climbing, this will have to remain.
9. Utility skills that have aoe components, like wells or spirit weapons for example, would also be centered on the caster without a target.
10. Soft CC skills would not reveal stealthers.
11. All skills would require line of sight to the target to be cast. The playing field has to be leveled. No more aoe spam on walls, or over walls/terrain.
12. Siege damage would not reveal stealhed players, reveal removed from arrow cart 4.
13. With the exception of combo fields, the only class with on demand stealth would be thief.
14. Thief portal replaced with a non-portal skill.

Lots of traits would need to be reworked. Lots of things would have to be changed to "balance" stealth, and not just on stealth itself. That includes changing how all weapon skills work for targetting, because both sides need adjustment for balance.

Honestly, I think they should remove all siege but oil and rams, and limit rams to 3 on a gate, which would make point 12 irrelevant, but I don't anticipate that either.

For those curios, I main mes and scrapper for wvw, although last 6 months, mostly just engineer (scrapper).

Why all the crying about DE when there is a profession that can do the same thing to your healthbar except unlike DE it has followup right after if they fail and infinitely more defenses/invuls.

@"Anput.4620" said:Why all the crying about DE when there is a profession that can do the same thing to your healthbar except unlike DE it has followup right after if they fail and infinitely more defenses/invuls.

remove stealth entirely from the game is the only solution and Anet know it

(during the meantime, i will make preparation for Amazon's New World game which will encouperate guild wars 2 wvw archetype game play (thanks to former guild wars personals ) )

This patch is my last straw and Anet must prove to their player base if they're serious about resolving our overdue concerns or not. Also, i want to add; all the gimmicks need to go to the trash as well...it's becoming too much of a child play game.

Lastly, all rest in Anet's hand:-To Care For Once Or We Are Done For Good!!-

@"Anput.4620" said:Why all the crying about DE when there is a profession that can do the same thing to your healthbar except unlike DE it has followup right after if they fail and infinitely more defenses/invuls.

Because it also utilizes Stealth to set up their burst.Mesmers doing their combo out of stealth are extremely obvious and any half decent player who isn't sleeping can dodge like 80% of their GS combo with a single evade.

Stay on topic here.

Stealth is what we are discussing and everyone in this thread seem to agree at some level that Stealth is abit too powerful, because it provides no counterplay at all, besides a few select classes which can pulse Reveal or lucky tag someone with Revealed.

DE is mentioned often because they are notorious of their ability to remove the Revealed debuff and basically ignore all Stealth limitations.Thieves are mentioned often because of their unlimited access to Stealth through a simple Black Powder + any Leap Combo.

Mesmers have their own slew of problems like extreme survivability, insane burst, condi spam, stuff which are actually being hit pretty heavily with upcoming balance patches, but one thing which isn't changed at all is Stealth as a mechanic, hence this discussion.