If only classes that had burning as their main source of damage had low access to other cover condis so that people could run cleanse sigils and literally have no problem with burn classes!!!
@choovanski.5462 said:
imagine not playing warrior and neutering burnguard with just weapon swap
Lmao yeah champ u get 36k multiple burns bursts being contantly applied while weapon swapping to remove 1 condi every 5 sec and see how that works out for u. Perfect talk is cheap example.
Burns are definitely grossly overperforming right now.
Burning itself is fine. all problems stem from the conversion from duration to intensity stacking. In doing that, ANet was either lazy or short-sighted. Instead of increasing durations to compensate for the lower per-stack damage, they mostly just increased stacks to match the original level of damage. The result is that when you apply burns from a single source, it's like having multiple of the original burning stacks ticking simultaneously.
The fix is to simply reduce number of stacks and increase duration. With few exceptions, this would mean one skill provides one stack.
@choovanski.5462 said:
imagine not playing warrior and neutering burnguard with just weapon swap
Lmao yeah champ u get 36k multiple burns bursts being contantly applied while weapon swapping to remove 1 condi every 5 sec and see how that works out for u. Perfect talk is cheap example.
Burns are definitely grossly overperforming right now.
Yeah pull another number like 36k ticks out if you want anyone to ever take ya seriously.
Shield of Wrath: Reduced the cooldown of this skill from 36 seconds to 35 seconds.
@choovanski.5462 said:
imagine not playing warrior and neutering burnguard with just weapon swap
Lmao yeah champ u get 36k multiple burns bursts being contantly applied while weapon swapping to remove 1 condi every 5 sec and see how that works out for u. Perfect talk is cheap example.
Burns are definitely grossly overperforming right now.
Yeah pull another number like 36k ticks out if you want anyone to ever take ya seriously.
Except there a recent post showing just that, u kno unless its photoshopped and all so....
@Exedore.6320 said:
Burning itself is fine. all problems stem from the conversion from duration to intensity stacking. In doing that, ANet was either lazy or short-sighted. Instead of increasing durations to compensate for the lower per-stack damage, they mostly just increased stacks to match the original level of damage. The result is that when you apply burns from a single source, it's like having multiple of the original burning stacks ticking simultaneously.
The fix is to simply reduce number of stacks and increase duration. With few exceptions, this would mean one skill provides one stack.
Which doesn't work because if you need to buff a condy attack increasing duration increases probability of removal to the point where it does nothing.
Its confirmation bias at play here (overturned classes aside). If it takes say 5 attacks to get that burn up, compare against equivelant dmg from 5 power attacks and you will see that power is more dangerous.
"Any path that narrows future possibilities may become a lethal trap. Humans do not thread their way through a maze; they scan a vast horizon filled with unique opportunities." - The Spacing Guild Handbook.
Which doesn't work because if you need to buff a condy attack increasing duration increases probability of removal to the point where it does nothing.
Its confirmation bias at play here (overturned classes aside). If it takes say 5 attacks to get that burn up, compare against equivelant dmg from 5 power attacks and you will see that power is more dangerous.
It absolutely works. Just like a power build can't dump all their attacks into an evade, a condi build shouldn't expect to unload all their cooldowns and not have it be cleansed. The counter play to cleanse would be to only use a few abilities, wait for the cleanse, then dump more. This is nearly predicated on toning down power creep in cleanse at the same time.
Thrn that wouldn't be a condy burst that people are complaining about would it.
"Any path that narrows future possibilities may become a lethal trap. Humans do not thread their way through a maze; they scan a vast horizon filled with unique opportunities." - The Spacing Guild Handbook.
Burning works better then power damage now and classes that have multiple different conditions should not get burns to bury them under 6 or 7 other conditions also why is this still a thing seeing 6 different conditions at the same time. Make them exclude each other like cc does, cc conditions are way too strong in this game and when you get all of them at the same time it is worse than hard cc.
@choovanski.5462 said:
imagine not playing warrior and neutering burnguard with just weapon swap
Lmao yeah champ u get 36k multiple burns bursts being contantly applied while weapon swapping to remove 1 condi every 5 sec and see how that works out for u. Perfect talk is cheap example.
Burns are definitely grossly overperforming right now.
Yeah pull another number like 36k ticks out if you want anyone to ever take ya seriously.
Except there a recent post showing just that, u kno unless its photoshopped and all so....
Wasn't that a minionmancer who went DS after a fire weaver stacked a ton of burning on the necro and minions. Going DS drew the conditions to the necro which resulted in the silly high burn stacks and tick?
Burning is fine. Only 2 classes inflict more than a few stacks of burning: ele and guard.
The idea that the problem came from the switch from duration to intensity is absurd. Burning before the switch was a joke on so many levels. It was non-functional as a condition and non-functional in any pvp setting.
Guard applies burn, vuln, immob, and cripple. Thats about it. It applies very few of those in pulsing except burning. Almost all the burning stacks from guard come from F1, meaning that hes still hitting you with the same abilities he would if he was power. FB has a few more condi abilities, but pays for them in cast time. Disregarding FBs (still) absurd level of boon support, burn fb is really pretty tame in terms of burst ability.
Ele inflicts a bit more bleeding and cripple, but relies a lot more on fields to stack burning. Ele also only inflicts burning in fire, where it doesn't get access to most of its other condis. Beyond a few troll FA one shot builds, ele has always gravitated towards condi builds. Any nerf to burn really hurts viable ele builds. And lets be honest here, ele hasn't been a dominant force since core celestial years ago.
Condi clear is a part of literally every remotely competitive build. Its also very easy to change into more condi cleanse in 2v2. Condi is currently slightly stronger than power builds after the nerf, but i really don't see how thats a problem. Power has been the go-to for almost every class with only small exceptions. The change to invuln to stop condi ticks made the strongest abilities in the game now counter even more and lead to most condi builds getting pushed out of the game. Now that condi is the go-to everyone is up in arms? Is a switch in meta really that hard to handle? Its not like condi skills are hitscans with no animations, you still have to get hit by everything that inflicts burning.
Yes burning is quite effective against players with a skillbar full of pve utilities standing still and pressing 1. I've seen that a few times. That's the same type of player that dies to power mirage these days.
I haven't seen more than a stack of 3 burns in my condi bar for months. Is this even still possible when you are not afk?
Burning overall but also on Guardians is just another thing that went under the radar, it was pretty whack but avoidable in the past because of the sustain, with all the nerfs that we got it's been power creeping a little too much as people didn't really care for expertise either.
None of it was changed, but here we had people complaining about 15 Torment when 7 burns which is easily handed out can do more overtime and faster on sage amulet. Damage is basically the same as before.
@Exedore.6320 said:
Burning itself is fine. all problems stem from the conversion from duration to intensity stacking. In doing that, ANet was either lazy or short-sighted. Instead of increasing durations to compensate for the lower per-stack damage, they mostly just increased stacks to match the original level of damage. The result is that when you apply burns from a single source, it's like having multiple of the original burning stacks ticking simultaneously.
The fix is to simply reduce number of stacks and increase duration. With few exceptions, this would mean one skill provides one stack.
Which doesn't work because if you need to buff a condy attack increasing duration increases probability of removal to the point where it does nothing.
Its confirmation bias at play here (overturned classes aside). If it takes say 5 attacks to get that burn up, compare against equivelant dmg from 5 power attacks and you will see that power is more dangerous.
Except you don't have to hit someone constantly at CQC range, you can sit down and let the AoE spam do the work and with Expertise amulets gone, everyone has Power now and if you look it up yourself, burning/power without crits outperforms 80% of all Berserker builds with less risk. Guardians need to be looked into.
@anjo.6143 said:
There is no intention of nerf on burning? It seems way op
+1
-i actually walked into wvw and was baffled and astonished....how can this not be taken seriously?-
how was this not included in the hotfix patch??
there is no serious urge of urgency to remove this Toxicity, that's it!!
yeah, that's it folks!!
-a bad design stealth mechanic is fine, a bad design mesmer/thief profession are fine, an elementalist profession having absolutely no identity is fine, +1 shot is fine, exploiting teleports is fine too...folks...everything is fine as always-
nothing new to see here folks
'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'
@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:
Burning does stack pretty aggressively, but it only gets heavy in bursts. Fight guards and FBs tactically and you should be fine.
Tactically is hard when 5 burn stacks that's easily achieved deal more damage than a typical power burst over and over. You can get rid of one and be tossed another one right away without much of a choice but to suck it up and die, the multi hit mechanic is cool but the end results need to be looked into, it's too rewarding for nothing and is basically the same even after the patch.
Only an issue when paired with 4 other condi classes in a team fight. Condis are only a problem in team fights imo. Amount of condis applied far outlasts condi removal.
Ele virtually does zero dmg outside burning...they have nothing left as they nerfed even arcane skill already low dmg, now you deal 600 dmg with utilities meant for dmg while a ranger pet deal 5x more dmg...yet people want more nerfs on ele...the class can't kill anything outside silver at this point
-A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"
@Arheundel.6451 said:
Ele virtually does zero dmg outside burning...they have nothing left as they nerfed even arcane skill already low dmg, now you deal 600 dmg with utilities meant for dmg while a ranger pet deal 5x more dmg...yet people want more nerfs on ele...the class can't kill anything outside silver at this point
This is why we look objectively at the core of the problem, because as you mention Ele, there's other people that also use burning and are not major issues, example being Condi Engi or Condi Rev.
@Arheundel.6451 said:
Ele virtually does zero dmg outside burning...they have nothing left as they nerfed even arcane skill already low dmg, now you deal 600 dmg with utilities meant for dmg while a ranger pet deal 5x more dmg...yet people want more nerfs on ele...the class can't kill anything outside silver at this point
This is why we look objectively at the core of the problem, because as you mention Ele, there's other people that also use burning and are not major issues, example being Condi Engi or Condi Rev.
Ele is super easy to down if you have any resemblance of skill..dunno any easier class to down atm, if you get killed by a burn weaver you should point the fingers at yourself, there is no class I used so far that struggle against an ele..if anybody call me biased pls jump on an ele and video record it
-A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"
I think power damage is abusive ....it's way OP! How am I supposed to manage skills that deal 11k damage? I can't cleanse it like I would have cleansed burn with my million cleanses. Yes, I can dodge, but there are just 2 dodge if you are not playing mirage! Remove power damage from the game!
@ollbirtan.2915 said:
I think power damage is abusive ....it's way OP! How am I supposed to manage skills that deal 11k damage? I can't cleanse it like I would have cleansed burn with my million cleanses. Yes, I can dodge, but there are just 2 dodge if you are not playing mirage! Remove power damage from the game!
People that hit 11k with power has 11k hp, no cleanses, 2 dogdes, no evades, etc, you have to make ALL your traits for damage. With burn is the same?
I just fought against one Ele, the guy has power dmg, burn, high hp, def and high heals, wth is that? The patch was supposed to make ppl to choose between things, how the hell this class can have it all yet ?
@ollbirtan.2915 said:
I fail to see the logic in your "counter argument" - pardon me.
You can hit high with power, but you have to abdicate of HP, healing, defense, etc. With a build based on burn, do you need to abdicate those things? (Also big condi circles are an advantage to secure a node, so it shouldnt take the same damage in comparison melee atacks)
Power skills also have AOE, and not every burn skill is AOE. And yes, you have to make sacrifices too if you want to deal enough damage with burn - as you said have to abdicate of HP, healing, defense, etc. .
@ollbirtan.2915 said:
Power skills also have AOE, and not every burn skill is AOE. And yes, you have to make sacrifices too if you want to deal enough damage with burn - as you said have to abdicate of HP, healing, defense, etc. .
That is weird, I found an Ele that was tank, healer AND burner, alone almost killed the entire team and could easily hold an node against 2 player.
All the time that im looking my combat log, is like 2, 3, 4k power skills and other condis and 18, 30, 45k burn. There is any explanation for that ? What im doing right with all the stuff and doing wrong with burn? How to handle it?
@ollbirtan.2915 said:
Power skills also have AOE, and not every burn skill is AOE. And yes, you have to make sacrifices too if you want to deal enough damage with burn - as you said have to abdicate of HP, healing, defense, etc. .
That is weird, I found an Ele that was tank, healer AND burner, alone almost killed the entire team and could easily hold an node against 2 player.
All the time that im looking my combat log, is like 2, 3, 4k power skills and other condis and 18, 30, 45k burn. There is any explanation for that ? What im doing right with all the stuff and doing wrong with burn? How to handle it?
Remove/steal/corrupt its might stacks? Ele is a hybrid class by design, but isn't much of a threat without it.
@anjo.6143 said:
Any player that is pro burn, doesnt play with burn build atm?
Here. I play straight power damage nine times out of ten and am fine with racking up burn stacks. If people think it's overperforming then sure look into it, but I haven't seen a major, major issue with it as of yet.
Ive fought a few burnguards since the patch and they havent been incredibly unmanagable. Yeah, if you pick up like 7 burn stacks it'll kill you if you dont manage cleanse properly, but they also have a hard time chasing you, so you can kite and come right back in most cases.
@ollbirtan.2915 said:
I think power damage is abusive ....it's way OP! How am I supposed to manage skills that deal 11k damage? I can't cleanse it like I would have cleansed burn with my million cleanses. Yes, I can dodge, but there are just 2 dodge if you are not playing mirage! Remove power damage from the game!
Speaking of, there's an axe scepter mirage out there named Zips or something (He wears a standard issue mesmer mask and dresses in gray) performing really kitten well even with the mirage nerfs. Pretty impressive.
@Arheundel.6451 said:
Ele is super easy to down if you have any resemblance of skill..dunno any easier class to down atm, if you get killed by a burn weaver you should point the fingers at yourself, there is no class I used so far that struggle against an ele..if anybody call me biased pls jump on an ele and video record it
I fought a Dagger Dagger Weaver named Hm Ok on grieving and cele. He's pretty strong.
The "Balance" is a fantasy -- another mortal superstition.
@choovanski.5462 said:
imagine not playing warrior and neutering burnguard with just weapon swap
Lmao yeah champ u get 36k multiple burns bursts being contantly applied while weapon swapping to remove 1 condi every 5 sec and see how that works out for u. Perfect talk is cheap example.
Burns are definitely grossly overperforming right now.
hey man, you're crying in the forum about burns- m not dude. seems like it's working fine
smh so salty
must be really taking a toll getting farmed by all these condi builds
It's coming for me through the trees
Help me someone
Help me please
Take my shoes off and throw them in the lake
I'll let the data speak for itself
From gw2 wiki: Burning
(0.155 * Condition Damage) + (1.55 * Level) + 7 damage per stack per second,
(0.155 * Condition Damage) + 131 damage per stack per second at Level 80
Bleeding
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + (0.25 * Level) + 2 damage per stack per second,
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + 22 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Poison
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + (0.375 * Level) + 3.5 damage per stack per second,
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + 33.5 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Torment
While stationary (WvW and sPvP):
(0.045 * Condition Damage) + 15.9 damage per stack per second.
While moving:
(0.09 * Condition Damage) + (0.36 * Level) + 3 damage per stack per second,
(0.09 * Condition Damage) + 31.8 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Confusion
(0.1 * Level) + 2 damage per stack per second.
10 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Damage on skill activation (Player):
(0.0975 * Condition Damage) + (0.575 * Level) + 3.5 damage per stack.
(0.0975 * Condition Damage) + 49.5 damage per stack.
My opinion:
It is undeniable that burning packs the most damage of all the conditions and it can really reach too high damage in few stacks compared to the number of stack of bleeding, poison and torment. And probably a sligh nerf in coefficient would not be bad for the game.
Does it needs to be nerfed across all classes? It would be an easy fix, but probably not the correct one. Infact the core of the argument would be how easy access does a class have to high numbers of stacks of burning? Infact would be a complete fail to reduce burning damage for classes that have very infrequent burning or with very low stacks. Probably reducing burning in stacks and frequency of reapplying it would be the way to go. This requires testing done properly considering all factors
Question to necro mains (with classic build not the signet tanky one): Due to huge impact of burning, is it a good choice to use the trait dhuumfire instead of eternal life in the soul reaping line? I do more dmg but using it feels clunky cus of slooow cast time...
I want to know where players think 11k burns come from. tbh I think it is a blatant lie, because you forgot to count in the dmg part of skills which can do quite more than condis on top. condis are just the stuff added on the side. so for condis your dmg is far lower but it stacks together with condis leading to such myths.
for example if I have 2k condi dmg burn does 443 dmg per second. so to reach 11k burn I need 11k:443= 25 stacks burning. this number is unlikely to get reached, because even with my 100% burn guard I can't get past 12 in pve.
@pninak.1069 said:
I want to know where players think 11k burns come from. tbh I think it is a blatant lie, because you forgot to count in the dmg part of skills which can do quite more than condis on top. condis are just the stuff added on the side. so for condis your dmg is far lower but it stacks together with condis leading to such myths.
for example if I have 2k condi dmg burn does 443 dmg per second. so to reach 11k burn I need 11k:443= 25 stacks burning. this number is unlikely to get reached, because even with my 100% burn guard I can't get past 12 in pve.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Zealot's_Fire
this alone is about 9k burn dmg.
1 skill. dunno how the rest works but the fact that 1 ability can whack people for over half HP, with no cast time on low cooldown AOE pulsing...
oh and a passive that does the same every 10s.
@Serenity.6304 said:
Due to huge impact of burning, is it a good choice to use the trait dhuumfire instead of eternal life in the soul reaping line? I do more dmg but using it feels clunky cus of slooow cast time...
just pay attention to how many lifeblasts you are hitting. Unless the answer is a lot, dhuum fire isn’t worth it. Tbh I always thought the trait sucked ever since they reworked it’s broken form to what it is now. I’d rather use crit+ferocity or the defensive option as better opponents will avoid/los most of your life blasts anyway (assuming they are pressured) as the skill is so slow to execute.
@pninak.1069 said:
I want to know where players think 11k burns come from. tbh I think it is a blatant lie, because you forgot to count in the dmg part of skills which can do quite more than condis on top. condis are just the stuff added on the side. so for condis your dmg is far lower but it stacks together with condis leading to such myths.
for example if I have 2k condi dmg burn does 443 dmg per second. so to reach 11k burn I need 11k:443= 25 stacks burning. this number is unlikely to get reached, because even with my 100% burn guard I can't get past 12 in pve.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Zealot's_Fire
this alone is about 9k burn dmg.
1 skill. dunno how the rest works but the fact that 1 ability can whack people for over half HP, with no cast time on low cooldown AOE pulsing...
oh and a passive that does the same every 10s.
Comments
Burning does need nerfing
Necromancer 1 trick
Burning is fine, it's only hurting but with good dmg, and you can remove it or block or evade attacks that gives you burn
how do u wanna nerf it? Put down the damage? Then its like bleeding, just with shorter duration.
If only classes that had burning as their main source of damage had low access to other cover condis so that people could run cleanse sigils and literally have no problem with burn classes!!!
imagine not playing warrior and neutering burnguard with just weapon swap
It's coming for me through the trees
Help me someone
Help me please
Take my shoes off and throw them in the lake
??
Lmao yeah champ u get 36k multiple burns bursts being contantly applied while weapon swapping to remove 1 condi every 5 sec and see how that works out for u. Perfect talk is cheap example.
Burns are definitely grossly overperforming right now.
actually fb and to a lesser extent burn dh have plenty of cover condis.
te lazla otstara.
fingers crossed meta ~
When a certain class can abuse burning, then this class should be nerfed, and not burning itself !
Damage is abusive too
Burning itself is fine. all problems stem from the conversion from duration to intensity stacking. In doing that, ANet was either lazy or short-sighted. Instead of increasing durations to compensate for the lower per-stack damage, they mostly just increased stacks to match the original level of damage. The result is that when you apply burns from a single source, it's like having multiple of the original burning stacks ticking simultaneously.
The fix is to simply reduce number of stacks and increase duration. With few exceptions, this would mean one skill provides one stack.
Burning isn't fine. It does too much on too many classes and stacks too easily. Burning needs a minor reduction then all condi specs would be fine.
Necromancer 1 trick
Yeah pull another number like 36k ticks out if you want anyone to ever take ya seriously.
Shield of Wrath: Reduced the cooldown of this skill from 36 seconds to 35 seconds.
Quality balance changes^TM
Except there a recent post showing just that, u kno unless its photoshopped and all so....
Which doesn't work because if you need to buff a condy attack increasing duration increases probability of removal to the point where it does nothing.
Its confirmation bias at play here (overturned classes aside). If it takes say 5 attacks to get that burn up, compare against equivelant dmg from 5 power attacks and you will see that power is more dangerous.
"Any path that narrows future possibilities may become a lethal trap. Humans do not thread their way through a maze; they scan a vast horizon filled with unique opportunities." - The Spacing Guild Handbook.
Beware the meta!
It absolutely works. Just like a power build can't dump all their attacks into an evade, a condi build shouldn't expect to unload all their cooldowns and not have it be cleansed. The counter play to cleanse would be to only use a few abilities, wait for the cleanse, then dump more. This is nearly predicated on toning down power creep in cleanse at the same time.
Thrn that wouldn't be a condy burst that people are complaining about would it.
"Any path that narrows future possibilities may become a lethal trap. Humans do not thread their way through a maze; they scan a vast horizon filled with unique opportunities." - The Spacing Guild Handbook.
Beware the meta!
Burning works better then power damage now and classes that have multiple different conditions should not get burns to bury them under 6 or 7 other conditions also why is this still a thing seeing 6 different conditions at the same time. Make them exclude each other like cc does, cc conditions are way too strong in this game and when you get all of them at the same time it is worse than hard cc.
Wasn't that a minionmancer who went DS after a fire weaver stacked a ton of burning on the necro and minions. Going DS drew the conditions to the necro which resulted in the silly high burn stacks and tick?
Is damage too high?
Burning is fine. Only 2 classes inflict more than a few stacks of burning: ele and guard.
The idea that the problem came from the switch from duration to intensity is absurd. Burning before the switch was a joke on so many levels. It was non-functional as a condition and non-functional in any pvp setting.
Guard applies burn, vuln, immob, and cripple. Thats about it. It applies very few of those in pulsing except burning. Almost all the burning stacks from guard come from F1, meaning that hes still hitting you with the same abilities he would if he was power. FB has a few more condi abilities, but pays for them in cast time. Disregarding FBs (still) absurd level of boon support, burn fb is really pretty tame in terms of burst ability.
Ele inflicts a bit more bleeding and cripple, but relies a lot more on fields to stack burning. Ele also only inflicts burning in fire, where it doesn't get access to most of its other condis. Beyond a few troll FA one shot builds, ele has always gravitated towards condi builds. Any nerf to burn really hurts viable ele builds. And lets be honest here, ele hasn't been a dominant force since core celestial years ago.
Condi clear is a part of literally every remotely competitive build. Its also very easy to change into more condi cleanse in 2v2. Condi is currently slightly stronger than power builds after the nerf, but i really don't see how thats a problem. Power has been the go-to for almost every class with only small exceptions. The change to invuln to stop condi ticks made the strongest abilities in the game now counter even more and lead to most condi builds getting pushed out of the game. Now that condi is the go-to everyone is up in arms? Is a switch in meta really that hard to handle? Its not like condi skills are hitscans with no animations, you still have to get hit by everything that inflicts burning.
Yes burning is quite effective against players with a skillbar full of pve utilities standing still and pressing 1. I've seen that a few times. That's the same type of player that dies to power mirage these days.
I haven't seen more than a stack of 3 burns in my condi bar for months. Is this even still possible when you are not afk?
Burning is very dangerous if you leave your computer to get the pizza. Otherwise not so much, you just have poor awareness and reaction times.
Shield of Wrath: Reduced the cooldown of this skill from 36 seconds to 35 seconds.
Quality balance changes^TM
I clicked on the topic because obvious bait, turns out to be a serious thread... what is happening?
Burning overall but also on Guardians is just another thing that went under the radar, it was pretty whack but avoidable in the past because of the sustain, with all the nerfs that we got it's been power creeping a little too much as people didn't really care for expertise either.
None of it was changed, but here we had people complaining about 15 Torment when 7 burns which is easily handed out can do more overtime and faster on sage amulet. Damage is basically the same as before.
Willing to help with anything Revenant related.
Except you don't have to hit someone constantly at CQC range, you can sit down and let the AoE spam do the work and with Expertise amulets gone, everyone has Power now and if you look it up yourself, burning/power without crits outperforms 80% of all Berserker builds with less risk. Guardians need to be looked into.
Willing to help with anything Revenant related.
+1
-i actually walked into wvw and was baffled and astonished....how can this not be taken seriously?-
how was this not included in the hotfix patch??
there is no serious urge of urgency to remove this Toxicity, that's it!!
yeah, that's it folks!!
-a bad design stealth mechanic is fine, a bad design mesmer/thief profession are fine, an elementalist profession having absolutely no identity is fine, +1 shot is fine, exploiting teleports is fine too...folks...everything is fine as always-
nothing new to see here folks
'Situations that are present are there because you allow and tolerate them to continue'
Burning does stack pretty aggressively, but it only gets heavy in bursts. Fight guards and FBs tactically and you should be fine.
The "Balance" is a fantasy -- another mortal superstition.
Tactically is hard when 5 burn stacks that's easily achieved deal more damage than a typical power burst over and over. You can get rid of one and be tossed another one right away without much of a choice but to suck it up and die, the multi hit mechanic is cool but the end results need to be looked into, it's too rewarding for nothing and is basically the same even after the patch.
Willing to help with anything Revenant related.
Only an issue when paired with 4 other condi classes in a team fight. Condis are only a problem in team fights imo. Amount of condis applied far outlasts condi removal.
Ele virtually does zero dmg outside burning...they have nothing left as they nerfed even arcane skill already low dmg, now you deal 600 dmg with utilities meant for dmg while a ranger pet deal 5x more dmg...yet people want more nerfs on ele...the class can't kill anything outside silver at this point
-A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"
Hope burning and poisoning could be the core version: 1 stack, high damage.
And another idea: buring and freezing should be only one of them on the same person. After all, fire won't be on ice.
This is why we look objectively at the core of the problem, because as you mention Ele, there's other people that also use burning and are not major issues, example being Condi Engi or Condi Rev.
Willing to help with anything Revenant related.
Ele is super easy to down if you have any resemblance of skill..dunno any easier class to down atm, if you get killed by a burn weaver you should point the fingers at yourself, there is no class I used so far that struggle against an ele..if anybody call me biased pls jump on an ele and video record it
-A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"
Any player that is pro burn, doesnt play with burn build atm?
I think power damage is abusive ....it's way OP! How am I supposed to manage skills that deal 11k damage? I can't cleanse it like I would have cleansed burn with my million cleanses. Yes, I can dodge, but there are just 2 dodge if you are not playing mirage! Remove power damage from the game!
burn a problem???? ahahahahaha let's speak about torment?
People that hit 11k with power has 11k hp, no cleanses, 2 dogdes, no evades, etc, you have to make ALL your traits for damage. With burn is the same?
I just fought against one Ele, the guy has power dmg, burn, high hp, def and high heals, wth is that? The patch was supposed to make ppl to choose between things, how the hell this class can have it all yet ?
I fail to see the logic in your "counter argument" - pardon me.
You can hit high with power, but you have to abdicate of HP, healing, defense, etc. With a build based on burn, do you need to abdicate those things? (Also big condi circles are an advantage to secure a node, so it shouldnt take the same damage in comparison melee atacks)
Power skills also have AOE, and not every burn skill is AOE. And yes, you have to make sacrifices too if you want to deal enough damage with burn - as you said have to abdicate of HP, healing, defense, etc. .
That is weird, I found an Ele that was tank, healer AND burner, alone almost killed the entire team and could easily hold an node against 2 player.
All the time that im looking my combat log, is like 2, 3, 4k power skills and other condis and 18, 30, 45k burn. There is any explanation for that ? What im doing right with all the stuff and doing wrong with burn? How to handle it?
Remove/steal/corrupt its might stacks? Ele is a hybrid class by design, but isn't much of a threat without it.
Edit: also don't stand in the fire.
Here. I play straight power damage nine times out of ten and am fine with racking up burn stacks. If people think it's overperforming then sure look into it, but I haven't seen a major, major issue with it as of yet.
Ive fought a few burnguards since the patch and they havent been incredibly unmanagable. Yeah, if you pick up like 7 burn stacks it'll kill you if you dont manage cleanse properly, but they also have a hard time chasing you, so you can kite and come right back in most cases.
Speaking of, there's an axe scepter mirage out there named Zips or something (He wears a standard issue mesmer mask and dresses in gray) performing really kitten well even with the mirage nerfs. Pretty impressive.
I fought a Dagger Dagger Weaver named Hm Ok on grieving and cele. He's pretty strong.
The "Balance" is a fantasy -- another mortal superstition.
hey man, you're crying in the forum about burns- m not dude. seems like it's working fine
smh so salty
must be really taking a toll getting farmed by all these condi builds
It's coming for me through the trees
Help me someone
Help me please
Take my shoes off and throw them in the lake
I'll let the data speak for itself
From gw2 wiki:
Burning
(0.155 * Condition Damage) + (1.55 * Level) + 7 damage per stack per second,
(0.155 * Condition Damage) + 131 damage per stack per second at Level 80
Bleeding
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + (0.25 * Level) + 2 damage per stack per second,
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + 22 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Poison
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + (0.375 * Level) + 3.5 damage per stack per second,
(0.06 * Condition Damage) + 33.5 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Torment
While stationary (WvW and sPvP):
(0.045 * Condition Damage) + 15.9 damage per stack per second.
While moving:
(0.09 * Condition Damage) + (0.36 * Level) + 3 damage per stack per second,
(0.09 * Condition Damage) + 31.8 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Confusion
(0.1 * Level) + 2 damage per stack per second.
10 damage per stack per second at level 80.
Damage on skill activation (Player):
(0.0975 * Condition Damage) + (0.575 * Level) + 3.5 damage per stack.
(0.0975 * Condition Damage) + 49.5 damage per stack.
My opinion:
It is undeniable that burning packs the most damage of all the conditions and it can really reach too high damage in few stacks compared to the number of stack of bleeding, poison and torment. And probably a sligh nerf in coefficient would not be bad for the game.
Does it needs to be nerfed across all classes? It would be an easy fix, but probably not the correct one. Infact the core of the argument would be how easy access does a class have to high numbers of stacks of burning? Infact would be a complete fail to reduce burning damage for classes that have very infrequent burning or with very low stacks. Probably reducing burning in stacks and frequency of reapplying it would be the way to go. This requires testing done properly considering all factors
Question to necro mains (with classic build not the signet tanky one): Due to huge impact of burning, is it a good choice to use the trait dhuumfire instead of eternal life in the soul reaping line? I do more dmg but using it feels clunky cus of slooow cast time...
~ Miyu Chan / twitch miyu_chan_serenity
I want to know where players think 11k burns come from. tbh I think it is a blatant lie, because you forgot to count in the dmg part of skills which can do quite more than condis on top. condis are just the stuff added on the side. so for condis your dmg is far lower but it stacks together with condis leading to such myths.
for example if I have 2k condi dmg burn does 443 dmg per second. so to reach 11k burn I need 11k:443= 25 stacks burning. this number is unlikely to get reached, because even with my 100% burn guard I can't get past 12 in pve.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Zealot's_Fire
this alone is about 9k burn dmg.
1 skill. dunno how the rest works but the fact that 1 ability can whack people for over half HP, with no cast time on low cooldown AOE pulsing...
oh and a passive that does the same every 10s.
yea sure it does 9k burn over the entire duration, but it doesn reach a 11k dmg tick in one second.
just pay attention to how many lifeblasts you are hitting. Unless the answer is a lot, dhuum fire isn’t worth it. Tbh I always thought the trait sucked ever since they reworked it’s broken form to what it is now. I’d rather use crit+ferocity or the defensive option as better opponents will avoid/los most of your life blasts anyway (assuming they are pressured) as the skill is so slow to execute.
How are you getting 9k?