Mesmer the only class that instead of elites got downgrades. — Guild Wars 2 Forums

Mesmer the only class that instead of elites got downgrades.

kraai.7265kraai.7265 Member ✭✭✭

So it seems anet thought, after so many years of giving us broken mechanics, now they have to give us handicap.

Chrono was butchered several months ago because of pve reasons, never addressed in pvp/wvw, still to this day unplayable, and considered the weakest e-spec right now.

Mirage got one dodge, I can't really understand who could have thought this was a good idea, clearly the problems with mirage weren't there, but instead of touching IH or condi applications they just removed a dodge, nerfed the damage and thats it. Killing power mirages and leaving a crippled condi mirage build, meanwhile daredevils still enjoy their 3 dodges... Thats what I call trying to fix a problem but creating several more in the process.

My question to you anet is.. why our e-specs are the only ones that feel like downgrades? why instead of tradeoffs you just rip the class apart over and over again? who is in charge of this class design over the balance team? are you gonna ever considerate addressing this changes? why we got no reply from you after several posts here and in reddit? Do you plan on removing the class from pvp/wvw after every mesmer who plays those modes leaves the game?

Comments

  • Curunen.8729Curunen.8729 Member ✭✭✭✭

    New elite specs incoming maybe - with all the demand from the LW "expansion" saga I wouldn't be surprised to see a glimpse of something within the next year or two.

    My ears, how are you! | Staff | Greatsword

  • Xstein.2187Xstein.2187 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 5, 2020

    @kraai.7265 said:
    My question to you anet is.. why our e-specs are the only ones that feel like downgrades? why instead of tradeoffs you just rip the class apart over and over again? who is in charge of this class design over the balance team? are you gonna ever considerate addressing this changes? why we got no reply from you after several posts here and in reddit? Do you plan on removing the class from pvp/wvw after every mesmer who plays those modes leaves the game?

    Q1: why our e-specs are the only ones that feel like downgrades?
    A: Because they are downgrades.

    Q2: why instead of tradeoffs you just rip the class apart over and over again?
    A: Instead of giving tradeoffs and then balancing like on the other classes, for mesmer Anet considered it better to nerf and balance to the tradeoffs of other classes and then install tradeoffs afterwards because . . . . reasons.

    Q3: who is in charge of this class design over the balance team?
    A: Unfortunately, we must assume Robert Gee is still in charge of mesmer.
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Robert_Gee
    As even though there were layoffs, those who no longer work for Anet are still listed as former staff and Robert Gee is not one of them.
    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/ArenaNet

    Q4: are you gonna ever considerate addressing this changes?
    A: . . . . . . . . No,

    Q5: why we got no reply from you after several posts here and in reddit?
    A: There is no point to replying if you think such a reply will hurt/decrease the player base or lead to a decrease in profits.

    Q6: Do you plan on removing the class from pvp/wvw after every mesmer who plays those modes leaves the game?
    A: No, you do not need to fully remove content to find a solution. Look at dungeons, just do a little snip snip here and a snip snip there and Boom, no one seriously or competitively plays dungeons anymore even though they are still in the game. Yet, people still can't complain about dungeons being removed. Problem solved! EZPZ

  • Cyninja.2954Cyninja.2954 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Curunen.8729 said:
    New elite specs incoming maybe - with all the demand from the LW "expansion" saga I wouldn't be surprised to see a glimpse of something within the next year or two.

    This is my assumption too. The devs have been changing up other classes too. Probabaly don't want to drop every change at once.

    The issue with mesmer elites was: they covered nearly every aspect in the game outside of healing. Superb power damage: chrono. Superb condi damage: mirage. Superb boonbot: chrono. Etc.

    The rest is covered by this games player base inability to deal with mesmer mechanics. Makes me nearly wish that any potential 3rd elite ditches clones and phantasms as much as possible.

  • Moradorin.6217Moradorin.6217 Member ✭✭✭

    @kraai.7265 said:

    @Cyninja.2954 said:

    @Curunen.8729 said:
    New elite specs incoming maybe - with all the demand from the LW "expansion" saga I wouldn't be surprised to see a glimpse of something within the next year or two.

    This is my assumption too. The devs have been changing up other classes too. Probabaly don't want to drop every change at once.

    The issue with mesmer elites was: they covered nearly every aspect in the game outside of healing. Superb power damage: chrono. Superb condi damage: mirage. Superb boonbot: chrono. Etc.

    The rest is covered by this games player base inability to deal with mesmer mechanics. Makes me nearly wish that any potential 3rd elite ditches clones and phantasms as much as possible.

    And thats the problem, they could have nerf only the double burst in power chrono, and no problem, boon application too, yet they destroyed the spec with one of the most stupid changes i've seen in my 5 years playing, same with mirage, they could have just nerfed the condi applications, some traits, even removing IH would be ok, but no they had to take another stupid decision and wreck the whole spec.

    Plus i just want to add, i can't understand why after nerfing boonshare, leaving us only with cc and stealth to add to the group, they gave engis that stupid braindead smoke field, our stealth applications always had lower stealth uptime, and more skill involved, instead of giving us an easier way to apply it or longer stealth times, they gave engi a far easier way to stealth the whole group and created the most stupid braindead meta in wvw ever.

    It's like they want us to be expelled from every zerg, or just be a portal with legs.

    Dont forget Engi also gets a much better moa with much lower cooldown timer on it ours is 180 seconds.

  • Gryxis.6950Gryxis.6950 Member ✭✭✭

    Can't wait till they give clones to other classes aswell

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭

    I got a question for you guys any of you got a graph showing if mirage is played more or core mes?

    And if you had to change something what would you change about core?

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • ArlAlt.1630ArlAlt.1630 Member ✭✭✭

    @Axl.8924 said:
    I got a question for you guys any of you got a graph showing if mirage is played more or core mes?

    And if you had to change something what would you change about core?

    Basic knowledge of human psychology tells you that Mirage has higher representation (mostly because muscle memory, anti-regression mentality). That doesn't necessarily make it better than Core tho.

    [HCM] 4 life!

  • Axl.8924Axl.8924 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 7, 2020

    I really like the weapon combo, is it viable for PVE? its really fun.

    It has tons of mobility too with a pistol. I'm guessing probably not since the condis seem to fall off really fast and not much stacks of torment and confusion.

    Here is my list of characters i got so far:

    Elementalist 80 with tempest:Talman nul
    Necromancer 80 with reaper:Zex vokar
    Mesmer level 80 no chrono yet:Klanga voosh.
    Level 80 Ranger with druid spec Jedkhan.

  • ArlAlt.1630ArlAlt.1630 Member ✭✭✭

    @Axl.8924 said:
    I really like the weapon combo, is it viable for PVE? its really fun.

    It has tons of mobility too with a pistol. I'm guessing probably not since the condis seem to fall off really fast and not much stacks of torment and confusion.

    2 years worth of nerfs will do that.

    [HCM] 4 life!

  • Kodama.6453Kodama.6453 Member ✭✭✭

    @Moradorin.6217 said:
    I mean this really does say it all! Orignially certain things belonged to memser ONLY like confusion and Moa. Later Alacrity. Now mesmer gets the worst moa hardly any confusion, not the best alacrity, etc. Mesmer has no legitimate role really. I know they have uses. I mean the class is totally lost. It has no purpose. Its often inferior in its own niche areas.

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Toss_Elixir_X
    ^ 120 sec cooldown - THREE TARGET, but half duration

    vs

    https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Humility - 6 seconds, but single target and 3 minute cooldown vs 2 min for engi.

    SO this "class defining skill" Mesmer gets is the worst version. Engi gets to cc 3 targets with it every 2 minutes vs 1 target every 3 minutes. Both have to deal with it not landing equally, BUT engi gets up to 3 targets to try and get it to work on and can ground target to get around line of sight much easier than direct line of sight target from player to player cause ground targets are fugable for line of sight. I would go on about alacrity and confusion but the point is made and we all know the rest.

    Also dispite all this Moa is often the best elite option sadly for mesmer.

    You should keep in mind that Mesmer can have access to their moa skill on all of their specs, while Engineer just has access to it on core only. If you are taking Scrapper or Holosmith, you simply are not able to use that skill.

  • Kodama.6453Kodama.6453 Member ✭✭✭

    @Leonidrex.5649 said:
    @Kodama.6453
    also keep in mind that its traited so CD is actually under 100s.
    and it also has 1/2s casttime on a class with access to quickness vs 1s SIGNET.
    Mesmer VS Engi
    180s VS 96s( due to trait )
    Single target VS AoE
    1s cast time VS 1/2s cast time ( possibility of quickness )
    6s duration VS 3,6s duration
    As everyone can see its half the cooldown, half the cast time AoE.
    3,6s vs 6s. 6s is overkill already, 3,6s serves its needs.
    for every mesmer moa engi can propably land 4-5. due to aoe ( no LoS fuckery ) shorter casttime ( harder to dodge ) and lower cooldown

    Why do you count the engineer as having quickness, but not the mesmer? Mesmers also have access to quickness to speed up the activation of the skill. And while it is true that the enemy can use LoS to make you miss, that mesmers signet is targeted is also an advantage. Engineer's Throw Elixir X is a skillshot that can be avoided my movement solely, mesmers signet is targeted and therefore can just get avoided by dodging, using defensive cooldowns or LoS.