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Should ArenaNet remove duo?


Chilli.2976

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@"Alatar.7364" said:If you people want to play Solo so hard then you should be using Forums to advocate a new game mode and not be trying to prevent other people from playing Team based PvP mod in Teams...That's like voting about having 2v2 increased to 5v5, it makes no sense.As to you OP; you legit can't walk in here and say "you wanna play in team in a team based mod? Well play something else than team conquest". Just no mate, no, if YOU wanna play Solo then you go and play something else than team mod. If anything re-enabling 5man will bring back more people, possibly enough to justify keeping it again.

Is it actually funny how this point has been overlooked for so long.

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If it wasn't for duo q, I wouldn't even be playing PvP. Unranked is awful, getting farmed by premades, and ranked is initially daunting to go in by yourself; enter duo q with a friend (my case, my wife).Now I mostly solo q as kids have changed our schedules. The point remains that duo q can definitely add population to a game mode that desperately needs it.

And match manipulation is not an excuse to remove it. From what I can tell, most of you yes voters shouldn't be asking for anet to remove duo q, but for them to actually "police" ranked: or hell, make "rank1 and 2 duo q" sit in queue for 5 hrs looking for a match (lol).

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@Chilli.2976 said:

@JETWING.2759 said:Why i can't play with my new comer friend?

You can, there is Unranked and Stronghold which consists of any team size - so you have this option to play with your friend.

ROFL. Unranked is a complete crapshoot with the matchmaking. The parameters are far looser than ranked, so you rarely get matched with someone remotely near your skill level. And you thought ranked matchmaking was bad? Unranked is to goof around and play new builds.

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No.

Simple because you won't get better match quality. The solo Q could be just an excuse to blame the "others" for their incompetence, instead to face the truth :)

Also, playing with a friend makes the entire experience of ranked more enjoyable, even if you go through a losing streak (at least for my experience). So duo Q should stay, regardless.

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In high level play, duoQ actually has very little ability to affect the outcome of games with the exception of games around 7-9am. This is because the matchmaking system works and gives you players that are in gold if you're soloQ and in Legend, let alone duoQ. If you want more evidence of this, I would recommend watching Boyce's stream vods from the past season. You will see that despite him being the best mechanical player in the game he cannot carry some games, even when duoQ with other good players.

You all vastly overestimate the value that DuoQ brings. Now, one thing that cannot be stated enough is the fact that for high level players SoloQ ranked is ridiculously unfun. A lot of you have no idea how it feels to be in plat3/legend and get players significantly lower skilled (not that being bad at the game is terrible, they just shouldn't be matchmade with really good players as its unfair for everyone). It leads to a lot of frustration, and a lot of players quit the game as a result of it before DuoQ for Plat 2+ was reinstated. DuoQ brings some solace with it, because a high leveled player can share the depressing experience with a friend, and it makes it better and less frustrating, even if your chances of winning are equal if not lowered by DuoQ, its more fun.

Another thing to consider is that the leaderboard has no integrity, and no I am not referring to wintrading - although that certainly has had an affect on people's attitudes towards the titles and the leaderboard as a whole. The most efficient way to get Rank 1 is to play those morning games 7-9am, DuoQ, and hide your rating by not reaching the minimum required games each week to appear on the leaderboard. Now this is not a fun way of playing the game as a lot of the players that are good enough to compete for Rank1, etc. just want to play the game. To this end, only a maximum of 5 or so players are actually competing for rank 1 by the end of the season (at least on EU). Additionally, the community outlook on the titles and leaderboad placements is such that no one really cares. Pain (EU) got rank 1 this past season and doesn't even use the title, that should tell you a lot.

All in all this means that DuoQ is not a detriment to the game from a high level perspective, and well, in a competitive gamemode the high level perspective is the most important one, as its the place that all players should be striving to reach. That may sound callous and harsh, but it is a reality.

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@"AngelsShadow.7360" said:In high level play, duoQ actually has very little ability to affect the outcome of games ....

The leaderboard says quite the opossite. I give you one more example. Look at Ajax for example. Him solo queuing ending in p2/p3. Him duo queuing ending in legendary. I believe Jaw made it once to legendary too only when he duo queued, he never did as solo queuer.

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I remember when 5-mans were the boogeyman that was just standing in the way of people reaching the ranks they feel they should be at.

Now all the seasons later, in their minds, it's duo queues messing all that up.

Anet should go ahead and remove it just for the sheer amusement of seeing what the next excuse players come up with on why they're just not at the ranks they should be at.

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@Starbreaker.6507 said:I remember when 5-mans were the boogeyman that was just standing in the way of people reaching the ranks they feel they should be at.

Now all the seasons later, in their minds, it's duo queues messing all that up.

Anet should go ahead and remove it just for the sheer amusement of seeing what the next excuse players come up with on why they're just not at the ranks they should be at.

because it's true. i won't list the reasons why you don't see it.i got legendary with a duo Q in 2 nights with a winrate of more then 90% and completely reckt all enemy teams, while soloq i can barely make plat 2. because the player base is so low, there's not many people who know how to pvp anymore, and having 2 who know how to play the game(@your rank level) is way better then having 1, often enough the matches are completely one sided and unfun.the DuoQ will beat your team one sided, even tho they can be individually inferior to you skill wise, as long as they are better then the rest of your team.

also you lose like almost 20 points per match because of low player base at high rank doesnt help either.

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@"AngelsShadow.7360" said:In high level play, duoQ actually has very little ability to affect the outcome of games with the exception of games around 7-9am. This is because the matchmaking system works and gives you players that are in gold if you're soloQ and in Legend, let alone duoQ. If you want more evidence of this, I would recommend watching Boyce's stream vods from the past season. You will see that despite him being the best mechanical player in the game he cannot carry some games, even when duoQ with other good players.

Leaderboards without Merged Queues:Top 250 maintain 50-70% winrates, very few alt or boosted accounts.

Leaderboards with merged queues:Most the top 250 still retain pretty average winrates, but the very highest players see a dramatic shift. 80-90% Winrates with well over a hundred games played, less than 20 lost. Alt and boosted accounts filling the other very top spots. Bugs make Season13's ratings highly inflated and meaningless.

To say merged queues don't effect the outcome of games, in a gamemode where they're literally unchecked, within a population that's already too small to stand any semblance of a chance of ever mirroring the higher-rated ones is pretty absurd.

The matchmaker isn't functional enough at all to operate with DuoQ as it is. When silvers and golds are thrown onto a team with two top players, that isn't in any way at all fair or reasonable. It's not exactly healthy(or even adequately effective judging by the LB) for the game, to throw people several hundred rating below another on the same team just to make up for the disparity they create between their ratings and the population. People tend to play ranked in any game for more fair and more competitive matchmaking to unranked. Not to be treated as gap fillers to what has essentially become a monopolistic farm for a handful of top players.

You all vastly overestimate the value that DuoQ brings. Now, one thing that cannot be stated enough is the fact that for high level players SoloQ ranked is ridiculously unfun. A lot of you have no idea how it feels to be in plat3/legend and get players significantly lower skilled (not that being bad at the game is terrible, they just shouldn't be matchmade with really good players as its unfair for everyone). It leads to a lot of frustration, and a lot of players quit the game as a result of it before DuoQ for Plat 2+ was reinstated. DuoQ brings some solace with it, because a high leveled player can share the depressing experience with a friend, and it makes it better and less frustrating, even if your chances of winning are equal if not lowered by DuoQ, its more fun.

I've touched P3 a few times, and I know that feel. Honestly, as an almost exclusively SoloQ player; I actually felt the rating of my teammates was way closer in matchmaking when DuoQ was restricted. With it unrestricted, I could have someone on my team who's a top player; queued with another top player smurfing on a silver, and sniping low-mid level players. The matchmaking is objectively worse in that scenario(Which isn't all that uncommon either, towards the end of a ranked season.)

It's made the game more boring for me; as someone who really only plays for a competitive rush, when the competition is leagues below me. That fun, my fun is ruined is ruined by DuoQs being forced into my games. I'm only speaking for myself too, and I can't imagine the pressure and disappointment anyone actually playing at the gold or silver level must feel right now. I would not be surprised at all if all this made anyone in our positions quit as well, nor am I going to show even the slightest amount of sympathy when people go threatening to quit when they can't play with friends, because this is how we pay for that.

Surely you see the hypocrisy there. Nothing makes either side more entitled. Why should one side be forced to quit just so the other can have fun? Arenanet should really just split the queues up and make everyone, but the people abusing it happy. Even those who do abuse DuoQ in every way possible to inflate their ranks and egos, would have to grit their teeth and just accept that.

I mean it, there really is no reason, none at all; as to why SoloQ players can't have the option to play purely with other SoloQ players. Let Duos and Teams play against other Duos and teams, and let people SoloQ separately against only other SoloQ people in the meantime. Two ways to play ranked, both separate from the other.

DuoQ as it is, is unacceptable; because that fun you have is at the expense of the fun and competitive experience of the vast majority of other players, and ultimately that's why merged queues need to get gone. They're as much a drain on ranked's population as SoloQ only was.

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@Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

@"AngelsShadow.7360" said:In high level play, duoQ actually has very little ability to affect the outcome of games with the exception of games around 7-9am. This is because the matchmaking system
works
and gives you players that are in gold if you're soloQ and in Legend, let alone duoQ. If you want more evidence of this, I would recommend watching Boyce's stream vods from the past season. You will see that despite him being
the best mechanical player in the game
he cannot carry some games, even when duoQ with other good players.

Leaderboards without Merged Queues:Top 250 maintain 50-70% winrates, very few alt or boosted accounts.

Leaderboards with merged queues:Most the top 250 still retain pretty average winrates, but the very highest players see a dramatic shift. 80-90% Winrates with well over a hundred games played, less than 20 lost. Alt and boosted accounts filling the other very top spots. Bugs make Season13's ratings highly inflated and meaningless.

To say merged queues don't effect the outcome of games, in a gamemode where they're literally unchecked, within a population that's already too small to stand any semblance of a chance of ever mirroring the higher-rated ones is pretty absurd.

The matchmaker isn't functional enough at all to operate with DuoQ as it is. When silvers and golds are thrown onto a team with two top players, that isn't in any way at all fair or reasonable. It's not exactly healthy(or even adequately effective judging by the LB) for the game, to throw people several hundred rating below another on the same team just to make up for the disparity they create between their ratings and the population. People tend to play ranked in any game for more fair and more competitive matchmaking to unranked. Not to be treated as gap fillers to what has essentially become a monopolistic farm for a handful of top players.

You all vastly overestimate the value that DuoQ brings. Now, one thing that cannot be stated enough is the fact that for high level players SoloQ ranked is ridiculously
unfun
. A lot of you have no idea how it feels to be in plat3/legend and get players significantly lower skilled (not that being bad at the game is terrible, they just shouldn't be matchmade with really good players as its unfair for everyone). It leads to a lot of frustration, and a lot of players quit the game as a result of it before DuoQ for Plat 2+ was reinstated. DuoQ brings some solace with it, because a high leveled player can share the depressing experience with a friend, and it makes it better and less frustrating, even if your chances of winning are equal if not lowered by DuoQ, its
more fun
.

I've touched P3 a few times, and I know that feel. Honestly, as an almost exclusively SoloQ player; I actually felt the rating of my teammates was way closer in matchmaking when DuoQ was restricted. With it unrestricted, I could have someone on my team who's a top player; queued with another top player smurfing on a silver, and sniping low-mid level players. The matchmaking is objectively worse in that scenario(Which isn't all that uncommon either, towards the end of a ranked season.)

It's made the game more boring for me; as someone who really only plays for a competitive rush, when the competition is leagues below me. That fun, my fun is ruined is ruined by DuoQs being forced into my games. I'm only speaking for myself too, and I can't imagine the pressure and disappointment anyone actually playing at the gold or silver level must feel right now. I would not be surprised at all if all this made anyone in our positions quit as well, nor am I going to show even the slightest amount of sympathy when people go threatening to quit when they can't play with friends, because this is how we pay for that.

Surely you see the hypocrisy there. Nothing makes either side more entitled. Why should one side be forced to quit just so the other can have fun? Arenanet should really just split the queues up and make everyone, but the people abusing it happy. Even those who do abuse DuoQ in every way possible to inflate their ranks and egos, would have to grit their teeth and just accept that.

I mean it, there really is no reason, none at all; as to why SoloQ players can't have the option to play purely with other SoloQ players. Let Duos and Teams play against other Duos and teams, and let people SoloQ separately against only other SoloQ people in the meantime. Two ways to play ranked, both separate from the other.

DuoQ as it is, is unacceptable; because that fun you have is at the expense of the fun and competitive experience of the vast majority of other players, and ultimately that's why merged queues need to get gone. They're as much a drain on ranked's population as SoloQ only was.

You do realise that ArenaNet had stated on multiple occasions that soloQ has a higher winrate than duoQ?

Where do you see these people with 90% wins in the leaderboard?

DuoQ doesn't prevent people from soloing. Soloing does however prevent people from duoing.

The season where they restricted duo for p2+ the games were even more awful because many of the top players just didn't even bother playing ranked that season.Also, we don't have the population to be able to split queues.

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@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

You do realise that ArenaNet had stated on multiple occasions that soloQ has a higher winrate than duoQ?

Where do you see these people with 90% wins in the leaderboard?

DuoQ doesn't prevent people from soloing. Soloing does however prevent people from duoing.

The season where they restricted duo for p2+ the games were even more awful because many of the top players just didn't even bother playing ranked that season.Also, we don't have the population to be able to split queues.

you literally contradict yourself, first of all, not true soloq has higher winrate lol.second of all, why you think top player didn't bother, because "top player" can't duoQ to the top (now who says soloq has higher winrate)btw only way to get to the top of lb right now is duoq, none of those winrates on top LB are maintainable without duoq.i can also argue the higher placement they are, the less soloq they do.

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@"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

@"AngelsShadow.7360" said:In high level play, duoQ actually has very little ability to affect the outcome of games with the exception of games around 7-9am. This is because the matchmaking system
works
and gives you players that are in gold if you're soloQ and in Legend, let alone duoQ. If you want more evidence of this, I would recommend watching Boyce's stream vods from the past season. You will see that despite him being
the best mechanical player in the game
he cannot carry some games, even when duoQ with other good players.

Leaderboards without Merged Queues:Top 250 maintain 50-70% winrates, very few alt or boosted accounts.

Leaderboards with merged queues:Most the top 250 still retain pretty average winrates, but the very highest players see a dramatic shift. 80-90% Winrates with well over a hundred games played, less than 20 lost. Alt and boosted accounts filling the other very top spots. Bugs make Season13's ratings highly inflated and meaningless.

To say merged queues don't effect the outcome of games, in a gamemode where they're literally unchecked, within a population that's already too small to stand any semblance of a chance of ever mirroring the higher-rated ones is pretty absurd.

The matchmaker isn't functional enough at all to operate with DuoQ as it is. When silvers and golds are thrown onto a team with two top players, that isn't in any way at all fair or reasonable. It's not exactly healthy(or even adequately effective judging by the LB) for the game, to throw people several hundred rating below another on the same team just to make up for the disparity they create between their ratings and the population. People tend to play ranked in any game for more fair and more competitive matchmaking to unranked. Not to be treated as gap fillers to what has essentially become a monopolistic farm for a handful of top players.

You all vastly overestimate the value that DuoQ brings. Now, one thing that cannot be stated enough is the fact that for high level players SoloQ ranked is ridiculously
unfun
. A lot of you have no idea how it feels to be in plat3/legend and get players significantly lower skilled (not that being bad at the game is terrible, they just shouldn't be matchmade with really good players as its unfair for everyone). It leads to a lot of frustration, and a lot of players quit the game as a result of it before DuoQ for Plat 2+ was reinstated. DuoQ brings some solace with it, because a high leveled player can share the depressing experience with a friend, and it makes it better and less frustrating, even if your chances of winning are equal if not lowered by DuoQ, its
more fun
.

I've touched P3 a few times, and I know that feel. Honestly, as an almost exclusively SoloQ player; I actually felt the rating of my teammates was way closer in matchmaking when DuoQ was restricted. With it unrestricted, I could have someone on my team who's a top player; queued with another top player smurfing on a silver, and sniping low-mid level players. The matchmaking is objectively worse in that scenario(Which isn't all that uncommon either, towards the end of a ranked season.)

It's made the game more boring for me; as someone who really only plays for a competitive rush, when the competition is leagues below me. That fun, my fun is ruined is ruined by DuoQs being forced into my games. I'm only speaking for myself too, and I can't imagine the pressure and disappointment anyone actually playing at the gold or silver level must feel right now. I would not be surprised at all if all this made anyone in our positions quit as well, nor am I going to show even the slightest amount of sympathy when people go threatening to quit when they can't play with friends, because this is how we pay for that.

Surely you see the hypocrisy there. Nothing makes either side more entitled. Why should one side be forced to quit just so the other can have fun? Arenanet should really just split the queues up and make everyone, but the people abusing it happy. Even those who do abuse DuoQ in every way possible to inflate their ranks and egos, would have to grit their teeth and just accept that.

I mean it, there really is no reason, none at all; as to why SoloQ players can't have the option to play purely with other SoloQ players. Let Duos and Teams play against other Duos and teams, and let people SoloQ separately against only other SoloQ people in the meantime. Two ways to play ranked, both separate from the other.

DuoQ as it is, is unacceptable; because that fun you have is at the expense of the fun and competitive experience of the vast majority of other players, and ultimately that's why merged queues need to get gone. They're as much a drain on ranked's population as SoloQ only was.

You do realise that ArenaNet had stated on multiple occasions that soloQ has a higher winrate than duoQ?

Where do you see these people with 90% wins in the leaderboard?

DuoQ doesn't prevent people from soloing. Soloing does however prevent people from duoing.

The season where they restricted duo for p2+ the games were even more awful because many of the top players just didn't even bother playing ranked that season.Also, we don't have the population to be able to split queues.

DuoQ has lower winrate than SoloQ in lower ratings probably, where it's just 2 friends that wanna casually play together and most likely lose together since they don't even play to win, which makes DuoQ even worse and unhealthy for pvp.

Top 1-3 have all very high winrate (i'm talking from my EU PoV), Season 16's top 1 and 2 had very close to 90% (Wing and Briseis).

TL;DR Did the players that didn't play ranked when duoQ were removed came back now that it's back though ?

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