Nerf mesmer

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Kumouta.4985 said:mesmers should explode and die when using f1,2,3 or 4

Except chrono

chrono goes back in time, to the good ol days before he was born.

[Burnfall.9573]

Until Mesmer return to its roots; to its calling....https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Mesmerhttps://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_a_mesmer

Nothing will change!

[Burnfall.9573]

@"Lyndina.7984" said:Yeah. Those people that complain about mesmer would have probably played a Ele with meteorshower back then,and complain why the mesmer interupts it every time. Mesmer in Gw1 was awesome, now in Gw2 with the klones and kitten its just garbage gameplay. I was honestly disappointed when i played the mesmer in Gw2 but pulled through. However it never came close to the Gw1 mesmer.

+1

http://www.toptiertactics.com/14669/guild-wars-2-how-arenanet-ruined-the-mesmer/

[Burnfall.9573]

@"DanAlcedo.3281" said:Mesmer should have never happend in the first place.

Change my mind.

+1

(Don't change your mind :)

Afterall; this is not Gwen's Mesmer in Guild Wars . In other word; i agree with you

-This Mesmer should have never happened in the first place-

--side note--

'Guild Wars (GvG) [Mesmer, Main]'

[Zenix.6198]

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:change title to nerf mirage. mesmer is fine. chrono needs help.

True.It already has been said a bazillion times, but Mirage simply is inherently broken when it comes to pvp.Its core mechanics alone are problematic enough to call it "flawed by design" when it comes to player combat.

Being able to dodge while stunned or immobilized already completely shuts down basic combo-play (like CC into burst).On top of that mirage cloak lets them dodge without interrupting casts, which on its own already is pretty broken.

Then, while chrono and core specs rely on a builder/spender mechanic (build clones, spend with shatters), IH mirage doesnt even need it's spender mechanic to deal good damage. Shatters are nice additional burst, but simply not required to sufficiently pressure somebody with a continuous stream of aids without the use of CD-based "key abilities".

I mean, there is a reason mirage already "died" like .....what? .... 4-5 times already and still manages to find new builds that supply a never-ending stream of tears from the community .....even tho, admittedly, some of it is nothing more than noise.It genuinely is impressive, how a spec can get nerfed THAT many times (on top of a rework for one condition) and still be this problematic.

[judgebeo.3976]

@geekiedude.4731 said:remove all of its CCmesmer should not be allowed to stun at allits an illusionist it doesnt need stun

just hope you are being sarcastic...

[Widmo.3186]

@Burnfall.9573 said:

@"DanAlcedo.3281" said:Mesmer should have never happend in the first place.

Change my mind.

+1

(Don't change your mind :)

Afterall; this is not Gwen's Mesmer in Guild Wars . In other word; i agree with you

-This Mesmer should have never happened in the first place-

--side note--

'Guild Wars (GvG) [Mesmer, Main]'

Dude, what is this game? It looks like actually skill-based and balanced with lots of team and skill combinations. And I heard that there's mesmer class in this game, is this perhaps footage from Alpha version of gw3? Cant wait to see this live!

[Ziggityzog.7389]

@Widmo.3186 said:

@Burnfall.9573 said:

@"DanAlcedo.3281" said:Mesmer should have never happend in the first place.

Change my mind.

+1

(Don't change your mind :)

Afterall; this is not Gwen's Mesmer in Guild Wars . In other word; i agree with you

-This Mesmer should have never happened in the first place-

--side note--

'Guild Wars (GvG) [Mesmer, Main]'

Dude, what is this game? It looks like actually skill-based and balanced with lots of team and skill combinations. And I heard that there's mesmer class in this game, is this perhaps footage from Alpha version of gw3? Cant wait to see this live!

That is a way older but better game (pvp wise). Sadly I believe from gw1 to gw2 all the people that knew how to make a game left or were let go. That's why pvp was epic in gw1 but it's been a sad sad joke since it started here with circlequest and spam wars.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Zenix.6198 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:change title to nerf mirage. mesmer is fine. chrono needs help.

True.It already has been said a bazillion times, but Mirage simply is inherently broken when it comes to pvp.Its core mechanics alone are problematic enough to call it "flawed by design" when it comes to player combat.

Being able to dodge while stunned or immobilized already completely shuts down basic combo-play (like CC into burst).On top of that mirage cloak lets them dodge without interrupting casts, which on its own already is pretty broken.

Then, while chrono and core specs rely on a builder/spender mechanic (build clones, spend with shatters), IH mirage doesnt even need it's spender mechanic to deal good damage. Shatters are nice additional burst, but simply not required to sufficiently pressure somebody with a continuous stream of aids without the use of CD-based "key abilities".

I mean, there is a reason mirage already "died" like .....what? .... 4-5 times already and still manages to find new builds that supply a never-ending stream of tears from the community .....even tho, admittedly, some of it is nothing more than noise.It genuinely is impressive, how a spec can get nerfed THAT many times (on top of a rework for one condition) and still be this problematic.

in a world where warrior pulls out 4-10k hits out of their asses while having 4+ hard CC, with multitude of mobility and aoe, where holo leaps for 4,5k + while pooping random 3k aoe hits every few secounds, or drops the hammer from stealth for 8k or more. There is few ways to survive it, its not mirage thats broken by "design" its the entire nature of most meta specs that are broken, forcing other classes to have ridiculous survivability to stand a slight chance of living throught this nonsence.make core mesmer and just try surviving spellbreaker for 20s, good luck have fun with that.Mirage is necessary evil untill brainless spam for 4k+ hits gets delt with.You can pretend that counterplay to CC is DoDgInG, but reality is you WILLG ET HIT and against most classes its donk, 0,5s cast time ( faster with quickness) and you are gone. Dodge while CC is a bandaid solution, contrary to popular belief its punished by not having the ability to use ambush skill.Most CC last longer then ambush anyways, so the clone summoned dies, you still take damage and waste potential damage from ambush.

[Zenix.6198]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Zenix.6198 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:change title to nerf mirage. mesmer is fine. chrono needs help.

True.It already has been said a bazillion times, but Mirage simply is inherently broken when it comes to pvp.Its core mechanics alone are problematic enough to call it "flawed by design" when it comes to player combat.

Being able to dodge while stunned or immobilized already completely shuts down basic combo-play (like CC into burst).On top of that mirage cloak lets them dodge without interrupting casts, which on its own already is pretty broken.

Then, while chrono and core specs rely on a builder/spender mechanic (build clones, spend with shatters), IH mirage doesnt even need it's spender mechanic to deal good damage. Shatters are nice additional burst, but simply not required to sufficiently pressure somebody with a continuous stream of aids without the use of CD-based "key abilities".

I mean, there is a reason mirage already "died" like .....what? .... 4-5 times already and still manages to find new builds that supply a never-ending stream of tears from the community .....even tho, admittedly, some of it is nothing more than noise.It genuinely is impressive, how a spec can get nerfed THAT many times (on top of a rework for one condition) and still be this problematic.

in a world where warrior pulls out 4-10k hits out of their kitten while having 4+ hard CC, with multitude of mobility and aoe, where holo leaps for 4,5k + while pooping random 3k aoe hits every few secounds, or drops the hammer from stealth for 8k or more. There is few ways to survive it, its not mirage thats broken by "design" its the entire nature of most meta specs that are broken, forcing other classes to have ridiculous survivability to stand a slight chance of living throught this nonsence.make core mesmer and just try surviving spellbreaker for 20s, good luck have fun with that.Mirage is necessary evil untill brainless spam for 4k+ hits gets delt with.You can pretend that counterplay to CC is DoDgInG, but reality is you WILLG ET HIT and against most classes its donk, 0,5s cast time ( faster with quickness) and you are gone. Dodge while CC is a bandaid solution, contrary to popular belief its punished by not having the ability to use ambush skill.Most CC last longer then ambush anyways, so the clone summoned dies, you still take damage and waste potential damage from ambush.

You are missing the entire point of my post by a mile, if the basis for your argument is "but what about class X/Y/Z?!"

Cause following that logic every class should be able to dodge while stunned.Or you think I have fun getting hit by a 9k arcing slice into a 7k whirling attack in a 1s timeframe?And sure, while I (as an ele) can resustain myself with healing, the difference here is, that I have to invest into it, trait and stat wise.

While all the benefits mirage cloak offers (ambushes, dodge while CCd, dodge without interrupting your cast), simply get handed to you when you just pick up the trailine. You dont have to choose between or invest into anything.It's a straight-up, massive buff to a core mechanic.

Obviously there are issues with the classes you mentioned.like Warrior getting essentially 1.4k extra power for free. Or holo with their ridiculously skewed damage output to survivability ratio.

But using those busted specs as justification for the existence of another busted spec is a slippery slope that would just lead to more powercreep.

[Leonidrex.5649]

@Zenix.6198 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:

@Zenix.6198 said:

@"Crab Fear.1624" said:change title to nerf mirage. mesmer is fine. chrono needs help.

True.It already has been said a bazillion times, but Mirage simply is inherently broken when it comes to pvp.Its core mechanics alone are problematic enough to call it "flawed by design" when it comes to player combat.

Being able to dodge while stunned or immobilized already completely shuts down basic combo-play (like CC into burst).On top of that mirage cloak lets them dodge without interrupting casts, which on its own already is pretty broken.

Then, while chrono and core specs rely on a builder/spender mechanic (build clones, spend with shatters), IH mirage doesnt even need it's spender mechanic to deal good damage. Shatters are nice additional burst, but simply not required to sufficiently pressure somebody with a continuous stream of aids without the use of CD-based "key abilities".

I mean, there is a reason mirage already "died" like .....what? .... 4-5 times already and still manages to find new builds that supply a never-ending stream of tears from the community .....even tho, admittedly, some of it is nothing more than noise.It genuinely is impressive, how a spec can get nerfed THAT many times (on top of a rework for one condition) and still be this problematic.

in a world where warrior pulls out 4-10k hits out of their kitten while having 4+ hard CC, with multitude of mobility and aoe, where holo leaps for 4,5k + while pooping random 3k aoe hits every few secounds, or drops the hammer from stealth for 8k or more. There is few ways to survive it, its not mirage thats broken by "design" its the entire nature of most meta specs that are broken, forcing other classes to have ridiculous survivability to stand a slight chance of living throught this nonsence.make core mesmer and just try surviving spellbreaker for 20s, good luck have fun with that.Mirage is necessary evil untill brainless spam for 4k+ hits gets delt with.You can pretend that counterplay to CC is DoDgInG, but reality is you WILLG ET HIT and against most classes its donk, 0,5s cast time ( faster with quickness) and you are gone. Dodge while CC is a bandaid solution, contrary to popular belief its punished by not having the ability to use ambush skill.Most CC last longer then ambush anyways, so the clone summoned dies, you still take damage and waste potential damage from ambush.

You are missing the entire point of my post by a mile, if the basis for your argument is "but what about class X/Y/Z?!"

Cause following that logic every class should be able to dodge while stunned.Or you think I have fun getting hit by a 9k arcing slice into a 7k whirling attack in a 1s timeframe?And sure, while I (as an ele) can resustain myself with healing, the difference here is, that I have to invest into it, trait and stat wise.

While all the benefits mirage cloak offers (ambushes, dodge while CCd, dodge without interrupting your cast), simply get handed to you when you just pick up the trailine. You dont have to choose between or invest into anything.It's a straight-up, massive buff to a core mechanic.

Obviously there are issues with the classes you mentioned.like Warrior getting essentially 1.4k extra power for free. Or holo with their ridiculously skewed damage output to survivability ratio.

But using those busted specs as justification for the existence of another busted spec is a slippery slope that would just lead to more powercreep.

i think you missed the point, every meta class bursts you down in 1s, or fills you with condis that are clear or die.warrior,holo,ranger,thief,revenant,ele,mesmer all of them.and what is taking mirage if not investing TRAITS into survival ? the reason mirage is not a tradeoff is becouse every single skill tree is utterly useless, our "survival" tree has small heal on shatter, bad condi clear and 1s immunity on sigil use, THATS NETIRE TREE, how can you survive using crap like that.when you decide on tree as a mesmer you look for 1 trait you want, and the rest is 1 useless or 2 bad.if you want tradeoff for mirage, buff every single core skill tree so you have to actually sacrafice something, chaos, domination and inspiration are good places to start.

[Tayga.3192]

@Leonidrex.5649 said:if you want tradeoff for class, buff every single core skill tree so you have to actually sacrafice something.Fixed that for you, as this was the original idea behind elite specs.

chaos, domination and inspiration are good places to start.I disagree.Except for CI, they should start with inspiration, followed by dueling and domination. Illusions and chaos lines can wait.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Leonidrex.5649 said:if you want tradeoff for class, buff every single core skill tree so you have to actually sacrafice something.Fixed that for you, as this was the original idea behind elite specs.

chaos, domination and inspiration are good places to start.I disagree.Except for CI, they should start with inspiration, followed by dueling and domination. Illusions and chaos lines can wait.

I disagreeIllusions traitline is garbage, chaos has now 1 good gm which is trash on pvp.Inspiration was always for new players anyway.

[Tayga.3192]

@Lincolnbeard.1735 said:I disagreeIllusions traitline is garbage, chaos has now 1 good gm which is trash on pvp.Inspiration was always for new players anyway.

IMO(I'll take CI as fixed) Chaos is one of the best traitlines in GW2, not in pure value but in versitality.

You have 1 bad trait in every rank, or 2 good traits. You can always count on chaos.

[Briearios.8407]

I wish there was a "Nerf Ritualist" thread... :'(

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

@Tayga.3192 said:

@Lincolnbeard.1735 said:I disagreeIllusions traitline is garbage, chaos has now 1 good gm which is trash on pvp.Inspiration was always for new players anyway.

IMO(I'll take CI as fixed) Chaos is one of the best traitlines in GW2, not in pure value but in versitality.

You have 1 bad trait in every rank, or 2 good traits. You can always count on chaos.

CI will get useless. Some ICD or something completely irrelevant.Which means one good gm (PU) that's useless on pvp. No one will go chaos if no good gms are present.Duel has 1 good trait on the entire traitlines (and one meme trait - sup complexity) - needs a rework.Mirage needs a rework too - only one good trait in the entire traitline.Illusion apart from torch cd reduction is pretty kitten too.

These are the ones that need most attention imo.