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When did GW2 turn into a grindfest?


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@Jotunhammer.7029 said:

@Jotunhammer.7029 said:what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.but other than that there was no grind to speak of.Grab those xp potions and that food, and venture out into Verdant Brink. Gaining experience for Gliding rank 1 is no different than gaining experience for levels to unlock the next step of the personal story. You get xp through pretty much everything you do in game, including unfogging the map and exploring it's objectives (waypoints, points of interest, vistas ...)

You can get around Verdant Brink without gliding or mushroom masteries (although those do open a lot of new ways to travel through the map), certainly enough to unlock the mastery for the next story step.

If all else fails and you just can't bring yourself to explore the map and join in on events (no need to repeat them), then grab another character and start on the story with them. Unlike character levels, masteries are account wide, so several characters can contribute experience to the same mastery.

@Jotunhammer.7029 said:also, its not just playing the game, raptor long jump require 2 more mastery points, and those mastery points can only be done by doing quests within the raptor area, are there any NEW quests, no, it is a repeat of quests done over and over again to earn the achievement points.I think you are mixing up a few things here (which is not surprising, as the mastery system is different to most other games' progression systems and not quite intuitive to many). You need experience to fill mastery levels (the same as you needed experience to fill character levels pre 80), and you need mastery points to unlock a mastery once you've filled the experience bar. You do not need achievement points for any of this. The game does however use achievements to track a lot of objectives, including mastery points. Just view those achievements as your "available points" list.

The early PoF masteries (up to raptor rank 3) are indeed a bit tight, though there are still more available than necessary. You do get several of them simply for playing the story, while others are attached to map objectives or specific "quests" (that are also tracked as achievements). None of the early ones require content repetition though, and since there are considerably more points available than necessary in any of the three mastery regions you can very well skip all of the repetitive ones if you don't like them. I know I didn't do them (unless on accident), and I've been maxed on masteries for a while.

If you still feel uncomfortable with the system, try putting up a post in the players helping players section to get tips on what to do to advance your story and masteries, or even state your region and usual play times to find people to join you, show you how to get around, and even port you to mastery communes you wouldn't be able to reach yet to make things easier (there are several that require certain masteries to reach them, but you can easily get those masteries with the points available to you before).

Thank you for explaining, however...in order to get 2 more mastery points, it says when I hover over the mastery points that I need to do quests etc in the area of the raptors. I done so, I dove every exploration point I could get my hands on, I even done some of the repeatable quests. The only thing that remains within the raptor area is to continue to do repeatable quests until I get the last 2 mastery points, because the storyline quest is over a sizable ravine that require the longer jump in raptors. So I am stuck doing that, which I detest, and honestly having being stuck there is causing me to play less because the moment I get into the game and I see I have to do same as I did yesterday, it gives me the "WoW chill" of having to do dailies ad infinitum and thats why I left WoW because they lock to much of the things behind "you got to get 3000 rep for your bodyguard in order to continue storyline". Thats not entertaining.Like I said, the early PoF story is one of the few points in mastery progression where points may seem a bit tight, but there are still enough in your reach to get those two and possibly a few extra. Check your achievement log for any category with a red mastery point. Those lead you to achievements that offer PoF mastery points you haven't claimed yet. Specifically the Crystal Desert and Desert Highlands categories in Path of Fire hold the ones available to you right now. Check the wiki for a full list of
, including links to more specific explanations/maps.

Reins of the raptor for example is an easy one, although that one does in fact require you to re-do some renown hearts if you haven't bought the collection items on your first trip through the area. You can however do this on any character, so if you have a second character you want to explore the Crystal Oasis with, just use them to do the hearts.

The Crystal Oasis bounty tour is another quick and easy one. Check the lfg for a bounty train in Crystal Oasis or simply ask in map chat for players to join you for one bounty from each bounty board. An even easier way is to ask nicely in map-chat if there is a player willing to place a portal for you to reach a mastery point you don't have the required mastery for, like the quicksand one in northern Crystal Oasis or the one on top of the pillar at the start of the desert highlands.

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@Dayra.7405 said:

@Dayra.7405 said:I don't remember any situation where I am forced to repeat stuff over several days. Which one are you talking about?

Raptor area where you get to get to level 3 raptore to earn the long jump, just to get to the other side of the ravine. You say you got the 3 points without grinding. How?I done every quests, every hero challenge, every point of interest and yet, I am 30% into second achievment and I need to get to third.

Hm, I remember that it was difficult to get enough Mastery Points to get Lvl 3 Raptor on the first map, but MPs cannot be grinded, they are once per account. I don't remember that I had an EXP problem, maybe because I started to do PoF with several chars to get Hero Points (to get their new elite) for all of them.

Solution: You can pass to the other PoF (or LS4) maps and do stuff there. Or nowadays you can ask in map-chat for a friendly Mesmer with all mounts who can easily give you access to MP's you cannot reach with your current mounts.

HAHAHAHAHAAAAA I almost came to same conclution, except I was thinking id create my own mesmer, seems they are fun ;)

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@"Naga.9623" said:Follow this video guide by dulfy to get mastery point needed to unlock them.

Dulfy have guides for the other pof maps too. Like other have mentioned, do various event and hearts on map to fill up your mastery level. Then follow the video guide to get the necessary mastery points to unlock mastery you want.It's the same thing with hot mastery too.Another good YouTube guide to follow is aiyinmaiden.

p/s: simply playing the story and doing some achievement will get you some mastery points too, good luck :)

I will try this, thank you :)

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@Jotunhammer.7029 said:I was thinking id create my own mesmer, seems they are fun ;)Hm, you cannot port yourself, and you have to reach the point you fail to reach yourself, and while Mesmer may be fun against few strong enemies, I found them annoying against many weak enemies (as the existence of clones and illusions is bound to the existence of the enemy you casted them on).

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@Dayra.7405 said:I don't remember any situation where I am forced to repeat stuff over several days. Which one are you talking about?I remember being stuck at VB for about two weeks. Granted, at the time I was returning from a long break and had to practically learn the game from scratch. Also, I did not use guides at the time, did not have a guild yet and played mostly for the story. Those weeks were totally frustrating, as the story wanted me to save those people ASAP, but the game mechanics didn't let me proceed. It felt as if the Commander did not take the mission seriously. Sure, the events are nice and all, but I wanted to save DE first and do sightseeing later.I do love HoT. It's my favorite part of the game now. But back then, I never wanted to replay it ever. :lol:(It became way more fun once I got used to the game mechanics and once I had unlocked the masteries, so my alts could go at a better pace.)

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@Fenella.2634 said:

@Dayra.7405 said:I don't remember any situation where I am forced to repeat stuff over several days. Which one are you talking about?I remember being stuck at VB for about two weeks. Granted, at the time I was returning from a long break and had to practically learn the game from scratch. Also, I did not use guides at the time, did not have a guild yet and played mostly for the story. Those weeks were totally frustrating, as
the story wanted me to save those people ASAP
, but the game mechanics didn't let me proceed. It felt as if the Commander did not take the mission seriously. Sure, the events are nice and all, but I wanted to save DE first and do sightseeing later.I do love HoT. It's my favorite part of the game now. But back then, I never wanted to replay it ever. :lol:(It became way more fun once I got used to the game mechanics and once I had unlocked the masteries, so my alts could go at a better pace.)

As said, grinding starts where your mindset is: I want to reach that ASAP.

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@Dayra.7405 said:As said, grinding starts where your mindset is: I want to reach that ASAP.True. :) I just wanted to point out that it's totally possible to waste a lot of time especially in HoT, if the player is not set on playing efficiently and using guides.Given the urgency of the story, that was especially unpleasant. And what a shame, really. I was so frustrated at the pace and the sidetrackings that I had really missed much of the beauty and interesting plots of HoT on that first playthrough. So, @ TE, don't be too negative, it might feel a bit grindy right now, but if you ever replay HoT and PoF and pay attention to the maps and the stories, it's really not that bad. :)

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Only time I've ever experienced grinding in this game is when I intentionally and willingly farmed something like Silverwastes for gold. Which I didn't need to do, I just wanted to.Sure, when HoT first came out, the exp requirements were a bit steep, but I never really saw it as a big grind cause I enjoyed the new maps and metas and was having a great time just playing the game. I believe they've since made the exp requirements easier? Not that big of a deal.

Better than doing the same dungeons over and over and over again to level a class you didn't take through the main story. Or grinding the same trial over and over and over again to get gear or that rare chance at a mount drop. Lookin at you FFXIV.And I've heard other MMOs like WoW are no better, though I've never played them. But to call GW2 a grind because you need to earn a wee bit of exp and do a few simple achievements is absurd.

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Maybe they decided that hey, maybe we shouldn't just cater to the people who want things handed to them, lets give the players that are getting bored and burnt out on the easy handout content something to do for a while?

Honestly though, not everything should be obtainable in 1 hour, an MMO is and has always been a grindy genre, and will always be. I enjoyed GW2 back in the day loads as well, but could I ever see myself playing a vanilla version of the game? Hell no. I'd get bored instantly like I did back in the day, taking a break from an MMO 2 months after launch cause there is literally no more content than PvP left cause everything was obtainable within hours is bad.

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@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

meaning: I have to do quests thats are non critical and non storyline just to earn points to get to use glidersI confess I forgot how much that rubbed me the wrong way when HoT launched, especially since I wasn't able to play for a week or so, and ended up far, far behind my cohorts.

It really hurt in HoT because of how little you could explore without gliding or mushrooms. I remember during beta I couldn't even participate in event because I didn't have them. And the Metroidvania aspect of "this zone is locked off until you go to a much later zone to get a Move McGuffin and can be allowed to come back this way" was really off-putting compared to vanilla's exploration process.

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Good thing is you can dedice on how much you want to grind - and there is enoughs stuff to grind in the game. (Which some people like. Which keeps games alive if there is still stuff to complete that takes longer keeping people playing.) On the other hand: It isn't forced since most/all major content can be done without grinding.

Mastery with it being account wide ... I haven't experience with that yet buying my first expansion in a few months or so) seems more like stuff you unlock while normally playing. Maybe a lil bit grind. But also fun.

The more hardcore grind seem the - optional - collections.

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@"Dayra.7405" said:It turns into a grindfest in the moment your mind changes from "let run a around and see what's happen" to "if I repeat this and only this, I get XYZ fastest".

The good point about gw2 is still: you are not much faster, it's just your choice, if you prefer speed over fun.

I remember very well when HoT came out: a lot of player grinded exp in Flame Zitadelle to have their Pact mastery as fast as possible. I preferred to have it later: I did map-exporation in Tyria (let some time pass in HoT maps to get most bugs fixed) with my revenant. :) and that was not really much slower.

I fully admit to grinding out Core Tyria masteries in the Citadel of Flame. That being said, I was on a Flamethrower Engineer... B)

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I think "grindfest" is an exaggeration, but I remember being similarly frustrated when I first played HoT. It was much worse on release: enemies, events and adventures gave less experience, event chains didn't give experience until the end, waypoints were contested whenever there were events happening near them, and I think each mastery line required a greater amount of experience as well.

I didn't have that problem with PoF though - I think I explored Crystal Oasis fully before I went to Desert Highlands, and in doing so got enough mastery points and experience that I comfortably had Canyon Jumping without any extra effort. If you're struggling with getting enough mastery points, I think the ones I used were Amnoon Bazaar, Old Amnoon, Pot of Soup, and Pahan, as well as the two from completing the story.

@Vayne.8563 said:When this game launched, several stories were above my level and I had to level to get high enough to actually survive in them. Not really sure how this is different. Also grind means doing the same thing over and over again. You can easily get all the masteries you need without ever repeating a single thing.

Obviously I can't speak for the OP, but for me the difference was that in the core game you have a huge number of options for maps to explore in order to level up. Typically there are several maps around your level, plus an ever increasing number of lower level maps - so you can level up mostly by exploring and doing map completion. When you first enter HoT you have one map where you can gain Heart of Maguuma experience, and you can barely explore any of it (and definitely can't complete it) because you don't have any masteries unlocked yet. Of course, you can go through to the later maps if you know where you're going - but that didn't occur to me because I thought they'd (a) be harder (at this point I hadn't cottoned on to the fact that ANet don't seem to make any attempt to implement increasing difficulty) and (b) require even more masteries to get around.

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@Jotunhammer.7029 said:

That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.
  1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get Xp for masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance or maybe some misunderstanding you have about the game, not some indication that GW2 turned 'grindy' sometime while you were gone. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

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@Obtena.7952 said:

That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.
  1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

There are MMO that does not require to do same quest over and over again, then again they been around for a long time. LotRO is one of them but buying all the expansions would be supremely costly. heh

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@Jotunhammer.7029 said:

That doesn't make sense. If you play the story and through the content, there is ALSO no grind in HoT because you earn the masteries as you play

what can I say, when I started over the game with my necromancer, I was not met with any grind, sure I had xp potions and food etc and leveled quite nicely.but other than that there was no grind to speak of.

What can you say? You can say you acknowledge that the grind for masteries isn't different than when you 'grinded' for levels, which you seem to have zero problem with. If leveling wasn't a grind for you, neither is getting masteries; it's the same approach for getting the XP; you simply play the game and you get the XP you need. IF anything, the limiting factor here isn't the 'grind' for the XP, it's getting the MP's.

Like I said ... if the 'grind' in GW2 is too much for you to handle, you got FPS games because you aren't going to find many MMO's where the level of tolerance you are showing for grinding would be acceptable to you.
  1. I never, NEVER did the same quest over and over again as levelling, not even one time. So the point of the whole thing is I do not want to get caught in hamsterwheel doing same quests over and over again into mindnumbing boredom. When I levelled it was natural, it was not doing the same thing over and over again. I maybe did the repeatable quests once per quest, ONCE, not over and over again....

I don't get your reply. If you don't want to repeat quests to get masteries, you don't have to. Again, this is just a demonstration of your lack of tolerance. You're not willing to repeat anything in an MMO more than once? Doesn't sound like it's the kind of game you should be playing.

There are MMO that does not require to do same quest over and over again, then again they been around for a long time. LotRO is one of them but buying all the expansions would be supremely costly. heh

Sounds like those would suit you better. If GW2 is too grindy for you, you have options to choose from. Certainly, if you know what you are doing, you don't need to grind missions over and over like you claim you do, so this isn't a game problem, it's a you problem. As you have been told, if you just play the game, you get your XP. Can't understand how that's a barrier for you since you managed to level to 80 but ... Good Luck figuring it out for yourself if you don't want to listen.

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