don't let siege damage siege and get rid of way point contested state

[TinkTinkPOOF.9201]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@"TinkTinkPOOF.9201" said:snipsif done right a t3 tower or keep can stop just about everything thrown at it. siege wars grinds everything to a standstill that can last a long time. why people think this is enjoyable is beyond me.

Not everything should be flippable if properly defended. With that said, I have yet to see a defended T3 keep being able to keep out a proper tag who has at least some idea of what they are doing. There is a counter to every use of siege in both defense and offense, what it comes down to of which side wins being who knows how to use siege properly in their tactics.

You want something they are holding and investing time and resources into defending, why do you think you should just be able to walk up and PvD and take it from them? When the game first came out to cap another servers garri required people in the guild to get on hours before everyone else, starve supply by flipping camps and building a golem and WPing it back to spawn, over and over. The guild would all get on, with coordinated mesmers to portal the golems to the keep while the zerg waited in spawn to not be spotted, once golems got close the zerg would head out, once there the golems would start, rams would be thrown and NO ONE would attack anything to not draw swords. And even after all of this, a single AC could melt every single golem before outer was down if they had a scout. And even if they didn't and you got into inner, it still took HOURS to cap. I remember fighting the defending guild in one of these fights, he PMed our tag and told him we should change our guild name to "the unkillables". They were getting on all their warriors (even uplevels) to banner lord over and over again.

It saddens me the game mode has become so casual and ktrain focused and anything that slows down flipping a structure needs to be "fixed".

[Sovereign.1093]

sieges been nerfed. :/ ppl just need to learn the mechanic. not all of us can fight good teams out there.

[Justine.6351]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Justine.6351 said:Because some people like to fight instead of karma train empty objectives?

cuz fighting with siege is fun for everyone... it actually makes people log off.

What server are you.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

whatever lol, if you guys wanna defend siege wars that's fine. just let the thread die its pointless to continue arguing.

[Offair.2563]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Celsith.2753 said:Siege should only hit siege imo.

so do you disagree with the statement siege killing siege creates siege wars?

Counter siege was one of my fave aspects of this mode. Hit those catas despite their bubble wars..

[sephiroth.4217]

But I like contesting Waypoints with my Warclaw ?

Its also a good way to drag players from other maps to your contested keep... tapping Bay for instance then floating around bay and garri to kill the scouts checking it out.

Sometimes the enemy zerg is on your borders... so you tap thier Garri a few times and more often than not the entire enemy zerg will stop sieging your keep to come and defend thiers only to discover its a "troll" that successfully single-handedly dismantled the enemy's offensive on ally keeps.

• Sparkles and Rainbows

[KeyOrion.9506]

Seriously this is how I taught Edge of the Mist players. You want INTO a location, you have to fight for that location, and you have to come up with new ways of breaking into that location. Enemy comes up to gate, puts down rams. I pour the oil. Same group comes back but builds catapults near the wall. I build Arrowcart to either kill or destroy them or their siege. They come back later, they build the catapults further, back. I build a Trebuchet. This is nothing more than moves and counter moves. You need to think of one step ahead. Watch the enemy. Where do they place siege. Why do they place the siege at that specific location. Does that siege have a counter to it. Where do you build that counter to have the most effect. I taught Tower Defense/Offense 101 for three years in Edge of the Mist. Many of your players currently that play in WvW, that used to play in EotM learned what I taught them. Whether they knew they were being taught or not, but they LEARNED. You know who has the record for gate breach? Blackgate does. 8 seconds. No siege, at Aldons. It was full zerg with hand weapons and that was it. Do you know who holds the record for a tier 3 tower wall breach? Tarnished Coast with 20 Omega Golems in 15 seconds at NE tower on Alpine Borderlands. Sometimes one type of siege, or even NO siege makes no difference in the end. What gets me now is the permaboons and Siege not even damaging the enemy. You have to build 10 Superior Arrowcarts and hope your damage output is enough to kill, one enemy? I'd almost say turn up the damage on certain types of siege, because it has become ineffective.

[Sovereign.1093]

i tell you, why we hate siege, before. couldnt afford it. now, players are helpful to give. :/ no excuse really not to learn.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

So in a mode all about war and strategy you want to take out a part of that strat? Siege hitting people or siege is fine imo. If a group is cataing in ruins by SWT, im building a treb in it to counter their attempt and destroy the threat to my tower. Want to build siege in the upper coliseum? Ill build a bali to remove the cat.

The intention of a bali is to heavily hit siege....thus siege hitting siege. You dont think there were never siege wars irl before?

[Stand The Wall.6987]

sigh... I think i'll post one more time to try and get my point across.

say there are 10 defenders, and 30 attackers. instead of the players fighting each other, it becomes a 5v5 siege battle. everyone else has to sit there and wait. its extremely boring.

[Sovereign.1093]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:sigh... I think i'll post one more time to try and get my point across.

say there are 10 defenders, and 30 attackers. instead of the players fighting each other, it becomes a 5v5 siege battle. everyone else has to sit there and wait. its boring af.

the 30 should have some shield gens, and break thru. =)

also that 30 shouldnt be paper. leave the paper for the kill squad.

[aspirine.6852]

Hmm how about no. Siege like AC should do more damage to siege than to players. You only have a very small window to damage siege these days. And sieging players is no fun.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Sitting in a keep with 10 ACs and catas watching the enemy stop caring and leave isnt fun. Sitting on rams or catas holding 1 key down while your FB and scrappers spam heals isnt fun. Sitting on a treb shooting a wall you cant even see isnt fun. Yes siege is necessary for the gamemode but siege vs zerg fights are incredibly dull and inactive gameplay.

[Rednik.3809]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:sigh... I think i'll post one more time to try and get my point across.

say there are 10 defenders, and 30 attackers. instead of the players fighting each other, it becomes a 5v5 siege battle. everyone else has to sit there and wait. its extremely boring.

Hm, I wonder why these 10 defenders don't want to go out and fight face to face against 30 attackers. Probably there is a reason behind their attitude?

[Caedmon.6798]

I think your siege placement might be a bit off. Everyting can be sieged without balis hitting you. Then you have shieldgens that can carry against mortar/treb and the bubble from cata's aswell. You want the walls removed and a flag planted to capture instead ? If you roam and this your issue,youre doing it wrong. If you raid or blob and this is your issue,youre doing it wrong.