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[Merged] Feedback about today's Icebrood Saga announcement


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@AlexxxDelta.1806 said:Full transparency and business don't go well together.

While this is true, at least be transparent about the stuff that has already been developed and just waits to be released, especially if it is stuff you are talking about/presenting in public. Only politicians have the right reserved to beat around the bush about existing facts. ;)

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@Iozeph.5617 said:

@MetalGirl.2370 said:It's not players fault at all.They announced it month prior. Even adding ominous sounds and stuff to the game to hype it, had 2 day long count down.... for what? Merch ads ?They led people on... it's not players fault at all. Altho I learnt my lesson and wasn't excited for it at all, I wish others were smarter.

Apple does this literally every year. I am not sure what your point is? Most game series do this. Borderlands 3 is being super hyped up by the community for it. Well knowing it will just be a shooter with comedy thrown in.

Bad example because Borderlands 3 is going to be a complete game that will offer a co-op experience and probably deliver on good action and story without nickling and diming you at every turn with worthless cash shop items.

GW2 is buy to play never asks for money unless you want to spend it.

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@attachi.1792 said:Did you noticed A-net increased their gem-store production last mounths? Brand new stuff every week + sales for some of the old goods. Gold price for 400 gems rised to the 170+ gold and won't drop. Looks like another way to get more money plus sink ingame gold from the player's pockets.Reminds me SWTOR and their Cartel market focus with short chapter content scheme.

Summer sales are a thing... it's a notable slow down for most businesses, mine included because ya know we all like a break every now and then... so to try and offset the potential downturn in revenue, we get to have sales and new bits of fluff to tempt us.... nothing out of the ordinary I'm afraid.Remember without gem sales and gemstore revenue would likely have a negative impact on getting even things like LS for free.Of course on the flipside no one is holding a gun to your head to buy anything you don't want to... you hold the power in your own wallet.

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@Mass Pandemic.3517 said:

@"DzT.8127" said:If i was the owner of ANET i would have seriously fired most of the people. This announcement was a joke really. Hey we announcing a LW5 that we allready announced weeks ago.

More like since March. I really do not understand Anet. Do they really think people care that much about the story? If I rate content in GW2 in terms of quality:

Open world PvE + great combat systemPvPInstanced PvEStory

Story is the GW2 weakest content.

Open world is some what tied to story, but story does not carry it. And open world quality too a nose dive with PoF. LWS4 had some improvement, but it is far from what it used to be.

I think you underestimate how many people play this game solely for the story , i'm not one of these people, but a lot of people are heavily invested into guild wars lore/story. Arenanet has all kinds of data on how people play, if it wasn't that popular or desired they wouldn't be focusing on it as much and if pvp was most of the community's focus like any good business they would do what they would believe would net the most income for them. Why do you think the game is very casual friendly in a lot of it's design?

Oh I agree... LS is there go to moneypit for sure and to me that is fine, I enjoy it quite alot and consider the story writing to be top notch and made all the more richer by the quality music, VA and art.But GW2 needs more than LS. Gemstore and grindfest mechanics will only last for so long before even the most diehard of players grow tired of it all and imo I Think we may be reached, if not over reached that point already.Servers have lost their identity, competitive gameplay feels like it is on life spport and the whole ebb and flow of the game has been reduced to trickle of it's former greatness. Aside from a few hours of new predominantly single player content every 3 or 4 months the biggest features of release are new skins in the gemstore.The game needed this announcement to push new or at least reignite old passions for investing in GW2... for me it failed to either.Sure the new LS sounds intriguing and fun, I expect nothing less but the game as a whole needed this to offer more, much more imo but it didn't so it is no sprise to that many players are asking... what was the point of yesterday, what was there that they couldn't of done on a live stream back at HQ considering it was mostly old news with a small piece of new talking points that clearly aren't even close to being in a state of readiness to talk about in any detail. Heck if strike forces are the next big thing to co.e out of their flagship content then it absolutely should of been given much more air time than it got and it should of been at a point there was actually somethi g to show and talk about, but it wasn't imo.

Trust me i agree , i wast expecting an expansion announcement, but at least if one was coming at some point or if they were stopping them for whatever reason. I hate to be overly dramatic , but it seems to be gw2 is on it's last legs so to speak. Which is very sad , because it's possible for games to be very successful for much longer (WOW is a perfect example of this). I want to wait to pass full judgement until the ice brood saga at least gets a full episode, but i can't say i'm very excited for the future because they haven't given me a reason to be. The announcement unfortunately was exactly what i was thinking was going to happen, but was hoping they had something more surprising and substantial. For the people who are generally excited about this whole thing, i'm very happy for them , i wish i could be as happy as well, it just doesn't seem to me at least that the game is in a healthy place and the announcement just seemed like a desperate attempt to make us believe otherwise. I am curious though, if we get just a prologue on the 17th how much longer do we have to wait for the offical episode , because i heard them say in the coming "months" which depending on the size of the prologue could be one of the worse droughts gw2 has had in a long time.

Well I wasn't expecting any announcement of an expansion as I think that preverberal pact ship has already sailed into the four winds. I was however hoping to hear about some of this expansion type content we can expect to see within the LS seasons.... errrmm saga.Sadly that didn't materialise and as much as I really enjoy LS it is nothing more than a few hours of solo content followed by lengthy repetitive grindfests and more currencies we can shake a stick at.I too am beginning to feel there is a distinct lack of any long term plan beyond this next season and it's now all about pushing as much microtransaction stuff out to the players as possible and the live event did nothing more than to reinforce that tbh imo.As for SWTOR I still have a fondness for the game and will definitely keep heading back to it to get my glow stick teddy bear bashing fix. I think they have one of the best player housing systems, cartel points can be earned and rewarded to us... heck I still get monthly coins without logging in just for having my authenticator linked.Crafting in SWTOR is easy and in no way forced on you as is buying things like decorations from either the player galactic market or for reasonable price of cartel coin microtransactions... or run the content and get them as rewards.The story isn't bad either, not as good as GW2 imo but still pretty good and Bioware are not afraid to actually put things like roadmaps and discussion out there. The one thing that does make me snigger is the gear grind every update or three but that does give us something to aim for rather than impossible odds RNG systems for infusions and fashion wars.Meeeh just my take on things I guess and after 3hrs of jet washing I'm maybe feeling tired and nigly:)

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I saw it somewhere, and I'll repeat it.This is the biggest example of "I'm not mad, just disappointed" that I felt. I think most of the community did. Before I voice my opinion on it, I'll say how I felt about it before the actual thing happened and explain why... If that makes sense.When the announcement was made, I was doubtful but even then, as a fan of the game, even I couldn't contain that tiny part of me being excited. Then the circus started. I call it that now because the way it was concluded makes me think of a bad joke.We got mysterious massages, countdown with revealing pictures, we got new ingame ominous stuff. It all was amazing, next to the announcement? Holy crap! Something amazing must be coming right?Now after all this, what was I thinking? Well, you see... I'm a bit starved with "toys" to play. We all want new stuff to play with. I mean new specs or new something. Meaning I thought they would mention something of that sort. Even a tease. I understood it was a living world announcement, but how big it all was? With the ingame content, the hype on the site and the counter AND the guild chat hype on the anniversary stream? Then the fact they made it a real-life event! Holy moly something had to be upright?So what did I get?Recap of past stuff and rehash of old information. I know it's silly to quote people like that, but as WP said, I hoped for at least a tease a promise that they are working on something ANYTHING in regards to that. Sadly, that's not the case. We literally got the same info with a tiny bit of new things here and there.Anet fell into its own hype trap. This could've been part of the anniversary guild chat. This could be an AMA on Reddit or whatever. This could be anything else but this.Am I unhappy that we'll get a new world SAGA or whatever? Of course not. It's always nice to move the story forward. But am I disappointed that I got baited into false hope? Yes. I am both disappointed by being baited into it and on the event and reveal itself.Like I stated before, I was doubtful but the amount of hype anet put out made me rekindle that flame of hope inside me, that maybe it'll be worth it. Only to assure me that it was a mistake and any future thing I will care even less from now on. I don't think anet wants to make more cynical players as it is, but sadly? I can't feel like anything but cynical towards all this.I'm also sad that the hard work that people put into this content release will be diminished by the flawed marketing decision that this announcement was. There's just so much small things piling up about this that make it such a pathetic thing to experience. For us, the players. For devs and for everyone else involved. Players got disappointed, devs work will not be fully appreciated by the community and speaking of community, another big ripple appeared that tore it's into two halves. People who will defend this and people who will attack this event.Even if you think this event, on its basic level, was not that bad, you have to understand how much "meta" dmg it did to the game, to anet, and to the community.The question is simple. Was it worth it? Personally I think not.

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@zealex.9410 said:

@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:People are expecting too much especially considering the shafting of things is pretty recent (especially since it hasn't even been a year since that shafting).

I cannot deny that perhaps in comparison to what they could have done previously, this felt a tad bit too small, but I can't deny the fact that, from a development standpoint, there's only so much they can do with the resource they have available to them.

I'm surprised they even got anything out at this stage.

I was expecting to watch an event about gw2, the future and its content, not about merch. What should ppl that flew or drove to watch that should feel when you sell them merch?

I mean given the amount of red lights on what's going on with GW2 right now, you'd think people would be aware of what's happening with GW2 and ANet as of current.

Honestly, I didn't even watch the livestream of the event because this was exactly what I expected from them. Either way, people expected way too much from a dev team that got a huge shafting very recently.

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So I've slept on it and got some of my disappointment out yesterday and I feel much better about everything today. Not perfect, but better and with a clearer head. It's important to look at each aspect of the announcement individually, because there really were some good things in there. However, certain things didn't reach as far or as deeply to enough players. In no particular order:

The Good:

  1. The announcement from July 27th clearly indicated it was about story, and they released mostly story [read: PvE] updates and features and that was what were delivered.1a. The trailer and discussion about the new story direction and locations w/devs afterwards were positive, no other way to see that. They discussed the format, themes, places, obstacles, tone etc. that we were going to see in the next chapter and is great.
  2. New maps. Relatively self-explanatory, this is good. Hopefully there is more involved in them, they did some dangerously plain, but still, new maps are new.
  3. New world boss. A much more significant addition that people really would be happy about across the board. Truly, it's a big deal, we haven't had one since launch. Remakes not included.
  4. Strike teams. Also massively positive, queueable, raid training that allows for people to meet others who are curious about doing the more difficult content but have difficulties meeting people. Yes. Good for the endgame community. Good for the game as a whole.
  5. The note at the very beginning from Mike Z about appreciating the players support during their company strife, it's a big deal and difficult from which to recover. The only caveat here is that I wish they would be more communicative as a result and I'm not sure why this isn't explored to greater capacity.
  6. The alterations to existing expansions. While many people considered this to be negative, I urge a reassessment of what it means. More people spreading through more of the game with access to more of its features are necessarily a good thing. I understand there's a perception that the money spent buying the game was somehow "lost" but players who already owned the expansion had the benefit of having played it for longer. Additionally, the veterans package is at the very least a gesture of good faith and should not be lost on people. Future players who pick up the game will be able to do much more and that can only be a good thing. Is it enough? That's for the player to decide.

Generally, the things that the announcement was built to expound upon were touched on, so yes, well done.

The Bad

  1. In my humble opinion, the single biggest problem is the perceived/real disparity between the hype/format of the announcement and the quantity of items discussed in the announcement as it related to previous live events. Previous announcements of this pomp and circumstance have been expansions, and the community simply went by precedent instead of by reading the post from July 27th word for word. However, I count myself as one of those who did read the announcement and wanted more because I thought ArenaNet would have some surprises in store. More on that later.1a. People have said this before, so being succinct: it could have been done/received better if the content came as a blogpost.1b. Relating to that, when the full exploratory video for path of fire was released it was around 20 minutes long and was nonstop features, limited commentary was presented and it was mostly a [good] checklist of incredible things to look forward to. HoT trailer is the same deal.
  2. GW2 communities are very passionate about their preferred game modes. As someone who plays all three (PvE, WvW, and PvP), I can tell you that people in each category somehow feel neglected. It's amazing how that's the perceived truth since PvE generally received the most tangible quantity and quality updating from each of the episodes at a regular pace. Other game modes don't have such a cadence, and even raids are in the air, and they're firmly in the PvE firmament. [Edit: somehow I didn't finish this sentence]
  3. The elephant in the room was the "captive audience informercial" that took place at the end of the event as if it was another piece of information pertaining to game content. Instead it was an ambush advertisement for merchandise. Many of us want to support you ArenaNet, however, very few of us wish to do so via merchandise. Speaking for myself, I would buy the 20th anniversary art book, but that's all. This surprise advertisement took considerable time and was the equivalent to "please buy this, thank you" [Read: the Diablo: Immortal fiasco], and was the thing that disappointed me the most without question.

Generally, it's like stepping in every pothole in a road, and one of them was suspiciously on purpose.

At the end of the day, people were hoping for an expansion announcement in addition to the information that was presented. And, they thought they would get it because of the format/hype surrounding the announcement. That did not happen, the people who were hyped, internally or externally, were let down, and even the substantial, tangible, legitimately good things about the announcement were lost in the subsequent backlash. A good portion of which, I think is unfair considering the reality that ArenaNet has experience with their layoffs. I urge for more understand and compassion, but I am also let down somehow. It's possible to be both, so lets try to be both together. We can only move forward if we're all on the same team here.

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@"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:I was relieved when I saw what it was about.Was already stressing out thinking "I must get the new flying mount, cooking to 500 and perhaps even a new motherboard and processor to get prepared for the awesomeness that is arriving".So turns out its just the same: login for 2 hours, log off and shelve the game for some months.

No new elite specs is a death sentence to pvp and wvw, I don't believe people will play for two more years the same builds, pressing the same skills over and over.

tinfoil hat on - I don't think they're naive enough to hype an announcement to stratospheric levels just to let everyone down, perhaps they're actually trying to kill gw2 for good.

Amen Bruddah.

As for my take, to quote a wise kid:

I expect nothing and am still disappointed.

Put simply ANet - you overhyped and delivered only disappointment. You literally made fun of your competitive players, and spent more time showing off out of game trinkets than in game content.

The manifesto is dead. You have lost your way and become a pale wanna-be copy of EA.

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I am looking forward to gradually evolving map content and accessibility again. I really much liked that with Dry Top and the Silverwastes."Strike Missions" sound like a mix of Shatterer/Triple Trouble Wurm + PoF Bounty mechanics as the new "map meta"?Not hearing anything about WvW alliances was a bit disappointing, but I did not really expect it anyway.

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I'm really disappointed. I've played the game since beta for dungeons, fotm, raids, wvwvw, and spvp. I didn't hear anything about new content in those modes.I play living story but story is not why I play MMOs. It's not repeatable and not challenging content for groups to clear. I quit my raid static after hearing the news and will stop playing GW2 unless/until I start seeing more challenging content that I enjoy.

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@"CherryWolf.2768" said:I'm also sad that the hard work that people put into this content release will be diminished by the flawed marketing decision that this announcement was.

This is a wonderful summary of why people are miffed. It's not the content that is being criticized by most but the lack of an in-depth presentation thereof. (And yes, the unanswered questions, I agree, but that would really have been the cherry on top of the episode preview.)

I don't get the whole "doom & gloom" attitude over yesterday's fiasco, though. Some reactions are totally out of line. Frustration is okay (and probably justified), but threatening to quit over this really is a bit of a harsh reaction, and saying that the devs don't care is far-fetched. Who knows whose decision it was to keep the whole thing as brief as possible. I doubt that the people who put their hard work into it made that decision.

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Season 1, Season 2, Season 3, Season 4, season 5 is not season 5 but we call them sagas now which is a way of not transparently saying sagas will replace the word expansion and if they are successfull will become payable DLC sagas.I'm only interested in one thing from now on since we can't get a straight answer from Anet it's free content, I only want the story. No money no support no dailies no nothing. :/

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@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:

@ChronoPinoyX.7923 said:People are expecting too much especially considering the shafting of things is pretty recent (especially since it hasn't even been a year since that shafting).

I cannot deny that perhaps in comparison to what they could have done previously, this felt a tad bit too small, but I can't deny the fact that, from a development standpoint, there's only so much they can do with the resource they have available to them.

I'm surprised they even got anything out at this stage.

I was expecting to watch an event about gw2, the future and its content, not about merch. What should ppl that flew or drove to watch that should feel when you sell them merch?

I mean given the amount of red lights on what's going on with GW2 right now, you'd think people would be aware of what's happening with GW2 and ANet as of current.

Honestly, I didn't even watch the livestream of the event because this was exactly what I expected from them. Either way, people expected way too much from a dev team that got a huge shafting very recently.

I think a lot of us were expecting them to hint at proposed solutions to the problems people voice. Especially when they stated they had a renewed focus on the game.

I wasn't upset that they didn't reveal a bunch of new instanced party content but I am upset that they didn't mention it at all.

They didn't have to showcase half a dozen new dungeons, but simply saying "we're bringing back dungeons with new locations and revamps to existing ones" would have blown people away. Even just saying "we have X amount of new fractals and new rewards in the works" would have been enough.

I have a feeling the general idea was we thought getting more LW instead of another expansion meant we'd be instead getting a more diffused improvement of the game but all we know for sure is we're getting fake raids and more LW content.

If you were someone who struggled to log in during season 4, that presentation was a giant sign that read "Maybe come back in 10 to 12 months".

And that goes for pvp/wvw people as much as the pve folks.

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@attachi.1792 said:Did you noticed A-net increased their gem-store production last mounths? Brand new stuff every week + sales for some of the old goods. Gold price for 400 gems rised to the 170+ gold and won't drop. Looks like another way to get more money plus sink ingame gold from the player's pockets.Reminds me SWTOR and their Cartel market focus with short chapter content scheme.

No one forces you to buy gems.

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@attachi.1792 said:Did you noticed A-net increased their gem-store production last mounths? Brand new stuff every week + sales for some of the old goods. Gold price for 400 gems rised to the 170+ gold and won't drop. Looks like another way to get more money plus sink ingame gold from the player's pockets.Reminds me SWTOR and their Cartel market focus with short chapter content scheme.

EditAlready answered before please delete.

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@Hybarf Tics.2048 said:I'm only interested in one thing from now on since we can't get a straight answer from Anet it's free content

It was made clear during the live preview that LWS5 will be free to play just like previous LW seasons, regardless of what it is called now.

@attachi.1792 said:Did you noticed A-net increased their gem-store production last mounths?

Yes, it's called Anniversary Sales. ;)

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Some of the people in Anet (cough) seem to think we are after them.

We are NOT after you. It's NOT you that we are upset at.

We're upset at the bad advertisement choices used yesterday, the deceptive marketing and the lack of a clear roadmap for the future.

We are scared that the game we love is slowly fizzling out, we don't know what we have to be excited for, to show us that this game is still going strong.

I've only been here since last Halloween, but I've spent several hundred dollars on living world episodes, and the gemstore - because I love the game and want to support it. But now I'm too nervous, I'm afraid there's something going on that we don't know about. So I will be holding my money until we get some clarity. I don't want to spend money if this game is going to be gone next year.

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@Dragon Priestess.9760 said:Some of the people in Anet (cough) seem to think we are after them.

We are NOT after you. It's NOT you that we are upset at.

We're upset at the bad advertisement choices used yesterday, the deceptive marketing and the lack of a clear roadmap for the future.

We are scared that the game we love is slowly fizzling out, we don't know what we have to be excited for, to show us that this game is still going strong.

I've only been here since last Halloween, but I've spent several hundred dollars on living world episodes, and the gemstore - because I love the game and want to support it. But now I'm too nervous, I'm afraid there's something going on that we don't know about. So I will be holding my money until we get some clarity. I don't want to spend money if this game is going to be gone next year.

Considering se5 is supposed to have expac like stuff and this being a lw centric event i was expecting at least a tease of such stuff like elite specs. I was also looking for any talk on cadence which was by far the biggest weakness of se4. We got none, while everything non lw seems to be in the bacj burner and the concept of another expansion is all but dropped at this point.

At least thats what it feel like.

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We saw that nothing changed before and after the lay off, the output and productivity of the studio is still shameful. What so many feared is happening : nothing interesting is being worked on and we will just have a tiny bit of a mediocre story each 4 months, as usual. It's just in these forums, the last white citadel, that some claim they are happy with arenanet's work. Every other medium is full of players uninstalling. Let me mention the lie about www restructuring, wich began in 2015 and arenanet said they were already working on it since 1 year. To 2014->2019, nothing. I don't thanks anet for their always lazy work, and it's mind blowing that losing 1/3 of your colleagues doesn't even act as a reality check.

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I think I got the aim of Season 5. It's too cover several different environments/maps and explore their lores regarding differents races. Obviously the path is all the north of the world map from right to left: Charrs homelands, Shiverpeaks with kodans and norns to end to Woodlands cascades with centaurs.The trailer show that during each transition, at the start we have the shiverpeaks and a burning charr/ascalonian city then Kodans and a giant lake still shiverpeaks.After that centaurs to end with lion's guard ships sinking (I suppose here, it's the Sea at the south of Janthir Isles)

Here is the road for me: Charr homelands -> Far Shiverpeaks -> Woodlands cascade -> Bay of Janthir(No asura, but maybe they keep them for the end, no much areas left: Maguuma wastes, Scavenger's causeway.....)

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@Ashantara.8731 said:

@"CherryWolf.2768" said:I'm also sad that the hard work that people put into this content release will be diminished by the flawed marketing decision that this announcement was.

This
is a wonderful summary of why people are miffed. It's not the content that is being criticized by most but the lack of an in-depth presentation thereof. (And yes, the unanswered questions, I agree, but that would really have been the cherry on top of the episode preview.)

I don't get the whole "doom & gloom" attitude over yesterday's fiasco, though. Some reactions are totally out of line. Frustration is okay (and probably justified), but threatening to quit over this really is a bit of a harsh reaction, and saying that the devs don't care is far-fetched. Who knows whose decision it was to keep the whole thing as brief as possible. I doubt that the people who put their hard work into it made that decision.

That's just it.. the disappointment derives from the fact there wasn't anything to talk around because there was nothing obviously anywhere near ready to discuss with the community.Keeping tight lipped and having us on tender hooks is one thing, but blatantly putting out the notion there was some big announcement with a double than normal promo to anything they have done previous in a live theatre people had to get to just to be bombarded with a merchandising fiasco for over half the time.. nah I can defo understand there is some genuine angst amongst the players.The announcement was about LW.. that much we knew before hand, we also knew that was the focus and that it would be coming (soon) months ago and yes most of us likely guessed where it was heading after the logo change a month back, but then the 48hr timer followed by.. well not much, a few sound bytes about stuff we already knew and some titbits about the direction of the story. Everything else is just glossed over in seconds, with perhaps the exception of a little bit about Strike missions but that was so vague leading me to think they don't even really know how they are going to work, how they are going to fit in and whether we the players want it, making it sound more and more like a twist on bounties.There just wasn't anything solid to get our claws in, what is this expansion type content we can expect, heck we are only going to be getting a short prologue with no idea when we can expect even Part 1.Nah it looked pretty cheap, pretty scrambled together last minute content bytes and a whole lot of merchandising moneymaker stuff.We each can take away our own thoughts and opinions on the event for sure, but I am of the mind there is one heck of a lot of the community left wondering what just went down. It is said there is no such thing as bad publicity, but I am not so sure now if I am honest.

At least the LS itself looks and sounds intriguing, I just hope this wasn't a pre-cursor into switching LS into a payable DLC to replace expacs in the not to distant future as to me there was an early impetus into highlighting all we got previous from LS for free, but no tangible detail for the future of the LS or the game.

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I really think they should have put the "questions and answers" instead of the merchandise showcase, every day when we log-in we have those tabs with the merchandises to need to put it in a theater... just a blog post. Plus the trailer was diffused two times, at the start and the end, so more minutes lost. It would have been really interesting to answers the questions showing you care about the community. Also some cringe moments with all the cosplays and interventions between cinematics.The lake creature shown doesn't even look like drakkar if it was it. I know they can't spoil the whole thing, but each time they are a Q&A it's answered with vague responses. I want to continue playing, but know nothing about the future.

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