Are Raids Gone for Good? Will Strikes Replace Raids?

[sephiroth.4217]

@Cameron.6450 said:

@"sephiroth.4217" said:if its required by the community to give up time for special training instead of learning on the fly, I'd rather miss out. Sometimes the fun for me involves failure and learning so I can earn myself a sense of accomplishment.

That aspect of failure and learning as you go is what training raids essentially are though, just with a couple of players who know what they're doing to help people figure out mechanics. The term "training" is just what has fallen into common usage, for lack of a better term. Really what they are are just raid squads where the kill is not expected within a few pulls. An experienced group would expect to only take a few pulls max to get a kill, which means you don't get many chances to see different mechanics before the boss dies and the group moves on. Joining a group with 9 highly experienced players just means that you'll most likely get the kill lying on your back for most of the run, which is not what you say you're looking for.

ok so "training" is basically just winging it and Learning on the go with a guide?

I don't mind lying on my back, its apart of learning.

right... Thanks ☺

[Cameron.6450]

@"sephiroth.4217" said:ok so "training" is basically just winging it and Learning on the go with a guide?

I don't mind lying on my back, its apart of learning.

right... Thanks ☺

Well what I meant was that you don't learn much if you lie on your back but the kill happens anyway. That's what I meant by that. Like if you die, then the rest of the squad still kills the boss, you don't actually get to try that same mechanic again. It's off to the next boss, and a completely new set, which makes it a bad way to learn.

Dying as a part of learning is of course going to happen though, just need to make sure it's in a situation where you can get back up afterwards and try to not die the same way next pull.

[The one to Rule.2593]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@Cameron.6450 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:if its required by the community to give up time for special training instead of learning on the fly, I'd rather miss out. Sometimes the fun for me involves failure and learning so I can earn myself a sense of accomplishment.

That aspect of failure and learning as you go is what training raids essentially are though, just with a couple of players who know what they're doing to help people figure out mechanics. The term "training" is just what has fallen into common usage, for lack of a better term. Really what they are are just raid squads where the kill is not expected within a few pulls. An experienced group would expect to only take a few pulls max to get a kill, which means you don't get many chances to see different mechanics before the boss dies and the group moves on. Joining a group with 9 highly experienced players just means that you'll most likely get the kill lying on your back for most of the run, which is not what you say you're looking for.

ok so "training" is basically just winging it and Learning on the go with a guide?

I don't mind lying on my back, its apart of learning.

right... Thanks ☺

the problem is, raiding requires a different mentality. I get that you don't want to have to set aside time to find 9 others to go with. I get that people want to skip the failures and go straight to successful runs.

The fact is as raiders we all had to put in our time and we all had to sit through hours and hours of wipes to get to the point where we were competent enough. For us that is the enjoyment we get out of the game. Improving ourselves and being better each and every time. I understand that there are those who don't care about such things or are motivated by rewards, but that's not the right mentality for raiding.

the rewards are just the icing on the cake for us. The true reward is seeing ourselves and our friends grow as players.

If that isn't something you enjoy, raids just weren't meant for you.

[kratan.4619]

@Anhellbro.7210 said:

@Zacchary.6183 said:If they could get rid of the toxicity in Raids, more people would play raids. Same thing with PvP.

you play badly> you do not learn> other dislike this > others are toxic and you are prince?

This is exactly what he is talking about. Thank you for this example of elitism.

[Ayakaru.6583]

@Zacchary.6183 said:If they could get rid of the toxicity in Raids, more people would play raids. Same thing with PvP.

cause and effect:player A plays bad > player B tells you how to play better > player A doesn't listen and keep playing bad > player B kicks player A > OMG so toxic

[Katary.7096]

@"kratan.4619" said:This is exactly what he is talking about. Thank you for this example of elitism.Where do people get that definition of elitism from?

"The belief that a society or system should be led by an elite."Source: https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/elitism"The belief that certain persons or members of certain groups deserve favored treatment by virtue of their superiority, as in intelligence, social standing, or wealth."Source: https://www.thefreedictionary.com/elitism

Option 1 makes no sense at all and option 2 could relate if we interpret superiority as "being better at playing gw2 raids" and the favored treatment would have to be "being invited into experienced raid groups". But with that much leeway we might as well say that calling Michelle the mechanic instead of Larry the librarian to repair a damaged car is an example of elitism.

[Teratus.2859]

Strikes are supposed to help get more people into raids so no I don't think they will replace raids.

If however they fail to do this but end up being successful as stand alone content then there might be a possibility though.I hope that won't be the case but i'd understand if it were, can't exactly justify the time and effort spend developing raid content when almost nobody actually plays it.

[Wakani.1829]

@Pirindolo.9427 said:

@Anhellbro.7210 said:

@Zacchary.6183 said:If they could get rid of the toxicity in Raids, more people would play raids. Same thing with PvP.

you play badly> you do not learn> other dislike this > others are toxic and you are prince?

And here we have another example of a toxic post.

Pointing that out isn't toxic.

Fact is everyone who would want to do the content, would like to do it smoothly, and if someone you invite along through LFG, keeps dieing, fucking up mechanics ectect, and simply does-not-get-better. then there's nothing wrong with the group kicking that person and finding someone more suitable.

Everyone learns at their own speed, thats alright, thats acceptable, always was, always will be. But by the same standard, you can't, and shoulden't be judging people for not wanting to spend their entire gametime, babysitting someone who needs a very, very long time to learn. It's upto that one person, to then put in the extra work, perhaps by researching the fights, and looking up guides, like everyone else who has issues with it, would do.

When i returned recently to the game, i had zero experience in raids other than wing 1, and i had only one character decced in ascended gear that could even do something, a condi engi. I was honest with the people leading groups that i applied to, and said outright before applying I only have 35 Li's, and i have 0 KP, i haven't raided since sabetha was brand new, id apretiate a shot, but i dont blame you if you'd rather find someone else , half the groups i applied to took me in, the other half didnt.

i don't blame the ones that didnt, because it is afterall THEIR gametime to do with, however they please, and if they'd rather do all 7 wings in one go, rather than babysit someone whos never gone past Wing 1, then all power to them.

The fact that you would call someone toxic for pointing that out, shows how much of a snowflake you are, and your type of people, are litterally the reason why the gaming industry as a whole is in the shitter. because of overly-sensitive SJW PC people like you.

Now stating that, is toxic - That i know but its also the truth, deal with it.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

Strike missions is probably bounties 2.0, which will be organized and with unique mechanics. Less number and higher quality.

[ButcherofMalakir.4067]

@kratan.4619 said:

@Anhellbro.7210 said:

@Zacchary.6183 said:If they could get rid of the toxicity in Raids, more people would play raids. Same thing with PvP.

you play badly> you do not learn> other dislike this > others are toxic and you are prince?

This is exactly what he is talking about. Thank you for this example of elitism.

Yiu are saying that players shouldnt be mad about diferent demands others have yet you are mad about diferent demands others have.

9 players want smooth run.1 player want to get carried9>19 players one.

[Nephalem.8921]

@mtpelion.4562 said:I looked at the achievement unlock rate on GW2Efficiency to see what percent of the users got achievements from the Raids. While the absolute easiest paths possible all hit 20%, the majority of the paths and raids had completion rates below 20% (with heavy weighting in the sub 8% rate).

Cancelling Raids would not lose 20% of the playerbase.

Only 33% did the latest story and how many did it only for the skyscale? Cancelling that doesn't seem bad either with your logic. Well i'm all for giving story maps you do only once less ressources though.

[Excursion.9752]

It will be a swing and a miss on raid training. Nothing will change the current problems. People who want to raid actually want the training for the raid that they are trying complete. Not some half attempt at a world/raid boss.

[Trise.2865]

Yes. Raids are dead now because nobody ever plays them. Blame Teapot.

/sarcasm

[Wizler.8192]

@Strider Pj.2193 said:...I figured ‘strikes’ would be away for people to start to be introduced to Raids. Kind of as a tutorial.

Exactly. It's like LFR (looking for raid) in WoW which is raid-light.

[Stephane Lo Presti.7258]

This discussion has devolved into a debate on toxicity and how it relates to the Raids community. Before I close it, I wanted to make clear to everyone that the Guild Wars 2 forums have rules and we enforce them to ensure that discussion can be respectful and productive. We don't stop players from discussing most topics but what we do is ask everyone to chose their words carefully, whatever your opinion. Be respectful of the players you're talking to or about. Thank you for your understanding!