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For the Love of God, Delete Mesmer Mantras!


shadowpass.4236

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:Cant tell if serious or just trolling

You talk about why learn to play when learning to play is just what you need to learn how to deal with them.

Fight a good mantra mesmer and tell me how you fight against a build that can 100-0 you from stealth without any animations to dodge. kitten the forums are incredible.

I have and adapted to overcome. I made friends with one and we dueled a lot. Learned a lot as well. Even main one in WvW because of it (not even meta 1 shot either)

If you truly want to learn to deal with them, there are ways. Its easier to QQ on the forums however and demand nerfs.

That said, what else ya got?

Fight a
good
mantra mesmer. By good, I mean one in the top 10 consistently.

I've known dozens and dozens of mantra mesmers since release but there are only two that I'd consider good. Mur and CJ.

Oh, and before you say there are good mantra mesmers in WvW. I won't disagree with you. However, there's a difference between people who roam and the people who specifically spam practice 1v1s and 1vX matchups over thousands of hours. WvW fights aren't rating locked and are a lot more sporadic than sPvP. So, you'll get better, quicker, in sPvP as a result.

So, when I say Mur and CJ are
good
at mantra mesmer, I mean it's very, very difficult to kill them because they kite well using the tools provided to the class COMBINED with the fact that they can very reliably (and unpredictably) land their entire burst on you which will insta kill you if they catch you with it.

While I dont doubt there are or are not others as good as those 2 you mentioned (whom I havent personally encountered), however the way you constantly emphasize "good" could apply to any class/build as any "good" players would be annoying or impossible to beat, thus stressing the "good" multiple times with mantra specifically loses a bit of weight.

Ive faced "good" holo's that are impossible to beat due to certain mechanics, "good" condi mirages, "good" weavers....etc. Who you consider good and other considered "good" is subjective as well so please watch for that as it could easily turn against you in a debate/criticism.

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

When I said you can cover the mantra charge with Mirage Cloak I didn't mean spamming your kitten dodges like a bot. See, what an intelligent player would do is dodge if they see a skill that can cc them during the animation. This is the second time I've had to clarify this on the thread and I'm not going to do it a third time.

And it got already mentioned to you, that it is not only cc it can be simple autoattackspam that makes the Mesmer unable to finish the cast and cancel it duo to pressure. Also you assuming that a glass canon Mesmer always has a dodges rdy to cover the cast, as if he doesn't need to dodge at any other time. Whatever the Mesmer has to invest at least one dodge or 30+secs cd skill to cover the charge and has no impact on the fight during that. And if nothing is rdy the Mesmer has to wait out for cds to cover it or to disengage and runs around with uncharged Mantra longer than the base cd. These all are high costs. But you deny that ,what is a biased, not based on facts opinion and you will not change it no matter what ppl tell you. So keep with it and get oneshot by 2 out of how many active Mesmers playing in NA? From my experience as someone played against Mesmers i had no problem to use the recharge to my advantage, even easier in conquest when more than one player can attack him. If you don't focus a Powermes and let him snack your team 1 by 1 and disengage without following him to death it is a problem of wrong target priority. But i also know at least 10 counters to Mantra of Distraction during you feel the need to complain about it. Lifes in this game can be so different based on game knowledge...

As said i am with you in regard to Mantra of Pain, stealthspam/stacking and Chaosline. Everything else is a l2p issue in my opinion, even though i am not a fan of oneshotbuilds and think that it is the only way for lower skilled ppl to play a Powerburstmes when they have no ability/skill to outplay ppl in a more reactive fight without being carried by passive sustain. Still as you say, only 2 Mesmers in whole NA during the life time of GW2 can play it in a way, that they are able to make it fast enough that you personally cannot react to it. What an insane high rate /s (and isn't at least Mur not accused several times of using macros by other higher skilled players knowing what they talk about? Means not the usual accuse of low skilled ppl have no clue what you can do with good keybinds and fast clickrate and reactiontime. I think i remember talks like that on more than one NA stream, among them Shorts and Zeromis)From your posts i would not think you are over average skilled (don't argue with the joke of lb rating pls), means no NA Mesmer can land a burst out of 3 secs stealth or without stealth fast enough to hit a rly good player aware of a Burstmes being around. NA must be heaven for everyone knows how to play vs Powermesmers...

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

@"Shao.7236" said:Honestly if you have slow reactions and no awareness at all, sure it's OP.

But when you know there's a one shot mesmer that exists, they are useless and can only chip you at best.

If you get ganked to mes burst in 1v1, it's part of the game and on you to be self aware their unability to do anything but gank.

I can't seem to find any mesmers that one shot nowadays and when I do they are always disengaging or downstate because of how they have to hug you with Mirror Blade and self shatter to do any decent damage.

Personally on any professions you should have a tool that prevents you from being gibbed so easily and that doesn't count the fact you can still evade.

If a mesmer goes for the actual kill, they will use all stealth, port to you, prepare mantra of pain then mirror blade mash mantras with shatters.

The actual last time I got to fight a mesmer that is one shot in ranked is.. A while ago, honestly I haven't felt the need to ever record them again as they are no issue to me;

These are like, super obvious ambushes from plat 1 when I was a power shiro scrub which was before the nerf. Since the nerf to stun, being able to evade in daze just made them 200% weaker to people that knows how to deal with em, if you are to just blatantly claim that they are that OP, I'd like to disagree entirely.

I hated them before, still do but there is a level of understanding to it and if you can't figure it out, improve because the last thing this game needs is nerf to a core profession, Mirage actually loses potential for sustain compared Core too, which means you should be able to deal with em even more easily since rarely anyone touches Core.

Aw Silly Face. You realize that rev was nerfed because it was instagibbing people from behind LoS too fast for them to react from right? That's literally the same problem that mantra mesmer has.

If you think getting 100-0'd from stealth without any animation is fine, you're either memeing or have a really poor understanding of balance.

Fight against Mur or CJ or literally any high plat player with a brain on mantras and you'll realize that it's also stupidly strong in straight 1v1s because they have high mobility/stealth and can oneshot you if you're not careful. There's a reason good mantra mesmers usually make it to the finals of 1v1 tournies...

I am literally above top 25 for days as condi rev and all I'm getting is the same people over and over which is definitely not one shot mesmer who would melt to any of my pressure, it's like you fail to understand that the only way mesmer can pressure you is being right next to you and that's not something they can achieve if you're head on brain dead about map awareness or them for that matter.

Relevant to the video, that was two years ago and I even quoted "power shiro scrub" and you're still talking smack, I probably won more 1v1's with that 1+ build in duels than anyone has ganked me in 1v1's with my condi rev build with their predictable approach and easy free heal.

You must be memeing to say that it's strong in 1v1 when the whole entire concept of the build falls apart if you are even aware of them.

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@bravan.3876 said:

@bravan.3876 said:Give him credit for not giving up even though it is somehow cringy that he restarts with it after his last 200 page thread ppl told him what is op and what not. All low gold ppl will happily jump on his train once again :joy:

I will continue to make threads every time I get 100-0'd by bs oneshots from stealth.

I don't even have an issue with Death's Judgment unless it's being paired with Shadow Arts for faceroll perma stealth DJ spam. My issue with DE is the 20k Malicious Backstab build. DJ has a giant laser and sound cue so I'm mostly fine with it on the meta DA variant, though it's very annoying with quickness when it hits you for 14k.

Builds that can one-shot you from stealth WITHOUT any reasonable indication, animation, or sound cue that you can dodge NEED to get deleted. They do not belong in this game.

You should think about what you wanna cry about before starting a thread then. You cry about Mantras but you mean stealthspam oneshot builds which have nothing to do with Mantras and are not even Mesmer only. Mantras have a sound and an animation (this mandala thing on the ground), Mantra of Distraction can be used to predict a burst, just dodge when you get dazed. GS2 has a tell even out of stealth. A mesmer with only 3 secs stealth is predictable and easy to counter. The problem starts with stacked stealth. I mean i'm on your side with the stealthspam oneshot builds including the (chasoline) core Mesmer build. It is braindead low skill carry, none reactive and unhealthy.

In all seriousness, during AT games where team play is a real thing, comps full of Mirage/Thief/Holo with a bunch of AoE stealth assist for each other, is starting to become problematic due to almost everything in the game now being capable of landing 2HKOs.

The problem Shadow is talking about indeed occurs when stealth meets too much power creep. When this game was originally designed, stealth was designed around every class having about 1/4th the damage output that it has now. Consider this. It was designed to be able to "Get a lead on your attack" not to blow someone up in .50 seconds before they can even react to use active defensive utilities.

I'd really also like to point out that maybe it isn't that stealth 1-2HKOs are necessarily "bRokEn OP!" as much as it is annoying and an undesirable feel for the game.

Just something to think about ^

I personally like the high DPS metas though, and from my point of view I'd say that it's too much stealth in the game, not so much that it's too much DPS. That's just how I feel about it.

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@"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said:While I dont doubt there are or are not others as good as those 2 you mentioned (whom I havent personally encountered), however the way you constantly emphasize "good" could apply to any class/build as any "good" players would be annoying or impossible to beat, thus stressing the "good" multiple times with mantra specifically loses a bit of weight.

Ive faced "good" holo's that are impossible to beat due to certain mechanics, "good" condi mirages, "good" weavers....etc. Who you consider good and other considered "good" is subjective as well so please watch for that as it could easily turn against you in a debate/criticism.

Mm maybe I should clarify a little more lol

There's a solid 15 players on NA I'd consider having top tier mechanics. WvW is a bit different but there are a lot of broken builds there because of the stats. It's easier to hide your mechanics when you're running what would be considered bunker + glass stats at the same time in PvP lol. Trailblazers is insane and there are power stat combos that make you very tanky and deal a high amount of damage as well.

When I'm referring to good players, I'm generally talking about the best players on any given class. I'm not talking about your run-of-the-mill above average plat 2-3 player. These are players that are extremely good at PvPing in 1v1/1vX scenarios, they understand how to kite and survive, how to kill quickly and punish misplays, and rotate/snowball/counter snowball (sPvP-only). Out of these 15, there are about 8 or so that I'd have to be careful with when fighting.

That's my definition of good. I've done a lot of GvGing for the top guilds over the years, a lot of zerg busting, running pick squads as a ranger (usually the only one in the guilds)... I used to roam a ton as well. There's only been a handful of times when I've met someone in WvW that actually was decent and those were usually sPvPers I ended up knowing and coming across randomly lol. Again, I'm not saying WvW players are bad but there's a clear difference in skill between someone who deserves to be legend/high plat 3 and everyone else. You can maybe pull up some of my old vod footage on Twitch if it's still up. I used to roam between ques to find outnumbered fights lol. Even without my ideal stat combo I was killing roaming groups of 3 or so pretty easily.

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@"Shao.7236" said:I am literally above top 25 for days as condi rev and all I'm getting is the same people over and over which is definitely not one shot mesmer who would melt to any of my pressure, it's like you fail to understand that the only way mesmer can pressure you is being right next to you and that's not something they can achieve if you're head on brain dead about map awareness or them for that matter.

Relevant to the video, that was two years ago and I even quoted "power shiro scrub" and you're still talking smack, I probably won more 1v1's with that 1+ build in duels than anyone has ganked me in 1v1's with my condi rev build with their predictable approach and easy free heal.

You must be memeing to say that it's strong in 1v1 when the whole entire concept of the build falls apart if you are even aware of them.

Yep, I know. I've seen you on the leaderboards lol

My dude, there's barely anyone playing right now. Like 2-3 good players have been actively quing ranked this season.

I really don't know how to get this point across... you guys think mantra mesmers are bad at 1v1s when they can literally 100-0 the other person in an instant. WATCH old 1v1 tournies (and new ones too!) in sPvP there's a very high chance a mantra mesmer beat several other decent players and made it to the finals. In one tourny, (because they didn't have a fucking bracket system) whoever won kept going till they lost. Well, great. I was the 3rd person to go and ended up 1v1ing over 30 people in Bo3s for the next 5-6 hours and beat everyone including Shorts g a m i n g before I fought CJ in the finals on berserker core mantra mesmer. That was definitely the most difficult fight in the entire tourny and I was running Druid back when it was still strong. They even removed the overtime timer because it was the finals and I ended up fighting against him for 15 minutes each round before I finally killed him. Fifteen minutes. This guy was kiting properly, setting up bursts properly... etc. etc. It was hard for me to kill him and survive.

Also if you linked a video I didn't watch it. I'll check it out later though if you think it's important.

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@bravan.3876 said:And it got already mentioned to you, that it is not only cc it can be simple autoattackspam that makes the Mesmer unable to finish the cast and cancel it duo to pressure. Also you assuming that a glass canon Mesmer always has a dodges rdy to cover the cast, as if he doesn't need to dodge at any other time. Whatever the Mesmer has to invest at least one dodge or 30+secs cd skill to cover the charge and has no impact on the fight during that. And if nothing is rdy the Mesmer has to wait out for cds to cover it or to disengage and runs around with uncharged Mantra longer than the base cd. These all are high costs. But you deny that ,what is a biased, not based on facts opinion and you will not change it no matter what ppl tell you. So keep with it and get oneshot by 2 out of how many active Mesmers playing in NA? From my experience as someone played against Mesmers i had no problem to use the recharge to my advantage, even easier in conquest when more than one player can attack him. If you don't focus a Powermes and let him snack your team 1 by 1 and disengage without following him to death it is a problem of wrong target priority. But i also know at least 10 counters to Mantra of Distraction during you feel the need to complain about it. Lifes in this game can be so different based on game knowledge...

As said i am with you in regard to Mantra of Pain, stealthspam/stacking and Chaosline. Everything else is a l2p issue in my opinion, even though i am not a fan of oneshotbuilds and think that it is the only way for lower skilled ppl to play a Powerburstmes when they have no ability/skill to outplay ppl in a more reactive fight without being carried by passive sustain. Still as you say, only 2 Mesmers in whole NA during the life time of GW2 can play it in a way, that they are able to make it fast enough that you personally cannot react to it. What an insane high rate /s (and isn't at least Mur not accused several times of using macros by other higher skilled players knowing what they talk about? Means not the usual accuse of low skilled ppl have no clue what you can do with good keybinds and fast clickrate and reactiontime. I think i remember talks like that on more than one NA stream, among them Shorts and Zeromis)From your posts i would not think you are over average skilled (don't argue with the joke of lb rating pls), means no NA Mesmer can land a burst out of 3 secs stealth or without stealth fast enough to hit a rly good player aware of a Burstmes being around. NA must be heaven for everyone knows how to play vs Powermesmers...

Walk. Behind. A. Wall.

If you guys refuse to use line of sight and insist on facetanking damage and trading poorly, don't fucking tell me mantra mesmer is bad when you guys are LITERALLY telling me exactly why you guys are struggling with it.

Dude... I play this fucking build also when I'm memeing. I'm not as good as CJ and Mur but anyone, and I mean ANYONE can 100-0 someone from stealth. It's one of the easiest combos to pull off because the other person doesn't even know you're there.

I have pretty good map awareness. I was capping nodes last night in one match, looking around to see if there was anyone coming to contest. Nothing. There was no one. I was panning my camera around, looking at the different paths around the map. Boop! Insta dead, multiple times that game. Mantra mesmer stealthed for so long and from so far away he killed me without me knowing he was there.

What am I supposed to do? Spam dodges randomly and use defensive cooldowns when there's nothing else except for empty space? At one point he went invis for so long he broke combat and I wasn't sure if he was still there so I had to keep dodging and trying to predict the burst after 12+ seconds of stealth. Like.... that's so fucking ridiculous. I ended up greatsword 4 blocking the burst at the end of my 4th dodge but since Mirror Blade is unblockable I was left with about 4k health regardless.

lol I play on EU too on my alt account and consistently place in the top 30 with 120-180 ping. You guys have some magical mass-delusion that somehow EU players are better than NA. In reality, there are about the same number of actually good players over there. The only difference is that there are more average plat 2-3 players so the ques are better.

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@"Shao.7236" said:

lol I watched that video, that mesmer is extremely bad

Do not use him as the standard for what a "good" mantra mesmer can do.

I'm not saying Shorts is good but he's definitely better than whoever that dude was.

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/962494/#Comment_962494https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/961934/#Comment_961934youtube timestamp

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@"shadowpass.4236" said:My dude, there's barely anyone playing right now. Like 2-3 good players have been actively quing ranked this season.Since the PP Corruption update past 4 seasons I was still above/below 50 tops as condi revenant before and after the changes, give or take, the amount of "known" good players doesn't leave any relevancy to the LB positioning when you still have competent players that aren't socially tapped out, you still have those memes like Vans, Naru or Grim that just troll around in duoQ while they still tend to get their asses handed to them when a team is competent enough, I'm not gonna say there's not less players, definitely not. There is a decline because people get tired to play the same game, whether it's ANY game. This wouldn't make GW2 anymore interesting to add content when people aren't happy with what they already have.

Also if you linked a video I didn't watch it. I'll check it out later though if you think it's important.No, it's just to show 3 different ways that (as my old bad revenant) I was mitigating mesmer burst from an average player, which display how well the build is not exactly as cheesy as it used to be. I still do similar plays as condi rev if there is one but lately it's just mirage memes that I eat for breakfast as they disengage over and over.

I was running Druid back when it was still strongI remember what Druid was and honestly, I don't expect you to win it even with the old bunker/bruiser meta, slow painful running around. My buddy is still making Druid work to this day which leads me to believe Anet wants people to adopt an actual Druid style, not a straight up upgrade from core which justify the nerfs. although Wisp is still uncalled for.

If you're familiar with FPS games, you probably know of sniper rifles that kills in 1 body shot, make it the best comparison because Mesmer Burst is pretty much an AWP shot from CS. It's a cheesy crutch, but it's there and honestly more options to work around in GW2 makes it a lot less annoying if you ask me. Only a bad team in a bad game would make it look OP, I just can't visualize it, I'd have to get my ass handed to myself to know how it is because 9 times out of 10, even if the mesmer successfully landed his burst, I was likely to survive because of various prevention such as protection.

lol I watched that video, that mesmer is extremely badDo not use him as the standard for what a "good" mantra mesmer can do.I did call him an average player, this just proves how the build is not as cheesy as it used to be for anyone to pick it up.

I'm not saying Shorts is good but he's definitely better than whoever that dude was.

Already faced Shorts, same results.

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@"Shao.7236" said:Since the PP Corruption update past 4 seasons I was still above/below 50 tops as condi revenant before and after the changes, give or take, the amount of "known" good players doesn't leave any relevancy to the LB positioning when you still have competent players that aren't socially tapped out, you still have those memes like Vans, Naru or Grim that just troll around in duoQ while they still tend to get their kitten handed to them when a team is competent enough, I'm not gonna say there's not less players, definitely not. There is a decline because people get tired to play the same game, whether it's ANY game. This wouldn't make GW2 anymore interesting to add content when people aren't happy with what they already have.No, it's just to show 3 different ways that (as my old bad revenant) I was mitigating mesmer burst from an average player, which display how well the build is not exactly as cheesy as it used to be. I still do similar plays as condi rev if there is one but lately it's just mirage memes that I eat for breakfast as they disengage over and over.I remember what Druid was and honestly, I don't expect you to win it even with the old bunker/bruiser meta, slow painful running around. My buddy is still making Druid work to this day which leads me to believe Anet wants people to adopt an actual Druid style, not a straight up upgrade from core which justify the nerfs. although Wisp is still uncalled for.If you're familiar with FPS games, you probably know of sniper rifles that kills in 1 body shot, make it the best comparison because Mesmer Burst is pretty much an AWP shot from CS. It's a cheesy crutch, but it's there and honestly more options to work around in GW2 makes it a lot less annoying if you ask me. Only a bad team in a bad game would make it look OP, I just can't visualize it, I'd have to get my kitten handed to myself to know how it is because 9 times out of 10, even if the mesmer successfully landed his burst, I was likely to survive because of various prevention such as protection.I did call him an average player, this just proves how the build is not as cheesy as it used to be for anyone to pick it up.Already faced Shorts, same results.

Top 250 starts at gold last time I checked. It's not that hard to make it onto the leaderboards, but try to get one of the top 10 spots and hold it throughout the season. That's where you'll find the hardest matches where you are forced to carry or lose 30+ rating.

Dude... that mesmer literally stealthed in front of you and walked up to you for the burst. If he mass invis'd from the mid point and blew you up as you were walking under the arch, you wouldn't have seen him coming. Also, opening with gs4 for a mantra burst is stupid.

I wasn't playing it during the bunker meta, nor was I running a bunker build. My build had a lot of damage in it.

Nah, shooters are different. This game auto aims for you and you don't need to aim at their body/head (depending on the game lol) to get that one shot. Either way, in games like Apex Legends, killing someone like that takes skill, but it's not very fun for the receiving end and a lot of players dislike the mechanic. Who the hell likes to die without getting a chance to fight back? The outcome would've been the same if you had just turned your monitor off and walked away from the keyboard.

I already said Shorts isn't that good but he knows how to instagib someone and set up the stealth from out of their field of vision. Mur and CJ can actually duel with it pretty well.

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@shadowpass.4236 said:Top 250 starts at gold last time I checked. It's not that hard to make it onto the leaderboards, but try to get one of the top 10 spots and hold it throughout the season. That's where you'll find the hardest matches where you are forced to carry or lose 30+ rating.Already had it for a moment, don't care. Past 4 seasons goes at least one year, I've had enough influence to know that I'm good. Degrading because I want to play with friends and it shows at the end of every matches.Dude... that mesmer literally stealthed in front of you and walked up to you for the burst. If he mass invis'd from the mid point and blew you up as you were walking under the arch, you wouldn't have seen him coming. Also, opening with gs4 for a mantra burst is stupid.Average player. Meaning this build is far from OP and is required to be in good hands in a way or other.I wasn't playing it during the bunker meta, nor was I running a bunker build. My build had a lot of damage in it.Shocker, it just says you got outplayed when they don't have as many options as you do. Least IMO because I can't tell apart as apparently I never fought any good mes but those I do cause no issue at all.Nah, shooters are different. This game auto aims for you and you don't need to aim at their body/head (depending on the game lol) to get that one shot. Either way, in games like Apex Legends, killing someone like that takes skill, but it's not very fun for the receiving end and a lot of players dislike the mechanic. Who the hell likes to die without getting a chance to fight back? The outcome would've been the same if you had just turned your monitor off and walked away from the keyboard.Aiming is not hard, one shots are a crutch in any form of genres including FPS (Excluding if headshots are required), but will always exist and have a form of more complicated counter, that was the statement.I already said Shorts isn't that good but he knows how to instagib someone and set up the stealth from out of their field of vision. Mur and CJ can actually duel with it pretty well.You can name whoever that had some sort of influence, I went through all of them but CJ it seems, or maybe I have but just didn't care. I saw some good core mes that gave me a hard time a while ago but not unkillable by any means. The only thing that actually makes my mind work all this time since I'm playing this build is Spellbreaker.

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@"Shao.7236"

You misunderstood my point. You can be in the top 25 but if the top players aren't quing, you aren't going to see what some of these builds are capable of. You linked me some pleb mesmer burst that a gold player could dodge and are using it as an argument in favor of mantras? Lol, please be real here. There are zero other mesmer players asides from Mur and CJ (to a lesser extent, Shorts) that can play mantras even remotely competently on NA. Does that mean that the build itself is hard to play? No. It doesn't. I could say the same for glass core ranger. It's not inherently difficult, but only one or two people can actually pull it off at a high level.

???? That's literally the worst balancing logic you could possibly use. Some random gold player can't play the build properly so that means it's balanced? Nice one, Genius. That's precisely why you balance around the top players. Little Bronze Tier Jimmy can't play tools holo correctly so that must mean it's balanced right? lol

loool... I won the 1v1 tourny against CJ's mantra mesmer. "Shocker, you got outplayed" xd you fucking admitted that the player in the video was bad yet you insist on referring to that example below-average play as the end-all-be-all of what mantra mesmer is capable of. I can't tell if you're trolling or being very, very silly right now. :)

lol what is the counter to getting one-shot with no chance to react? Not getting one shot? Fantastic.

Silly Face, you literally linked me a bot mesmer and told me the build is balanced because he can't play it well. D: I never said they are unkillable but they don't just keel over as soon as you apply pressure to them. It's the mantras that are unbalanced. Good players can still survive on glassy builds if they know how to play properly, but that's besides the point.

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@bravan.3876 @Shao.7236 @Bigpapasmurf.5623 @ollbirtan.2915 @Leonidrex.5649 @viquing.8254 @lightstalker.1498 @kraai.7265 @yusayu.3629 @"everyman.4375"

Tell me you'd be able to dodge this and I'll call you a liar. It's literally a fucking insta kill. There's no possibly way to avoid it if the mesmer stealths out of your range of vision before the burst.

https://clips.twitch.tv/SpikyHungryCaterpillarArsonNoSexy

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@shadowpass.4236 said:@bravan.3876 @Shao.7236 @Bigpapasmurf.5623 @ollbirtan.2915 @Leonidrex.5649 @viquing.8254 @lightstalker.1498 @kraai.7265 @yusayu.3629 @"everyman.4375"

Tell me you'd be able to dodge this and I'll call you a liar. It's literally a kitten insta kill. There's no possibly way to avoid it if the mesmer stealths out of your range of vision before the burst.

https://clips.twitch.tv/SpikyHungryCaterpillarArsonNoSexy

Look behind + awareness? You can even see the mesmer on the minimap behind her.

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@"shadowpass.4236" said:

Tell me you'd be able to dodge this and I'll call you a liar. It's literally a kitten insta kill. There's no possibly way to avoid it if the mesmer stealths out of your range of vision before the burst.

https://clips.twitch.tv/SpikyHungryCaterpillarArsonNoSexy

She sure hasn't looked behind her, how could she know? Are you gonna tell me that absolutely nothing else, even some puny power shiro couldn't have caught her by surprise either while she's on all her cooldowns? Let's be real.

Man, that base health too looking super glassy. I'm always above that for a reason. I've even fought that mesmer in that clip before but that's besides the point.

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@"Quadox.7834" said:Look behind + awareness? You can even see the mesmer on the minimap behind her.

That's a different mesmer lmao... This is precisely what I'm talking about....

I find it hilarious that the people arguing with me are literally detailing exactly why they don't understand the issue.

  • First off, how are you supposed to "look behind" you and see the mesmer in stealth?
  • Second, how are you going to be aware of the mesmer is he's in stealth... lol that's the whole point of stealth to begin with.
  • Third, there are two mesmers on their team. The one you see on the minimap was not the one that downed her. The other mesmer was invisible, and out of combat. Both of these hide your location on the minimap.
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@Shao.7236 said:She sure hasn't looked behind her, how could she know? Are you gonna tell me that absolutely nothing else, even some puny power shiro couldn't have caught her by surprise either while she's on all her cooldowns? Let's be real.

Man, that base health too looking super glassy. I'm always above that for a reason. I've even fought that mesmer in that clip before but that's besides the point.

So you're telling me that if she looked behind her, she would've seen the mesmer in stealth? lol...

And health =/= tankiness. Marauders Amulet has a lot of health but is very squishy. In this video, she was running a build I gave her using Knight's Amulet. She had 3600 armor and still got one-shot.

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

@"Shao.7236" said:She sure hasn't looked behind her, how could she know? Are you gonna tell me that absolutely nothing else, even some puny power shiro couldn't have caught her by surprise either while she's on all her cooldowns? Let's be real.

Man, that base health too looking super glassy. I'm always above that for a reason. I've even fought that mesmer in that clip before but that's besides the point.

So you're telling me that if she looked behind her, she would've seen the mesmer in stealth? lol...

And health =/= tankiness. Marauders Amulet has a lot of health but is very squishy. In this video, she was running a build I gave her using Knight's Amulet. She had 3600 armor and still got one-shot.

Look, I'm not even gonna try to justify, explain my reasoning or lack of struggle against it anymore. Not in all of my years playing this game have I had issues against a mesmer even when they could stun and that's just my final thoughts on it, call me bad or just unable to play against anyone competent because it seems no one is ever good enough, that's all I ever hear and with that I say that nerfing them anymore would pretty much ruin the profession altogether.

I'd have many answers as to why this hopeless situation might have turned differently for her, but overall. Just one evade was available and that's all it would have taken to avoid it, being aware is much easier to anticipate and nothing shows that the mes didn't cloak right in plain sight behind her before he came. Whenever there is one that "exists" it's the thing I always look out for with both my eyes and ears, period. Have a good day.

Edit: To add up on video at the mesmer whether being bad or good, it clearly landed similar amount of damage that would be pretty much 1k off killing someone at 15k health, goes to show how "squishy" how marauder is but at full health still leaves a bigger window, also he was likely to be berserker himself given how phase traversal alone removed 15% of his health.

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@"Shao.7236" said:Look, I'm not even gonna try to justify, explain my reasoning or lack of struggle against it anymore. Not in all of my years playing this game have I had issues against a mesmer even when they could stun and that's just my final thoughts on it, call me bad or just unable to play against anyone competent because it seems no one is ever good enough, that's all I ever hear and with that I say that nerfing them anymore would pretty much ruin the profession altogether.

I'd have many answers as to why this hopeless situation might have turned differently for her, but overall. Just one evade was available and that's all it would have taken to avoid it, being aware is much easier to anticipate and nothing shows that the mes didn't cloak right in plain sight behind her before he came. Whenever there is one that "exists" it's the thing I always look out for with both my eyes and ears, period. Have a good day.

Explain what Zeromis (the best mesmer in the game) could've done differently in this situation.

Youtube timestamp

Do you think it's fine that he insta died from full health, completely nullifying all of his years of practice and experience, because there are builds that can stealth from so far away that you can't even see them coming, then land a completely frontloaded burst with no cast times on at least half of the skills, that can do 20k worth of damage in under a fifth of a second?

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Few, we should do something in this forum :
EVERY WHINER SHOULD GET LEGEND/PLAT3 WITH THE OP CLASS THEY WHINE ABOUT TO PROVE IT'S OP BEFORE POSTING PLEASE.

Bold and caps lock doesn't make nonsense sound sensible. It does synbolise whining though.One shot is one shot capability. We don't care what tier it's in. The point is simply to get rid of the one shot builds altogether.

I use the OP style.bronze whine is bronze whine. Did you know that if you remove one shot or similar on every class, we will come back again with full tank meta ? (I don't care but remember this.)

@shadowpass.4236 said:

@Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:Cant tell if serious or just trolling

You talk about why learn to play when learning to play is just what you need to learn how to deal with them.

Fight a good mantra mesmer and tell me how you fight against a build that can 100-0 you from stealth without any animations to dodge. kitten the forums are incredible.

There isn't in EU ladder so it's pretty hard to understand what you are saying.The rare mantra mesmer I meet aren't high at all and once they use all their mantra charge they are free food.Take a Holo and stealth ins't a problem at all.

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@"viquing.8254" said:There isn't in EU ladder so it's pretty hard to understand what you are saying.The rare mantra mesmer I meet aren't high at all and once they use all their mantra charge they are free food.Take a Holo and stealth ins't a problem at all.

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1037705/#Comment_1037705

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@shadowpass.4236 said:

@"viquing.8254" said:There isn't in EU ladder so it's pretty hard to understand what you are saying.The rare mantra mesmer I meet aren't high at all and once they use all their mantra charge they are free food.Take a Holo and stealth ins't a problem at all.

Yeah that's probably the highest problem in this forum, NA and EU PvP are really too much different in terms of class representation...

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