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Ranger is way too strong 1v1 in WvW


Aridon.8362

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@Aridon.8362 said:

; just to put this out there and rub all the I told you so on this thread. They have been like this for about half a year now.

Dear Aridon,

1- This game wasn't built for 1v1. And putting "1v1" next to "wvw" looks kinda silly.

2- I can guarantee most players around the pvp and wvw scenes are aware that damage output, aka "power creep", is a problem across all professions when geared for it. Here again, silly to complain about ranger directly when it's a problem with profession designs.

Have a great one!

Writing a forum post as if it were a letter is silly.

You're spamming a meme video taken in the context of a special event to try and argue balance with regards to a glass cannon build, and you're worried about looking silly?

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@CETheLucid.3964 said:

; just to put this out there and rub all the I told you so on this thread. They have been like this for about half a year now.

Dear Aridon,

1- This game wasn't built for 1v1. And putting "1v1" next to "wvw" looks kinda silly.

2- I can guarantee most players around the pvp and wvw scenes are aware that damage output, aka "power creep", is a problem across all professions when geared for it. Here again, silly to complain about ranger directly when it's a problem with profession designs.

Have a great one!

Writing a forum post as if it were a letter is silly.

You're spamming a meme video taken in the context of a special event to try and argue balance with regards to a glass cannon build, and you're worried about looking silly?I'm just replying to a previous comment: Dear Aridon,
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lol... cant believe how people cant see that ranger is indeed OP in any 1v1 scenario...GS hit harder than Warrior GS and has great mobility + dodge/blockLB has knockback and pewpew (also stealth)

  • Soulbeast enables you to merge for unblockables and more mobility (also dodge with smokescale)

what are the downsides? the counter play should be me getting in ranger face but he can kite me for weeks with all this mobility :)

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  • 3 weeks later...

@Swagger.1459 said:

@Aridon.8362 said:People keep saying it's a L2P issue, I bet none of you have actually 1v1ed a ranger that actually does a lot of roaming. I know a skilled player when I see one and I can tell already from these comments that alot of you don't actually fit the bill. And those that actually are skilled actually agree with me to an extent.

The biggest flaw with this thread is that people are actually suggesting to go make a ranger and waste time testing out the cons I pointed out to begin with, but there's not actually a need to do so when there is a literal tab for combat logging. It's actually very easy to play ranger compared to warrior (and yes I used to main one back before Hot), I've spent hours throughout the day just looking around for small brawls and 1v1 fights and the biggest class that gives nobody a chance to do anything is in fact the SKILLED ranger in WvW. Just a while back today those two rangers I mentioned previously had wiped out a group of 6 players right in front of me. 6 and they did it by running away and using skills that give an excessive amount of range to an advantage every single time or using the signet skill to proc invuln so they can sneak the greatsword bear maul skill that chews their hip like b cutting through butter. If you can't win against everything in WvW as a ranger 1v1, then you are an unskilled ranger.

Honestly this isn't that big of a deal to me, and I will never see it as an important issue because of the mere fact that wvw isn't about 1v1s and in spvp for some reason every ranger just pretty much sucks these days. I see them as easy prey in spvp and I'm certain a lot of other people do as well.

So rangers are “easy prey” for you in spvp, but a problem for you in wvw... That’s a personal problem then.... Unlike in spvp, a good roamer in wvw isn’t going to stand and fight honorably in a little circle while getting smashed... You’re getting out-played, so take your losses as a learning experience.

Dunno about the above. But you obv don't play PvP. no 1 in high level PvP stands on a circle and fights honorably. There's far more kiting than anything in PvP.

High rank PvP players would level the majority of wvw players just due to the shear constant battle. In the space of 10 minutes you could have fought dozens of fights.where as in wvw takes 10 mins to even find 1 roamer worth 1v1ing. Then there is also equal stats in PvP which don't happen in wvw

You can really tell this from the top PvPers who stream like kritsuga,shorts vallun etc who regularly 1vX on wvw. Where it would be impossible in PvP simply because the player skill level is much higher.

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@TorQ.7041 said:

You can really tell this from the top PvPers who stream like kritsuga,shorts vallun etc who regularly 1vX on wvw. Where it would be impossible in PvP simply because the player skill level is much higher.

Don't confuse live streams and edited youtube vids. The players who only do youtube roaming montages aren't as skilled as their edits might lead you to believe.

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  • 1 month later...

A ranger does not "stealth" and "teleport away. We have one skill, and we MOVE to another location while stealthed. The most dodges from a Ranger is with Sword/Dagger combo. Believe me, I played that a lot early on. Very few rangers ever mastered the Sword/Dagger, which to this day is very sad, because most rangers currently avoid that combo. But the correct Nourishment and Sword/Dagger and you'll be hard pressed to nail down a ranger without quite a few stuns.

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@"Zawn.9647" said:GS hit harder than Warrior GS and has great mobility + dodge/block

Do yourself and the rest of us a favor and stop implying the weapon is a problem. It's not. It never was. For most of the time it has been grossly underpowered, but buffing it at the same time as SB came out obviously came as a surprise to the people that were used to the nuddle damage it had. Comparing it to a PvE focused weapon like the warrior GS, that has always been a staple for PvE warrior, unlike ranger GS, isn't exactly a good look either. Especially not when complaing about its block and evades, as if warrior doesn't have inherently better passive defenses to begin with. And "hit harder" is simplifying it. It bursts harder, because it has a burst skill.

Longbow stealth has been there for years aswell. It's not a problem. Direct your complaints to the elite spec. At least you would be on to something.

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Honestly the problem with Ranger, is ultimately gonna be Soulbeast and their pets.

I see Anet always target high performance classes for balancing, but Soulbeast has been getting nothing but love with minor tweaks which can be properly described as Balancing. (I'm avoiding the term nerf or buff here, because tweaks are indeed tweaks)

Soulbeast's greatest utility, and greatest strength, is gonna be Beastmode in conjunction with Pets.

  1. Pets do a hideous amount of damage. Talk about automatic free damage.
  2. Soulbeasts completely negate the loss of a pet by going beastmode, and gaining even more benefits as well as unique skills.

And Anet had the gall to nerf pets for Druids without touching Soulbeast, claiming that Druid needs a tradeoff.Come on Anet, yu being serious?

But okay, one can make the argument : It doesn't make sense to nerf pets on Soulbeast, they literally involve pets in the kit.

Alright, fair.

But then why does Soulbeast hit like a truck even without their pet? Would it make sense then to say we should nerf Soulbeast core weapon damage outside of beastmode, since they are more relient on their pets thematically?

I mean how does one even start to explain a weapon auto which does upwards of 5k to 7k damage in a single shot.

That's like hitting a Deathstrike every second, and it doesn't even have a cooldown.

"Dude, just block it or dodge"

Tell me if yu have enough dodges to completely evade unblockable attacks per second from 1500 range.

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@"Yasai.3549" said:Honestly the problem with Ranger, is ultimately gonna be Soulbeast and their pets.

I see Anet always target high performance classes for balancing, but Soulbeast has been getting nothing but love with minor tweaks which can be properly described as Balancing. (I'm avoiding the term nerf or buff here, because tweaks are indeed tweaks)

Soulbeast's greatest utility, and greatest strength, is gonna be Beastmode in conjunction with Pets.

  1. Pets do a hideous amount of damage. Talk about automatic free damage.
  2. Soulbeasts completely negate the loss of a pet by going beastmode, and gaining even more benefits as well as unique skills.

And Anet had the gall to nerf pets for Druids without touching Soulbeast, claiming that Druid needs a tradeoff.Come on Anet, yu being serious?

But okay, one can make the argument : It doesn't make sense to nerf pets on Soulbeast, they literally involve pets in the kit.

Alright, fair.

But then why does Soulbeast hit like a truck even without their pet? Would it make sense then to say we should nerf Soulbeast core weapon damage outside of beastmode, since they are more relient on their pets thematically?

I mean how does one even start to explain a weapon auto which does upwards of 5k to 7k damage in a single shot.

That's like hitting a Deathstrike every second, and it doesn't even have a cooldown.

"Dude, just block it or dodge"

Tell me if yu have enough dodges to completely evade unblockable attacks per second from 1500 range.

I want to explain you why ranger does that kind of damage without pets. But keep in mind that I also think it is not right to use pet skills for ranger itself (like sic em).

Rangers general damage is calculated with the pet. That was why rangers were trash tier in many pve events for several years. Pet AI was crappy and the damage was not enough to compare with other professions. So when a soulbeast is merged with his pet, he gets a stat buff to compansate it. As the ranger damage and utilities are reliant on the pets very existance, it would be highly unbalancing to remove them. So what you proposed in your good intention is not a solution but a heavy nerf that cannot be done.There are heavily bugged builds, I agree. Winter's bite or Maul builds are really insane. But with bow and arrow, it is not hard to find a solution. Unblockable rapid fire can be dodged completely. And there are too many reflect skills in the game that can not only protect you from damage, but also force your opponent to react differently. If you are not aware of your surroundings, and get killed due to it, you deserve it. Among all the professions I have had trouble with, soulbeast is the least I worry about. I can heal the damage and then go offensive. Because that it takes more than 1-2 hits to kill me, I can react to the situation. With mesmers for example, it is different. All the burst happens in 1.5 seconds with cc's so it is way harder. And invisible makes it so much worse.

But I want to add that you are right in some points. Those one shot builds should not exist. Not on ranger, not on mesmer, not on any profession. Keep in mind that I do not play zerker and I usually have healing power and toughness, and I occasionaly have at least one panic button (and one reflect in some cases). So I can dodge, get myself fixed and enter combat.

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I wish I could report this for necro> @"Aridon.8362" said:

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/75147/soulbeast-pew-pew-is-out-of-hand#latest ; just to put this out there and rub all the I told you so on this thread. They have been like this for about half a year now.

OctoberNovemberDecemberJanuaryFebruaryMarchAprilMAY THE 8th!

8 Month Thread Necro. NICE! Just for a 'told you so'.

@Zawn.9647 said:lol... cant believe how people cant see that ranger is indeed OP in any 1v1 scenario...GS hit harder than Warrior GS and has great mobility + dodge/blockLB has knockback and pewpew (also stealth)

  • Soulbeast enables you to merge for unblockables and more mobility (also dodge with smokescale)

what are the downsides? the counter play should be me getting in ranger face but he can kite me for weeks with all this mobility :)

It's easy.This goes for any class, if you think it's opPlay itLearn to beat itPlay something that beats itOr enjoy it--and JOIN THE RANKS lol

If you don't know what the downsides are, you haven't played it long enough.

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@"Zawn.9647" said:when a ranger can hit harder than a warrior with the same weapon, it is a problem :)

Well, if you're gonna resort to arguing like a 5 year old; Maul specifically says attack with "the force of a bear". It's magic, and a bear is stronger than your puny little warrior. No problem.

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@Lazze.9870 said:

@"Zawn.9647" said:when a ranger can hit harder than a warrior with the same weapon, it is a problem :)

Well, if you're gonna resort to arguing like a 5 year old; Maul specifically says attack with "the force of a bear". It's magic, and a bear is stronger than your puny little warrior. No problem.

not stronger than a mighty warrior rampaging and yet still does more damage :D

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I quit the game a while ago! This game, while the combat is fun, was way too unbalanced. DPS did too much Damage in 1 second to outweigh the benefits of Vitality and Toughness, the only class that really could outsustain the power damage was honestly Engineer, and the fact that people had serious trouble killing one is absolutely mental. I skimmed at some of the patch notes, and clearly Anet still doesn't understand these flaws; there shouldn't be meta "classes" for any game mode, there shouldn't be any less distinguishable viability between what people decide to go with, but it exists. Literally in gold t1/2 back when I played engineers were everywhere, and I mean everywhere.

People will play meta to the dot and I'm against this practice. It's not fun, it's annoying, and it kills the idea of having a main. Literally they buffed damage on like half the classes on the patch on July 16th, they didn't need buffs, in fact every class needs a nerf to damage and go back to the original vanilla GW2 damage when fights lasted more than 3 seconds. It's pretty moronic to keep going with this train and I'm just fed up with it. I literally went through over 250 ranked pvp matches and about 80% of those had annoying Engineers all over them, and before that season, Scourges were running around 1 shotting people with Condi FOR AN ENTIRE YEAR, no I'm done with this.

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  • 1 month later...
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  • 2 weeks later...

Besides Gale Gray, who the hell uses Shortbow as a ranger anymore? The only time I see Shortbow is when a Ranger is using Sword/Dagger....and that's even RARER still. All those weapons are meant to give the ranger the complete and full Evade list for Ranger combat. Basilisk thieves eat those up for breakfast.

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@KeyOrion.9506 said:Besides Gale Gray, who the hell uses Shortbow as a ranger anymore? The only time I see Shortbow is when a Ranger is using Sword/Dagger....and that's even RARER still. All those weapons are meant to give the ranger the complete and full Evade list for Ranger combat. Basilisk thieves eat those up for breakfast.

I’ve tried, it just doesn’t work.

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@KeyOrion.9506 said:Besides Gale Gray, who the hell uses Shortbow as a ranger anymore? The only time I see Shortbow is when a Ranger is using Sword/Dagger....and that's even RARER still. All those weapons are meant to give the ranger the complete and full Evade list for Ranger combat. Basilisk thieves eat those up for breakfast.

There is a trollish trailblazzer druid build around WvW with short bow. It does nothing more than annoy ppl, and is good for 1v1 because of how busted the condi stat sets are.

Not fun to play with or against.

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I have yet to meet one. I played full evade with Sword/Dagger and shortbow...and yah, it's troll. But There's not a large amount of burst, one shot, not even a two shot off that build that would really let you do anything. The one battle I had sucker had more dps than me, but couldn't land a hit. When he did land a hit, it was with stun or extended knockdown. I'd have less than 3 to 4 second after that to evade or I would get killed. Had sigils for boon stealing at the time. So...that helped quite a bit to keep me on my feet. 4 out 5 times, since they couldn't kill me, and I couldn't damage them, they'd break combat and take off.

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@Aridon.8362 said:It is too hard to kill a ranger, they get too many invulns dodging and stealth and hit like a truck. I block, and they pierce through my shield, I cripple, and they stealth and teleport away, I activate my invuln yet somehow the skill bugs out and allows me to still take physical damage enough is enough my dude. They need a nerf as they have a serious advantage in the roaming scene. I switch to full toughness armor and that bear greatsword skill chomped all of my hp and I'm still questioning how that even happens.

Unless you're complaining from the standpoint of encountering Soulbeasts while actually running a real roaming build, this argument is sort of invalid.

Of course you're going to die if you're trying to solo cap a supply with a Scourge. Of course you're going to die if you're waddling around with a Support or even Condi FB by yourself. Of course you're going to die with a non roamer Warrior designed for zerging. ect ect ect. Of course you're going to die with a non roaming build when you come against any roaming build.

Soulbeasts just make it feel more annoying because they can do it at 1500 range if you don't have an actual roam build that can gap close to them. Get over it. Stop complaining about Rangers when Holosaiyans are out there dealing 3x actual DPS in AoEs, dropping 4x the CC output, and healing themselves like Mender Druids while running Demolisher amulets.

Seriously, get off this Ranger stuff. There are too many people out there who just complain about ranged attacks in general, regardless of if they are weak or strong.

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