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Please make back items with a matching glider that is dyable also be dyable?


HaniJani.2105

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@Donari.5237 said:

@Excursion.9752 said:This could be said about anything being added/updated in the game. Just ask any Hard Core WvW if they want to see the Devs spending their time on another living world update. Everyone has different wants and needs but I think in general everyone would be overwhelmingly happy to be able to dye their back pieces. This kind of update would transcend all game modes and impact everyone. It would be a true QoL update.

In general? Maybe. Overwhelmingly? I'm not so sure. Specifically me? It'd be kind of nice but since my usual treatment of backpacks is to make them invisible, or find the smallest possible ones that don't clip with or hide my armor details, it's certainly not worth giving up on other QoL matters. For example, I have a burning need for them to make unlocked account/character bound consumable skins convertible to transmutation charges. Not everyone has a big collection of those waiting for just the right alt to don the skin, but the gem value of that many transmute charges makes me incredibly reluctant to just trash the skins for bank room. I would be overwhelmingly happy if they did that. And I'm pretty sure a lot of players would gripe and grouse that they'd wasted time on that fix, though
hopefully
it would be a pretty simple thing, especially compared to re-arting and re-coding every back piece in the game.

While I understand your point on transmutation charges and I agree with you because I thought that as well until I started playing WvW and got so many that its not funny.

But I wanted to comment on the re-arting and coding on the back pieces. You would think it would not be hard to apply the models from the gliders which already have the dyeable skins and apply it to the back pieces once they are able to make this happen? My opinion it is more of a problem to make back pieces actually dyeable.

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@Excursion.9752 said:

@Excursion.9752 said:This could be said about anything being added/updated in the game. Just ask any Hard Core WvW if they want to see the Devs spending their time on another living world update. Everyone has different wants and needs but I think in general everyone would be overwhelmingly happy to be able to dye their back pieces. This kind of update would transcend all game modes and impact everyone. It would be a true QoL update.

In general? Maybe. Overwhelmingly? I'm not so sure. Specifically me? It'd be kind of nice but since my usual treatment of backpacks is to make them invisible, or find the smallest possible ones that don't clip with or hide my armor details, it's certainly not worth giving up on other QoL matters. For example, I have a burning need for them to make unlocked account/character bound consumable skins convertible to transmutation charges. Not everyone has a big collection of those waiting for just the right alt to don the skin, but the gem value of that many transmute charges makes me incredibly reluctant to just trash the skins for bank room. I would be overwhelmingly happy if they did that. And I'm pretty sure a lot of players would gripe and grouse that they'd wasted time on that fix, though
hopefully
it would be a pretty simple thing, especially compared to re-arting and re-coding every back piece in the game.

While I understand your point on transmutation charges and I agree with you because I thought that as well until I started playing WvW and got so many that its not funny.

But I wanted to comment on the re-arting and coding on the back pieces. You would think it would not be hard to apply the models from the gliders which already have the dyeable skins and apply it to the back pieces once they are able to make this happen? My opinion it is more of a problem to make back pieces actually dyeable.

You do know that gliders have no physical item thats why they can be dyed right?So lets remove backpacks, you cant have them anymore but a visual on your back can be dyed would that be acceptable?I dont think alot of people would be happy to get a downgrade in stats just to be able to colour the thing that extends from their back tho.

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@Excursion.9752 said:

@Excursion.9752 said:Just because something may be hard does not mean its not worth doing. It is something that they could slowly roll out just like adding novelty items to the wardrobe storage. I would trade the novelty storage for the ability to dye my back piece.

Because updating code that's baked into the very core of the game is
not
(in their opinion) worth doing. That means that the cost is too high relative to the possible benefit
for ArenaNet
, in the opinion of the only people who matter for deciding what to work on: ArenaNet.

Why wouldn't you want to update your code to something that's not legacy...

Because as legacy code, it
works
, and as updated code, it will have bugs, and therefore
does not work
.

Disclaimer. I have been a professional programmer for over thirty years.
I have colleagues younger than my career.
I know something about the tradeoffs involved in programming.I to am a programmer for over 17 years. I know its not 35 years but I have some background and frame of reference for what it takes to make what seems to be impossible changes. Here is how it works for me If I give only certain parts of a program the ability to do do something such as "apply a skin" but only limit it to certain areas guess what my clients do? They ask me to create the same capabilities to all the other areas where it can be applied. They do not care about the reasons why or what it will take for me to make said change. If I say something is to hard they will simply say well then I will find someone else who can and will be willing to do it.

Saying that something simply will not work because its updated just implies that everything new is bugged including the new update that we are about to get next week. So why have any updates? While there is some truth to that but that is what patching is for. To simply not update your "core" because there may be bugs tells me that there is something fundamentally wrong that needs looked at anyhow. The game as a whole may benefit from it as well. who knows?

Anet should have never gave us the ability to dye our gliders if they didn't want these types of questions to come to surface. They must have seen this coming. To me its one of those little things that the Devs think that do not matter when in fact its like pimple on a otherwise flawless face. Pretty much everyone has thought to themselves at one time or another, "I wish I could dye my back piece". The bottom line is no one really cares what any update costs or how it effects the companies bottom line. They just simply want to be able to customize all aspects of their character.

This is something that should have been thought of before the release of the wardrobe system. I know they looked at it and decided to go on without it. Maybe even they thought that they would come back and fix it later. But I will tell you nothing looks more cheesy than a person running up to the cliff with their Green Vine - Touched Destroyer Wings jumping off the edge and them flying out and turning purple...

I respect all the hard work that is put into this game but this is one of the most irritating things for me. I wish is was fixed and I am tired of the to hard excuse. I don't get to throw that card in my office I will tell you that right now.

I would argue that pretty much everyone cares what an update costs because that cost impacts every other aspect of development.

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@Linken.6345 said:

@Excursion.9752 said:This could be said about anything being added/updated in the game. Just ask any Hard Core WvW if they want to see the Devs spending their time on another living world update. Everyone has different wants and needs but I think in general everyone would be overwhelmingly happy to be able to dye their back pieces. This kind of update would transcend all game modes and impact everyone. It would be a true QoL update.

In general? Maybe. Overwhelmingly? I'm not so sure. Specifically me? It'd be kind of nice but since my usual treatment of backpacks is to make them invisible, or find the smallest possible ones that don't clip with or hide my armor details, it's certainly not worth giving up on other QoL matters. For example, I have a burning need for them to make unlocked account/character bound consumable skins convertible to transmutation charges. Not everyone has a big collection of those waiting for just the right alt to don the skin, but the gem value of that many transmute charges makes me incredibly reluctant to just trash the skins for bank room. I would be overwhelmingly happy if they did that. And I'm pretty sure a lot of players would gripe and grouse that they'd wasted time on that fix, though
hopefully
it would be a pretty simple thing, especially compared to re-arting and re-coding every back piece in the game.

While I understand your point on transmutation charges and I agree with you because I thought that as well until I started playing WvW and got so many that its not funny.

But I wanted to comment on the re-arting and coding on the back pieces. You would think it would not be hard to apply the models from the gliders which already have the dyeable skins and apply it to the back pieces once they are able to make this happen? My opinion it is more of a problem to make back pieces actually dyeable.

You do know that gliders have no physical item thats why they can be dyed right?So lets remove backpacks, you cant have them anymore but a visual on your back can be dyed would that be acceptable?I dont think alot of people would be happy to get a downgrade in stats just to be able to colour the thing that extends from their back tho.No one said anything about removing the stats from the back piece so one could color it. This is plain and simple keeping everything how it is with the addition to modify the colors of the back piece while not in a gliding state. All I was saying is that since the gliding models were already dyeable you wouldn't think it would take much to use those same models for the back piece slot IF they granted us the ability to dye our back items.

No one cares what it will take to get the job done what the logistics are because in the end of the day it does not matter to them. Most people (If Not All) would like to dye at least one of their back pieces and they don't particularly care how the job gets done. It is particularly puzzling to me is why people are so quick to defend the reason why this is not being looked at.

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@Ashen.2907 said:

@Excursion.9752 said:Just because something may be hard does not mean its not worth doing. It is something that they could slowly roll out just like adding novelty items to the wardrobe storage. I would trade the novelty storage for the ability to dye my back piece.

Because updating code that's baked into the very core of the game is
not
(in their opinion) worth doing. That means that the cost is too high relative to the possible benefit
for ArenaNet
, in the opinion of the only people who matter for deciding what to work on: ArenaNet.

Why wouldn't you want to update your code to something that's not legacy...

Because as legacy code, it
works
, and as updated code, it will have bugs, and therefore
does not work
.

Disclaimer. I have been a professional programmer for over thirty years.
I have colleagues younger than my career.
I know something about the tradeoffs involved in programming.I to am a programmer for over 17 years. I know its not 35 years but I have some background and frame of reference for what it takes to make what seems to be impossible changes. Here is how it works for me If I give only certain parts of a program the ability to do do something such as "apply a skin" but only limit it to certain areas guess what my clients do? They ask me to create the same capabilities to all the other areas where it can be applied. They do not care about the reasons why or what it will take for me to make said change. If I say something is to hard they will simply say well then I will find someone else who can and will be willing to do it.

Saying that something simply will not work because its updated just implies that everything new is bugged including the new update that we are about to get next week. So why have any updates? While there is some truth to that but that is what patching is for. To simply not update your "core" because there may be bugs tells me that there is something fundamentally wrong that needs looked at anyhow. The game as a whole may benefit from it as well. who knows?

Anet should have never gave us the ability to dye our gliders if they didn't want these types of questions to come to surface. They must have seen this coming. To me its one of those little things that the Devs think that do not matter when in fact its like pimple on a otherwise flawless face. Pretty much everyone has thought to themselves at one time or another, "I wish I could dye my back piece". The bottom line is no one really cares what any update costs or how it effects the companies bottom line. They just simply want to be able to customize all aspects of their character.

This is something that should have been thought of before the release of the wardrobe system. I know they looked at it and decided to go on without it. Maybe even they thought that they would come back and fix it later. But I will tell you nothing looks more cheesy than a person running up to the cliff with their Green Vine - Touched Destroyer Wings jumping off the edge and them flying out and turning purple...

I respect all the hard work that is put into this game but this is one of the most irritating things for me. I wish is was fixed and I am tired of the to hard excuse. I don't get to throw that card in my office I will tell you that right now.

I would argue that pretty much everyone cares what an update costs because that cost impacts every other aspect of development.They have multiple teams working on everything in this game on of which is working on QoL updates. They even have a thread for it
. The money is already being spent. The focus and direction towards this particular problem is what is lacking.

You see this particular thread come and go in these forums all the time well since 2014 when it was introduced. 5 years later and its still not fixed. There is a problem there.

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@"Excursion.9752" said:Saying that something simply will not work because its updated

Sorry about that. I wasn't quite clear about what I meant. If you've been programming for 17 years, you've surely run across the idea that when you change code, you have to consider it broken until you can prove otherwise. Maybe that proof comes from a full set of Test-Driven-Development unit tests and automated QA procedures, in which case, you're very lucky. More likely, it comes from a bunch of poor schmucks pushing buttons or looking at the colours of dyed backpacks in diferent lighting to make sure they look the same colour as the equivalent glider skin dyed the same colour, and in that case, you'll have a harder time proving it.

That "broken unless proven to be working" aspect is what I meant.

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@Excursion.9752 said:

@Excursion.9752 said:Just because something may be hard does not mean its not worth doing. It is something that they could slowly roll out just like adding novelty items to the wardrobe storage. I would trade the novelty storage for the ability to dye my back piece.

Because updating code that's baked into the very core of the game is
not
(in their opinion) worth doing. That means that the cost is too high relative to the possible benefit
for ArenaNet
, in the opinion of the only people who matter for deciding what to work on: ArenaNet.

Why wouldn't you want to update your code to something that's not legacy...

Because as legacy code, it
works
, and as updated code, it will have bugs, and therefore
does not work
.

Disclaimer. I have been a professional programmer for over thirty years.
I have colleagues younger than my career.
I know something about the tradeoffs involved in programming.I to am a programmer for over 17 years. I know its not 35 years but I have some background and frame of reference for what it takes to make what seems to be impossible changes. Here is how it works for me If I give only certain parts of a program the ability to do do something such as "apply a skin" but only limit it to certain areas guess what my clients do? They ask me to create the same capabilities to all the other areas where it can be applied. They do not care about the reasons why or what it will take for me to make said change. If I say something is to hard they will simply say well then I will find someone else who can and will be willing to do it.

Saying that something simply will not work because its updated just implies that everything new is bugged including the new update that we are about to get next week. So why have any updates? While there is some truth to that but that is what patching is for. To simply not update your "core" because there may be bugs tells me that there is something fundamentally wrong that needs looked at anyhow. The game as a whole may benefit from it as well. who knows?

Anet should have never gave us the ability to dye our gliders if they didn't want these types of questions to come to surface. They must have seen this coming. To me its one of those little things that the Devs think that do not matter when in fact its like pimple on a otherwise flawless face. Pretty much everyone has thought to themselves at one time or another, "I wish I could dye my back piece". The bottom line is no one really cares what any update costs or how it effects the companies bottom line. They just simply want to be able to customize all aspects of their character.

This is something that should have been thought of before the release of the wardrobe system. I know they looked at it and decided to go on without it. Maybe even they thought that they would come back and fix it later. But I will tell you nothing looks more cheesy than a person running up to the cliff with their Green Vine - Touched Destroyer Wings jumping off the edge and them flying out and turning purple...

I respect all the hard work that is put into this game but this is one of the most irritating things for me. I wish is was fixed and I am tired of the to hard excuse. I don't get to throw that card in my office I will tell you that right now.

I would argue that pretty much everyone cares what an update costs because that cost impacts every other aspect of development.They have multiple teams working on everything in this game on of which is working on QoL updates. They even have a thread for it
. The money is already being spent. The focus and direction towards this particular problem is what is lacking.

You see this particular thread come and go in these forums all the time well since 2014 when it was introduced. 5 years later and its still not fixed. There is a problem there.

A programmer diving into the big bowl of spaghetti that is gw2 code in order to add dyability to back pieces is not working on code that supports, is necessary for, all of the other teams. Time is money.

The only people who know how much of an impact this reallocation of resources would have on the overall development are the very same people who have said that they have considered the option and found it to pose too negative an impact.

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@Excursion.9752 said:You see this particular thread come and go in these forums all the time well since 2014 when it was introduced. 5 years later and its still not fixed. There is a problem there.

But there's not a problem, that's the issue and that's why it keeps coming up again and again.

They looked at this, they evaluated how much time and effort it would take, they evaluated the trade-off between current work and doing this, and with all the feedback and all of their desire to also dye their own backpacks and etc., etc., they decided it wouldn't be worth it.

Sometimes issues do get settled. You might not accept it. My boss certainly doesn't accept it; I have to walk him through why something is a bad idea even though he wants it time and time again. I have to revisit the same topic about every six months because it keeps coming up. Just because it keeps coming up does not mean it's worth the time and effort - it just means there's a flaw. It's okay for something to be flawed, otherwise things would never get done. The longevity of a flaw does not impact it's worth.

PS - I'm not saying the discussion or conversation should be shut down or people should be castigated for bringing it up. I'm mostly objecting to this general idea of non-acceptance of explanations that seems to be so common. Their explanation is reasonable; it's not a slight or unwillingness to do the work or ignoring customer desires. It's logical and forthright.

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@HaniJani.2105 said:There might already be a thread like this around, but I would like to raise this point to daylight again. It is such a trivial thing, but would make a huge difference for a lot of people, I would imagine. Makes no sense the way it is now from an aesthetic point of view.

Are you looking for new items to be that way or looking for them to update previously released items? I thought I saw something about new ones getting that type of treatment.

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