Staff Thief

[enkidu.5937]

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

@enkidu.5937 said:

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

@enkidu.5937 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:Staff Thief dmg is mediocre at best except Vault, but then Vault is not only easily interruptable it is also easily avoidable because it is the only skill you need to dodge.True. Vault is just bad in 1 vs 1. The enemy doesn't even have to dodge, but just move with some speed buff and change directions every few seconds. :#

@enkidu.5937 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:Staff Thief dmg is mediocre at best except Vault, but then Vault is not only easily interruptable it is also easily avoidable because it is the only skill you need to dodge.True. Vault is just bad in 1 vs 1. The enemy doesn't even have to dodge, but just move with some speed buff and change directions every few seconds. :#

That's not true, only if the vault is misplaced. With swiftness I never been able to avoid a well placed vault with just changing direction, and view versa.Vault: 180 units radius, ¾ secs cast time

Combat speed +33%: 279 units / sec → 209 units in ¾ secs

At the time when vault is activated, the enemy player has a moving radius of 209 units in any direction from his / her starting position. When vault lands, the enemy could be located e. g. 209 units south of his starting location or 209 units north. So, changing directions every few seconds should be enough to make some vaults just miss.

That's more like, "some" but not all. I worded my original post wrong so sorry for that. Though depending who you are, is it worth risking doing that vs a 7/8k that does land.Sry, I didn't mean that solely movement is enough to avoid every single vault (though my post might have implied that :3 ). With "the enemy doesn't even have to dodge" I just meant, you can also avoid vaults with movement. Won't work all the time, so one only "has to" dodge the vaults where one couldn't outsmart the enemy by movement beforehand.

[Vicariuz.1605]

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:We understood the issue with extreme evade and invuln frame chaining with chrono was a serious issue, and while staff thief is no bunker chrono, it is exactly the same idea.

Should we see a change to a side noder that does nothing but evade chain with a vault for 7k here and there?

The idea may be similar but its execution is different, all of Staff DD evades have considerably long after cast that Thief can not avoid so it is a free CC/DMG window.Staff Thief dmg is mediocre at best except Vault, but then Vault is not only easily interruptable it is also easily avoidable because it is the only skill you need to dodge. Most of the professions out-dmg thief in a "DPS contest" meaning that based on what profession you are playing you can afford to just stand and dps for considerably longer periods of time than the Thief. I don't deny Staff DrD has lots of Evades in both Weapons and Traitline, but consider that it is only becuase it is heavily invested in it and is the only thing it can do Evade and Deal mediocre-dmg, if it was

actually

effective or dangerous then we'd see it as a viable/meta side-noder, but it is not because it just does two things only and in a very predictable fasion. No protection, no stealth, no heals, no regen, no combo-fields, no invul. It is just too much of a simple/gimmick-gameplay to be nerfed even further than it already was.

considerably long aftercasts? are u serious? lmfao.

its hilarious how many people in here have no idea what a real staff thief looks or acts like.

feel FREE to record yourself 1v1ing a plat3+ staff/staff thief and posting it for my education.

I am almost sure there even isn't anything such as Plat3 Staff Thief, but in case I am wrong do tell who is that miracle?

Do you pay attention to the leaderboards/streams/ats? There's several, most notably Anya.

Can you point me to some of those streams? I never met a single one in At and out of the names I know I don't see a single one in LB either, so a capture of the video where such thing is visible would be helpful.

https://www.twitch.tv/jonseeboy

Thank you for the video.

Him being NA explains why I don't see any in LB or ATs.

Anyway, this would almost had me convinced, however from observing his fights it is quite clear that even though it is a gimming build it still could not be picked up just by anyone and be as effective as this person. This video proves his skill more than it does the builds usefulness, he spent most of his time in Team-fights instead of side-nodes.

So to sum up my thoughts after this video;1) Apparently S/S DrD build can be more useful than I thought, however unlike other known and useful builds likely can't be just picked up even despite its gimmick nature2) Core S/D in the hands of equally skilled player will still be more effective than this3) Other side-noders are still better side-noders, even he said at least Holo is, because I doubt that if a God of PvP managed to smack someone in Plat2

(the video shows him as P2 not P3, minor detail which means he is likely getting matched vs Gold players)

that it would mean this build is good/meta.

Anyway I asked him personally about it, if I get an answer it would help clear the air more.

All of this has nothing to do with the premise of the thread. This exactly gameplay on bunker chrono was nerfed into the ground.

[Alatar.7364]

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Vicariuz.1605 said:We understood the issue with extreme evade and invuln frame chaining with chrono was a serious issue, and while staff thief is no bunker chrono, it is exactly the same idea.

Should we see a change to a side noder that does nothing but evade chain with a vault for 7k here and there?

The idea may be similar but its execution is different, all of Staff DD evades have considerably long after cast that Thief can not avoid so it is a free CC/DMG window.Staff Thief dmg is mediocre at best except Vault, but then Vault is not only easily interruptable it is also easily avoidable because it is the only skill you need to dodge. Most of the professions out-dmg thief in a "DPS contest" meaning that based on what profession you are playing you can afford to just stand and dps for considerably longer periods of time than the Thief. I don't deny Staff DrD has lots of Evades in both Weapons and Traitline, but consider that it is only becuase it is heavily invested in it and is the only thing it can do Evade and Deal mediocre-dmg, if it was

actually

effective or dangerous then we'd see it as a viable/meta side-noder, but it is not because it just does two things only and in a very predictable fasion. No protection, no stealth, no heals, no regen, no combo-fields, no invul. It is just too much of a simple/gimmick-gameplay to be nerfed even further than it already was.

considerably long aftercasts? are u serious? lmfao.

its hilarious how many people in here have no idea what a real staff thief looks or acts like.

feel FREE to record yourself 1v1ing a plat3+ staff/staff thief and posting it for my education.

I am almost sure there even isn't anything such as Plat3 Staff Thief, but in case I am wrong do tell who is that miracle?

Do you pay attention to the leaderboards/streams/ats? There's several, most notably Anya.

Can you point me to some of those streams? I never met a single one in At and out of the names I know I don't see a single one in LB either, so a capture of the video where such thing is visible would be helpful.

https://www.twitch.tv/jonseeboy

Thank you for the video.

Him being NA explains why I don't see any in LB or ATs.

Anyway, this would almost had me convinced, however from observing his fights it is quite clear that even though it is a gimming build it still could not be picked up just by anyone and be as effective as this person. This video proves his skill more than it does the builds usefulness, he spent most of his time in Team-fights instead of side-nodes.

So to sum up my thoughts after this video;1) Apparently S/S DrD build can be more useful than I thought, however unlike other known and useful builds likely can't be just picked up even despite its gimmick nature2) Core S/D in the hands of equally skilled player will still be more effective than this3) Other side-noders are still better side-noders, even he said at least Holo is, because I doubt that if a God of PvP managed to smack someone in Plat2

(the video shows him as P2 not P3, minor detail which means he is likely getting matched vs Gold players)

that it would mean this build is good/meta.

Anyway I asked him personally about it, if I get an answer it would help clear the air more.

All of this has nothing to do with the premise of the thread. This exactly gameplay on bunker chrono was nerfed into the ground.

Chrono could hold it for eternity without taking pressure, this can do it for few seconds while taking immense pressure.

[Vicariuz.1605]

Bumping so every one here can tell me about how weak staff thief is :)

dont forget ur xd's and lol's

@Alatar.7364 said:I don't deny Staff DrD has lots of Evades in both Weapons and Traitline, but consider that it is only becuase it is heavily invested in it and is the only thing it can do Evade and Deal mediocre-dmg, if it was actually effective or dangerous then we'd see it as a viable/meta side-noder, but it is not because it just does two things only and in a very predictable fasion.

@ZhouX.8742 said:looooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:Staff thief lmao

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:Oh look. Thief's a side noder.

@ZhouX.8742 said:Which makes it useless, that's why it's funny. Thief's prime role is decapper.

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:See above post for the joke.

@Elxdark.9702 said:this build has always been useless and bad but it works in ranked because people will outnumber it so your main goal is go to far and 1v1 the entire game, but the true purpose of this build is simply stack people with you so your team can win fights.

This is why u will never see this build in any monthly or anything close to competitive games because it's easily avoided and it's boring af.

inb4 staff thief wins monthly owait they did LOL, inb4 staff thief is meta owait it is LOL, dont forget inhouses deciding if staff thief is allowed or not XD

[Dantheman.3589]

The problem with this post is- it doesn’t address staff overall. No fundamentals have been addressed and where that’s wrong is that it doesn’t look at conventional thief staff builds. If you played DA staff once you’d realize how broken the damage is- when u hit weakening charge for 10k with spammable 10-15k vaults. The staff line and it’s traits just haven’t been touched in forever because nobody plays staff thief. Just give it similar nerfs s/d thief got and it’s not even close to useful

[Dante.1508]

@Vicariuz.1605 said:We understood the issue with extreme evade and invuln frame chaining with chrono was a serious issue, and while staff thief is no bunker chrono, it is exactly the same idea.

Should we see a change to a side noder that does nothing but evade chain with a vault for 7k here and there?

Its the only real build that works in PvE please don't nerf this as well..

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Vicariuz.1605 said:Bumping so every one here can tell me about how weak staff thief is :)

dont forget ur xd's and lol's

@Alatar.7364 said:I don't deny Staff DrD has lots of Evades in both Weapons and Traitline, but consider that it is only becuase it is heavily invested in it and is the only thing it can do Evade and Deal mediocre-dmg, if it was

actually

effective or dangerous then we'd see it as a viable/meta side-noder, but it is not because it just does two things only and in a very predictable fasion.

@ZhouX.8742 said:looooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:Staff thief lmao

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:Oh look. Thief's a side noder.

@ZhouX.8742 said:Which makes it useless, that's why it's funny. Thief's prime role is decapper.

@Azure The Heartless.3261 said:See above post for the joke.

@Elxdark.9702 said:this build has always been useless and bad but it works in ranked because people will outnumber it so your main goal is go to far and 1v1 the entire game, but the true purpose of this build is simply stack people with you so your team can win fights.

This is why u will never see this build in any monthly or anything close to competitive games because it's easily avoided and it's boring af.

inb4 staff thief wins monthly owait they did LOL, inb4 staff thief is meta owait it is LOL, dont forget inhouses deciding if staff thief is allowed or not XD

Why cant people just rotate away from the point?

Elxdark has already pointed out that the quality of players reflects why this build is successful (in another thred).

Players just mash buttons, dont rotate, and have no teamwork.