maddoctor.2738 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @"Obtena.7952" said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @maddoctor.2738 said:@"Obtena.7952" said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical and it's not the intention of the YOU in PHYW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knite.1542 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knite.1542 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don'tWell, I want to play with high DPS. The dps meter is pretty helpful for finding people with high DPS. I want to learn from mistakes. The DPS meter can show you exactly where mechanics were failed in fight review. I want to know that I am providing proper boon uptime when I play a support class. The DPS meter can show you that. There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knite.1542 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug.If it's only hurting people that use it and you don't use it, why do you want it gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug.If it's only hurting people that use it and you don't use it, why do you want it gone?Remind me where I say I wanted it gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knite.1542 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug.If it's only hurting people that use it and you don't use it, why do you want it gone?Remind me where I say I wanted it gone?You are right, I should not put words in your mouth. I apologize. You said they are toxic, not that you want them gone. Let me rephrase my question. If toxic DPS meters only hurt people using them, and you don't use them, why does it matter to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical and it's not the intention of the YOU in PHYW. Playing how you want doesn't include playing with who you want? Right. You got it backwards here, you are the one that wants to make sure others play how YOU want to play, by not giving players any kind of choice. Talk about hypocritical doing exactly what you are against, forcing others to play how YOU want and not how THEY want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug.If it's only hurting people that use it and you don't use it, why do you want it gone?Remind me where I say I wanted it gone?You are right, I should not put words in your mouth. I apologize. You said they are toxic, not that you want them gone. Let me rephrase my question. If toxic DPS meters only hurt people using them, and you don't use them, why does it matter to you?I should also be careful ... DPS meters can and are use to abuse people. This is not debateable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical and it's not the intention of the YOU in PHYW. Playing how you want doesn't include playing with who you want? Right. You got it backwards here, No, your just putting words in my mouth. I didn't say that. The funny part is that lots of people have figured out who they want to play with and didn't use a DPS meter. Now you're going to tell me you need it to do the same. It's OK ... I've seen this all before ... and people are still managing to succeed in GW2 while playing how they want without them. You go ahead and keep using it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical and it's not the intention of the YOU in PHYW. Playing how you want doesn't include playing with who you want? Right. You got it backwards here, No, your just putting words in my mouth. I didn't say that.You said:Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. You are the one policing others to play how you want them to. You know the "wants" of different players can be at conflict sometimes, it's then that you must use common sense to pick the wants of the reasonable side over the ones of the unreasonable one. If a group asks for specific players and it gets different kinds, they got their wishes disrespected and those joining are the toxic and inconsiderate ones. I have every right to tell others joining my group how I want them to play, it's basic reading comprehension, and every right to boot them if they disrespect that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taygus.4571 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @maddoctor.2738 said:stuffLook, I'm not getting into an argument with you about what I said and what you said, etc ...Playing how you want has nothing to do with using a DPS meter to monitor and judging other players performance, period. That is NOT in contrast with the idea you can team with people that play how you like to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taygus.4571 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug.If it's only hurting people that use it and you don't use it, why do you want it gone?Remind me where I say I wanted it gone?You are right, I should not put words in your mouth. I apologize. You said they are toxic, not that you want them gone. Let me rephrase my question. If toxic DPS meters only hurt people using them, and you don't use them, why does it matter to you?I should also be careful ... DPS meters can and are use to abuse people. This is not debateable. How do they get abused?Is it becosue they get kicked from groups that dont want to play with them since they clearly dont want to play the same way?EditIm a support since I do pretty shity dps and even I get kicked if my support aint up to snuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does.Sure it's wide ... for example, people short-man them all the time. Maybe not all of them ... but the range of what you need to succeed in raids includes a much wider range of performances than you want people to think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taygus.4571 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does.Sure it's wide ... for example, people short-man them all the time. Maybe not all of them ... but the range of what you need to succeed in raids includes a much wider range of performances than you want people to think. You have to be very very good..with(oh shocker) high dps and good boon output and healing to short man them.How do you know if someone is doing well? A DPS meter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does.Sure it's wide ... for example, people short-man them all the time. Maybe not all of them ... but the range of what you need to succeed in raids includes a much wider range of performances than you want people to think. You have to be very very good..with(oh shocker) high dps and good boon output and healing to short man them.How do you know if someone is doing well? A DPS meter.Yeah I know ... which proves that the threshold for success is wide ... I mean, again, I don't need to know if someone is doing well. It is not necessary to judge people's performance in this game to succeed in raids. There are other and more relevant ways to judge the team's performance ... without a DPS meter. This is the fundamental problem with the 'DPS' people ... they think individuals are more important than how the team works. They focus on the wrong things ... the OP makes a good point. But go ahead ... keep telling me things I've seen other metapushers say hundreds of times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taygus.4571 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does.Sure it's wide ... for example, people short-man them all the time. Maybe not all of them ... but the range of what you need to succeed in raids includes a much wider range of performances than you want people to think. You have to be very very good..with(oh shocker) high dps and good boon output and healing to short man them.How do you know if someone is doing well? A DPS meter.Yeah I know ... which proves that the threshold for success is wide ... I mean, again, I don't need to know if someone is doing well. It is not necessary to judge people's performance in this game to succeed in raids. There are other and more relevant ways to judge the team's performance ... without a DPS meter. This is the fundamental problem with the 'DPS' people ... they think individuals are more important than how the team works. But go ahead ... keep telling me things I've seen other metapushers say hundreds of times. What way would you be able to tell if someone in your team idn't doimg enough dps without a meter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knite.1542 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Taygus.4571 said:What way would you be able to tell if someone in your team idn't doimg enough dps without a meter?I think that's one of the biggest conflict points right there. Some players don't care about individual performance as long as the group succeeds. Which is definitely fine for some people and not fine for others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted October 31, 2019 Share Posted October 31, 2019 @Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does.Sure it's wide ... for example, people short-man them all the time. Maybe not all of them ... but the range of what you need to succeed in raids includes a much wider range of performances than you want people to think. You have to be very very good..with(oh shocker) high dps and good boon output and healing to short man them.How do you know if someone is doing well? A DPS meter.Yeah I know ... which proves that the threshold for success is wide ... I mean, again, I don't need to know if someone is doing well. It is not necessary to judge people's performance in this game to succeed in raids. There are other and more relevant ways to judge the team's performance ... without a DPS meter. This is the fundamental problem with the 'DPS' people ... they think individuals are more important than how the team works. But go ahead ... keep telling me things I've seen other metapushers say hundreds of times. What way would you be able to tell if someone in your team idn't doimg enough dps without a meter?I don't need to know that ... it's more important people know the mechanics of a raid than how to pull of their best DPS rotations. What makes you think (apart from some exceptions) that the success of a group depends on a SINGLE PERSON? It doesn't ... the threshold for success is just NOT that narrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted November 1, 2019 Share Posted November 1, 2019 @Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@Taygus.4571 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@maddoctor.2738 said:@Obtena.7952 said:Maybe you like to think Playing How you Want supports the idea that people are monitored and judged by others.That's what "playing how you want" means in this context. I want to play with people of a particular skill level, that's also "playing how you want". And usually those poor souls being "monitored" and "judged" are in the wrong group to begin with. The key word is respectNo, it doesn't. Playing how you want does not mean policing others to play how you think they should play. Again, I'm not telling you who to team with ... but you aren't going to play how you want by making sure others play how you want too. That's hypocritical. We don't really police people though. We just find other people that want to play the same way as us. If we needed to 'police' someone we would just not play with that person. OK ... what I'm saying aligns with how you play ... what's the problem here? Furthermore, why do you need a DPS meter to find people that want to play the same way you do? You don't. It's probably the WORST way to find people that want to play like you do. There are two different lines of discussion going on here. I hope people realize that. clearly you don't understand how much info the dps meter shows.Some people might claim to be a dps role, and want a fast clear but turn out to do less dps than a hesler.without a dps meter, you wouldnt know.No, I'm well aware of what a DPS meter does. I just realize I don't need to know what someone's DPS is. The range of success in this game is wide enough that it's not necessary with some noted exceptions. That's great for you. but for example the range of success i raids..is not so wide, that knowing a persons dps or boon output doeant matter. It absolutely does.Sure it's wide ... for example, people short-man them all the time. Maybe not all of them ... but the range of what you need to succeed in raids includes a much wider range of performances than you want people to think. You have to be very very good..with(oh shocker) high dps and good boon output and healing to short man them.How do you know if someone is doing well? A DPS meter.Yeah I know ... which proves that the threshold for success is wide ... I mean, again, I don't need to know if someone is doing well. It is not necessary to judge people's performance in this game to succeed in raids. There are other and more relevant ways to judge the team's performance ... without a DPS meter. This is the fundamental problem with the 'DPS' people ... they think individuals are more important than how the team works. But go ahead ... keep telling me things I've seen other metapushers say hundreds of times. What way would you be able to tell if someone in your team idn't doimg enough dps without a meter?I don't need to know that ... it's more important people know the mechanics of a raid than how to pull of their best DPS rotations. What makes you think (apart from some exceptions) that the success of a group depends on a SINGLE PERSON? It doesn't ... the threshold for success is just NOT that narrow. You do know that the dps meter shows you whos doing mechanics aswell right?EditAnd can you answer this please@Linken.6345 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:@Obtena.7952 said:@knite.1542 said:There are many many reasons. I am just trying to figure out how the DPS meter existing is hurting people.Well, I gave some ideas about that. You don't believe them. The funny part is that it's not hurting the people that don't use them. /shrug.If it's only hurting people that use it and you don't use it, why do you want it gone?Remind me where I say I wanted it gone?You are right, I should not put words in your mouth. I apologize. You said they are toxic, not that you want them gone. Let me rephrase my question. If toxic DPS meters only hurt people using them, and you don't use them, why does it matter to you?I should also be careful ... DPS meters can and are use to abuse people. This is not debateable. How do they get abused?Is it becosue they get kicked from groups that dont want to play with them since they clearly dont want to play the same way?EditIm a support since I do pretty shity dps and even I get kicked if my support aint up to snuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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