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Potential Future Balance Changes - PvP


Cal Cohen.2358

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:Devs should make changes so pvp isnt a condi garbage clown fiesta, condi weavers,mirages,scourges and burn guards just spam condi garbage on the nodes every conquest match. That's what condi wars 2 is now. And the roamers like thief, well u know their story with condi's. If the devs actually want players to consider gw2 pvp not garbage maybe make toning down condis like ur toning down rampage may be a good idea. Gw2 = spam whatever condi's ur specs running- clear condi that the opponent's are spamming than spam urs again than hope u have more clears for the condi's that are about to be instantly put back on u. Games more frustrating than fun at this point lol

Scourges are only op when the target are boons spamming, however they've died from the last update so now you will see people running around with 25 stacks of might along with other boons.

Its a burst or be burst dumb keyboard faceroll game.

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@Jasonbdj.4021 said:

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:Devs should make changes so pvp isnt a condi garbage clown fiesta, condi weavers,mirages,scourges and burn guards just spam condi garbage on the nodes every conquest match. That's what condi wars 2 is now. And the roamers like thief, well u know their story with condi's. If the devs actually want players to consider gw2 pvp not garbage maybe make toning down condis like ur toning down rampage may be a good idea. Gw2 = spam whatever condi's ur specs running- clear condi that the opponent's are spamming than spam urs again than hope u have more clears for the condi's that are about to be instantly put back on u. Games more frustrating than fun at this point lol

Scourges are only op when the target are boons spamming, however they've died from the last update so now you will see people running around with 25 stacks of might along with other boons.

Its a burst or be burst dumb keyboard faceroll game.

I've seen scourges 1v1 warriors in last few days constant condi bursting and fears anytime warrior got close. The games a condi mess and a very a very bad joke of a pvp state

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:Devs should make changes so pvp isnt a condi garbage clown fiesta, condi weavers,mirages,scourges and burn guards just spam condi garbage on the nodes every conquest match. That's what condi wars 2 is now. And the roamers like thief, well u know their story with condi's. If the devs actually want players to consider gw2 pvp not garbage maybe make toning down condis like ur toning down rampage may be a good idea. Gw2 = spam whatever condi's ur specs running- clear condi that the opponent's are spamming than spam urs again than hope u have more clears for the condi's that are about to be instantly put back on u. Games more frustrating than fun at this point lol

Scourges are only op when the target are boons spamming, however they've died from the last update so now you will see people running around with 25 stacks of might along with other boons.

Its a burst or be burst dumb keyboard faceroll game.

I've seen scourges 1v1 warriors in last few days constant condi bursting and fears anytime warrior got close. The games a condi mess and a very a very bad joke of a pvp state

that because of their braindead op rampage skill giving them stability, it gets converted to fear.

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laughing at all the people that think they know how to balance holo...nerf sustain, nerf dmg, nerf cc, nerf all core traits....really??

the change to photon wall is fine, but heat therapy should remain as is. if you decide to nerf heat therapy, passive portion of healing signet should be nerfed too as some have already stated.

can we talk about why firebrands aren't on the chopping block?

the combination of dmg, support, aegis, weakness, immob, and cc can be just as oppressive (if not more so) than fighting a tools holo.

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@Exalted Quality.8534 said:laughing at all the people that think they know how to balance holo...nerf sustain, nerf dmg, nerf cc, nerf all core traits....really??

the change to photon wall is fine, but heat therapy should remain as is. if you decide to nerf heat therapy, passive portion of healing signet should be nerfed too as some have already stated.

can we talk about why firebrands aren't on the chopping block?

the combination of dmg, support, aegis, weakness, immob, and cc can be just as oppressive (if not more so) than fighting a tools holo.

fb don't do all that at same time, if they pick support they cant dmg, while holo do everything while killing

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:Devs should make changes so pvp isnt a condi garbage clown fiesta, condi weavers,mirages,scourges and burn guards just spam condi garbage on the nodes every conquest match. That's what condi wars 2 is now. And the roamers like thief, well u know their story with condi's. If the devs actually want players to consider gw2 pvp not garbage maybe make toning down condis like ur toning down rampage may be a good idea. Gw2 = spam whatever condi's ur specs running- clear condi that the opponent's are spamming than spam urs again than hope u have more clears for the condi's that are about to be instantly put back on u. Games more frustrating than fun at this point lol

Scourges are only op when the target are boons spamming, however they've died from the last update so now you will see people running around with 25 stacks of might along with other boons.

Its a burst or be burst dumb keyboard faceroll game.

I've seen scourges 1v1 warriors in last few days constant condi bursting and fears anytime warrior got close. The games a condi mess and a very a very bad joke of a pvp state

how many fears can scourge pump out against frenzy spb that has 3 stunremoving tools? how long untill he just gets steamrolled.

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@SeikeNz.3526 said:

@Exalted Quality.8534 said:laughing at all the people that think they know how to balance holo...nerf sustain, nerf dmg, nerf cc, nerf all core traits....really??

the change to photon wall is fine, but heat therapy should remain as is. if you decide to nerf heat therapy, passive portion of healing signet should be nerfed too as some have already stated.

can we talk about why firebrands aren't on the chopping block?

the combination of dmg, support, aegis, weakness, immob, and cc can be just as oppressive (if not more so) than fighting a tools holo.

fb don't do all that at same time, if they pick support they cant dmg, while holo do everything while killing

maybe you not played against a good symbolbrand? what league do you generally play in?

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I meant to post this here, not the other thread...

@"Cal Cohen.3527" Regarding this... "hard CC skills also doing large amounts of damage."

The Condition System could use a 2019 review. Most games used DoT skills, which made most sense and seems much easier to balance around. In wvw sometimes my outgoing conditions are cleansed away almost completely or sometimes they are overly effective against an opponent. There could be a middle ground maybe? https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/29999/let-s-also-fix-up-the-condi-system-before-we-neuter-professions-more

And just so you are aware, I have 6 Daze skills and 3 Stun skills on my Thief skill bar.

The team needs to not just reduce damage of Hard CC skills (and on some movement impairing skills), but there needs to either be (in addition to cutting out a bunch of hard cc skills from weapons and slot skills)...

1- Immunity timers after a player gets hit with 1 (ONE) Hard CC effect and movement impairing effect when the duration ends, or when a player https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun_break out of the effect.

OR...

2- Break Bars on players.

Getting Hard CCed and "snared up" by movement impairing skills and effects over and over and over and over and over... needs to go right away. MOA from https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Humility and https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Toss_Elixir_X NEEDS to be considered a Hard CC skill that is countered by https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun_break.

There are also weapons and slot skills that drop too many different conditions and effects.

The team needs to revamp the condition system sooner than later, because it's not really great at all honestly.

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@Swagger.1459 said:I meant to post this here, not the other thread...

@"Cal Cohen.3527" Regarding this... "hard CC skills also doing large amounts of damage."

The Condition System could use a 2019 review. Most games used DoT skills, which made most sense and seems much easier to balance around. In wvw sometimes my outgoing conditions are cleansed away almost completely or sometimes they are overly effective against an opponent. There could be a middle ground maybe? https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/29999/let-s-also-fix-up-the-condi-system-before-we-neuter-professions-more

And just so you are aware, I have 6 Daze skills and 3 Stun skills on my Thief skill bar.

The team needs to not just reduce damage of Hard CC skills (and on some movement impairing skills), but there needs to either be (in addition to cutting out a bunch of hard cc skills from weapons and slot skills)...

1- Immunity timers after a player gets hit with 1 (ONE) Hard CC effect and movement impairing effect when the duration ends, or when a player https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun_break out of the effect.

OR...

2- Break Bars on players.

Getting Hard CCed and "snared up" by movement impairing skills and effects over and over and over and over and over... needs to go right away. MOA from https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Humility and https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Toss_Elixir_X NEEDS to be considered a Hard CC skill that is countered by https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun_break.

There are also weapons and slot skills that drop too many different conditions and effects.

The team needs to revamp the condition system sooner than later, because it's not really great at all honestly.

Naw the team needs to increase thief skills dps so they can actually burst without backstabbing and actually act like a rogue class maybe as a counter balance remove some of the hard cc on the kit. Also cherry picking a possible build that picks all skills with hard cc can be done on literally every spc/class. A lot of people don't use palm strike, distracting daggers etc. In their builds for example lol

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@"Cal Cohen.3527"

Can we get some kind of "hint" about the major shake up in mind? Class mechanic changes? Class revamps? ..anything, even a small hint would be fine..although I would not blame you for not sharing any info with this playerbase...it does tend to go wild with speculations which get turned in half-truths..

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@Radagascar.6231 said:The fact that Firebrand is not on here at all is INCREDIBLY worrying. You have Staff Thief listed, yet FB is not being looked at? Please don't be so out of touch with what is actually incredibly obnoxious and overpowered to play against. Look. At. Firebrand.

I'm pretty scared of Firebrand, pretty much all variants, and Fire Weaver next patch based on these notes.

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@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Radagascar.6231 said:The fact that Firebrand is not on here at all is INCREDIBLY worrying. You have Staff Thief listed, yet FB is not being looked at? Please don't be so out of touch with what is actually incredibly obnoxious and overpowered to play against. Look. At. Firebrand.

I'm pretty scared of Firebrand, pretty much variants, and Fire Weaver next patch based on these notes.

It's because of you people if they will nerf the wrong things.......

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@mortrialus.3062 said:

@Radagascar.6231 said:The fact that Firebrand is not on here at all is INCREDIBLY worrying. You have Staff Thief listed, yet FB is not being looked at? Please don't be so out of touch with what is actually incredibly obnoxious and overpowered to play against. Look. At. Firebrand.

I'm pretty scared of Firebrand, pretty much variants, and Fire Weaver next patch based on these notes.

These will be top dogs I predict.

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@Arheundel.6451 said:

@Radagascar.6231 said:The fact that Firebrand is not on here at all is INCREDIBLY worrying. You have Staff Thief listed, yet FB is not being looked at? Please don't be so out of touch with what is actually incredibly obnoxious and overpowered to play against. Look. At. Firebrand.

I'm pretty scared of Firebrand, pretty much variants, and Fire Weaver next patch based on these notes.

It's because of you people if they will nerf the wrong things.......

Haha riiiiigggghhhhttttt! Cuz ur better lol.

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@Counter Terrorist.7421 said:Well unless you give us a viable elite besides rampage after these nerfs i rather reroll another class that has utility skills in all slots until a elite skill is added again. But never the less my war and I had a good run. I guess I get to revisit Guardian or Revenant to make use of that gear somehow.

Their iteration of rampage will be garbage and still be more useful than their other elites. It's great rampage keeps its cc potential but means little when its autos and one other skill are the only damage follow up options lol plus with condi pressure so high these days the fact ur licked out of all ur cleansing utilities was a decent drawback. The coefficients could have been dropped 30% and call it a day and focus on other op specs like fb etc.Such large coefficients alterations never end well and just end up with further fixes wasting more time.

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@Arheundel.6451 said:It's because of you people if they will nerf the wrong things.......

He takes one break from suggesting Engineer nerfs and suddenly the bad guy, haha. He's right you know, Firebrand is being stacked very commonly in coordinated groups, Fire Weaver potential as dominant side node looking bright as well, I have no problem with that but they shouldn't be dismissed. Ranked queue isn't the only PvP feature worth balancing

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@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@Counter Terrorist.7421 said:Well unless you give us a viable elite besides rampage after these nerfs i rather reroll another class that has utility skills in all slots until a elite skill is added again. But never the less my war and I had a good run. I guess I get to revisit Guardian or Revenant to make use of that gear somehow.

Their iteration of rampage will be garbage and still be more useful than their other elites. It's great rampage keeps its cc potential but means little when its autos and one other skill are the only damage follow up options lol plus with condi pressure so high these days the fact ur licked out of all ur cleansing utilities was a decent drawback. The coefficients could have been dropped 30% and call it a day and focus on other op specs like fb etc.Such large coefficients alterations never end well and just end up with further fixes wasting more time.

Agree that change to rampage will not end well. Now my first char in Gw2 was a warrior 2013 and I've seen what happens when anet decides to ruin the spec and over-nerf it. It ends up collecting dust in the char selection for a year or two until Anet starts giving it some love again. The class is extremely telegraphed so the cc it has is not even enough against really competent players there's simply to much evade/dodge ability's paired with easy get out any situation tricks to get CC stun locked to death if you have any decency to actually evade some of the '' must dodge ability's / evade ability's'' As of such with this damage nerf coming up I will personally re-roll for a uncertain amount of time until the buffs arrives. This is a smiter's boon patch.

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@Arheundel.6451 said:

@Radagascar.6231 said:The fact that Firebrand is not on here at all is INCREDIBLY worrying. You have Staff Thief listed, yet FB is not being looked at? Please don't be so out of touch with what is actually incredibly obnoxious and overpowered to play against. Look. At. Firebrand.

I'm pretty scared of Firebrand, pretty much variants, and Fire Weaver next patch based on these notes.

It's because of you people if they will nerf the wrong things.......

I wouldnt be scared for firebrand because gurdian's base kit is strong. They could effectively nerf the heck out of only the firebrand line and it would still do fine because the base it sits ontop of ifs one of the most if not the most solid ideal situation that a core profession should be in. A few others are close like warrior and ranger. But in terms of balanced guardian at its core is near perfect always has strengths and weaknesses based on how / what you build. But what ever you build into is always very effective.

You should be worried for firebrand only if they start over nerfing the core aspects of guardian and not firebrand itself which is where most of the issues are.

In relation to fire weaver its more so balancing the damage with the evades properly a big issue right now is skill that either do a ton of damage and hard cc at the same time or skills/combs that allow a person to strike while being safe with evades.

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@Cal Cohen.2358 said:RampageRampage has been overperforming since the initial change that brought its cooldown to 90 seconds, and continues to with the cooldown at 120 seconds. Rather than just bumping up the cooldown again, we’re looking to address an underlying issue: hard CC skills also doing large amounts of damage. This is something that we’re looking to do across the board for the future update, and we see Rampage as a good opportunity to see the idea in action.

  • Rampage skills have been adjusted as follows
    • Kick: Power coefficient reduced from 1.2 to 0.01 in PvP only
    • Throw Boulder: Power coefficient reduced from 2.0 to 0.01 in PvP only
    • Seismic Leap: Power coefficient reduced from 1.6 to 0.01 in PvP only

Nice. Notice a problem just like 100 years too late and then make decent fixes to the skill that should have been done when the problems initially started. Now we have the fix coming but another question is: what the frick is taking so long with it?!?!?! C'mon Anet Step up your game and start actually acting!

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It would make it approachable to do pvp again if it wasn't just some spam fest that is why I stopped doing it when HoT came out it only got worse as PoF came out too. Not to mention they need to just get rid of the condi spamming too bad enough in pvp and even worse in wvw. Only reason wvw can even be done with all that condi spam is that firebrands and scrapper tome and med kit spamming out cleanses. Not much skill involved just whoever doesn't get skill lagged out wins lol.

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