WvW Support Mirage Zergling: Feedback and Theory Crafting Request

[Crow.2851]

Hello Fellow WvW Mesmers,

Preface2018-2019 has been rough for WvW Mesmers patch wise, leaving a lot of builds off the table and prohibiting the class from making meaningful contributions to WvW zerg fights. I've seen a few GS Power Mirage builds floating around, but those aren't what I'm looking for. I don't think that Mesmer can really compete with the AoE damage output of other classes commonly found in zerg fights, so I wanted to make a build that leaned harder into the unique support tools that Mesmer has access to. Those being personal invulnerability, boon up-time, veil, mass invisibility, and Melee range boon removal. Yes... that does mean I'm seriously considering Dune Cloak.

The BuildFor a long time I've wanted to experiment with Inspiring Distortion + Desert Distortion + Blurred Inscriptions for small bursts of invulnerability and extra group aegis. With the recent changes to Auspicious Anguish, and the engine provided by F4 + Signet of Illusions, I thought this build would be a good way to test invulnerability against zerg spikes. Will it be gimmicky and unreliable? Most likely, but that's kind of where I feel Mesmer is at in this particular game mode. Dune Cloak adds an extra boon strip to melee pushes, and because I'm really just a veil and rally bot for my squad I didn't see much purpose in Elusive Mind or Infinite Horizons. Traited Mass Invisibility is an underrated way to protect downs and clean up your zerg's tail. I would rather be running Portal over Illusion of Life, but it's called for more often by commanders.

Changes and Improvements1) What utilities would you like to use more as a zerg support Mesmer? Not exclusively to this build, I'm curious about what you think Mesmer can contribute.2) If the build had more illusion generation would Illusionary Defense be a better choice? Most zergs will kill you outright so it might not be worth it.3) What runes/sigils might you use for this weird build? Playing a healer isn't my forte, so I don't know if better support runes/sigils could be chosen.

TLDRCan a full support Mirage in WvW make meaningful contributions to a zerg?

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PiwAw2ZlVwEZZMFGKeOT1PbA-zVZYPR3UF8YYnRmKhulBecA-wThe armor layout is on my poor kitten budget, but would be more effective with full Minstrel.

[Gryxis.6950]

I don't think support mesmer can contribute in any meaningful way in a zerg as of now. However i would suggest taking at least one mantra and restorative mantras instead of medic's feedback. the amount of time you would make good use of medic's feedback is rather low, while restorative mantras would heal for 3k on 5 people (so 15k in total) and you can proc it quite often. also, mantra of concentration and resolve can always be useful.

the diversion synergy is quite nice though, the aegis share is really what makes it somewhat worth it. However, you do not get much value out of desert distortion. distortion does not grant you dune cloak, and your ambush skills aren't really that useful in a zerg settings, chaos vortex would probably get reflected and mirage thrust won't probably interrupt anyone due to stab, plus its damage is negligible. and the probability that you have any illusion alive when shattering + the fact that you would have to go seek those mirage mirrors from the shatter makes the mirage mirror aspect of the trait worthless. mirage mantle would probably be more useful.

also do not get rid of master of manipulation for illusionary defense. master of manipulation gives superspeed to your allies and it's one of the rare useful thing you could give. this trait + the leadership runes would make your elite useful even in the middle of the fight. Just taking mirage mantle instead of desert distortion would probably help you survive long enough, along with your defensive stats, your dodges and invulnerability.

I do not think this build would be more effective on full minstrel, you do not get much use out of concentration as you do not give a lot of boons. clerical is actually quite a strong contender for this build. the toughness makes you quite tanky, thanks to your power you do a little bit of damage and it boosts your healing from healing prism, and you naturally get more healing from cleric than from minstrel. You might want to throw some nomad with it tho to get more vitality (or some minstrel). I don't think celestial is quite the fit though.

Finally one last thing, while sigil of absorption on sword is a good idea since you get access to your daze on sword quite often, and you have another cc on your focus, i don't think it's good on staff. you get access to your daze on staff once every 35s, and with all the stab from the guards it is likely it wouldn't interrupt anyone. i'm not sure what other sigil would be better though, maybe of renewal ?

Overall I still think that power gs would be more useful, if you take portal/veil/mass invi with it. If you have sigil of endurance on the greatsword and desert distortion, you have a lot of access to your ambush (and a lot of clones generation with deceptive evasion), so the damage you dish out is actually on par with the scourges. You obviously don't get access to all the corrupts but having a portal, veil, or mass invi is still a huge amount of utility. I personally even run with a mantra of concentration or of resolve when we're lacking of guardians. You just have to be careful to not die because of the retalation though. But if you really want to go support go for it !

[AliamRationem.5172]

This seems a bit like trying to force a square peg into a round hole. Mirage just isn't a team player. You aren't providing meaningful boons or heals. Everything you can do, the zerg favorites do it better.

You should play a roamer. Enjoy it while it lasts. With the upcoming staff "fix", every condi weapon will have been nerfed into the ground and the only thing left propping up the class will be mirage cloak...until they "fix" that, too! Then we'll all be left playing power shatter burst roamers that die if you sneeze at them. Lovely!

[SloRules.3560]

I'm sorry, but this is just bad. If mods remove me for this, so be it, but this build does absolutely nothing better than someone else.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PiwAw2ZlZwmghinzk+zG-z1QYvIY7T6YnRPygMVC+dW8bzC-w

I wouldn't even worry about minstrel. mes doesn't have enough boon output to warrant concentration. spam pain mantra for heals, consider taking stab mantra for obvious reasons. dune cloak, if it actually does remove stab and prot at the top of boon removal order (someone else tested this but i'm assuming its true), is a great choice and honestly would not be surprised if more groups start to run this. using absorption on sword I think is fine, could even get daze mantra for max rips (gotta only use it when pirate shipping or on their backline, basically anytime you suspect ppl are stab-less). wouldn't fully endorse that tho lol. if you haven't already definitely give stamina sigil a test. its ridiculous.

[Gryxis.6950]

@"Stand The Wall.6987" said:http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PiwAw2ZlZwmghinzk+zG-z1QYvIY7T6YnRPygMVC+dW8bzC-w

I wouldn't even worry about minstrel. mes doesn't have enough boon output to warrant concentration. spam pain mantra for heals, consider taking stab mantra for obvious reasons. dune cloak, if it actually does remove stab and prot at the top of boon removal order (someone else tested this but i'm assuming its true), is a great choice and honestly would not be surprised if more groups start to run this. using absorption on sword I think is fine, could even get daze mantra for max rips (gotta only use it when pirate shipping or on their backline, basically anytime you suspect ppl are stab-less). wouldn't fully endorse that tho lol. if you haven't already definitely give stamina sigil a test. its ridiculous.

I'm not sure about protection but stability is definitely the first boon dune cloak rips

[Dawdler.8521]

@Crow.2851 said:TLDRCan a full support Mirage in WvW make meaningful contributions to a zerg?TLDRNo.

The boonshare is no longer needed, the portal is niche and the veil has been replaced by gyro blasting. Only the focus pull see practical use but even then commanders appreciate it maybe 1 out of 20 engagements.

Personally I still consider the mesmer to be much better as focus party/flanker, gs power specced. Unlike certain other ranged flanker specs such as the ranger that the zerg doesnt want either, the mesmer can punch an unblockable hole into the zerg. You cant reflect the autoattack and you generally wont see 3/4 coming.

[Cyninja.2954]

@Crow.2851 said:Can a full support Mirage in WvW make meaningful contributions to a zerg?

Here is a couple of questions you need to ask yourself when creating a squad build for WvW:1.) What am I providing to the squad?2.) How well can I provide my support in a combat situation?3.) Can any class provide what I am providing, but better?4.) Is what I am providing required? Is it scalable, aka are multiple of my class useful?

Let's answer those shall we?1.) Veil, Illusion of life, portal, mass invisVeil - does not stack, poor mans public squad fake push or corner push option. mediocre usefulIllusion of Life - even less useful after the nerf. almost uselessportal - still very usefulmass invisibility - useful in smaller scale fights

2.) clones are a very huge detriment and pretty much unreliable in big blob fights as mechanic

3.) Veil/Mass infivs - engis and thiefs do it better, way betterIllusion of Life - guardian has MI, other healers have better rezz abilitiesportal - the only reason to bring a mesmer

4.) no, the only thing you need a mesmer for is portal or maybe a veil. for those 1-2 mesmers per 50 man squad suffice.

Once you answer those questions, you should pretty much realize why mesmer is pretty much dead in squad wvw atm. At most you take 1, maybe 2 per 50 man squad for the portals. That's it.