Jump to content
  • Sign Up

Double Firebrand Double Herald


Monkey See.1498

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 88
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

@Galvin.2704 said:

@"Cal Cohen.2358" said:With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver.

I always thought that Weaver was one of the most balanced elite spe in competitives modes (compared to other overperforming ones)

I guess I was wrong since it's also in the sights apparently.

Weaver is probably the best 1v1 spec in the game right now. It does have some weaknesses notably how slow the meta build is since it can't afford lightning flash, probably the slowest in the game with only a minor amount of swiftness, air 2, and that's it.

But any build that can potentially stack 45 stacks of burning onto a target, effectively doing
18,000 damage per second in burning
, probably deserves a serious look in.

Can you please stop taking stuff out of context by clipping a tiny 12-second segment? That necro was using minions with Blood Magic and
Unholy Martyr
trait which
transfers conditions from allies to the necro
when he enters the shroud, in this case it transferred condis from his minions to him. So Grim didn't stack 45 stacks of burning, it's not an issue with the Fire Weaver build.

Here's the link to the stream
twitch.tv/videos/503737460
, the fight starts at about
02:40:35
, he talks about the burning and trait interaction after the the fight was over. (for anyone who wants to know what actually happened there)

@Grimjack.8130 look how they clip your stream to witch-hunt the weaver, it's actually funny.

Thanks a lot, I was wondering how 45 stacks were possible so quickly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:Support firebrand is more of a big picture issue. It's definitely the dominant support build, which pushes out some other builds that just don't bring as much to the table. This is something we're looking at for the larger update, but isn't really solvable with a few quick changes in the short-term. There are some shaves we can do if support fb is overperforming relative to the power of the meta, but it's likely to continue being the best support build for the time being.

BUT..... you want to gut every other class that has the potential to kill FB's (warrior/thief/mes). Furthermore, lets allow symbol FB to run the support/dmg meta for an unsaid period of time.

I had a positive outlook when you joined the balance team bro but this comment..... typical cookie cutter anet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:Also let's just be honest here.

Any competent DPS + two Firebrands is going to be an overtuned comp. FB self synergy is off the charts.

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:Also let's just be honest here.

Any competent DPS + two Firebrands is going to be an overtuned comp. FB self synergy is off the charts.

I'd say

1 Firebrand is more secure than single or double herald. Double herald is absolutely more secure than double Firebrand.

One of the things about meta rev at the moment is it's sheer capacity to hard stop incoming damage while it gets support, or even before it needs support.

Let's say you're in sword+sword shiro and about to be focused you can:

Riposting shadows > dodge > dodge > unrelenting assault > riposting shadows > weapon swap > legend swap > dodge from sigil of energy > warding rift > facet of darkness+gaze of darkness > surge of the mists (potentially 2 seconds of you land the knockdown) > facet of light+infused light > force an enemy dodge with facet of chaos+chaotic release > natural dodge > warding rift > weapon swap > legend swap > unrelenting assault > riposting shadows you can keep going.

That's a hilariously over the top defensive rotation, probably 25 seconds of fighting right there and you're only vulnerable for I estimate about 5 of it (at work can't crunch the exact numbers).

And between Riposting Shadows, Gaze of Darkness, Empty Vessel Legend Swap, that's 6 different stun breaks in that rotation.

And in a real fight you aren't going to just chain defenses nonstop back to back to back like that. You'll use something like Riposting Shadows or Surge of the Mists to gain a positional advantage so you don't have to use many more defenses. You'll kite while using Warding rift while you get behind line of sight or take a jumping puzzle to safety.

And that's not even counting porting away with Phase Traversal to a distant enemy or even an object like a gate or treb.

You look at something you could theoretically build a team fight damage dealer around like a core necro, Holosmith, reaper, warrior, berserker, yeah they have some safety measures, some emergency tools but they just are not competing with that on any level.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Cal Cohen.2358" said:Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly. With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver. Essentially we're going to keep a close eye on the meta builds that aren't seeing any changes, but we want to see how the new meta shakes out first. Like I've said previously, we have the opportunity to make additional changes outside of the usual balance cadence if something terrible happens.

Support firebrand is more of a big picture issue. It's definitely the dominant support build, which pushes out some other builds that just don't bring as much to the table. This is something we're looking at for the larger update, but isn't really solvable with a few quick changes in the short-term. There are some shaves we can do if support fb is overperforming relative to the power of the meta, but it's likely to continue being the best support build for the time being.

This is why I haven't played in months. It's the same type of spin and deflection that's plagued pvp and run off so many. I'm playing WoW classic and it has more build diversity and balance than this.

The most pathetic spin is "rev is a class favored more by the best players". First of all, all the best players left the game. Even for the remaining "best players", this quote is just desperate spin. Why would the best players favor one class if Anet was doing it's job correctly??? That quote makes NO SENSE. You're basically admitting that Rev's are OP with this attempt at spin, and you don't even know it.

Second, why would you need to "keep a close eye on it"? Don't you see the games and play yourself??? How can you not factor the proposed balance changes and see what's going to be obvious. Do you literally have no intuition about your own game and the ability to model what's going to happen??? This isn't a new release. POF has been out forever. How many times now have you had to change things and you STILL can't get it right??? You STILL need more time???

All you guys do with patches is try to fix one thing and break two others while ignoring the obvious problems. Look how many patches/nerfs were needed to Mesmers in the past few years. How did mesmers get out of internal testing TWO years ago WITHOUT any of these nerfs??? Yet they are STILL overperforming.

Firebrand has been the dominant support spec FOREVER yet NOTHING has been done in years, yet you are still desperately spinning and saying you need more time. How can you ADMIT it's the best support build, but have done NOTHING to solve that in the upcoming patch. Again, how many more years do you need in PoF's life cycle???

Didn't you just gut Scourge and make them totally extinct in sPvP because you thought they were OP when the stats clearly showed FAR less dominance by Scourge in sPvP prior to the last gutting? Why is it ok to totally gut one profession and limit the options for players in PvP and yet do NOTHING for years on a support spec that you admit is OP and will remain even LONGER OP per your own admission.

Third, I guarantee the next patch will have the same mistakes as every patch in the last couple years. Things that were totally missed because you guys don't even internally test (or do a bad job of finding problems that the player base finds 10 minutes after patch release). Go back and look at some of the things that got through internal testing in the past. It's unbelievable that someone even spent 10 minutes testing things. The rune patch was especially hilarious, but I remember a change made to Epidemic that literally only required someone internally to cast it one time to see the problem that had to be hotfixed.

The bottom line is this game is plagued by total failures at internal testing and even slower response to balance issues...even ones that are clear as day and ADMITTED...as in this post...but NOTHING is done...just excuses..."wait and see" spin...and deflection.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly. With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver. Essentially we're going to keep a close eye on the meta builds that aren't seeing any changes, but we want to see how the new meta shakes out first. Like I've said previously, we have the opportunity to make additional changes outside of the usual balance cadence if something terrible happens.

Support firebrand is more of a big picture issue. It's definitely the dominant support build, which pushes out some other builds that just don't bring as much to the table. This is something we're looking at for the larger update, but isn't really solvable with a few quick changes in the short-term. There are some shaves we can do if support fb is overperforming relative to the power of the meta, but it's likely to continue being the best support build for the time being.

When you do that can you please not nerf dps FB or core? Last balance patch you guys aimed to lower FB support capacity you removed single aegis from ToC and left the AOE one...

If you nerf virtues or honor, you will nerf already under performing builds. And if you kill tomes, dps FB does not become viable.

I would focus on elite mantra and instant Rez (which should be removed).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

this probably wouldn't be an issue if we weren't allowed to Class Stack the same spec in the first place.

Rev Alone and Fb aren't an issue at all....however when you run 2 of each then that becomes a major fucking problem. Remove the ability from people being able to stack 2+ of the same spec in games. This would probably push for a different meta and shows other spec getting played more in order to "counter" other specs.

Imagine a monthly where people aren't stacking mesmer/fb/revs? Would probably be great because just one is fine but when you have 2 over performing specs in a game that's when it becomes stupid.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you nerf Rev, can you nerf Shiro plz ?Not like you always do by nerf global rev and compensate Shiro again and again (or Shiro's build with sword offhand for exemple).Can we play Revenant and not Shironant one day ? Shiro is mandatory for any meta build since rev's creation...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Neil.3825" said:If you nerf Rev, can you nerf Shiro plz ?Not like you always do by nerf global rev and compensate Shiro again and again (or Shiro's build with sword offhand for exemple).Can we play Revenant and not Shironant one day ? Shiro is mandatory for any meta build since rev's creation...

I see a few people saying this every now and then, but Rev builds that use Shiro outside of Glint-Herald are not considered OP. They are all considered either useless or meme tier at best.

Shiro/Jalis - MemeShiro/Kalla - PvE / TrashShiro/Mallyx - MemeShiro/Ventari - Trash

Now ask yourself "Would Shiro still be strong if it didn't get +28~35% damage buffs from Herald traits + Burst of strength"?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Monkey See.1498 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:Also let's just be honest here.

Any competent DPS + two Firebrands is going to be an overtuned comp. FB self synergy is off the charts.

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:Also let's just be honest here.

Any competent DPS + two Firebrands is going to be an overtuned comp. FB self synergy is off the charts.

I'd say

1 Firebrand is more secure than single or double herald. Double herald is absolutely more secure than double Firebrand.

One of the things about meta rev at the moment is it's sheer capacity to hard stop incoming damage while it gets support, or even before it needs support.

Let's say you're in sword+sword shiro and about to be focused you can:

Riposting shadows > dodge > dodge > unrelenting assault > riposting shadows > weapon swap > legend swap > dodge from sigil of energy > warding rift > facet of darkness+gaze of darkness > surge of the mists (potentially 2 seconds of you land the knockdown) > facet of light+infused light > force an enemy dodge with facet of chaos+chaotic release > natural dodge > warding rift > weapon swap > legend swap > unrelenting assault > riposting shadows you can keep going.

That's a hilariously over the top defensive rotation, probably 25 seconds of fighting right there and you're only vulnerable for I estimate about 5 of it (at work can't crunch the exact numbers).

And between Riposting Shadows, Gaze of Darkness, Empty Vessel Legend Swap, that's 6 different stun breaks in that rotation.

And in a real fight you aren't going to just chain defenses nonstop back to back to back like that. You'll use something like Riposting Shadows or Surge of the Mists to gain a positional advantage so you don't have to use many more defenses. You'll kite while using Warding rift while you get behind line of sight or take a jumping puzzle to safety.

And that's not even counting porting away with Phase Traversal to a distant enemy or even an object like a gate or treb.

You look at something you could theoretically build a team fight damage dealer around like a core necro, Holosmith, reaper, warrior, berserker, yeah they have some safety measures, some emergency tools but they just are not competing with
that
on any level.

So when you lay it down like that, is it really a high skill cap class? I mean sure awareness helps and getting use to muscle memory will hold you back for a bit, but yeah there is crazy amount of defensive combos there (and offensive) if done correctly

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

I see a few people saying this every now and then, but Rev builds that use Shiro outside of Glint-Herald are not considered OP. They are all considered either useless or meme tier at best.

Shiro/Jalis - MemeShiro/Kalla - PvE / TrashShiro/Mallyx - MemeShiro/Ventari - Trash

Now ask yourself "Would Shiro still be strong if it didn't get +28~35% damage buffs from Herald traits + Burst of strength"?

Shiro/Jalis - Meme , because Jalis IS a meme itself ?Shiro/Kalla - PvE / Trash , because Kalla is a trash leg ?Shiro/Mallyx - Meme , we can say the same here for Glint/MallyxShiro/Ventari - Trash , I agree with you but it's just 2 legends without synergy...

Shiro is not just a great offensive legend, with Phase Traversal and Riposting Shadows he got the 2 best defensive utility of the profession (funny for a offensive legend, huh ?). This is why Shiro is OP.Look 2 sec at Jalis (our great defensive legend lol), he has no offensive impact (ok) and less defense than Shiro (not ok). If Shiro was less an escape machine, his damage will be fine.Glint is just here to sublimate Shiro.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Ouk.5914" said:this probably wouldn't be an issue if we weren't allowed to Class Stack the same spec in the first place.

Rev Alone and Fb aren't an issue at all....however when you run 2 of each then that becomes a major kitten problem. Remove the ability from people being able to stack 2+ of the same spec in games. This would probably push for a different meta and shows other spec getting played more in order to "counter" other specs.

Imagine a monthly where people aren't stacking mesmer/fb/revs? Would probably be great because just one is fine but when you have 2 over performing specs in a game that's when it becomes stupid.

The problem to solving class imbalance is not to prevent class stacking. If anything, class stacking reveals how dysfunctional the balance is, since a few builds can offer, everything and have better synergy stacking that same build, instead of needing other classes to add synergy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Cal Cohen.2358" said:Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly. With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver. Essentially we're going to keep a close eye on the meta builds that aren't seeing any changes, but we want to see how the new meta shakes out first. Like I've said previously, we have the opportunity to make additional changes outside of the usual balance cadence if something terrible happens.

I guess that's the Dev Version of "PSA: Don't be mad because Rev outskilled you." :expressionless:

While it's true that the full potential of Rev is usually only reached by mechanical top players, that doesn't mean it's not overperforming. Many top players don't inherently favour that class, they roll it because it has consistently been one of top the teamfight classes over years. The spam of portengages and the near endless chain of dodges and blocks combined with one of the best heals in the game is definitely worth looking at. Rev might not be broken on its own, but it stacks very well and has extremely high synergy with FB since the lack of stability and cleanse is probably the only downside of Rev and an FB (or even two) completely changes that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly. With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver. Essentially we're going to keep a close eye on the meta builds that aren't seeing any changes, but we want to see how the new meta shakes out first. Like I've said previously, we have the opportunity to make additional changes outside of the usual balance cadence if something terrible happens.

Well mainly, it's Herald meta that is stacked. The rest of the class outside of Herald is either meme-tier or never stacked. The big reason it is played by organized teams is because Rev in general has poor sustain but excellent engage and burst damage thanks to being able to stack multiple damage mods. When supported by a FB to make up for the sustain/condi weakness issue it can end up feeling like the class has no downside in the hands of a team built around it.
Alone without support, most people consider the class pretty balanced.

A way to address the problem would thus be:-Forceful persistence. -> Reduced to 8% upkeep 2% Herald facets-Burst of strength -> Reduced to 10% damage buff on hit-Reinforced Potency -> Reduced to 0.75% damage per boon*Reasoning: Toning down Herald damage mods across the board addresses the issue that Herald gets too much free damage, and keeping it this way would mean the rest of the Rev class keeps getting nerfed around it.

-Swift termination -> Reduced to 15% damage buff*Reasoning: This is the one nerf outside Herald that is mainly needed because of double stacking Revs. Two Revs bursting the same target will gain the bonus from swift term way too quickly. This will also make the utility/sustain traits Brutality and Assassin's Annihilation more viable by being less outshined.

-Cleansing channel -> 2 conditions removed*Reasoning: This is a slight buff to Revs sustain that would make the above nerfs hurt less for Revs that are solo queuing ranked. When Revs have an FB in an organized team, they can just fall back for cleanses/Resistance, however this does not exist in Solo Q very much.

The TL;DR of it is that Herald damage mods were way overbuffed in the Herald rework a year ago or so, and it's really annoying to keep seeing all Core legends / traits / Renegade getting constantly nerfed due to an issue that is primarily due to how Herald can stack damage mods over +30%.

I'm guessing that its just like with scourge where FB held it up and made it real strong combo.

If thats the case we definitely should do these nerfs to FB.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Axl.8924 said:

@Cal Cohen.2358 said:Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly. With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver. Essentially we're going to keep a close eye on the meta builds that aren't seeing any changes, but we want to see how the new meta shakes out first. Like I've said previously, we have the opportunity to make additional changes outside of the usual balance cadence if something terrible happens.

Well mainly, it's Herald meta that is stacked. The rest of the class outside of Herald is either meme-tier or never stacked. The big reason it is played by organized teams is because Rev in general has poor sustain but excellent engage and burst damage thanks to being able to stack multiple damage mods. When supported by a FB to make up for the sustain/condi weakness issue it can end up feeling like the class has no downside in the hands of a team built around it.
Alone without support, most people consider the class pretty balanced.

A way to address the problem would thus be:-Forceful persistence. -> Reduced to 8% upkeep 2% Herald facets-Burst of strength -> Reduced to 10% damage buff on hit-Reinforced Potency -> Reduced to 0.75% damage per boon*Reasoning: Toning down Herald damage mods across the board addresses the issue that Herald gets too much free damage, and keeping it this way would mean the rest of the Rev class keeps getting nerfed around it.

-Swift termination -> Reduced to 15% damage buff*Reasoning: This is the one nerf outside Herald that is mainly needed because of double stacking Revs. Two Revs bursting the same target will gain the bonus from swift term way too quickly. This will also make the utility/sustain traits Brutality and Assassin's Annihilation more viable by being less outshined.

-Cleansing channel -> 2 conditions removed*Reasoning: This is a slight buff to Revs sustain that would make the above nerfs hurt less for Revs that are solo queuing ranked. When Revs have an FB in an organized team, they can just fall back for cleanses/Resistance, however this does not exist in Solo Q very much.

The TL;DR of it is that Herald damage mods were way overbuffed in the Herald rework a year ago or so, and it's really annoying to keep seeing all Core legends / traits / Renegade getting constantly nerfed due to an issue that is primarily due to how Herald can stack damage mods over +30%.

I'm guessing that its just like with scourge where FB held it up and made it real strong combo.

If thats the case we definitely should do these nerfs to FB.

This^Maybe nerfing fb instead of always destroying the builds that synergize well with it all while not touching fb might be a good change no? I don't play rev much and don't find much issues fighting them but I read a lot of post even by people who want it nerfed stating every build rev has but power shiro being meme or almost useless so maybe nerfing power shiro build which is the only viable build the whole class has isn't the best idea. I don't kno but if u guys do shave power rev down a bit maybe do it when u have some reasonable and significant changes for the rest of the rev class so u don't delete it completely.Just a thought.Also as I said the op thread sounds more like a fb issue than rev.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@Axl.8924 said:

@"Cal Cohen.2358" said:Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly. With that said it's definitely strong, and it's on our watch list following the next balance update along with symbol firebrand and weaver. Essentially we're going to keep a close eye on the meta builds that aren't seeing any changes, but we want to see how the new meta shakes out first. Like I've said previously, we have the opportunity to make additional changes outside of the usual balance cadence if something terrible happens.

Well mainly, it's Herald meta that is stacked. The rest of the class outside of Herald is either meme-tier or never stacked. The big reason it is played by organized teams is because Rev in general has poor sustain but excellent engage and burst damage thanks to being able to stack multiple damage mods. When supported by a FB to make up for the sustain/condi weakness issue it can end up feeling like the class has no downside in the hands of a team built around it.
Alone without support, most people consider the class pretty balanced.

A way to address the problem would thus be:-Forceful persistence. -> Reduced to 8% upkeep 2% Herald facets-Burst of strength -> Reduced to 10% damage buff on hit-Reinforced Potency -> Reduced to 0.75% damage per boon*Reasoning: Toning down Herald damage mods across the board addresses the issue that Herald gets too much free damage, and keeping it this way would mean the rest of the Rev class keeps getting nerfed around it.

-Swift termination -> Reduced to 15% damage buff*Reasoning: This is the one nerf outside Herald that is mainly needed because of double stacking Revs. Two Revs bursting the same target will gain the bonus from swift term way too quickly. This will also make the utility/sustain traits Brutality and Assassin's Annihilation more viable by being less outshined.

-Cleansing channel -> 2 conditions removed*Reasoning: This is a slight buff to Revs sustain that would make the above nerfs hurt less for Revs that are solo queuing ranked. When Revs have an FB in an organized team, they can just fall back for cleanses/Resistance, however this does not exist in Solo Q very much.

The TL;DR of it is that Herald damage mods were way overbuffed in the Herald rework a year ago or so, and it's really annoying to keep seeing all Core legends / traits / Renegade getting constantly nerfed due to an issue that is primarily due to how Herald can stack damage mods over +30%.

I'm guessing that its just like with scourge where FB held it up and made it real strong combo.

If thats the case we definitely should do these nerfs to FB.

This^Maybe nerfing fb instead of always destroying the builds that synergize well with it all while not touching fb might be a good change no? I don't play rev much and don't find much issues fighting them but I read a lot of post even by people who want it nerfed stating every build rev has but power shiro being meme or almost useless so maybe nerfing power shiro build which is the only viable build the whole class has isn't the best idea. I don't kno but if u guys do shave power rev down a bit maybe do it when u have some reasonable and significant changes for the rest of the rev class so u don't delete it completely.Just a thought.Also as I said the op thread sounds more like a fb issue than rev.

Yep, doesnt even have to be buffs, dont know about rev but mesmer has alot of abilities, that arent used becouse their QoL sucks, or they are glichy.If not buffing numbers smooth out those "weakish" abilities so they get to be better.

As for necros, RN core is really hard to take down due to weakness and big HP pool + shroud, but its fine and managable, then firebrand strolls in and gives the necro prot, that thats 50k HP + heals + weakness + protection, and thats just too much.I like the fact that after scourge nerfs alot of build diversity opened up, MB if we shoot the kneecaps of FB even more could be played.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

just like fb is the best support and therefore pushes other supports out of the game, revenant is a better version of almost all other offensive builds. The builds that can compete with it are all going to be nerfed in the next patch (rightfully so). At the same time, revenant is so good at chasing down targets that weaker builds are sitting duck all game which makes facing (a) competent revenant(s) a very frustrating experience for most builds.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Erzian.5218 said:just like fb is the best support and therefore pushes other supports out of the game, revenant is a better version of almost all other offensive builds. The builds that can compete with it are all going to be nerfed in the next patch (rightfully so). At the same time, revenant is so good at chasing down targets that weaker builds are sitting duck all game which makes facing (a) competent revenant(s) a very frustrating experience for most builds.

Rev better be better than most classes when considering how many other viable builds it has-0 and what other roles it can effectively take on-0. If the devs made the spec not so heavily dependent on +1 high bursts type playstyle similar to thief and gave the class love in other areas I say sure shave away at their burst damage potential.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Psycoprophet.8107 said:

@Erzian.5218 said:just like fb is the best support and therefore pushes other supports out of the game, revenant is a better version of almost all other offensive builds. The builds that can compete with it are all going to be nerfed in the next patch (rightfully so). At the same time, revenant is so good at chasing down targets that weaker builds are sitting duck all game which makes facing (a) competent revenant(s) a very frustrating experience for most builds.

Rev better be better than most classes when considering how many other viable builds it has-0 and what other roles it can effectively take on-0. If the devs made the spec not so heavily dependent on +1 high bursts type playstyle similar to thief and gave the class love in other areas I say sure shave away at their burst damage potential.

having no other choices is no excuse for a spec being broken, buff other specs, nerf the current one.Did developers even try ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...